breeding a maiden mare

laoch na mona

Hi I've a 9 yr old mare half bred mare I'd like to get a foal off her but I'm a bit cautious I know older maiden mares can have issue but 9 isn't that old either.

My main concern is that the mare in question was an orphan foal and basically I'm worried that getting her in foal would be a risk to the mare/foal. The stallion I have in mind is a Irish draught slightly smaller than the mare.

I won't be breeding her till next year so I'm just looking for some advice, obviously I'd be getting the vet to check her over before I do anything. So what do people think would breading her be safe or would buying in a colt/filly be better.

Esroh

Firstly. 9 is not old and if everyone worried about what could go wrong nobody would breed

Breeding is a big step for anyone. You have to be sure why you want to do it.
1) Why do you want to breed a foal from the mare. Is it just to breed a replacement or to sell .
2) Is the mare worth breeding from. Ie Has she a good preformance record/ If not a record does she move and jump in a brillant way.
3) Is you chosen Stallion. Commercially Viable if selling Are you improving the mare's negative by using the stallion .
4) If you are breeding to Keep its a longterm project. 2022 until its 4 ,.

There is a much bigger satisfaction from watching a homebred going on over following a youngster you bought and produced so I would say if you are in a position to give it a go do but if your not buying a foal/yearling/2yesr old is a nice way to go

laoch na mona

The mare is decent enough has a good trot and was an ok jumper (hasn't done much jumping over the past few years as I was in college). The stallion I was planning on using has produced good jumping progeny before. I'm not sure yet what I'll be doing with the foal other variables such as time and land availability (most my land is rented) will effect that put I'd be happy enough to work with a foal to sell it as a yearling/2 year old ect or to keep it depending on above variables.

paddi22

It sounds harsh but what's the point of breeding from an average mare unless it's something you are happy to keep for life? Too many people think you just add a good stallion and you'l get a good foal and it's rarely the case. You might get a stallion that can jump, but if you breed with a mare with weak quarters for example you'l just end up with a bog standard horse. Or temperament wise if you mare isn't a brave jumper you might end up with a horse that CAN jump but just hasn't got the bravery. And there is much that can go wrong. My friend just had a foal who ended up in hospital with a couple of grand vets bills, what would you do if that happened? Another bred a foal who ended up being pts as it had wobblers. There's so many risks even after they are born.

There are so many average/badly bred horses around. Unless you're mare is a cracker, why bother breeding? If it's to keep for yourself thats fine, but if it's to sell then by the time it's a yearling you'l have spend WAAAY more than the purchase price you will get.

Kamili

Here's and interesting piece about the cost of breeding your own. Its not cheap. I've had plenty of breeders say to me that they budget at least 10k and they have their own land, and live close to the stallion they chose, so not much transport or stabling fees.
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/features/how-much-does-it-cost-to-breed-a-horse-316201
Where would you keep the mare to foal? What would you do if something happened? Have you experience of pregnancy in mares? Its a massive undertaking. I had thought about doing it with my own mare, she has a fantastic record. But I wouldn't be able to manage alone if the foal got into difficulty.

I helped on a stud where a foal was scouring exceptionally badly, and required round the clock care, and I mean 24 hour care. It was touch and go, and the foal nearly didn't make it. Luckily he pulled through, but he was weak for quite some time afterwards. The vet was out regularly checking up on him.

If you feel you can manage financially and have a plan in place for any mishaps, I would say go for it, but its not an easy task, which is why I decided not to with my mare.

Bunnyslippers

Agree with the above, it costs waaaay more to breed a foal than to buy exactly what you want, the old saying 'you breed what you get and buy what you want' is very true. With the market as poor as it is unless your mare is an outstanding example of her breed/type and has the record to match then I really wouldn't bother, especially if you're wanting to sell on. We always used to allow about 3 grand to get the foal on the ground and upto yearling stage, if anything goes wrong, which foals have a tendancy to do then you can go up from there! I had one youngster who was just an accident magnet and always just when we'd get him bouncing again and ready to sell he'd mangle himself, probably cost us around 8 grand, that didn't include the stud fee as we owned the stallion and had our own land, we ended up keeping him till he was 6yrs old, sold him in the end for less than a grand as he had a few blemishes!!

