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Berlin Q or Bust: Road to sub 2:45

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Congrats on Limerick and thanks for the report. Just the thing I needed to read. I last had a go at a marathon in Berlin in 2011 and derailed with cramp after 2hrs on track (for 2:55) to a 3:15. I was so angry and disappointed that I just couldn't consider another attempt. Kudos to you picking yourself up 6 weeks later to get it done! Well done!

    I'll probably come back to read your report periodically over the next 12 months..

    Tbf it was 4 weeks and not 6. If it was 6 I'm not sure if I'd have made it to the start line......what sort of running have you done since Berlin?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    healy1835 wrote: »
    Tbf it was 4 weeks and not 6. If it was 6 I'm not sure if I'd have made it to the start line......what sort of running have you done since Berlin?

    Berlin was 2011. 2012 was triathlons and some runs. 38xx 10k and 1:23xx half marathon. 10ks were mainly off a hard swim and bike but 40-43 mins generally.
    2013-2016 was decent volume of all but running. Kayaking, swimming, trekking, cycling... I paced the 4hr gang at DCM a couple of times but volume would have been 30km per week. Last 18 months average of a single 7km run per week. There is an aerobic base there but I need to build a run base before I can contemplate a marathon plan!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Berlin was 2011. 2012 was triathlons and some runs. 38xx 10k and 1:23xx half marathon. 10ks were mainly off a hard swim and bike but 40-43 mins generally.
    2013-2016 was decent volume of all but running. Kayaking, swimming, trekking, cycling... I paced the 4hr gang at DCM a couple of times but volume would have been 30km per week. Last 18 months average of a single 7km run per week. There is an aerobic base there but I need to build a run base before I can contemplate a marathon plan!

    Maybe target an Autumn half marathon....good few to choose from, then see where you stand after it.....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    healy1835 wrote: »
    Maybe target an Autumn half marathon....good few to choose from, then see where you stand after it.....

    Considering that. Need to lose weight and just get fit to train first. I know where I need to me. Cheers though. What is next for you?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Took 8 days off. No running. Trip to chiropodist to sort a couple of feet issues. A few trips to various take aways in Newbridge. Good few bottles of beer. And now I'm back :)

    Tue: 5Mile Easy: 40:02 @4:58/km
    Wed: 13k V Easy: 1:12:33 @5:35/km

    My training partner is running the Portumna 100k in June so I joined him for a few slow miles on the plains today. Great to catch up and reflect on the previous 6 weeks that saw us both break the sub 3 mark :)

    Gonna have a rattle at the Irish Runner 5Mile in June and the Night of the PBs in July. Gonna run DCM, not sure of target but I definitely don't plan on running any slower than I did in Limerick :) gonna see if my time from Limerick is good enough for a GFA entry to London. Not overly confident but we'll see how it pans out. Mojo levels are high, looking forward to a good summer of running.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    I've just been getting out for some runs and running them how I feel. It's been nice just running and not having any particular targets for the runs.....but I'm definitely ready to put a bit of structure back in. Gonna do a mini 4 week block of some faster stuff and then have a rattle at the Irish Runner 5 Mile on the 24th. That suits me as I'm off to the Killers in the RDS on the Tue after and a stag in Edinburgh that weekend (and Kildare could be in a Leinster final the day of the 5 Miler :) ) so running will take a bit of a hit that week.

    Thu: 10.3k: 52.02 @5:04/km

    Sat: Buggy 8.5k: 42:07 Got an Out n About running buggy so took my new partner out for a debut run. She loved it, so hopefully the buggy will let her daddy crank up the mileage this summer :)

    Sun: Buggy AM 10k: 47.11 @4:43/km These fecking buggies can move when they want to! Didn't look at the watch at all during this run, never realised we were moving that quickly :)

    PM 11k: 1:00:27 @5:28/km Training partner who's running the Portumna 100k next month was heading out again so I joined him for a few more. Was full of the free Red Bull I'd drank up at the Flugtag so had to reign it in!

    Tue: 10k: 47:11 @4:44/km

    Wed: 13k: 1:11:18 @5:29/km

    Fri: 21.1k: 1:40:43 @4:46/km

    Hmming and hawing about going for a run, went from not going at 6pm to doing a long run at 7pm :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,017 ✭✭✭Itziger


    I'm a small bit confused. Were you pushing the buggy? Sounds like it in at least one run but then I'm reading that your partner was pushing the buggy and you were running alongside??? In a big logical jump I'm guessing you have a baby or toddler ;)

    Congratulations all round.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Itziger wrote: »
    I'm a small bit confused. Were you pushing the buggy? Sounds like it in at least one run but then I'm reading that your partner was pushing the buggy and you were running alongside??? In a big logical jump I'm guessing you have a baby or toddler ;)

    Congratulations all round.

