Phonewatch/Home Secure Saga

Mr E

Hey folks, a bit of advice please.

I'd been with Phonewatch for 10 years. I had two Home Secure sales people call to the door last March and they managed to persuade me to switch over. Note: In hindsight, some of the sales spiel was a bit dishonest and I had a snarky phone call from PW a few days later which countered all their benefits.

A few weeks ago I got a phonecall from Phonewatch, basically saying that they shouldn't have lost me after 10 years of business, and they wanted me back. They offered to replace my 10 year old system with a brand new system (new panel, cameras, new window sensors, key fobs and all). They'd take over the monitoring and cover the cost of that while I worked through the remainder of my 3 year contract with HS (so HS aren't out of pocket - I'm still paying them).

I asked PW at the time what HS could do to retaliate, and they said nothing. As long as I keep paying them, everything would be fine.

I couldn't see a downside to this, so I agreed. New PW system installed yesterday and I was fully expecting a HS call this morning. First HS call was the monitoring station saying that they weren't getting a signal. Told him the story, finished up the call, and got another phone call 30 seconds later from HS Accounts. I told her what PW told me - as long as HS were paid for the remainder of the contract then everything would be fine.

She said no. Part of the fine print of my contract was that they had to cover the monitoring and if they weren't, it was a breach of contract. They were within their rights to invoice me for the remainder of my contract period (which I assume would be about €900 - 30 months x €30).

They didn't want to do that though. They said that phonewatch had taken away a system that I owned and replaced it with a system that I was now renting (which was news to me). What they offered instead was that if I exercised my cooling off period with PW and asked them to take it away, they would install an even better super duper system that I would own, and I'd be back with HS again.

So I told her to leave it with me and I'd do some research.

I had the number of the PW guy from a few weeks ago and called him back. He said it was a scare tactic to try and recoup their money all in one go, and as long as I was still paying them by DD, there was nothing that they could do. He said I could expect a letter in the post requesting the €900 (or whatever the balance is) but I can ignore it. He said if it ever went to court (and it won't), it would be thrown out because I'm still paying them. He also said that the new super duper system that they were offering was just a more modern version of what I had previously, and didn't even have cameras.

PW said that 40% of HS's business is ex-PW, and PW have been very aggressive in trying to win back that lost business (so there are allegedly hundreds of others in the same position that I'm in). Are any of those hundreds of people reading this?

Basically I'm stuck in a pissing contest between two monitoring companies, so I'm looking for advice.

fred funk }{

Do a search in this forum regarding phone watch and make up your own mind.

Whatever system you eventually go with remember that a beams only system is an inferior system to a perimeter protected system (and a lot cheaper to install.The burglar has already gained entry before the alarm with activate. Insist on a live external bell and not a dummy bell. Ask them can another company take over your system when your contract has expired, Phone watch gear can't be taken over and you'll need to either stick with them or buy a new system again in a few years.

Also, remember that their control room can look through those cameras at will, even when the alarm hasn't activated.

Mr E

Thanks for the reply, Fred. I was more concerned with the contract situation than the functionality though...

KoolKid

PW are eager to get all these older systems upgraded. Once they convince you to do this they eliminate all the competition. No one can monitor or maintain their systems,so the contact term is irrelevant. It is also a rental agreement. So when you hear all these €599 /€499 offers etc, that's what your paying for an installation that generally takes an hour or less.
Fred has covered a lot of people's concerns, but a good read around here will give you all the information you need.

On the contract side I would say exercise your cooling off period with PW and research some more. After that shop around. There are plenty of good company's out there that offer as good or better service without tying you into any contract.

Stoner

Tbh this might not be the best place for answers. I know it's an alarm but it's a contract issue imo

you've signed two contacts by listening to advice from salesmen, but you signed up.

You could just as easily get more confusing advice here. A Rep telling you something won't go to court is not great advice imo as it sounds like they just wanted your business and think the other guys won't try to get their money back because it's not worth the expense, not that you did nothing wrong, but that it will be too costly to do it. That's just reading your post I could have it wrong.
It doesn't read well TBH. You seem to have signed up to two similar services, leveraged the best equipment deal you could , twice, but now you are being pushed into paying for two things.
Imo your best option would be as above, get out of any contract you can. Limit yourself to one and recognise that you singed up two different contracts.
You might be better going to a consumer issues forum as that cooling off period might need immediate attention.

If you did manage to drop pw have you the equipment to use with the other guys?

Mr E

Thanks for the frank reply, Stoner.

I was misled by both companies.

HS said back in March that my panel was vulnerable (if it was smashed off the wall before being disarmed, it couldn't send a signal out).
It was on Joe Duffy the week before, allegedly!
Obviously bulls*it, I know that now. PW told me as much (it applied to systems older than mine), and HS didn't even replace the panel.

PW never told me that I owned the original system and that I would be renting the new one - that would have given me second thoughts about switching back.

PW took away the old system, so if I exercise the cooldown and they take away the new one, I'm vulnerable.

I'm not in a financial position to pay for another alarm system outright.

I wish I'd told the aggressive HS sales people to go away last March (well, I did initially, but they were good at their job).

KoolKid

Did you ask PW to take away the old equipment?
This was yours you had paid for it AFAIK.

Mr E

Nope, they just took it. Never crossed my mind to hold on to it.

KoolKid

I think you may have some leverage there.
If you had anyone else's system PW won't even take it down let alone take it with them.
Perhaps it's because it's something they may be able to reuse.

Mr E

Leverage - to what extent, KK? How would I use it in my situation?

KoolKid

Tell them you want it back. It was your equipment after all. Or compensation for it to use towards a new system.
Whatever way you my advice would be don't get yourself tied up in their new system.
I am not up on HS T&Cs but with where they came from its probably very close to PW.
As an installer, I wouldn't want to get into a load of legality s for the sake of one monitoring contract,which is going to be a customer lost one way or the other.

Stoner

Mr E wrote:

I was misled by both companies.

Unfortunately that happens alright MrE

Many are in the same boat, I've been there too

PeteK*

Would it be fair to say that PW's new alarm system is the problem and not the actual monitoring side of things?
Every time I've renewed contracts (on two houses) I managed to get a new bell box, too.
So each side at this stage has a bellbox on the wall! Last one I managed to get the LED one

fred funk }{

PeteK* wrote: »

Would it be fair to say that PW's new alarm system is the problem and not the actual monitoring side of things?
Every time I've renewed contracts (on two houses) I managed to get a new bell box, too.
So each side at this stage has a bellbox on the wall! Last one I managed to get the LED one

You mean you got a dummy box with a battery power LED light inside?

PeteK*

fred funk }{ wrote: »

You mean you got a dummy box with a battery power LED light inside?

Yes.
Are there still companies giving out ones with sirens?

fred funk }{

PeteK* wrote: »

Yes.
Are there still companies giving out ones with sirens?

Any reputable company will supply a real working bell and not just a dummy.