Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2016/2017

Dickerty

corwill wrote: »

The market for Benteke is a buyer's one, he is not going to sell for the money LFC say they're looking for.

In terms of the fee, it's a sellers market because there is plenty of money and not too many proven players. Hence why we know that £23M up front is not a good enough offer.

ricero

GBX wrote: »

Was Sahko in the matchday squad on Sunday? Or is he still in limbo with Klopp? Will he be considered for Burnley?

Still recovering from his injury as far as i know

J Mysterio

5starpool wrote: »

Either Klopp thinks he can improve Moreno, or else he is thinking 'fúck it, we'll just outscore the cúnts'.

More evidence for the latter than the former.

If Lovren can be turned around, can Moreno find salvation?

Lovren was diabolical under Rodgers. I didnt just want him sold, I wanted him flogged and sold into slavery.

Moreno needs to know when to make runs and, more importanty, when not to. He also needs to stop lunge-dive-tackling like a delinquent. Those two things would make a big difference, as would the LCM taking more care to cover for him when appropriate.

corwill

Dickerty wrote: »

In terms of the fee, it's a sellers market because there is plenty of money and not too many proven players. Hence why we know that £23M up front is not a good enough offer.

It's a seller's market generally, but not for Benteke. Everyone knows we want rid, that he has literally no playing future with us, he's that wrong for the way Klopp plays football. Everyone knows he's on he's on a large salary. Those factors quite simply weaken LFC's bargaining position, and mean that the financial positions of potential buyers is less relevant. We're not getting our money back on him, imho, there's going to be a loss to be borne.

That's not to say that I'm disagreeing with LFC's stance so far, just that the expectation amongst some fans that seems to be there that we will actually get €30 million for him seems unrealistic.

ShamoBuc

J Mysterio wrote: »

If Lovren can be turned around, can Moreno find salvation?

Lovren was diabolical under Rodgers. I didnt just want him sold, I wanted him flogged and sold into slavery.

Moreno needs to know when to make runs and, more importanty, when not to. He also needs to stop lunge-dive-tackling like a delinquent. Those two things would make a big difference, as would the LCM taking more care to cover for him when appropriate.

The problem is lovren was always able to defend, Moreno simply can't.

NukaCola

J Mysterio wrote: »

If Lovren can be turned around, can Moreno find salvation?

Lovren was diabolical under Rodgers. I didnt just want him sold, I wanted him flogged and sold into slavery.

Moreno needs to know when to make runs and, more importanty, when not to. He also needs to stop lunge-dive-tackling like a delinquent. Those two things would make a big difference, as would the LCM taking more care to cover for him when appropriate.

He's an emotional chap, loses the head easily......not sure if that can be trained out of him....

corwill

J Mysterio wrote: »

Moreno needs to know when to make runs and, more importanty, when not to. He also needs to stop lunge-dive-tackling like a delinquent. Those two things would make a big difference, as would the LCM taking more care to cover for him when appropriate.

He's 24 and ostensibly a defender. It's bloody close to midnight to be trying to coach him to be a half competent defender.

I reckon he's a lost cause as a defender, at this stage it would be easier to coach him on the attacking side of the game to try and turn him into a wide midfielder. I don't think that should be at Melwood, though, good luck to his next club with that project.

Bandana boy

What are peoples thoughts on Ings this season
Where will he lie in the pecking order and will he get any game time

J Mysterio

corwill wrote: »

He's 24 and ostensibly a defender. It's bloody close to midnight to be trying to coach him to be a half competent defender.

8-10

5starpool wrote: »

He won't even be that I'd say. Ings/Origi/Sturridge/Firmino all ahead of him, and not all of them (esp Ings) will get enough game time to keep them happy, so Benteke will get none I'd say unless we are injury stricken (yes, I know, Sturridge, injury, etc.)

I agree with this being the state of things, but personally if it were up to me I'd have (and don't shoot me here), Benteke ahead of Ings in the pecking order.

jcsoulinger

8-10 wrote: »

I agree with this being the state of things, but personally if it were up to me I'd have (and don't shoot me here), Benteke ahead of Ings in the pecking order.

