2016 U.S. Presidential Race Megathread Mark 2.

Feline Grabber

frostyjacks wrote: »

I don't get all the faux hysteria over some off air comments between two heterosexual males. What do people think we talk about in private? You think Hilary talks about saving the planet in her private conversations? Gimmee a break. No wonder western society is going down the toilet.

I must be a minority, a lot of people seem to talk about sexually assaulting women with their friends. Mostly Trump supporters saying it which is interesting.

dwayneshintzy

realitykeeper wrote: »

2) I think the Democrats have set the stage for an enormous economic implosion.

how

Hunchback

frostyjacks wrote: »

I don't get all the faux hysteria over some off air comments between two heterosexual males. What do people think we talk about in private? You think Hilary talks about saving the planet in her private conversations? Gimmee a break. No wonder western society is going down the toilet.

It's not faux hysteria. It is legitimate frustration that there is even a possibility that the most powerful political position in the world could possibly go to a man who relishes in the fact that he can sexually assault women at will by virtue of the fact that he is a 'star'.

aloyisious

frostyjacks wrote: »

I don't get all the faux hysteria over some off air comments between two heterosexual males. What do people think we talk about in private? You think Hilary talks about saving the planet in her private conversations? Gimmee a break. No wonder western society is going down the toilet.

Lol. except it wasn't some private casual locker-room off-air comment. It was a chat when the show participants were heading out to appear with the cameras rolling in their faces. Don was caught with his knickers down talking about what he'd do with the contents of an O/P's knickers. Time for him to fess up and be a man.

aloyisious

This opinion-piece from the New York Post by Ed Rollins, a GOP strategist who runs the pro-Trump Great America Super Pac.

http://nypost.com/2016/10/08/6-ways-donald-trump-can-turn-his-campaign-around/

Igotadose

InTheTrees wrote: »

I bet her lawyers are drawing up a list of her demands from donald right now. A new aeroplane, maybe a yacht. More time off.

The marriage is over in about 2 years is my guess. Perhaps when their offspring is 18, though I doubt she waits that long. What, ya think Hair Furor isn't grabbing poon to this very day? Of course he is. Now, Melanoma's just a high-priced escort, but I think she's had enough even though she went into this business relationship clear-eyed.

And what divorce judge wouldn't give her everything? Prenups can be beaten

Suryavarman

frostyjacks wrote: »

I don't get all the faux hysteria over some off air comments between two heterosexual males. What do people think we talk about in private? You think Hilary talks about saving the planet in her private conversations? Gimmee a break. No wonder western society is going down the toilet.

You might be friends with a lot of men that brag about sexually assaulting women to men they barely know, most of us aren't, hence our disgust at Trump's comments.

Suryavarman

realitykeeper wrote: »

I do not agree with Hilary on most things and Donald seems to more clued in with a lot of things. Still, if I were a US voter I would vote for Hilary for two reasons. 1) I think Donald might be dangerous and 2) I think the Democrats have set the stage for an enormous economic implosion. They should be in office when it happens, to clean up their own mess.

Who I think will win is a different matter. I think it will be Donald. The reason being my sense of foreboding.

He's not clued in on anything apart from knowing how to alienate broad swathes of the electorate.

cowboyBuilder

So should Hillary step down because of her appaling treatment of women too ?

Her REAL actual appaling treatment of women and not just some lewd comment ??

Nah ... course not

Suryavarman

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

So should Hillary step down because of her appaling treatment of women too ?

Her REAL actual appaling treatment of women and not just some lewd comment ??

Nah ... course not

Hillary Clinton hasn't been recorded bragging about sexually assaulting women to men she barely knows.

PopePalpatine

Quin_Dub wrote: »

There is a very real difference between guys talking about women and saying things like " look at the T**s on her" or some other off colour inappropriate comments and Trump basically saying that his celebrity allows him to sexually assault women with impunity..

The former isn't acceptable but the latter is actually criminal.

You're talking to a guy who believes in alphabater bollocks, of course he'll defend Trump bragging about sexual assault, shure only "betas" ask for a woman's consent.

Brian?

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

So should Hillary step down because of her appaling treatment of women too ?

Her REAL actual appaling treatment of women and not just some lewd comment ??

Nah ... course not

Should Trump step doen because of his appalling treatment of women.

His REAL actual appalling treatment of women and not some lewd comment?

cowboyBuilder

Suryavarman wrote: »

Hillary Clinton hasn't been recorded bragging about sexually assaulting women to men she barely knows.

Nope - worse she defended a rapist of a 12 year old girl - she KNEW was guilty,she received 100s millions from Saudi Arabia, and we all know how they treat their women.

