ragwort national epidemic

emaherx

Curly Judge wrote: »

That's been my experience too.
What is it with this pulling business?
Sounds like very hard work to me!
I cut them as low as possible with a sharp machete type tool and cart them off.
Surely, with them being biennial and all, cutting is just as good?

Cutting is less effective as they may grow back the following year, (because they are evil that way). See Chuchote's link to "Ragworth and its control"

Curly Judge

Chuchote wrote: »

Ragwort is serious bad news for asthmatics and people with hay fever too.

Good piece on ragwort and its control:

http://www.ihwt.ie/site2/welfare-campaigns/welfare-information-tips/797-2/

and on the Irish Wildflowers site:

http://www.irishwildflowers.ie/pages/128a.html

plus a bunch more references to different breeds on this page:

http://www.irishwildflowers.ie/AZ-english.html#R

Thanks Chuchote.
I found your links very useful and informative.
So... my theory about cutting rather than pulling isn't as good as I thought.
One thing I've noticed is that if you start removal early you must be prepared to visit the field repeatedly as they flower and make themselves known at any time from June onwards.

Chuchote

What interests me is the '-wort' suffix; a 'wort' is usually a plant that is used medicinally. Can't think what ragwort could be used to cure, except maybe bad neighbours!

emaherx

Curly Judge wrote: »

Thanks Chuchote.
I found your links very useful and informative.
So... my theory about cutting rather than pulling isn't as good as I thought.
One thing I've noticed is that if you start removal early you must be prepared to visit the field repeatedly as they flower and make themselves known at any time from June onwards.

oh, yes that is true also, 2 visits is not a bad idea, if you wait till they all flower, some will surely have gone to seed and if you go out too early a field you think was nice and clear surely has a dozen more in it by Mid August.

Chuchote

Ah, I'm wrong about 'wort' meaning a medicinal plant, it seems; etymology:

wort (n.) Look up wort at Dictionary.com
"a plant," Old English wyrt "root, herb, vegetable, plant, spice," from Proto-Germanic *wurtiz (source also of Old Saxon wurt, Old Norse, Danish urt, Old High German wurz "plant, herb," German Wurz, Gothic waurts, Old Norse rot "root"), from PIE root *wrad- "twig, root" (see radish). St. John's wort attested from 15c.

Base price

I was out pulling ragwort this morning at 9am from two fields that were mowed afterwards. I was surprised at how many bees were on the plants collecting nectar.
After reading some posts on this thread I have decided to leave any ragwort plants growing in the pasture fields, headlands and hedges alone until they are about to go to seed.
Other than the recently introduced linseed (flowers) and a growth of redshank on the same GLAS plots there is feck all for the bees to gather from.
I still cannot understand why there was not an active pollinator option in GLAS.

patsy_mccabe

I'm trying to get me head around the exact life cycle of the ragwort plant.
From what I gather the plant has a 2 year cycle (biennial).
Year 1 - the seed germinates and greens up to the rosette stage.
Year 2 - stalk grows and plant heads out into a yellow flower, goes to seed and then dies.
Is this correct?

So if you cut the plants by topping before it goes to flower, you should be able to kill it off, right?

(BTW, I just pull them and it works for me.)

99nsr125

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I'm trying to get me head around the exact life cycle of the ragwort plant.
From what I gather the plant has a 2 year cycle (biennial).
Year 1 - the seed germinates and greens up to the rosette stage.
Year 2 - stalk grows and plant heads out into a yellow flower, goes to seed and then dies.
Is this correct?

So if you cut the plants by topping before it goes to flower, you should be able to kill it off, right?

(BTW, I just pull them and it works for me.)

Pretty much yup
Becomes perennial if repeatedly cut.

If they start getting close to us working their way up the ditch
I hit them with a few drops of neat glyphosate then go back and pull then
incinerate the gangsters in the range

I'll throw up a picture hopefully

Chuchote

Seems to me that it's worth a swap. Say a bunch of farmers with some nice mountain land got together with some hillwalkers who'd like to walk the land on winter weekends. Do a deal that if the hillwalkers come and pull the ragwort, they'd have free access. It would be a nice chance to get to know each other too – have people from the farms bagging the ragwort as it's picked and helping, bake up a few cakes and have a Burco of tea to share when the work is done.

marzic

blue5000 wrote: »

I don't think there's any fear of that yet. Just in the door from west Clare and the amount of ragwort around the Lahinch-Doolin area is unreal.

we used to top them, if you cut them before they flower - two years in a row - it used to kill them off, until they blew in again off the road. You talk about West Clare, I've seen plenty of them in big acre fields down around quin, kilmurry, the bridge - where the good land is!

blue5000

marzic wrote: »

we used to top them, if you cut them before they flower - two years in a row - it used to kill them off, until they blew in again off the road. You talk about West Clare, I've seen plenty of them in big acre fields down around quin, kilmurry, the bridge - where the good land is!