I would say there is very little between them, Benteke is technically a better striker, But Ings would probably fit better with winning the ball back high up the pitch that Klopp values. Benteke would be a great option from the bench.

Kimbot

I think Ings will get a good bit of time this season, Klopp just wants to ease him back in at the moment after a long lay off.

Utopia Parkway

Bandana boy wrote: »

What are peoples thoughts on Ings this season
Where will he lie in the pecking order and will he get any game time

3rd choice striker at best. Maybe even 4th if you count Firmino as a makeshift striker. Thing is Klopp will only be playing one man up front in a lot of games. Could limit his chances. Of course a couple of injuries could change all that and Sturridge is one of the strikers ahead of him.

Umaro

Crystal Palace's form in 2016 has been absolutely diabolical.

W - D - L
2 - 5 - 12

They released Adebayor and Chamakh - and then they sold Bolasie and Gayle! At present their only striking option is Connor bloody Wickham. They are destined for relegation.


Their net spend so far means they're up £9 million - they haven't even touched their TV money. It'll be a travesty if the club don't take them for £30 million on Benteke. He wasn't right for us - but he'll keep Palace up, no doubt. That's worth a lot more than £23m+addons.

Benzino

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

3rd choice striker at best. Maybe even 4th if you count Firmino as a makeshift striker. Thing is Klopp will only be playing one man up front in a lot of games. Could limit his chances. Of course a couple of injuries could change all that and Sturridge is one of the strikers ahead of him.

Ings should be ahead of Firmino in terms of strikers. Firmino has done nothing to warrant a guaranteed starting position imo.

marklazarcovic

Benzino wrote: »

Ings should be ahead of Firmino in terms of strikers. Firmino has done nothing to warrant a guaranteed starting position imo.

You actually want a striker who has played a couple of matches for us to replace firminho?


Do you watch us play or what?

ShamoBuc

Benzino wrote: »

Ings should be ahead of Firmino in terms of strikers. Firmino has done nothing to warrant a guaranteed starting position imo.

Wasn't he our top scorer last year?

Hollister11

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Wasn't he our top scorer last year?

Sturridge 13
Coutinho 12
Firmino 11
Benteke 10
Origi 10

Benzino

marklazarcovic wrote: »

You actually want a striker who has played a couple of matches for us to replace firminho?


Do you watch us play or what?

As a striker, yes. I think Ings (when fit) would be a better option up front. I'll play Origi before both of them.

SuperTortoise

marklazarcovic wrote: »

You actually want a striker who has played a couple of matches for us to replace firminho?


Do you watch us play or what?

To be fair Firmino had a poor pre-season and was very average against Arsenal.

noodler

Benzino wrote: »

Ings should be ahead of Firmino in terms of strikers. Firmino has done nothing to warrant a guaranteed starting position imo.

marklazarcovic wrote: »

You actually want a striker who has played a couple of matches for us to replace firminho?


Do you watch us play or what?

Completely with marklazarcovic on this one.

Ings has Burnley pedigree and was a free transfer. None of this necessarily makes him lower class but all he has done is play a handful of game for us where he looked impressive.

Compared to Firminho who is far more seasoned and has far more (technical) ability and who has contributed many times more what Ings has - I don't understand the clamour to put him ahead of Firminho automatically.

It sounds like an "absence makes the heart grow fonder" kind of situation whereby people are falling in love with the idea of Ings based on a very small, albeit impressive, sample of performances.

8-10

noodler wrote: »

It sounds like an "absence makes the heart grow fonder" kind of situation whereby people are falling in love with the idea of Ings based on a very small, albeit impressive, sample of performances.

All of which were before he was out with a long-term injury. We saw it with Flanno and we also have to temper our expectations with Joe Gomez also. Long-term injuries in your early 20's (late teens for Gomez) can seriously hold you back. To be out for a year and then come back into a team that play like Liverpool do is tough.

I don't like saying it but people think that after a year once back to fitness these lads will be at the same level they were before injury, and I'm just not that confident.

One_Of_Shanks

Firmino ahead of Ings all day long for me.

One of the reasons why Klopp likes picking Firmino on his own in big games away from home is that he can actually create chances for himself, which you don't generally get from out and out strikers, they tend to need them created by others for them.