Suryavarman

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Nope - worse she defended a rapist of a 12 year old girl - she KNEW was guilty,she received 100s millions from Saudi Arabia, and we all know how they treat their women.

She was a lawyer. It was her job to defend people.

cowboyBuilder

Suryavarman wrote: »

Hillary Clinton hasn't been recorded bragging about sexually assaulting women to men she barely knows.

Was he bragging about actual sexual assault ?
sounded to me like hot air - just talk among the lads - still unacceptable for someone running for POTUS ... but again - Hillary worse.

cowboyBuilder

Suryavarman wrote: »

She was a lawyer. It was her job to defend people.

Ah that's ok then, a LEGAL defender of a child rapist , makes her morally superior.

dwayneshintzy

Clinton didn't want to take that case either, she was assigned it by the judge in the case. She had been on a list of lawyers that would assist low income defendants; the defendant requested a female lawyer, of which there were only 6 available (Clinton being one).

http://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-freed-child-rapist-laughed-about-it/

Suryavarman

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Was he bragging about actual sexual assault ?
sounded to me like hot air - just talk among the lads - still unacceptable for someone running for POTUS ... but again - Hillary worse.

What part of "grab them by the pussy" did you not understand?

Inquitus

Game over imo, unless wikileaks or someone finds something incredibly damning about Hillary this is done, and rightly so, he is unfit to govern anyone.

B_Wayne

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

Clinton didn't want to take that case either, she was assigned it by the judge in the case. She had been on a list of lawyers that would assist low income defendants; the defendant requested a female lawyer, of which there were only 6 available (Clinton being one).

http://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-freed-child-rapist-laughed-about-it/

I posted it a few pages back, it was conveniently ignored.

daithi7

Sorry, I'm gonna start the political post mortem already:

1. How did such a clown ever get to run for office?
2. How did such a childish clown ever win the Republican party nomination??
3. How has such a compete childish clown come with a point or 2 of being the favoured candidate for president of the USA???

Truly Scary!!

Billy86

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

So should Hillary step down because of her appaling treatment of women too ?

Her REAL actual appaling treatment of women and not just some lewd comment ??

Nah ... course not

Has Hillary Clinton been in court for rape on multiple occasions like Trump has been? Is she on video openly bragging about sexually assaulting women like Donald Trump is?

He's also got an upcoming hearing in December for repeatedly raping and threatening to murder a 13 year old child, something most were previously willing to write off as a conspiracy theory. Yet here we are.

Billy86

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Nope - worse she defended a rapist of a 12 year old girl - she KNEW was guilty,she received 100s millions from Saudi Arabia, and we all know how they treat their women.

Trump has received plenty of money from Saudi's too, why are you so eager to overlook this?

And why are you so eager to overlook his upcoming hearing for repeatedly raping a 13 year old child? Clearly you feel he should not be allowed a lawyer for this case, right?

gosplan

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Nope - worse she defended a rapist of a 12 year old girl - she KNEW was guilty,she received 100s millions from Saudi Arabia, and we all know how they treat their women.

The lawyer thing is rediculous. Anyone involved in legal aid will obviously have defended some fairly reprehensible people.

So that's the lawyer thing and the Lybia peace deal generally shown to be nothings.

What else is there?

Right donations from Saudi Arabia. Have to check that.

Billy86

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Was he bragging about actual sexual assault ?
sounded to me like hot air - just talk among the lads - still unacceptable for someone running for POTUS ... but again - Hillary worse.

Yes. He literally was bragging about sexually assaulting women and saying he has done it. It's as open and shut as can possibly be.

“You know I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star they let you do it, you can do anything. Grab them by the pussy. You can do anything.”

alastair

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Ah that's ok then, a LEGAL defender of a child rapist , makes her morally superior.

Yes, of course it does. It's her job to provide the best defence for her client. She's not culpable for anything her client did, nor is she in any position to criticise their actions once she represents them.

Billy86

daithi7 wrote: »

Sorry, I'm gonna start the political post mortem already:

1. How did such a clown ever get to run for office?
2. How did such a childish clown ever win the Republican party nomination??
3. How has such a compete childish clown come with a point or 2 of being the favoured candidate for president of the USA???

Truly Scary!!

1. Ego, money and stature.

2. That's the GOP for you. By no means all of them or even that close, but they've been building on a platform of race politics for decades, and far moreso since a black man (who being black, naturally HAD to be Muslim) got into the White House. Oh, and all the free media coverage was key, the same media coverage his fans now moan and whinge about since these comments might fly with a chunk of the GOP fanbase but not with the wider American public.

