2016 U.S. Presidential Race Megathread Mark 2.

Nody

Thomas_... wrote: »

I see too much red in there. Too much of it an today is just another sh1te day in this awkward year 2016.

And yet Clinton took the popular vote; goes to show that something is wrong with the system.

Jawgap

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Comey was pressured by the DOJ. The DOJ was actually colluding with Clinton in the initial email investigation. On two counts, Billo meeting yer wan in the back of the plane, and Hillary getting a email called "heads up" from Kadzik telling her what's going to be coming up.

Farcical when you think of it.

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Wikileaks.

So, Bill's conversation was on Wikileaks?

.....and there was an email with 'heads up' in the header?

Wow, definitely a smoking gun there......and how is that evidence of Comey being pressured by the DoJ or the 'DoJ' (who in the DoJ?) colluding with Hillary?

Jawgap

Jawgap wrote: »

So, Bill's conversation was on Wikileaks?

.....and there was an email with 'heads up' in the header?

Wow, definitely a smoking gun there......and how is that evidence of Comey being pressured by the DoJ or the 'DoJ' (who in the DoJ?) colluding with Hillary?

https://twitter.com/SnoozeInBrief/status/792354973153628160

BoJack Horseman

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

it's just that he was just more popular in places where turnips are grown, yessir yeehaw.

Indeed..... those cursed simple plebs.... screwing things up again.

Never change boards!

Hank Scorpio

Jawgap wrote: »

So, Bill's conversation was on Wikileaks?

.....and there was an email with 'heads up' in the header?

Wow, definitely a smoking gun there......and how is that evidence of Comey being pressured by the DoJ or the 'DoJ' (who in the DoJ?) colluding with Hillary?

The email from Kazdik is there, it wasn't just a heads up in the header.

https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/43150

Bill was seen by a freelance reporter meeting with Loretta Lynch in the back of the plane for 45 minutes right before Hillarys hearing.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3822307/How-Bill-Clinton-plotted-bushwhack-attorney-general-airport-tarmac-got-promise-Hillary-wouldn-t-prosecuted-classified-emails.html

She's being sued right now. If you're not familar with wikileaks you should probably lose the smart tone.

The Comey thing? Well put 2 and 2 together.

Jawgap

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Because Trump isn't manipulative! DO you honestly foresee him standing by even 10% of his empty promises and wishy washy "change" / "shake it up" speeches.

The man has no plan. And in a way that's good as it allows the likes of Pence to basically be president behind the scenes with Trump taking the media glory.

It's just pure soundbites from him. so he is 10 x more manipulative than other candidates down the years. and that's what got him elected

It'll be interesting to see how much of what he promised at Gettysburg will be delivered. In the first 100 days he promised to ...

• begin the process of "removing the more than two million criminal, illegal immigrants"
• deny visa-free travel to countries who refused to take back their citizens
• repeal every Obama executive order
• introduce restrictions on White House officials becoming lobbyists
• work to introduce term limits for members of Congress
• cancel of all payments to UN climate change programmes (and use that money to fix US infrastructure)
• label China a currency manipulator

The wall wasn't timelined.

HensVassal

cnocbui wrote: »

Never underestimate the stupidity of the American people.

Enjoy:

https://www.rt.com/news/365966-putin-trump-congratulates-victory/

Jawgap

Jawgap wrote: »

So Trump supporters think one of his first acts should be to use the office for the purposes of political retribution? Not veterans' care, a capital spending programme, or even start the deportations.....but taking out the political opposition.....

In that case, some modern day Eugene Joe McCarthy should fit the bill.

EDIT: Meant to say Joe McCarthy, not Eugene

A significant part of the vote for him was in protest that she got away with what she did. If you're so quick to want him to do things, then it means Obama didn't do a good job while he was there.. You should be happy he spends his time chasing down political corruption instead of all the things you're worried about him doing.

BoatMad wrote: »

I agree, its a shocking indictment of her character

It was always about her.. If it were for the people, she'd have come out. Trump would be destroyed for life for doing what she did.