Then there's his work rate which is excellent, his creativity for others, flair, movement (space made for others), the lot. He's ideal for games like Sunday.
Man City away last season is another off the top of my head where you had him bringing others into the play, Ings doesn't quite give you that, even if he's possibly more likely to put a snap-shot away.

They're different types of forwards so they'll be used in different types of games.

But Firmino is undoubtedly ahead of Ings in the overall pecking order and rightly so.

Benzino

noodler wrote: »

It sounds like an "absence makes the heart grow fonder" kind of situation whereby people are falling in love with the idea of Ings based on a very small, albeit impressive, sample of performances.

It's more to do with me not being impressed with Firmino to be honest, I feel he doesn't contribute enough on a regular basis when he is played up front and would like to give Ings a shot providing he is fit (which doesn't appear to be the case admittedly) and if Origi is not an option. I just feel there are too many games that seem to pass Firmino by.

Now in saying that, it was he first time playing in England last season so I am probably being too harsh on him. I would still play Origi ahead of both of them though.

I also hate his hair, maybe that is clouding my judgment :P

Knex*

Firmino is pretty integral to how we play. I can't see Klopp dropping him for any important game, to be honest.

Pyjamarama

I don't understand how anyone can't see how important Firmino us for us. He scores goals and presses better than any other playereason we have. He gives the ball away at times but he has vision that very few players we have can. Ings is a trier but not in Firminos league.

He's proven exceptionally effective up top on his own against the better teams.

Sheeeeit

Benzino wrote: »

Now in saying that, it was he first time playing in England last season so I am probably being too harsh on him.

Firmino got 10 goals and 7 assists in 24 starts in his first season. Pretty damn good if you ask me for someone who is not an out and out striker. No way he's getting dropped, as others have said, he is integral to how we play and is probably the best player we have who can play up top and press with high intensity for 90 mins.

Sappy404

corwill wrote: »

It's a seller's market generally, but not for Benteke. Everyone knows we want rid, that he has literally no playing future with us, he's that wrong for the way Klopp plays football. Everyone knows he's on he's on a large salary. Those factors quite simply weaken LFC's bargaining position, and mean that the financial positions of potential buyers is less relevant. We're not getting our money back on him, imho, there's going to be a loss to be borne.

That's not to say that I'm disagreeing with LFC's stance so far, just that the expectation amongst some fans that seems to be there that we will actually get €30 million for him seems unrealistic.

We have absolutely no pressing need to sell Benteke. We can clearly afford his wages and we aren't desperate to replace him, what with Sturridge, Origi, Ings and even Firmino competing for his place. Palace, on the other hand, are desperate for a striker (if not two) and have recently sold Bolasie for £25m. They have the money and the need for him.

NukaCola

Garth Crooks thinks we'll get relegated if we keep Moreno at LB........what an absolute donut...

Utopia Parkway

Firmino reminds me of a better version of Luis Garcia. Frustrating as hell sometimes as he gives the ball away cheaply with loose passes but he always seems to get involved in goals and assists. Even the last day (which was not his best game) he created a great chance out of nothing really for Coutinho to score but Cech made a point blank save.

dogbert27

J Mysterio wrote: »

If Lovren can be turned around, can Moreno find salvation?

Lovren was diabolical under Rodgers. I didnt just want him sold, I wanted him flogged and sold into slavery.

Moreno needs to know when to make runs and, more importanty, when not to. He also needs to stop lunge-dive-tackling like a delinquent. Those two things would make a big difference, as would the LCM taking more care to cover for him when appropriate.

He did this enough times last season that it should have been kicked out of him in pre-season.

The fact that he did it a number of times in the first half of the first game of the season resulting in a penalty shows that this guy is brainless and will not change.

Dickerty

Knex. wrote: »

Firmino is pretty integral to how we play. I can't see Klopp dropping him for any important game, to be honest.

It depends on how we intend to play on a certain day, and who else starts in attack. Firmino does the work that Coutinho doesn't (as much), neither Origi now Sturridge are that busy.

But in games where we expect a lot of ball and time in their half, I'd prefer a clinical finisher like Sturridge or Origi...

