Kids in Cafes

goz83

Smondie wrote: »

If you are interacting with your child and sitting beside them you would notice if the start getting off the chair.

Accidents can happen and having children running round increases this

If you have more than 1, it gets trickier

Again, you'd have to have them to know. Theory is great....but it's only theory.

Smondie wrote: »

What an odd this to boast about online. Why are you actively encouraging children to behave inappropriately? is Teaching manners and approiate behaviour too hard?

Just guessing that the poster you quoted there is joking. At least that's my theory.

Smondie

goz83 wrote: »

Smondie wrote: »

If you are interacting with your child and sitting beside them you would notice if the start getting off the chair.

Accidents can happen and having children running round increases this

If you have more than 1, it gets trickier

Again, you'd have to have them to know. Theory is great....but it's only theory.

You can't talk to more than one child at once? Good parents would understand what I mean.

PowerToWait

goz83 wrote: »

No, it's not. If you had kids, you would know this. In a second, they can be off their seat, under table playing with whatever toys they have, or they could be on the other side of the restaurant if you turn away for a few seconds at the wrong time.

And servers need to be careful whether there are kids present or not. Anything could be in their way. Someone could drop a spoon and the server could slip and drench everyone with boiling hot tea. It's called being observant.

So the wait staff have to know where your kids are while it's ok for you to lapse and look away 'for a few seconds' as you're watching like a hawk?

bnt

I don't have kids, but it's been a really long time since I had a genuinely bad experience around kids - and I'm generally grumpy, I'm told. For example, I flew to the USA a couple of years ago and sat next to a new mother, and her infant basically spent the next eight hours latched on to her, and cried for something like ten seconds at one point. While I was there I went out with my friends and their three kids - youngest 8-y.o. - and they were well-behaved all the time, but not in a "repressed" way - it felt more like they understood they were out in public and had to tone it down a bit.

Probably the weirdest incident was on a plane about 5 years ago - not weird for me, but weird for the father of the toddler (~3 y.o.) sat next to me. I had the window seat, dad had the aisle, and at one point the kid in the middle decided he *really* wanted to see out of the window. I didn't mind letting the kid stand on my lap (ow), with me holding him steady. He looked out for a few minutes, after which he was happy again. The weird part was the dad clearly nonplussed that this stranger would be so accommodating, not complaining that a toddler understandably got a bit antsy on a fairly long flight (~ 3h).

I just think kids take their behavioural cues from their parents: agitated parents lead to agitated kids, in my experiance.

andekwarhola

bnt wrote: »

The weird part was the dad clearly nonplussed that this stranger would be so accommodating, not complaining that a toddler understandably got a bit antsy on a fairly long flight (~ 3h).

A friend of a friend told me their small kid got randomly allocated a seat away from him and his missus on a flight once. They apologized to the couple beside the kid and asked could they possibly swap seats and the couple refused.

Only time you'd actually want the kid to behave like a brat and he didn't.:pac:

Smondie

andekwarhola wrote: »

bnt wrote: »

The weird part was the dad clearly nonplussed that this stranger would be so accommodating, not complaining that a toddler understandably got a bit antsy on a fairly long flight (~ 3h).

A friend of a friend told me their small kid got randomly allocated a seat away from him and his missus on a flight once. They apologized to the couple beside the kid and asked could they possibly swap seats and the couple refused.

Only time you'd actually want the kid to behave like a brat and he didn't.:pac:

Sounds lile the kid had more cop on than the parents, why would others be expected to move?

Smondie

bnt wrote: »

.. I didn't mind letting the kid stand on my lap (ow), with me holding him steady. ...

was he wearing shoes or socks?

Story Bud?

andekwarhola wrote: »

A friend of a friend told me their small kid got randomly allocated a seat away from him and his missus on a flight once. They apologized to the couple beside the kid and asked could they possibly swap seats and the couple refused.

Only time you'd actually want the kid to behave like a brat and he didn't.:pac:

Yeh no, that's utter bullsh*t ffs.