3. A very unlikable opponent, lots of soft/kiddie gloves by an ironically very soft media (all they really do is repeat what he says, very little mention of his losing $800mn over this past year, his past or upcoming rape cases, or his upcoming fraud trials) and a pretty uninformed electorate in a low-information, low attention span market/era.

gosplan

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Nope - worse she defended a rapist of a 12 year old girl - she KNEW was guilty,she received 100s millions from Saudi Arabia, and we all know how they treat their women.

No she didn't.

The Clinton foundation received between 10 and 25 million from Saudi Arabia.

Before getting to that, note the difference between that and

'She received 100s of millions...'

So you're fairly wide of the truth.

Anyway a non-profit org receives donations and puts it to charitable causes.

That's fine. The non profit being connected to leading figures in American political life is a bit murky.

However, it did go to charity.

So the greatest charge you can level was that HIllary and Bill were using their global status to gain more money for charity.

I'm not sure that's so bad. They shouldn't be using their status for anything really but it's not like they profited.

gosplan

Billy86 wrote: »

1. Ego, money and stature.

2. That's the GOP for you. By no means all of them or even that close, but they've been building on a platform of race politics for decades, and far moreso since a black man (who being black, naturally HAD to be Muslim) got into the White House. Oh, and all the free media coverage was key, the same media coverage his fans now moan and whinge about since these comments might fly with a chunk of the GOP fanbase but not with the wider American public.

3. A very unlikable opponent, lots of soft/kiddie gloves by an ironically very soft media (all they really do is repeat what he says, very little mention of his losing $800mn over this past year, his past or upcoming rape cases, or his upcoming fraud trials) and a pretty uninformed electorate in a low-information, low attention span market/era.

3: Because of a hateful campaign by the press against Hillary for the last 2 decades or so.

It's fine saying 'oh we can't endorse trump' but the damage is done by so much of the media.

I can't see any real wrongdoing by HRC. It seems as though it's just assumed by nearly everyone.

The only thing so far that stands up is the e-mail server and tbh that was just smart.

I'm sure in the day to day reality of international politics you say and do lots of things. She knew that all of this would be FOI'd if she ever ran so she kept them in one place and deleted.

I'd chalk that one up to experience given how she's been treated over the last 20 or so years.

Brian?

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Ah that's ok then, a LEGAL defender of a child rapist , makes her morally superior.

Ah give over. Every lawyer has a duty to defend their clients to the best of their ability. It would be immoral to refuse to defend someone based on the crime they're accused of. The entire criminal justice system would collapse if lawyers only defended criminals they approved of. Have some sense.

Christy42

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Was he bragging about actual sexual assault ?
sounded to me like hot air - just talk among the lads - still unacceptable for someone running for POTUS ... but again - Hillary worse.

I am a man and that is not just talk among the lads. Men don't talk that way, pieces of scum do.

I would thank Trump supporters not to insult me like this again.

For all those that think this is what all straight men talk about in private I guarantee you that scum like this are in the minority. If you are in a group like this I would urge you to think about what you are doing and how you have come to consider women. Then start behaving like a normal human being going forward.

Itssoeasy

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Was he bragging about actual sexual assault ?
sounded to me like hot air - just talk among the lads - still unacceptable for someone running for POTUS ... but again - Hillary worse.

Sounded like bragging to me. He made the point because of him being a superstar he could have any women he wanted. That's bragging.

Igotadose

daithi7 wrote: »

Sorry, I'm gonna start the political post mortem already:

1. How did such a clown ever get to run for office?
2. How did such a childish clown ever win the Republican party nomination??
3. How has such a compete childish clown come with a point or 2 of being the favoured candidate for president of the USA???

Truly Scary!!

I think we'll soon need a post-mortem thread

1. Anyone can run. Money buys votes.
2. and 3.: This is today's America. Hateful, anti-intelligence, badly skewed wealth, massively overcrowded. Trump'll soon be gone, but someone smoother and slicker will show up; Trump's shown that there's no politician or political will to help the folks being screwed by the US economy. What's a little different, is it's massively hurting the 40-60 set now, and they vote, and they understand that votes count. Millenials are still optimistic. 40- and 50- somethings out of work for years and forced to take lower-paying jobs are a huge political force. By and large I don't think they got behind Bernie Sanders, though his Medicare for all ideas did resonate.

In 2020, I doubt we see a lot of the usual clowns in the GOP primaries - good riddance Gingrich, Santorum, Carson, Fiorina. Cruz and Rubio will likely be around even if they're out of office (hopefully) before then. Jeb Bush might return, but he's really just another HRC type, the politically connected.