Agent Coulson

Bascombe is reporting that Milner is very unhappy at been used as a makeshift LB so far this season.

Dont be at yourself

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Bascombe is reporting that Milner is very unhappy at been used as a makeshift LB so far this season.

Didn't he receive guarantees from Rodgers that he'd be playing in central midfield when he joined?

GBX

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Bascombe is reporting that Milner is very unhappy at been used as a makeshift LB so far this season.

How many times has he actually played there? Is it more a case of him being unhappy with potential lack of games?

Kerrigooney

Dont be at yourself wrote: »

Didn't he receive guarantees from Rodgers that he'd be playing in central midfield when he joined?

That was the talk when he joined alright. Unfortunately for him Rodgers is gone and he's rubbish in central midfield.

J Mysterio

SuperTortoise wrote: »

To be fair Firmino had a poor pre-season and was very average against Arsenal.

Firmino played well against Arsenal. He does a lot of little work: runs and link up play. He created a few chances too.

Agent Coulson

The one thing about Milner is he is the ultimate pro if he is picked to play LB he will play it to the best of his ability and won't sulk about in on the pitch.

NukaCola

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Bascombe is reporting that Milner is very unhappy at been used as a makeshift LB so far this season.

He played there for 45 minutes in preseason.....the way we are setting up it may be the only position where he'll get decent game time.....

ERG89

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Bascombe is reporting that Milner is very unhappy at been used as a makeshift LB so far this season.

Wait until he actually starts playing there, then he'll be even more unhappy. To be fair nobody is happy about him there even to get the headless chicken out of the side

Knex*

If Mignolet performs solid for the next few weeks, it'll be interesting to see what Klopp does when Karius is back.

I hate the situations where you have the supposed better player on the bench, waiting for the monumental error that allows the manager to start him again, so that everyone can hold the apparent moral high ground of not screwing over the replacement who played well. Not for defensive positions, anyway.

Kerrigooney

Agent Coulson wrote: »

The one thing about Milner is he is the ultimate pro if he is picked to play LB he will play it to the best of his ability and won't sulk about in on the pitch.

Absolutely. I like Milner,just not in central midfield. If he's not playing left back then hell struggle to get into the team.

Nerdlingr

Kerrigooney wrote: »

That was the talk when he joined alright. Unfortunately for him Rodgers is gone and he's rubbish in central midfield.

Milner probably played the best football of his career in central midfield at Villa. It was his performances there that got him the transfer to Man City. He won Villa player of the year and the PFA young player of the year that year. If anything he's suffered because of his versatility, he's never played in a settled position since.

Kerrigooney

Knex. wrote: »

If Mignolet performs solid for the next few weeks, it'll be interesting to see what Klopp does when Karius is back.

I hate the situations where you have the supposed better player on the bench, waiting for the monumental error that allows the manager to start him again, so that everyone can hold the apparent moral high ground of not screwing over the replacement who played well. Not for defensive positions, anyway.

He won't. He's never far away from a stupid mistake.

Kerrigooney

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Milner probably played the best football of his career in central midfield at Villa. It was his performances there that got him the transfer to Man City. He won Villa player of the year and the PFA young player of the year that year. If anything he's suffered because of his versatility, he's never played in a settled position since.

I agree but that's a long time ago now. The few games he played in central midfield for us were less than inspiring.

Gaillimh1976

Could another option be Milner RB Clyne LB ??

Kerrigooney

Gaillimh1976 wrote: »

Could another option be Milner RB Clyne LB ??

Could another option be BUY A BLOODY LEFT BACK?

Vicxas

Kerrigooney wrote: »

Could another option be BUY A BLOODY LEFT BACK?

Woah, woah, woah, lets not go nuts here.


Who do you think we are?! More than 1 LB..... how extravagant.

Kerrigooney

Vicxas wrote: »

Woah, woah, woah, lets not go nuts here.


Who do you think we are?! More than 1 LB..... how extravagant.

Yeah it would probably just be showing off if we had another one.

5starpool

Kerrigooney wrote: »

Could another option be BUY A BLOODY LEFT BACK?

Don't be daft.