Lots of it around here too, and it's not just with the horsey types either.

TheRiverman

The only effective way is to pull it from the roots.

Base price

Chuchote wrote: »

Seems to me that it's worth a swap. Say a bunch of farmers with some nice mountain land got together with some hillwalkers who'd like to walk the land on winter weekends. Do a deal that if the hillwalkers come and pull the ragwort, they'd have free access. It would be a nice chance to get to know each other too – have people from the farms bagging the ragwort as it's picked and helping, bake up a few cakes and have a Burco of tea to share when the work is done.

Personally I would prefer to spend every daylight minute till my death pulling ragwort on my land rather than seeing people with some sort of quasi entitlement crossing my land. They are trespassers, same as rogue dogs - neither are wanted or welcomed.

ganmo

Chuchote wrote: »

Seems to me that it's worth a swap. Say a bunch of farmers with some nice mountain land got together with some hillwalkers who'd like to walk the land on winter weekends. Do a deal that if the hillwalkers come and pull the ragwort, they'd have free access. It would be a nice chance to get to know each other too – have people from the farms bagging the ragwort as it's picked and helping, bake up a few cakes and have a Burco of tea to share when the work is done.

Ragwort doesn't grow well in the hills due to sheep.

Is there a mountain range in Ireland without a public walk?

Chuchote

Base price wrote: »

Personally I would prefer to spend every daylight minute till my death pulling ragwort on my land rather than seeing people with some sort of quasi entitlement crossing my land. They are trespassers, same as rogue dogs - neither are wanted or welcomed.

That's all very well if you're not accepting large public subsidies…

Odelay

Chuchote wrote: »

That's all very well if you're not accepting large public subsidies…

The same subsidies that make our food safe and affordable (steriod free and all that), I assume you mean?

Hobby farmer

Chuchote wrote: »

That's all very well if you're not accepting large public subsidies…

Its my understanding that "large public subsidies" are in fact helping to keep food affordable for the consumer? If you had to pay at the shops a price which reflected the cost of production our diets may be a little different

ganmo

Odelay wrote: »

The same subsidies that make our food safe and affordable (steriod free and all that), I assume you mean?

read the treaty of rome

ganmo

Odelay wrote: »

The same subsidies that make our food safe and affordable (steriod free and all that), I assume you mean?

read the treaty of rome

Chuchote

I think it's right that farming should be subsidised; however, heavy subsidisation should lessen the right of farmers to take a "Git offa mah land" stance. Of course all people should use the countryside respectfully, on the other hand, and take cognisance of the fact that crops are being grown and animals grazed in specific areas.

ganmo

Chuchote wrote: »

I think it's right that farming should be subsidised; however, heavy subsidisation should lessen the right of farmers to take a "Git offa mah land" stance. Of course all people should use the countryside respectfully, on the other hand, and take cognisance of the fact that crops are being grown and animals grazed in specific areas.

http://www.irishtrails.ie/National_Waymarked_Trails/
Go take a hike!

Chuchote

ganmo wrote: »

http://www.irishtrails.ie/National_Waymarked_Trails/
Go take a hike!

Pretty pathetic when you look at the thousands of kilometres of walking trails in other European countries. But then, their farmers are more welcoming, and their governments also simply buy land at agricultural prices.

whisky_galore

Chuchote wrote: »

Pretty pathetic when you look at the thousands of kilometres of walking trails in other European countries. But then, their farmers are more welcoming, and their governments also simply buy land at agricultural prices.

Respect probably works both ways, visited a few historical places in the middle of farmland where people just leave their wrappers, camp fires and disposable BBQs after them here.
Went and had a look at a Norman castle which had a big tricolour and a 'chuky ar la' painted onto it, drink cans and rubbish left behind...don't think the Normans left all that after them.

Capercaillie

Chuchote wrote: »

I think it's right that farming should be subsidised; however, heavy subsidisation should lessen the right of farmers to take a "Git offa mah land" stance. Of course all people should use the countryside respectfully, on the other hand, and take cognisance of the fact that crops are being grown and animals grazed in specific areas.

I would have no problem with people being on my land: If I wasn't sued if somebody fell over, people closed gates behind them, people didn't drop rubbish, people didn't let dogs run free............

Chuchote

Capercaillie wrote: »

I would have no problem with people being on my land: If I wasn't sued if somebody fell over, people closed gates behind them, people didn't drop rubbish, people didn't let dogs run free............