There's no way that child was even beside that couple because no adults with an ounce of cop on would leave a child on their own on a plane instead of you know - doing the logical thing and having one parent sitting alone, and the child with the other parent.

andekwarhola

Smondie wrote: »

why would others be expected to move?

For the badness of it.

andekwarhola

Story Bud? wrote: »

Yeh no, that's utter bullsh*t ffs.

There's no way that child was even beside that couple because no adults with an ounce of cop on would leave a child on their own on a plane instead of you know - doing the logical thing and having one parent sitting alone, and the child with the other parent.

That's the story I was told. Maybe the kid was at the window (neither of the couple would move). Who knows?

I can ask the guy for the full specifics of the story when I see him next and report back to AH. Is a fortnight's turnaround cool on that?

Story Bud?

andekwarhola wrote: »

That's the story I was told. Maybe the kid was at the window (neither of the couple would move). Who knows?

I can ask the guy for the full specifics of the story when I see him next and report back to AH. Is a fortnight's turnaround cool on that?

You don't need to ask, because you know it's a bullsh*t story.

Boom_Bap

Smondie wrote: »

What an odd this to boast about online. Why are you actively encouraging children to behave inappropriately? is Teaching manners and approiate behaviour too hard?

They are kids. Not young adults, not marines, not cadets. Kids. I am not boasting, I'm promoting kids being allowed to be kids.
And who says it's inappropriate behaviour to hear kids expressing themselves and laughing in a public place.

Smondie

Boom_Bap wrote: »

Smondie wrote: »

What an odd this to boast about online. Why are you actively encouraging children to behave inappropriately? is Teaching manners and approiate behaviour too hard?

They are kids. Not young adults, not marines, not cadets. Kids. I am not boasting, I'm promoting kids being allowed to be kids.
And who says it's inappropriate behaviour to hear kids expressing themselves and laughing in a public place.

"was the one tickling them, throwing them around, making them wild, encouraging them to make noise."


I must go in and start throwing my partner round the cafe.

andekwarhola

Story Bud? wrote: »

You don't need to ask, because you know it's a bullsh*t story.

I'll let him know his anecdote has been torn asunder on the internet, not to worry.

Smondie

andekwarhola wrote: »

Story Bud? wrote: »

Yeh no, that's utter bullsh*t ffs.

There's no way that child was even beside that couple because no adults with an ounce of cop on would leave a child on their own on a plane instead of you know - doing the logical thing and having one parent sitting alone, and the child with the other parent.

That's the story I was told. Maybe the kid was at the window (neither of the couple would move). Who knows?

I can ask the guy for the full specifics of the story when I see him next and report back to AH. Is a fortnight's turnaround cool on that?

Can you ask if there was the option of allocated seating with an extra charge?

andekwarhola

Smondie wrote: »

Can you ask if there was the option of allocated seating with an extra charge?

I'll need a pamphlet for all these questions.

Yeah_Right

If you're being bothered by a stranger's kid in public, the best thing to do is make the child cry by telling them something mean or horrible. Their parent then has to deal with crying child and you can get back to your coffee/lunch etc.

Boom_Bap

Smondie wrote: »

"was the one tickling them, throwing them around, making them wild, encouraging them to make noise."


I must go in and start throwing my partner round the cafe.

OK.
Is your partner a kid? Actually it doesn't matter, go out and enjoy life. If enjoyment comes from throwing your partner around, go for it.
There are too many people that are aghast at every little thing.

Smondie

Boom_Bap wrote: »

Smondie wrote: »

"was the one tickling them, throwing them around, making them wild, encouraging them to make noise."


I must go in and start throwing my partner round the cafe.

OK.
Is your partner a kid? Actually it doesn't matter, go out and enjoy life. If enjoyment comes from throwing your partner around, go for it.
There are too many people that are aghast at every little thing.

Throwing children round in a place where they serve scalding tea?

I play with my childen in appropriate settings. I'll throw them around the park etc. They know that a cafe is not the place to be thrown around. I made it my buisness to teach them appropriate behaviour in different situations, because I love them and want them to be the best humans they can be.

Boom_Bap

Smondie wrote: »

Throwing children round in a place where they serve scalding tea?