No, it'll be some new populist, not as hidebound by the religious right junk (Trump did pretty well largely ignoring that bunch). One that runs on the economy. As always, "it's the economy, stupid."

Itssoeasy

Just watching Sunday politics on the BBC and they said more tapes emerged of trump ? And the chairperson of republicans overseas looked very down and this is more than trump it's about the affect this has on the GOP going forward.

Billy86

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Just watching Sunday politics on the BBC and they said more tapes emerged of trump ? And the chairperson of republicans overseas looked very down and this is more than trump it's about the affect this has on the GOP going forward.

Posted it last night in this thread I think, one of the producers of the Apprentice tweeting there is 'much worse' from the first two seasons of that show likely still to come, and a FOX reporter also tweeting that one of Trump's top advisers has let him know this is the 'tip of the iceberg' or somesuch.

Also to be mentioned, Trump has apparently lost $800mn in the last year, which further explains the refusal to show tax returns.

With all of this carry on playing out on the global stage, a lot more could be ruined than Trump's political career by the end of this. Obviously he's never going to be out on the streets or worth less than a whole lot of millions, but he is taking an absolute pounding that might only get worse, is getting very old, and his name and reputation are both now absolute dirt around the entire world.

alastair

Billy86 wrote: »

and a FOX reporter also tweeting that one of Trump's top advisers has let him know this is the 'tip of the iceberg' or somesuch.

I would be surprised if Ben Carson (he's the 'advisor') was privy to that much about the skeletons about to emerge from Trump's closet. He's more likely just to be letting his mind run riot yet again. Very strange man.

Overheal

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Sounded like bragging to me. He made the point because of him being a superstar he could have any women he wanted. That's bragging.

It wasn't in any tense of could or would. Read it again.

“You know I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star they let you do it, you can do anything. Grab them by the pussy. You can do anything.”

Itssoeasy

Trumps biggest supporter Rudy Giuliani is on cnn now. He thinks that trumps "apology" was sincere and was an actual apology.

cowboyBuilder

Christy42 wrote: »

I am a man and that is not just talk among the lads. Men don't talk that way, pieces of scum do.

I would thank Trump supporters not to insult me like this again.

For all those that think this is what all straight men talk about in private I guarantee you that scum like this are in the minority. If you are in a group like this I would urge you to think about what you are doing and how you have come to consider women. Then start behaving like a normal human being going forward.

I don't speak like that, my point was I think however tasteless it was - he wasn't actually being serious ..


Look I don't think Trump is a good candidate,I think he is a creep, but Hillary Clinton is a dodgy character too - and it's ****ing depressing to think this is the "best" the USA has to offer !!

MSM make a big deal of this Trump thing - fair enough, but don't paint HC as a saint..

cowboyBuilder

Anyway what time is this car crash of a debate on tonight ? 2AM Irish time ?

Itssoeasy

Trump supporters seem to be forgetting that bill Clinton isn't running for office. If they could get away from this point people might start believing what they are saying.

Itssoeasy

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Anyway what time is this car crash of a debate on tonight ? 2AM Irish time ?

Yeah 9pm ET so yes 2am out time.

Christy42

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

I don't speak like that, my point was I think however tasteless it was - he wasn't actually being serious ..


Look I don't think Trump is a good candidate,I think he is a creep, but Hillary Clinton is a dodgy character too - and it's ****ing depressing to think this is the "best" the USA has to offer !!

MSM make a big deal of this Trump thing - fair enough, but don't paint HC as a saint..

I didn't mention HC in my post. I pointed out that Trump and anyone who thinks like that are complete and utter scum. This should not be excused as only joking. Look at his record and tell me why you give him such a massive benefit of the doubt. I would also say that even if it was a joke this should still destroy whatever hope he had left of the presidency. Most men don't make those jokes.

No one has painted Hillary as a saint but next to Trump she looks like one. Trump is so far off the scaled that it is next to impossible to give a balanced view of HC while she is standing next to him.

K-9

Christy42 wrote: »

I am a man and that is not just talk among the lads. Men don't talk that way, pieces of scum do.

I would thank Trump supporters not to insult me like this again.

For all those that think this is what all straight men talk about in private I guarantee you that scum like this are in the minority. If you are in a group like this I would urge you to think about what you are doing and how you have come to consider women. Then start behaving like a normal human being going forward.

It is also the stupidity of it.

I'm sure we all see a good looking women and think I wouldn't mind getting a bit closer to her, but it's the bragging and OTT stuff that is soo pointless.