    Fixed :) my new partner is little Erin Healy......running partner still the same guy :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭OOnegative


    Have to get past Westmeath before ye make that Leinster final!!!(he says when Laois are gonna beat Westmeath later).


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    OOnegative wrote: »
    Have to get past Westmeath before ye make that Leinster final!!!(he says when Laois are gonna beat Westmeath later).

    I did say 'could'!! We've to win tomorrow first....


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Sat: 5.3k Easy: 27:06 @5:04/km
    Down in Tramore at a communion so got in a little trot on the beach.

    Tue: 15k Easy: 1:17:21 @5:09/I'm
    Well at least Kildare won't be messing with my running plans thus summer....had a good few pints after the game so didn't get out Monday :(

    Wed AM: 7.4k: 37:01 @5:00/km
    PM: 7k: 35:11 @5:01/km
    In and out of work.

    Fri: Buggy 11.3k: 55:07 @4:51/km
    Out early for this one, sweated buckets. I suppose the buggy does add a bit of an extra dimension to a run.

    Sat: Session 8x1k off 90secs.
    Instructions were to just loosen the legs a bit, see how they felt, no faster than 10k pace, let it out a little towards the end if I was feeling good but just get things moving again. So basically safety first! Brought the eldest fella to a 7th birthday party so had 2 hours and an industrial estate to myself :) found a nice loop that was almost inch perfect for the km + recovery meters. 2 clockwise, 2 anti clockwise, 2 clockwise and 2 anti clockwise, the clockwise loops being the trickier.

    First 2 >> 3:59, 3:55
    >> 3:48, 3:41
    >> 3:57, 3:55
    >> 3:39, 3:22

    Wore my new Adidas Takumi Ren that
    I picked up around Christmas. Lightest shoe I've ran in but very comfortable. Don't think I'd stray over 10k in them though.....

    Session felt great. Pace wasn't an issue, had to reign it in on a few of the reps. Let her out on the last one, felt good to be motoring again. Have 3 weeks until the Irish Runner 5 Mile, gonna do a 5k the weekend before, that Arthur's Way 5k near the Lyons estate probably, the evening start suits me that day. Will see how the sessions go and pick a couple of targets. PB's in 5k & 5mile are fairly soft.....


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Have bit the Strava bullet and signed up.....used some site tapiirik or something and most of my runs seem to have crossed over...anyway was looking to follow a few of the people on here but not sure of many peoples real names :) is there a boards club or something? anyway here's my own profile


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    There is, Boards AC
    Can't link, on my phone


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Mon: Rest

    Tue: 12k V Easy: 1:01:53 @5:10/km

    Wed: 14k Easy: 1:07:16 @4:48/km
    Down in Avon Ri on a tour, so had a great run along the greenway up to Russborough House and back

    Thu: 10k Steady: 42:07 @4:13/km
    Had a small window for a run so after missing Monday due to a hangover and not being able to do a session Wed, I just went for a steady 10k. Feeling decent by the end but hadn't a great deal to eat that day beforehand so all in all not the best run but got a decent shift in.

    Fri: 10.6k Easy: 51:39 @4:53/km
    Loop of the plains. Training partner running the 100k race in Portumna so I gave him the Fenix 3. Ended up pulling up at 50k, a couple of injuries flared up. He really is a different kind of gravy though :) anyway got a Forerunner 610 which I really just don't have the wherewithal to figure out for the couple of days I have it!

    Sat: Session: 4x1min @faster than 5k pace, 6 mins @5k pace, 4x1min @faster than 5k pace. 4k w/u & 4k c/d.

    Took this from the Marathon Talk podcast the other week. The emphasis seemed to be on the last 4x1min and holding a decent pace. Picked 18min pace for the 6 mins. I plan on going a good bit lower so maybe I should have aimed a bit higher here, but I've been told to take it easy enough with my first couple of speed sessions back. Anyway session went great, 6min section was vwry manageable and I finished pretty strong. Looking forward to my 5k debut next Sat :)

    1st set 4 x 1min: 3:19, 3:12, 3:11, 3:14

    6mins @3:34

    2nd set 4 x 1min: 3:11, 3:09, 3:04, 2;59

    Sun: 90min Easy. c19k


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Mon: 14k Easy: 1:07:21 @4:49/km

    Re-upped my Lidl socks supply during this run :) €3 a pop you can't go wrong really.