I play with my childen in appropriate settings. I'll throw them around the park etc. They know that a cafe is not the place to be thrown around. I made it my buisness to teach them appropriate behaviour in different situations, because I love them and want them to be the best humans they can be.

Ah yeah, I was daring them them to do shots of the scalding tea and to juggle full tea pots.

Baggly

Smondie wrote: »

You can't talk to more than one child at once? Good parents would understand what I mean.

Smondie wrote: »

Sounds lile the kid had more cop on than the parents, why would others be expected to move?

Smondie wrote: »

"was the one tickling them, throwing them around, making them wild, encouraging them to make noise."

I must go in and start throwing my partner round the cafe.

Smondie wrote: »

Throwing children round in a place where they serve scalding tea?

I play with my childen in appropriate settings. I'll throw them around the park etc. They know that a cafe is not the place to be thrown around. I made it my buisness to teach them appropriate behaviour in different situations, because I love them and want them to be the best humans they can be.

The sheer level of condescention in the above posts, Smondie.....wow.

Cienciano

zedhead wrote: »

I don't know if thats altogether fair. A child continued to try to engage even though he was clearly uncomfortable and the parent just ignored it.

I have social anxiety and do not handle random conversation from anyone well. Something with a set a defined answer like requesting directions or the time is fine but someone just randomly trying to engage with me can bring on a panic attack. Totally my issue and I would never be intentionally rude to someone and do my best to be polite and engage whether they be a child or an adult. But if I am sitting somewhere enjoying my lunch and somebody comes up and just lands themself on me it can ruin my day/week. I don't think its unreasonable to teach your children that randomly chatting to strangers like this may not always be welcome, and may not always be safe.There are boundaries that need to be taught.

Who are you to judge what someone should and should accept and be comfortable with. Or what may or may not have been going on in their lives at that moment that means that interaction is more difficult.

Again none of this is the childrens fault - it is the parents failing to teach boundaries and excusing it as kids will be kids. These parents are in the minority. Most children in public do know boundaries and most parents in the situation would request that their child 'stops bothering the lady/man'. If someone is fine chatting to their kid at that point they can say whether it is bothering them or not.

Nobody expects kids to be perfect, but people do expect parents to react when kids do beahve in a socially unacceptable way.

The guy in question didn't mention any social anxiety. And he did say the kid had special needs. Mightn't be as easy to teach a special needs kid to not talk to anyone.

Maybe the parent has told the child 10 times that day to stop talking to people and if the child has something like downs syndrome they can't learn as easily as you or I? Maybe the child had a serious illness and the parent was glad to see them happy?
Also depends on what's deemed socially acceptable. A child asking one question? 2? 3? A child not interacting with anyone in public? Different people have different levels of what's "socially acceptable", this thread is clear evidence of that, some people think hearing a child in public isn't acceptable, so saying a child should behave in a socially acceptable way is pointless.
Personally, I'd rather not be questioned by a child, but part of being out in public is interacting with people, it's impossible to avoid and part of life.

Smondie

Pter wrote: »

Smondie wrote: »

You can't talk to more than one child at once? Good parents would understand what I mean.

Smondie wrote: »

Sounds lile the kid had more cop on than the parents, why would others be expected to move?

Smondie wrote: »

"was the one tickling them, throwing them around, making them wild, encouraging them to make noise."

I must go in and start throwing my partner round the cafe.

Smondie wrote: »

Throwing children round in a place where they serve scalding tea?

I play with my childen in appropriate settings. I'll throw them around the park etc. They know that a cafe is not the place to be thrown around. I made it my buisness to teach them appropriate behaviour in different situations, because I love them and want them to be the best humans they can be.

The sheer level of condescention in the above posts, Smondie.....wow.

Whatever you like to call it. But not demanding others move to accommodate you, and not throwing children around cafes falls under my definition of common sense.

Baggly

Smondie wrote: »

Whatever you like to call it. But not demanding others move to accommodate you, and not throwing children around cafes falls under my definition of common sense.

Moving to accomodate small kids and parents falls under my definition of common courtesy.