We're all male and have sex drives, big deal!

Seriously though, he was a 60 year old man at the time, if it was a 20 year old student trying to hide insecurities I'd give him a pass.

Billy86

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Trump supporters seem to be forgetting that bill Clinton isn't running for office. If they could get away from this point people might start believing what they are saying.

That's the problem they don't seem able to solve - for the last year, from day one, the whole campaign has basically been about 'talk sh*t about other people' and nothing else. Even the 'bring the jobs home' rhetoric that has completely disappeared from their platform as it becomes clear it was never something Trump was interested in was built on the back of talking sh*t about other countries.

Now that all this has come out on Trump, and with all he has been saying himself in the last few weeks before it even came out, they're like a scratched CD when it comes to addressing it - they can't. All they can do is repeat and repeat and repeat their attempts to talk sh*t about others. Thing is, nobody is interested in that anymore, the returns have diminished with each and every one of their attacks over the last 12 months, and now the hardcore Trump support looks like a punch-drunk boxer in the 12th round, swinging aimlessly and desperately at shadows that aren't even there (e.g. Bill isn't even running for President, but is all they can try to talk about in response to this). That between the whole lot of them, they can't even stop to recognise this for one brief moment, just shows how far gone they are as a collective.

The real question at this point isn't who is going to win, it is will they even make it to the final bell?

K-9

Billy86 wrote: »

Posted it last night in this thread I think, one of the producers of the Apprentice tweeting there is 'much worse' from the first two seasons of that show likely still to come, and a FOX reporter also tweeting that one of Trump's top advisers has let him know this is the 'tip of the iceberg' or somesuch.

Also to be mentioned, Trump has apparently lost $800mn in the last year, which further explains the refusal to show tax returns.

With all of this carry on playing out on the global stage, a lot more could be ruined than Trump's political career by the end of this. Obviously he's never going to be out on the streets or worth less than a whole lot of millions, but he is taking an absolute pounding that might only get worse, is getting very old, and his name and reputation are both now absolute dirt around the entire world.

That was the impression I got at the time when the stuff about the Apprentice came out. Trump basically rubbished them as lies, attention seeking and maybe even looking for money.

My impression was a video tape would miraculously surface to prove it.

The tape from yesterday basically does prove it. It isn't actual footage but it shows that this is the way Trump carries on. Women are sexual possessions to him.

RobertKK

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Trump supporters seem to be forgetting that bill Clinton isn't running for office. If they could get away from this point people might start believing what they are saying.

Bill Clinton is used to attack Hillary, as he will be the first whatever if Hillary is president.
Hillary is accused of being an enabler of sexual offenses by attacking the women and hiring private investigators to go dig up dirt on the women who say Bill sexually assaulted them.
If you take this into account and the Clinton family accepting money into their foundation from Saudi Arabia, isn't this just what the Wikileaks release showed?
A public policy and a private policy. The public policy is pro women, the private policy is 'it is all about me, my family, wealth and power'.

I find both the main candidates are in it for themselves, for the power, for the extra wealth the presidency brings.

When it comes to things sexual, both are guilty.

InTheTrees

RobertKK wrote: »

Hillary is accused of being an enabler of sexual offenses by attacking the women and hiring private investigators to go dig up dirt on the women who say Bill sexually assaulted them.

So to recap. Twenty Five years ago a woman claims she and Bill Clinton had an affair.

And because Hillary "attacks" her and hires an investigator to check her story you think this makes Hillary as "guilty" as Bill?

Is that right? Basically you're saying the wife of the person having the affair is as sleazy and as badly behaved as the person having the affair?? Its like 19th century logic. And as an election tactic you can see how well its working.

Feline Grabber

RobertKK wrote: »

Bill Clinton is used to attack Hillary, as he will be the first whatever if Hillary is president.
Hillary is accused of being an enabler of sexual offenses by attacking the women and hiring private investigators to go dig up dirt on the women who say Bill sexually assaulted them.
If you take this into account and the Clinton family accepting money into their foundation from Saudi Arabia, isn't this just what the Wikileaks release showed?
A public policy and a private policy. The public policy is pro women, the private policy is 'it is all about me, my family, wealth and power'.

I find both the main candidates are in it for themselves, for the power, for the extra wealth the presidency brings.

When it comes to things sexual, both are guilty.

Except one is currently looking at going to court for raping children themselves. No matter how you try to defend him they are nowhere near as bad as each other. Raping children is far far worse.

BorneTobyWilde

Trump should stick to policies tonight. If he doesn't it will become a mud slinging contest