Nody wrote: »

And yet Clinton took the popular vote; goes to show that something is wrong with the system.

It makes sense in a country the size of America and the losing side will always have a problem with it.. I would have if Clinton won.

But realistically, its to stop politicians campaigning for what only matters to the most populated places.. "I'm going to make sure the west coast has all the jobs and there are no taxes in any major city on the east coast."

Thomas_...

Nody wrote: »

Thomas_... wrote: »

I see too much red in there. Too much of it an today is just another sh1te day in this awkward year 2016.

And yet Clinton took the popular vote; goes to show that something is wrong with the system.

Yes, that system is outdated and is from the 19th Century where "bold riders" had to deliver the vote despatches to Washington. I remember the PEs when G.W.B. jr. was elected and some "irregularities" were subject of debates. He also just narrowly made it to get elected and there was more but just some speculation on vote fraud or other ways of manipulation. A couple of weeks ago, the Americans suspected the Russians to have the means to manipulate the election results in this PE. That was of course denied by the Russians, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was some manipulation given that this system works online and Russians are suspected to have hacked Clintons email account and leaked those emails to stir up the scandal anew and the acting of the FBI Boss (he himself being a Republican) is also very suspicious to me.

Now that Clinton has lost, it was of course all correct, reliable and clean. Well, I can't be arsed by them for I wouldn't trust them Republicans one meter off my shoes. But for the Trumpers, it's all democracy where if it had turned out the other way, it had been all manipulation and fraud. Utter hypocrites, the lot of them.

Jawgap

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

https://twitter.com/SnoozeInBrief/status/792354973153628160

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

The email from Kazdik is there, it wasn't just a heads up in the header.

https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/43150

Bill was seen by a freelance reporter meeting with Loretta Lynch in the back of the plane for 45 minutes right before Hillarys hearing.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3822307/How-Bill-Clinton-plotted-bushwhack-attorney-general-airport-tarmac-got-promise-Hillary-wouldn-t-prosecuted-classified-emails.html

She's being sued right now. If you're not familar with wikileaks you should probably lose the smart tone.

The Comey thing? Well put 2 and 2 together.

And how does any of that support this....

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Comey was pressured by the DOJ. The DOJ was actually colluding with Clinton in the initial email investigation. On two counts, Billo meeting yer wan in the back of the plane, and Hillary getting a email called "heads up" from Kadzik telling her what's going to be coming up.

Farcical when you think of it.

now if only the Yanks would get rid of the pesky Bill of Rights that's stop the Fifth Amendment getting in the way of such additive justice......

Seems like innuendo, supposition and circumstance will be enough to get you denounced in the world of the Trump supporter.

Quite deplorable actually.

BoJack Horseman

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Indeed..... those cursed simple plebs.... screwing things up again.

Never change boards!

I'm originally a culchie myself, and we grow spuds. Just making light of a bizarre situation.

But undeniably, it was a rural vote; that's why geographic representations are misleading. Population density is smallest in the red areas of the map.

Chips Lovell

HensVassal wrote: »

Blaming the people for their decision is bull****.

Who should we blame then? Surely it's a tenet of democracy that the people take responsibility for the decisions they make?

Hank Scorpio

Jawgap wrote: »

And how does any of that support this....



now if only the Yanks would get rid of the pesky Bill of Rights that's stop the Fifth Amendment getting in the way of such additive justice......

Seems like innuendo, supposition and circumstance will be enough to get you denounced in the world of the Trump supporter.

Quite deplorable actually.

Because from what I read ( and i'm no expert ) the DOJ can block the FBI going forward on investigations, asking for search warrants etc.

Given that Clinton has openly colluded with 2 DOJ officers in the first email investigation ( one she should have never gotten away with ), I think assuming there's people there protecting her is a normal assumption.

Bear in mind we only get certain emails from the leaks, so there's a strong possibility the collusion was on a much higher level with many different people.