Paying attention to the tone of other people's posts, and not using hyperbolic language to make their point seem silly also falls under the same definition.

Nothing wrong with tickling a child in public and making them laugh. Even in a cafe. The use of the phrase throwing around is just that, a phrase. Not intended literally. Especially since Boom's original post was said in jest (at least that's how i am reading it).

Smondie

Pter wrote: »

Smondie wrote: »

Whatever you like to call it. But not demanding others move to accommodate you, and not throwing children around cafes falls under my definition of common sense.

Moving to accomodate small kids and parents falls under my definition of common courtesy.

Paying attention to the tone of other people's posts, and not using hyperbolic language to make their point seem silly also falls under the same definition.

Nothing wrong with tickling a child in public and making them laugh. Even in a cafe. The use of the phrase throwing around is just that, a phrase. Not intended literally. Especially since Boom's original post was said in jest (at least that's how i am reading it).

So the throwing around is the hyperbolic language you speak of? I'll take boom bap at thier word, unless you were there i'm not sure how you're in a position to clarify what they meant?

As for the moving, why should they? If the parents prepared in advance, they wouldn't need to be making demands of strangers.

Boom_Bap

I actually was throwing one of them up in the air. He had a blast.
But I wasn't picking them up like a sliotar and launching them across the cafe. That's a challenge for someone with better upper body strength than myself.

Baggly

Smondie wrote: »

So the throwing around is the hyperbolic language you speak of? I'll take boom bap at thier word, unless you were there i'm not sure how you're in a position to clarify what they meant?

As for the moving, why should they? If the parents prepared in advance, they wouldn't need to be making demands of strangers.

Well i clicked on the link he posted, which lead to a meme....so im gonna take the tone as in jest.

They are under no obligation to, but its the sound thing to do....again, courtesy. The same courtesy you might expect from well behaved children?

Also, none of us were there, but the poster said they asked, not demanded......they didnt kick up a fuss after they said no and that was that. I don't understand why you are setting out to vilify parents who do not subscribe to what you would do in their place.

Baggly

Boom_Bap wrote: »

I actually was throwing one of them up in the air. He had a blast.
But I wasn't picking them up like a sliotar and launching them across the cafe. That's a challenge for someone with better upper body strength than myself.

Ah for jebuses sake, throwing them up in the air to make them laugh is a perk of the job. Unless there was scalding tea pots being stored just below the ceiling, what harm.

zedhead

Cienciano wrote: »

The guy in question didn't mention any social anxiety. And he did say the kid had special needs. Mightn't be as easy to teach a special needs kid to not talk to anyone.

Maybe the parent has told the child 10 times that day to stop talking to people and if the child has something like downs syndrome they can't learn as easily as you or I? Maybe the child had a serious illness and the parent was glad to see them happy?
Also depends on what's deemed socially acceptable. A child asking one question? 2? 3? A child not interacting with anyone in public? Different people have different levels of what's "socially acceptable", this thread is clear evidence of that, some people think hearing a child in public isn't acceptable, so saying a child should behave in a socially acceptable way is pointless.
Personally, I'd rather not be questioned by a child, but part of being out in public is interacting with people, it's impossible to avoid and part of life.

Just because the child can't learn as easily doesn't mean they should just stop trying. If the child had hit the stranger repeatadly would it be ok to say 'Maybe the parent has told the child 10 times that day to stop hitting people and if the child has something like downs syndrome they can't learn as easily as you or I?'

Again not saying the child is at fault for doing it - just that the parent was at fault for sitting back and laughing as the child continued to bother a complete stranger and possibly make him uncomfortable.

Is stranger danger not a thing any more? Are parents really ok with their kids going up and talking to random strangers as that was a big no no for me growing up?

dr.fuzzenstein

Smondie wrote: »

So the throwing around is the hyperbolic language you speak of? I'll take boom bap at thier word, unless you were there i'm not sure how you're in a position to clarify what they meant?

As for the moving, why should they? If the parents prepared in advance, they wouldn't need to be making demands of strangers.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/comedy/2015-09/sept17/victormeldrew-xlarge.jpg