Funny enough, a paranoid farmer probably saved my financial ass; in the middle of the Celtic Tiger I walked up into an empty, unused-for-years, weed-strewn mountain field to look at the ruins of a cottage, considering making an offer to the farmer for the site.

Before I had time to go near him, he appeared, charged up at me and started screaming at me that I was going to sue him (?)

He calmed down in a few minutes when he realised that I was civilised enough, and I left, friendly enough with him. But I'd decided that I didn't want someone this paranoid for a neighbour. So he didn't get his juicy price for the site, and I didn't buy the site to build on, which would probably have run me into big trouble when the bottom fell out of the economy, and out of my work.

Getting back to the ragwort question, here's some in the back garden of a derelict, disused three-storey redbrick house in Rathmines… (Sorry, don't know why they're sideways.)

MF290

On the topic of public walkways, it's absolutely crazy in England, some of them nearly go through farmyards. Only today I was driving the tractor through a farm when some ejit nearly walks out on front of me and then scowls at me for disrupting his leisurely pursuit. Some of them expect you to stop the tractor and forage harvester so they can stroll through the middle of a row. Not to mention the one who wouldn't stand onto the grass verge and expected me to run over the edge of a wheat crop! My favourite has to be the clueless young women who stood admiring the lads baling small bales of haylage. The balers were getting closer and closer (2-3 kph), suddenly it dawns on them that the baler is heading straight for them. Like throwing a cat among the pigeons they all panic and run in different directions, a few of them leaping and tripping over rows of grass! Dog walkers can be annoying when they have those inbred dogs with no cop on or obedience, who walk out on front of you! What really annoys me is when they give you that dirty look when they're the ones crossing working farms.
Anyway that's me done moaning for the day
It must be a lot more problematic for livestock owners. I think it was on here someone posted the link to a video a who was complaining about heifers following him and his dog about a field!

The Cuban

Been pulling the ragwort every year now with the last 4, place was heavily infested. Ive got it down to about 5 plants per acre now.
What I have noticed is the seed doesn't spread as far as you think but 1 plant left will be 3 or 4 next year.
Poaching is a big no no if your trying to get rid of them.
If the yellow flowers have gone hard (to seed) then forget it your too late and wait till next year.
Start with the grazing fields first, the silage ground usually isnt a big problem around me.

Jonny303

Get an opinion if I can. Neighbours land has been let go the last few years, now field next to the house is virtually yellow. Don't fancy approaching him trying to get him to sort it out but was half thinking of approaching it to lease it off him.

While it would not be the most responsible thing to do, would I be mad if I got it at the right price taking it, cutting and baling it, burning the resulting bales and just worry about next years by grazing it down with sheep?

I am in the position where I am looking for land so its a case of taking it to get rid of the weed

cmore123

They're all over Co Kerry among other places. Worse, though, is the epidemic of gone-wild rhododendron and the "giant rhubarb" gunnera - a mature plant of that, according to a horticulturalist friend of mine, can produce nearly 15000 seeds a year.

Fluffy Cat 88

whisky_galore wrote: »

My parents generation would have taken it seriously and pulled them whenever they saw one spring up.

They're all over the road margins now, along with other bastard-weeds like Japanese knotweed.

Hymalayan Balsam and Giant Hogweed are taking over the countryside too.

Chuchote

I'm told that gunnera and Japanese knotweed are both edible, if push comes to shove. Ragwort has no known use, afaik, unless you're a cinnabar moth.

Base price

Chuchote wrote: »

That's all very well if you're not accepting large public subsidies…

Jez, one would think from reading your comment is that we farmers do not also contribute to the National Exchequer

MF290

Fluffy Cat 88 wrote: »

Hymalayan Balsam and Giant Hogweed are taking over the countryside too.

The giant hogweed is a bad one, I was about to pick some one of the days and was told that my hands would blister up if I did. There's a weed that looks the cow parsley, hemlock I think? that the foreman was showing me the other day.

quietsailor

MF290 wrote: »

The giant hogweed is a bad one, I was about to pick some one of the days and was told that my hands would blister up if I did. There's a weed that looks the cow parsley, hemlock I think? that the foreman was showing me the other day.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/viewpoints/analysis/knotweed-authorities-decided-to-ignore-this-issue-for-years-because-of-the-costs-in-dealing-with-it-415824.html

This is a good article in the examiner about all the invasive plants growing in Ireland and how they're not being taken seriously enough by local government bodies

Chuchote

What are the four notifiable weeds? All together, now:

Base price

quietsailor wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/viewpoints/analysis/knotweed-authorities-decided-to-ignore-this-issue-for-years-because-of-the-costs-in-dealing-with-it-415824.html

This is a good article in the examiner about all the invasive plants growing in Ireland and how they're not being taken seriously enough by local government bodies

Cavan County Council appear to be actively tackling Japanese Knotweed. They have "No Cutting" warning signs along the roads where it is growing and are treating it with a new herbicide called Synero.
Problem is where dopes with hedge cutters/flails ignore the warning signs and cut it which leads to it spreading :mad:

whisky_galore

Chuchote wrote: »

I'm told that gunnera and Japanese knotweed are both edible, if push comes to shove. Ragwort has no known use, afaik, unless you're a cinnabar moth.