Nody

Deleted User wrote: »

But realistically, its to stop politicians campaigning for what only matters to the most populated places.. "I'm going to make sure the west coast has all the jobs and there are no taxes in any major city on the east coast."

Sorry not an American so not a voter or a loser of the election but what you describe is what already happens today except they are called swing states instead. And in those swing states the politicians will target their part of the state (be it the major towns or rural) to get most bang for the buck as well. Moving it to let's say 50 regions split on even population instead with popular vote being the deciding factor would open up the number of swing states a lot more and without the winner takes all approach all those 50 states are now in play and are important.

MadYaker

Looks like she won the popular vote..... carnage in the stock market. Interesting times ahead. His initial speech was encouraging though. No Hillary bashing, very sensible and dignified compared to what I was expecting.

HensVassal

cnocbui wrote: »

Remember those words when the Russian tanks are crossing borders.

Apple and those other US companies that make stuff in China must be ecstatic. If you have shares in any of them, sell them the minute the market opens today.

Like the Russian "invasion" of Ukraine I'll be asking you "Whatever happened to those Russian tanks crossing the borders?"

:pac:

Snickers Man

Jawgap wrote: »

The contractors are already lined up......

I think I know what the Americans would say to that

Hank Scorpio

vetinari wrote: »

Comey you ****ing traitor, what an absolute c**t. He deserves to be in prison.

With Hillary?

It's her fault, she ran the private server.

26000 Elephants

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

If someone like Trump ran here with a simple plan to abolish car tax, cut income tax and provide jobs he would win.

We already had that guy in '77. Charles Haughy. Look where that got us.

Thomas_...

26000 Elephants wrote: »

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

If someone like Trump ran here with a simple plan to abolish car tax, cut income tax and provide jobs he would win.

We already had that guy in '77. Charles Haughy. Look where that got us.

Celtic Tiger, messed up by Bertie.

26000 Elephants

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

...Those people would go to jail or at the very least have a trial.

There is really no hope for America now, is there?

Nody

Nody wrote: »

Sorry not an American so not a voter or a loser of the election but what you describe is what already happens today except they are called swing states instead. And in those swing states the politicians will target their part of the state (be it the major towns or rural) to get most bang for the buck as well. Moving it to let's say 50 regions split on even population instead with popular vote being the deciding factor would open up the number of swing states a lot more and without the winner takes all approach all those 50 states are now in play and are important.

I guess the swing states have a significant number of electoral college votes available and are usually hotly contested.. California has an incredible number of votes (56 I think) but is very Democratic so isn't a swing state. It's a given that Hillary would get it whereas the swing states could go either way.

To get into why they target certain areas, a lot of it comes down to Gerrymandering which is a ridiculous notion altogether. There's likely far more to it but I'm not versed in this stuff.

BorneTobyWilde

vetinari wrote: »

Comey you ****ing traitor, what an absolute c**t. He deserves to be in prison.

He had political pressure right from the top coming down on him to write that letter on Sunday. He's just a man, even you would have protected your interests . He had an invisible gun to his head.

HensVassal

Jawgap wrote: »

How?

Seriously how?

His speech struck a nice tone, but how is he going to reduce taxes and increase infrastructure spending and maintain fiscal discipline?

Maybe sell one aircraft carrier? That should settle the infrastructure bill.

Hank Scorpio

Jawgap wrote: »

Sorry, what?

Clinton "targets weak minorities and manipulates the media"? What is it that Trump does?

The DNC, Hillary's party, openly collude with major news networks like CNN.

CNN is basically propraganda for the liberals. NBC and others have emails showing collusion too. There's a TONNE of stuff.

Here's an example from Wikileaks and a CNN puppet called Wolf Blitzer

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3912164/Latest-Wikileaks-dump-8-000-new-emails-shows-DNC-prepared-anchors-Wolf-Blitzer-Jake-Tapper-interviews-Trump-Cruz.html

About the minorities, that's what she does. She meets in private with black lives matter etc, when IMO she doesn't give a crap about any of them and only wants their vote.