The foaling itself can be a lot of work, we used to check every half an hour day and night and some of our girls used to go weeks overdue, we worked from home with the foaling paddock right outside our office so we could watch them, so no problem otherwise I would never have done it! Plus you need good clean grazing, secure fencing with no barbed wire, a good large double box for foaling etc, it really is a labour of love, with a good touch of madness thrown in!!:D

fits

Bunnyslippers wrote: »

We always used to allow about 3 grand to get the foal on the ground and upto yearling stage, if anything goes wrong, which foals have a tendancy to do then you can go up from there! D

:eek: What are you doing to spend 3 grand to get them on the ground?

My costs are approx 400 euro for a decent ISH/draught stallion. Another 150 ish for scans. Good grass, and thats it! Oh another 130 euro or so to register the foal. We dont even give hard feed.

Bunnyslippers

I'm taking into consideration all costs though, I'm sure most of these are common sense but for anyone else reading this and considering the same its not just the stud fee:
Vaccinations for mare, swabs for sti's etc and certificates for mare - all good studs should ask for them and have their stallions tested at the start of each season, the stallion owner should tell you what they need.
Stud fee.
Scanning fees.
Keep fees and transport if visiting a stallion, could be there a month or more.
Is your mare with other horses or mares and foals - foals always do better with other horses or foals about to learn how to behave, helps burn off all the mad 5mins they have!
Teeth and back checked to make sure mare is sound to carry the foal if you don't routinely do these, vitamin/salt lick, farrier, wormers, pasture maintenance ie. Topping, fertiliser etc. you need fairly good pasture for foals, old horse sick stuff is not suitable. But you need poor grazing for drying off the mare.
Hard feed, even some of our fatties needed it, For good doers who are holding their weight a high quality vitamin supplement for mare in the last 3 months something like bluechip and some alphalpha, ad lib hay or haylage over winter - feed by eye, likewise for weaning the foal a vitamin supplement and good forage, no hard feed you want to see a few of the last ribs by end of winter before hitting spring grass especially on draught breeds as they are prone to OCD.
Possible Transport costs and stabling at a stud farm or to someone else who has a lone foal needing to be weaned, if you don't have the facilities to do it at home, if the foal has a quiet buddy then you could use an older horse. The foal and mare need to be out of hearing distance of each other for a couple of months, we always kept them apart for the whole winter so the foals did not go back to feeding off the mares which they can do even after a month or two! Our foals were stabled in double stables in pairs with the top door shut for the first week just so they didn't jump out, also a good chance to brush up on halter training and basic handling as all can go out the window when weaned! You can wean by keeping the foal in its herd and just sending the mare away, just make sure your fences are upto scratch!
Good quality straw for bedding at foaling time.
Microchip, registration, vaccinations, wormer and farrier for foal.
A bit set aside for vet fees or insurance if you prefer - most foalings are textbook but the odd one can be a nightmare, we've had dystocias - correctable luckily, uterine inertia, placenta previa and we've lost 2 foals in the past, never lost a mare thank goodness but have had retained placentas one which led to severe laminitis and colic, cost a bomb but all survived, although that mare was an incredibly foal proud mare even though she was a dope normally she would turn into a monster with a baby so we always had to be super careful and never handle her alone, she'd chill out after a month!

You also need to think if the worst happens and you have to hand rear the foal have you the time for starters!, plus foals learn from their mothers how to rear a foal, so as yours is an orphan there is a tiny chance she may reject it, hopefully not but I have seen it happen. To hand rear a foal is very expensive, a friend of mine spent over two and a half grand on just the mare milk replacer for her fell pony foal as she sadly lost the mare, luckily she got colostrum from her before she died or the foal would have died, monetarily though the foal was bred to sell originally and was only worth about 800 quid, they ended up keeping him!

I'm sure I've probably forgotten something as been a good few years since we bred any foals, don't get me wrong it's very rewarding, but it's not a cheap hobby at all and you never get paid for your time!!:rolleyes:

A good couple of basic books to read are From Foal to full Grown by Janet Lorch and Foaling Simplified by Sue Caldwell. If I were you Id be buying at the mo the market is flooded and you can get very nice youngsters for very little, I saw a gorgeous yearling ID a year ago, stallion quality too, for less than a couple of grand, I was soooo tempted as love draughts!!:D
Have you got a picture of your mare?