    Tue: AM: 7.6k: 36:57 @4:52/km
    PM: 8k: 38:27 @4:48/km

    In and out of the Curragh.

    Wed: Session: 4x200m, 2x400m, 1x800m, 2x400m, 4x200m off 60secs jog recovery

    Holy moly.....this was a rough enough one. The soothing words of advice I had been given were 'It's a tough one, you should be hanging on by the end'. First session like this that I'd done on my own for a while didn't make it any easier. But i have 2 races coming up over the next week so I wanted to have a good one.

    Splits were:
    40, 38, 35, 35
    76, 74
    2:31
    74, 72,
    36, 35, 35, 35

    More or less hit the splits that I was given (35, 73, 2:35) but found it tough going. Wind didn't help but now it's done I'm happy to have it in the bag.

    Not sure what approach to take with the 5k on Sat. Not sure of the course or the field, I'd prefer to do the Castleknock 5k Sat morning but that's not an option so I'm doing the Arthurs Way 5k in Ardclough. I figure I can run under 18mins relatively straightforward, but by how much is the question? I don't mind going out hard and crashing, the 5 Miler the following weekend is my priority, but I'd like to post a nice time. So aim to get in safely under the 18mins or have a good rattle at it and see what happens. I have of course never actually ran a 5k race before.......


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭OOnegative


    From reading on jake1970’s log that race is ran along the Grand Canal paths so should be fairly flat. Best of luck with it, first two miles hard as fcuk then hold on for dear life!!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,582 ✭✭✭Swashbuckler


    Best of luck. Go out hard and hang on. Haha


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Thu: AM Commute: 7.5k: 37:44 @5:02/km
    Into a pretty horrible wind :(
    PM Commute: 8k: 38:48 @4:48/km
    Nice wind on the back :)

    Fri: 8k w/pooch no watch. c45mins

    Sat: Arthur's Way 5k: 18:51@3:42/km

    Well........
    Pre Race statements of running under 18mins 'relatively straightforward' look a little cringworthy after that showing. Wasn't feeling it at any stage if the day. Sleep has been ropey lately but that's really nothing new for me. Felt crap the whole day, considered pulling out but I wanted the legs to get a blowout before the 5 Miler next Sunday. Plus I just figured I'd feel alright once the race came around.....

    Race:
    Lap of the GAA pitch to start, settled in about 15th I'd say coming out the gate. First km 3:40, moving along the canal now, picked off a couple of runners and myself and another chap were sort of working together. 2nd km 3:31km. Feeling decent at this point and kept the pace honest but was beginning to slow a little in the 3rd, another 3:40km. At this point we left the canal and into the Lyons estate, well the long driveway into the Lyons estate. (Oversold a little in the race description :) ).
    Energy levels very low here, was sort of on my own, gaining a little on the guys in front but not a while lot happening. I'd describe effort levels here as being like a hard tempo. I just couldn't muster anything. Mental, physical I don't know the reason. Got in around 18:50. Talking to guys who'd finished in front the course was about 150/200m long but that wasn't a big issue. 18:30 would have been just as disappointing.
    So there you go, first 5k was a bit of a wash out. Hopefully it will wake up the legs for next week. I WILL leave it all out there for the 5 Miler which is a target race. My mate who gives me my training programmes wasn't overly keen on me running the 5k, so maybe I should have just listened to him like I usually do!

    Sun: 16k: 1:19:22 @4:58/km
    Licking wounds......meant to do 22/24k....just couldn't be arsed!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭OOnegative


    Can’t sugar coat $hite Dude, it’s still $hite!! Surprised to see your time yesterday evening, your much better than that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    OOnegative wrote: »
    Can’t sugar coat $hite Dude, it’s still $hite!! Surprised to see your time yesterday evening, your much better than that.

    I hope it didn't come across that I was trying to sugar coat anything! :(


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭OOnegative


    healy1835 wrote: »
    I hope it didn't come across that I was trying to sugar coat anything! :(

    I wasn’t having a go and I hope you know that, rubbish performance by you. Your capable of much better than that. Apologies for the bad choice of words in original post.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    OOnegative wrote: »
    I wasn’t having a go and I hope you know that, rubbish performance by you. Your capable of much better than that. Apologies for the bad choice of words in original post.

    Oh I never thought that for a milli second pal.....this log is very grateful for your contributions :) I just didn't want anyone to think I wasn't owning that performance, which was very much a pile of ****e :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭OOnegative


    Bit more like it!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Mon: 16k: 1:17:08 @4:48/km

    Tue: 6k w/ pooch c40mins
    Mental day. Wasn't gonna head out but the dog guilted me into taking her out.