She had the entire mainstream media on her side, up against a supposed "Racist" (cnn propapanda) and still lost in a landslide. Pathetic really, maybe if she wasn't so fake people would have believed the crap she spiels

Jawgap

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Because from what I read ( and i'm no expert ) the DOJ can block the FBI going forward on investigations, asking for search warrants etc.

DoJ doesn't grant search warrants - and yes a USADA can opt not apply for one if they feel the evidentiary test is not met - how is that anything other than good legal practice?

Under Trump with the FBI get pre-signed blank search warrants to be filled in when they need them?

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Given that Clinton has openly colluded with 2 DOJ officers in the first email investigation ( one she should have never gotten away with ), I think assuming there's people there protecting her is a normal assumption.

Bear in mind we only get certain emails from the leaks, so there's a strong possibility the collusion was on a much higher level with many different people.

Which DoJ officers and where's the evidence?

And what? You presume she's guilty and the evidence is there just waiting to be found?

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

As a sidenote, to anyone who may doubt media bias, The Guardian just had this up when analysing his speech.

Trump has here pledged a moderated version of his “America first” slogan, which he stopped using in recent weeks – the Anti-Defamation League has noted the phrase’s origins among isolationists and Nazi sympathizers before the second world war. This new variation is both typical of presidential candidates – high-flying, optimistic, friendly to the world and very vague – and specific to Trump: “beautiful”, without details and with a hint of grievance.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2016/nov/09/president-victory-speech-annotated

I can see why so many people thought she was going to win.. When popular media write up stuff like that.
That isn't an editorial.. That's going all-in on Godwin's Law.

Thomas_...

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Jawgap wrote: »

Sorry, what?

Clinton "targets weak minorities and manipulates the media"? What is it that Trump does?

The DNC, Hillary's party, openly collude with major news networks like CNN.

CNN is basically propraganda for the liberals. NBC and others have emails showing collusion too. There's a TONNE of stuff.

Here's an example from Wikileaks and a CNN puppet called Wolf Blitzer

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3912164/Latest-Wikileaks-dump-8-000-new-emails-shows-DNC-prepared-anchors-Wolf-Blitzer-Jake-Tapper-interviews-Trump-Cruz.html

About the minorities, that's what she does. She meets in private with black lives matter etc, when IMO she doesn't give a crap about any of them and only wants their vote.

She had the entire mainstream media on her side, up against a supposed "Racist" (cnn propapanda) and still lost in a landslide. Pathetic really, maybe if she wasn't so fake people would have believed the crap she spiels

Every politician is seeking to get the votes for him-/herself in the first place and frankly, I don't hold wikileaks as that reliable and unbiased as many like to see them. I often wonder who else has any interests in their work and who is behind it. I don't buy them their story of being "the Knights of the truth". Otherwise, Mr Assange wouldn't had the need to hide himself in an embassy of a foreign state in London, wouldn't he?

Jawgap

HensVassal wrote: »

Maybe sell one aircraft carrier? That should settle the infrastructure bill.

To who?

Leaving aside who might be able to afford one, the US aside who has the capacity, knowhow and experience to operate a Nimitz class strike carrier, along with its CBG, strike group and replenishment support?

130Kph

Maintaining the electoral college system is an unnecessary mistake – it’s muddling a logical popular vote method to elect a government with a geographic first past the post winner take all weighting (based on 18th century circumstances & thinking).

A third political party might help; a gutted and completely new democratic party may help.

But a deeper division is rural (lower skilled/unskilled) conservatives versus urban democrats.

Huge numbers of people are not doing well out of capitalism – made worse by globalisation.

This result is, in my opinion, all about the age old question of wealth distribution.

So 60 million (mostly rural) Americans need to be re-tooled (quickly) to compete with the South Koreans/Germans on one hand and Indonesians & Thais on the other.
Trump will absolutely not do it; the thing is, I don’t think any party or even economist has the answer to a problem of that scale.

Jawgap

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

The DNC, Hillary's party, openly collude with major news networks like CNN.