Have to know what you're doing cutting it and disposing of the leftovers.

Plus it might be treated with herbicide as well, so eating it might not be such a good idea.

Chuchote

whisky_galore wrote: »

Have to know what you're doing cutting it and disposing of the leftovers.

Plus it might be treated with herbicide as well, so eating it might not be such a good idea.

Good points!

I wasn't actually suggesting that people should add it to dinner, more that the municipal and national conversation about these particular weeds could take in the fact that they're a possible food, and could (possibly) be controlled by harvesting rather than by poisoning.

Don't know about the New Zealand mussels that are a threat to lakes.

whisky_galore

I can't see restaurants taking it en masse, given how conservative most Irish diners are....Mate and Shpuds.

kevthegaff

There's was turbines put on land here and the disturbing of soil was catalyst for ragwort. Considering reseeding that field nxt year, does round up sort it out?

ganmo

Chuchote wrote: »

Good points!

I wasn't actually suggesting that people should add it to dinner, more that the municipal and national conversation about these particular weeds could take in the fact that they're a possible food, and could (possibly) be controlled by harvesting rather than by poisoning.

Don't know about the New Zealand mussels that are a threat to lakes.

I'm not sure if you have a grasp of the controls around food traceability where each carrot has a record of what pesticide it got and when. Stuff growing on ditches have none of that traceability.

Second what incentive is there to the person selling the weed to reduce the supply

Chuchote

ganmo wrote: »

I'm not sure if you have a grasp of the controls around food traceability where each carrot has a record of what pesticide it got and when. Stuff growing on ditches have none of that traceability.

Second what incentive is there to the person selling the weed to reduce the supply

Thanks for mansplaining that

kerry cow

I think there should be a government program where each town land is given 2 on the dole recipientants for a year and let them rid the country of ragwort .They could pull away from 10 am till 3 pm 3 day a week .
Happy days

Chuchote

kerry cow wrote: »

I think there should be a government program where each town land is given 2 on the dole recipientants for a year and let them rid the country of ragwort .They could pull away from 10 am till 3 pm 3 day a week .
Happy days

Great idea, as long as they're paid a proper wage for doing this, given thick gloves and so on, and it doesn't last more than a year, after which they're given special help to find work in their own trade, or train for work in a trade that has plenty of employment opportunities.

whelan2

kerry cow wrote: »

I think there should be a government program where each town land is given 2 on the dole recipientants for a year and let them rid the country of ragwort .They could pull away from 10 am till 3 pm 3 day a week .
Happy days

Do you honestly think they would lower themselves to do that type of work

kerry cow

That's the problem in this country .People expect everything is below them and yet want hand outs for nothing .problem is if they had to turn up 3 day a week it might up set their mixer cash jobs .god love them they would have give back a little to the country that feeds them .hopefully some day a politican will have the ball to enact , a dole for some type of productivity for the state . If you do not have a job the state should give you a job for food and shelter till you can better you self .pull the ragwort .
Cop on tax payers

whisky_galore

We have lads at the top creaming it off as well as the equally parasitic underclass.

99nsr125

whisky_galore wrote: »

We have lads at the top creaming it off as well as the equally parasitic underclass.

This is a thread about ragwort not about blaming poor people for being poor.

People on the dole didn't come up with

The bank guarantee
The abolition of Glass Steagle
The bailing out of AIB and ICI in the 80's
Pulling down of Sunningdale
The sacrifice of our fishing rights
The giving away of our seaweed rights.

The list goes on

I can tell you from hiring, firing and interviewing, everyone wants a job but
more importantly they want to be respected, it's our fault for not respecting
certain occupations.

A bit more please, thank you, excuse me, your welcome and sincerity would go a long way.

I'll finish with my textbook example.
Cleaners are poorly respected but cleaners in a hospital are vastly underpaid for the benefit society gains from their skills

whisky_galore

99nsr125 wrote: »

This is a thread about ragwort not about blaming poor people for being poor.

Not 'the poor' but those living on welfare as a lifestyle choice.

rangler1

whisky_galore wrote: »

Not 'the poor' but those living on welfare as a lifestyle choice.

+1, the poorest are probably not on the dole, but selfemployed entitled to nothing