    Wed: 12k: 55:51 @4:39/km
    As often happens in my line of work June is turning out to be a bit of a drainer....16x400m got canned as I couldn't make it put after work. Didn't get out til late enough and headspace was in no place for a session. Then as happens from time to time I felt like a million dollars on the run and managed to churn out a steady enough effort that didn't feel like an effort at all.

    Thu: 14k: 1:11:25 @5:06/km
    Easy effort late into the evening. Curragh was glorious on the longest day of the year.

    Fri: 10.5k: 51:28 @4:54/km
    Straight after a lunch thing in work. Belly was full enough but felt in good nick.

    Sat: 8k w/buggy. About 6k of running, a few strides, a bit of walking and carrying as my passenger got a little grumpy in the last couple of k :) last shake out before 5 Miler.

    Sun: Irish Runner 5 Mile: 29:51@3:42/km

    Got up to the PP in decent time. Feet had been a little tender from night before and the questionable decision to wear flip flops as my footwear of choice at the Kildare game! But the warm up allayed any fears on that count. I was feeling a lot better than I was the previous week, but I had still scaled expectations back a bit, and decided that id be happy with a PB of any description . Lined up beside the 30mins pacer, Thomas Cotter and hoped for the best :o

    Pacer was very chatty and told the group that he was going to bank a few seconds in the first mile and then back off to 6min mile pace. True to his word after a 3:33 first km, we settled into the goal pace. Group was small enough, maybe 10 people, and as we moved on to the north road I was feeling fairly comfortable. Km 2 was 3:43. At this stage I started to have some real motivation issues. We were headed back towards Chesterfield Avenue and the thoughts of maintaining this pace for another 5k was just not very appealing. Thought about pulling into the side and walking back to the car as we went back up Chesterfield Ave, but tried to zone out and think about it again in a few minutes. Km s 3&4 3:40 & 3:43.
    Moving down Ordnance Survey road, again I'm just thinking about pulling in. But I made a deal that id at least get to 5k before I did it :) through 5k in 18:23, I'm feeling ok. I'm not flat out at this stage but I know I'll have to dig deep come the Furry Glen. The heat is a factor but not a big one if I'm honest. Into the Furry Glen and the pacer is great. Slowing a little, going to the back of the group, telling everyone to drive the arms etc. And before you know it 7k is showing on the watch and I'm actually feeling a bit better about the whole situation! Bring it home with a 3:40km for 29:51.....

    If you told me I'd run that time after I finished Limerick I'd have been disappointed and would have hoped to go a good bit faster but I think Rotterdam and Limerick have taken a bit more out of me than I thought. I felt in good shape today, I just struggled mentally if I'm honest. Have a stag in Edinburgh next weekend so gonna recharge batteries over the next couple of weeks and then start training for Dublin. Looking forward to it :)

    Oh, an 8sec PB as well ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭OOnegative


    Good man, where was that 18.23 last week....... Bit of downtime before getting stuck into DCM will do you good. Your in great nick.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    So since the Irish Runner 5 Mile I've ate a lot of crap, drank a lot of beers and had a great time. Still kept my eye in with a few runs...

    Mon 25th: 13.3k: 1:10:15 @5:17/km

    Thu 28th: Lunch: 5.3k: 24:52 @4:43/km
    After work: 5k: 23:22 @4:40/km

    Really struggled to get these in but i knew there was nothing happening over the weekend so squeezed these in :)

    Tue: 14k: 1:06:10 @4:44/I'm

    Was dreading this, but maybe that down week and skinful of Tennants I had in Edinburgh over the weekend was just what was needed. Great weekend topped off by Kildare beating Mayo in probably the only match that it's ever going to beneficial for me to have a season ticket for......but a small price to pay. I'll say nothing yet though.

    Wed: 10.2k Buggy: 50:14 @4:56/km

    Thu: 4Mile Tempo: 24:51 @3:51/km(4k w/u & 3k c/d)

    Wanted to do something fast this week to make sure I was still in decent shape :) chose this tempo on a whim, meant to be 5mile but I managed to come upon a guy who'd creased himself in the Park doing pull ups on the outdoor gym equipment, so by the time I'd ascertained that he was going to be ok, time had moved on and so had my rhythm :( had a small enough window for this so left it at 4miles and jogged home. Effort felt pretty comfortable and I finished run safe in the knowledge that I hadn't undone all my training over one week.