CNN is basically propraganda for the liberals. NBC and others have emails showing collusion too. There's a TONNE of stuff.

Here's an example from Wikileaks and a CNN puppet called Wolf Blitzer

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3912164/Latest-Wikileaks-dump-8-000-new-emails-shows-DNC-prepared-anchors-Wolf-Blitzer-Jake-Tapper-interviews-Trump-Cruz.html

About the minorities, that's what she does. She meets in private with black lives matter etc, when IMO she doesn't give a crap about any of them and only wants their vote.

She had the entire mainstream media on her side, up against a supposed "Racist" (cnn propapanda) and still lost in a landslide. Pathetic really, maybe if she wasn't so fake people would have believed the crap she spiels

And that paragon of unbiased reporting of fact - Fox?

vetinari

Hopefully it'll be the Trump supporters that get ****ed the most by the impending recession. Their jobs aren't coming back because they no longer ****ing exist.

Saipanne

Does anyone think Trump's victory is good news for Julian Assange?

Kilboor

Next George Soros ****s off and I'm even happier

Hank Scorpio

Jawgap wrote: »

DoJ doesn't grant search warrants - and yes a USADA can opt not apply for one if they feel the evidentiary test is not met - how is that anything other than good legal practice?

Under Trump with the FBI get pre-signed blank search warrants to be filled in when they need them?



Which DoJ officers and where's the evidence?

And what? You presume she's guilty and the evidence is there just waiting to be found?

I think she's guilty obviously.. like Trey Gowdy said her real trial was in the election tonight and she lost. Look on wikileaks reddit, there's more info there on Hillary and her team. Some of it is disgusting.

Putin says Russia ready to fully restore ties with U.S.

I'll happily take that over the instant problems that Hillary was going to cause.

Saipanne

Saipanne wrote: »

Does anyone think Trump's victory is good news for Julian Assange?

No, not really.. Great news for Ecuador though.

HensVassal

cnocbui wrote: »

Markets will be down 30-50% within a week.

OK......put your money where your mouth is. Open a spreadtrading account, stick 10grand in it and short sell everything you can starting this afternoon. You'll be rich this time 2 weeks.

Or you could just be waffling, making halfbaked sour grapes comments.

Hank Scorpio

Saipanne wrote: »

Does anyone think Trump's victory is good news for Julian Assange?

I feel so bad for him stuck in that embassy. He must worry about his Family all the time. That "Rape" charge drawing him to Sweden is a big fat lie.

There's no doubts wikileaks helped Trump immensely exposing the corruption of Clinton and her cronies. #pizza

Would be great if Trump could help him.

Amerika

Let's see. Some effects of a Trump win...

Barbara Streisand is moving to Canada, Cher is moving to Jupiter, and Miley Cyrus is moving to some country where clothing is optional. Amy Schumer is moving to Spain, George Lopez is going to Mexico, Jon Stewart is moving to another planet (to be determined), and Chelsea Handler and Whoopi Goldberg have already made contingency plans... destination unknown. Samuel L. Jackson is moving to South Africa, Lena Dunham and Neve Campbell to Canada, and Natasha Lyonne said she would hightail it to a mental hospital. Best of all... Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg said it’d be time to move to New Zealand -- GREAT another SCOTUS pick for Trump. Is there any way we can hold these celebrities to their words?

jobbridge4life

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Can you seriously not distinguish between Trump, who isn't even a real Republican, and the true, ideological Republicans?

They'll work together on areas of common interest, but there's no way Congress will allow a corporation tax of 15%, for example, and the maaassive deficit that would require.

I certainly can but most Republicans believe awful things and we will see awful things.

Hank Scorpio

Amerika wrote: »

Let's see. Some effects of a Trump win...

Barbara Streisand is moving to Canada, Cher is moving to Jupiter, and Miley Cyrus is moving to some country where clothing is optional. Amy Schumer is moving to Spain, George Lopez is going to Mexico, Jon Stewart is moving to another planet (to be determined), and Chelsea Handler and Whoopi Goldberg have already made contingency plans... destination unknown. Samuel L. Jackson is moving to South Africa, Lena Dunham and Neve Campbell to Canada, and Natasha Lyonne said she would hightail it to a mental hospital. Best of all... Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg said it’d be time to move to New Zealand -- GREAT another SCOTUS pick for Trump. Is there any way we can hold these celebrities to their words?

All a bunch of phonie shills with no perception of reality, lady gaga went running out the door tonight when Trump started winning :rolleyes:

Call Me Jimmy

HensVassal wrote: »

OK......put your money where your mouth is. Open a spreadtrading account, stick 10grand in it and short sell everything you can starting this afternoon. You'll be rich this time 2 weeks.

Or you could just be waffling, making halfbaked sour grapes comments.

What was the actual effect of brexit? There was the same talk, I never followed how it went after that?

Christy42

HensVassal wrote: »

OK......put your money where your mouth is. Open a spreadtrading account, stick 10grand in it and short sell everything you can starting this afternoon. You'll be rich this time 2 weeks.

Or you could just be waffling, making halfbaked sour grapes comments.

You can't just open an account and short sell as you might not have the money to cover it if it booms so they aren't allowed unless they are already a large trader.

HensVassal

seamus wrote: »

I'm not sure if being "pro business" is good enough though really. Trump is a terrible businessman in every regard.
I'm not sure the markets will put a lot of stock (pun intended) in his capability.

That said though, it's the other houses who will control most of the domestic policy, so it'll be a good day to be an American oligarch and a bad day to be an average American worker.
Foreign policy is a different matter though. Trump will be a complete disaster on that front, worse than GWB, Reagan, or Nixon, so has the potential to put the value of the dollar in the toilet.

Being a terrible businessman isn't a problem. Bush jr. rammed every business he ever touched into the ground....Arbusto, Harken Energy, some airline food operation, that baseball team. Business-wise everything Bush touched turned to excrement. Trump isn't as dire as Bush was.

4068ac1elhodqr

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

What was the actual effect of brexit? There was the same talk, I never followed how it went after that?

They'll be asked again.
Then they'll loose again, and loose Scotland also.
J.C. (Labour) will win the early general election as a result of this.

TheOven

Amerika wrote: »

Let's see. Some effects of a Trump win...

Barbara Streisand is moving to Canada, Cher is moving to Jupiter, and Miley Cyrus is moving to some country where clothing is optional. Amy Schumer is moving to Spain, George Lopez is going to Mexico, Jon Stewart is moving to another planet (to be determined), and Chelsea Handler and Whoopi Goldberg have already made contingency plans... destination unknown. Samuel L. Jackson is moving to South Africa, Lena Dunham and Neve Campbell to Canada, and Natasha Lyonne said she would hightail it to a mental hospital. Best of all... Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg said it’d be time to move to New Zealand -- GREAT another SCOTUS pick for Trump. Is there any way we can hold these celebrities to their words?

More likely to see Hannity being waterboarded.

At least they have the means to leave if it suits them.

jobbridge4life

Amerika wrote: »

Let's see. Some effects of a Trump win...

Barbara Streisand is moving to Canada, Cher is moving to Jupiter, and Miley Cyrus is moving to some country where clothing is optional. Amy Schumer is moving to Spain, George Lopez is going to Mexico, Jon Stewart is moving to another planet (to be determined), and Chelsea Handler and Whoopi Goldberg have already made contingency plans... destination unknown. Samuel L. Jackson is moving to South Africa, Lena Dunham and Neve Campbell to Canada, and Natasha Lyonne said she would hightail it to a mental hospital. Best of all... Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg said it’d be time to move to New Zealand -- GREAT another SCOTUS pick for Trump. Is there any way we can hold these celebrities to their words?

And you will be left with Ted Nugent and Scott Bacio... so we can see a cultural implosion of the United States as well as, economic and diplomatic.

What a vision you have for America.

spacecoyote

So, how long before this actually becomes a reality