    Ps. Wore the Adios Boosts for the first time since Rotterdam. I like those shoes.....they'll be back for some more serious stuff in the months ahead :)

    Friday: 11.5k Buggy: 57:21 @4:59/km
    One would be fairly perspiring by the end of these buggy runs :) jaysus....

    Sat down with my buddy and tentatively planned the outline of the 16 week training block for DCM and the first 4 weeks in a bit more detail. Mileage is gonna be upped this time, 130/140k for most weeks. Long slow mileage on the cards for the first couple of weeks with a couple of sessions slowly introduced. He wants me to up the mileage but pare things back on the pace side of things, threading carefully after Rotterdam and Limerick.

    Races tentatively include;

    Mullingar 10 Mile @wk3

    AN Other 5Mile/10k @wk5/6

    Frank Duffy @wk8

    Race Series Half @wk11

    AN Other 5Mile/10k @13/14

    Target is 2:55. Looking forward to it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    Fully custom 16wk block or an edit from abother plan? Is 130-140k a new volume for you or have you done that for other marathon cycles? And is that avg or peak volume?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Fully custom 16wk block or an edit from abother plan? Is 130-140k a new volume for you or have you done that for other marathon cycles? And is that avg or peak volume?

    Yeah I'd have been consistently around 110-120k for the last couple of cycles, peaking at 130k. But for this one, yeah its pretty much 140k for non race weeks. Now as always this can/will change depending on how things are coming together.....which answers your other question; it's a custom plan alright. But I don't think it's going to differ drastically from the approach that we've been taking thus far.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Sat: 20k Easy: 1:37:36 @4:53/km
    Longish effort out onto the plains and then home. Glorious place to be on a morning like that.

    Sun: 13.3k Easy: 1:04:10 @4:49/km

    Out at Kildare Animal Foundation Field day with the whole gang, so stuck the gear in the boot and ran home to Newbridge. :)

    Dublin Marathon 2018: Week 1 of 16

    Mon: AM: 12.1k: 1:00:23 @4:59/km
    PM: 11.1k: 55:41 @5:00/km

    New Nike Pegasus 35's made their debut today. Very nice.....

    Tue: 12k Buggy: 59:35 @4:58/km

    Wed: 17k: 1:22:45 @4:52/km

    Thu: AM: 12.1k Buggy: 1:00:00 @4:57/km
    PM: 9k: 44:01 @4:53/km

    Fri: 11k: 53:20 @4:51/km

    Sat: 30k Long Run.

    So my mate was doing his first 10Mile race at the Irish Runner 10Miler so I said I'd get 14k in before the race and then pace him around. Got 14k in, 1:09:30 @4:58/km.
    My buddy was aiming for 95mins or thereabouts so we set off at that pace but unfortunately he was struggling badly with some allergies so at the 5mile marker he called it a day and I said i might as well finish out the last 5miles and put a bit of an effort in.
    Finished in about 32:30 for the second 5 miles which makes this run the only time I've ever ran MP miles or faster in a long run :) obviously being towards the back of the field made those 5 Miles seem even faster as I was moving at a faster pace than those around me, got a few double takes and for a brief period of time got a slight idea of what it must be like to be a genuinely fast runner :)

    Sun: 6k Easy: 30:31 @5:05/km Brought up the 120k for the Week with this one and then off to Croker to see the Lilywhites :(

    So that's the first week done. All easy miles with the exception of the unscripted finish to the LR. similar next week but have a session pencilled in for later in the week.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭healy1835


    Dublin Marathon 2018: Week 2 of 16

    Mon: 16k Recovery: 80ish mins
    Tired from the previous days pints and exertions in Croke Park, also forgot my watch had actually died on Hill 16 during the Kildare game, so ventured out and ran my usual 10Mile route.

    Tue: 15.1k Easy: 1:15:13 @4:59

    Wed: Unscheduled Rest day.....stuff came up :(

    Thu: Said stuff almost gave me a double donut but made it out for.....
    17.5k Easy: 1:23:58 @4:48/km
    Up through the town and then out on to the plains for a big lap in the glorious evening sunshine.

    Fri: 8 Miles Relaxed/Steady: 55:20 @4:18/km

    2k w/u & c/d

    Instructions were that this was NOT an 8 Mile tempo and just to run relaxed. Had 4:30's in mind, but didn't look at watch until 2k in and that pace seemed like the perfect effort. Said I'd try and bring it back around 7min miles. Effort felt spot on, proper sessions start next week. Happy with how that went, feeling pretty fit at the moment and, touch wood, can keep improving. 30k Long Run Sunday, 6x1 Mile midweek and then Mullingar 10 Miler next Saturday.....


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