Problem tenants

gustus

punisher5112 wrote: »

No as why would this person believe the bogus claims in the 1st place? And from what I read friends( so called) were there and not paying and making all sorts of claims the op even stated they couldn't know if it was or wasn't present.


I really think they aren't cut out to be a ll as I stated its a business and all personal property within reason should be removed as to not be attached.

Mad in my opinion but sure hey not my house so oh well.

Ll get a bad rap in the news. I was simply one of the good ones. Too good it turns out.

Yes they turned out to be bogus claims by people who called themselves friends. Unfortunately that happens sometimes. I guess we live and learn. But believe me it's an ugly situation which I hope others don't have to go through.

All that aside I cannot change the past, only the future and that's why I asked about actions from here on.

gustus

newacc2015 wrote: »

There was no threat from the beginning. They lied to OP about the test in the first place to dodge paying rent. Radon is not carbon monoxide, it doesnt kill you over night. It takes decades of exposure to be any way cancer causing.

A digital test could have been ordered. They are pretty accurate within 2 to 7 days

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Corentium-AirThings-Detector-International-Version/dp/B00FORY4QU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1481150614&sr=8-1&keywords=digital+radon

The gold standard test is the 3 month EPA test. Tenants claimed they used a digital test to get their results. Could have been someone digging for remedial work, I don't know. The fact is, that's what happened. I was hoping to talk about the situation now, not then.

gustus

Jacqueline CoolS Mimicry wrote: »

If you are in the habit of believing dodgy tenants claims its unsafe with no grounds or proof for their claim.

Most people would just rent it out again straight away, I certainly would and wouldn't have gone getting it tested either.

Im not in the habit of either taking dodgy tenants or believing their claims. We were "friends". One of them shared a house with me for 6 months. This is a situation where a "friend" nailed another to a wall. Not very pleasant I can tell you.

I believe that's one of the problems in our rental market though. Yes landlords just rent out again, nevermind the possibility something is wrong. Well I couldn't do that. I now know the claims were bogus but I didn't then.

Anyway I'm looking to move from here onwards. Looking to get them for lost earnings after their scam. And believe me they went to town on me...

FishOnABike

gustus wrote: »

Anyway I'm looking to move from here onwards. Looking to get them for lost earnings after their scam. And believe me they went to town on me...

Looking for lost earnings for the 3 or 4 months the house was left empty may be a grey area. You also have a responsibility to mitigate your losses. I can see the availability of a quick digital test as being a strong argument why there was no need to leave the property vacant.

You could look to the RTB for a determination on any rent owed from when they were still in the property and any damage caused. You did take photographic evidence of any damage I hope.

Once you have a determination they may pay up - or more likely they will not. You can then go to court for enforcement. The time and cost of this needs to be weighed up against the liklihood of recovering your loss (plus legal expenses).

If they have no assets looking for a determination and enforcement might be just be throwing good money after bad. While it galls being betrayed, especially by "friends" sometimes, from a business point of view, it is better to draw a line under things and cut your losses.

It might stink but until there is a more efficient way of dealing with non-paying tenants it is what it is. Only you can decide how likely you are to recover what is owed and if, on the balance of probabilities, it is worth pursuing.

newacc2015

rawn wrote: »

Can you imagine the outrage if the tenants weren't lying though, and the LL knowingly moved new tenants into a house that wasn't safe??! Yes it turns out they were lying, but as a LL (or any businessman) surely you legally have to err on the side of caution until you get a professional in to declare it safe?

The tenants were so concerned about their safety that they decided to remain in the house exposing themselves to cancer causing gases? Yet they had no problem living there rent free. There is something not right there, as they were lying from the start. IMO if they were really concerned with their health they would have left. They wouldnt even let OP test it himself.

AFAIK there is no laws regarding radon testing. There was no need for a professional. The digital tests can be 95% accurate. That is pretty good.

If every landlord/professional had to invest merit less claims from tenants, there would be tens of thousands of empty houses in Ireland.

handlemaster

gustus wrote: »

Still fussing? Sure I only just got the radon result back and house has now been empty for 4 months. All the while paying the mortgage with no income. They were "friends" and completely screwed me over. I'll keep fussing

Dont mix friendship and business is tried and tested. Never works

gustus

UPDATE: Did my own EPA test. Ater 90 days it came back 5 times below the safety level. I then took them to the PRTB. Mediation first, which collapsed as they wouldnt pay a penny. Moved onto adjudication and I was able to prove that they fraudulently changed the contract to suit the day they left last august. I was looking for 2 months rent + damages. I managed to secure 1 months rent in the end.
PRTB were so soft on the tenants it was laughable. I had concrete evidence that they had altered the contract. An EPA report which disproved their radon claims. And photos of damages...
ANyway thats what happened for anyone else in the same situation. It was hassle but worth it in the end to put manners on the tenants. The look on their face was priceless

currants

Good for you OP. You did the decent thing and followed the law and EPA standards. Its a pity you cant pursue them for further damages without costing yourself even more money. These kind of tenants are the pits and make honest LLs like yourself turn hard against all tenants, the majority of whom are honest people too. Had you known them long?

jamesthepeach

So you won but you lost.

Just about sums up the current situation between tenants and landlords.
Having some issues of my own at the moment as both tenant and landlord.

Definitely better off being a tenant than a landlord these days.

gustus

currants wrote: »

Good for you OP. You did the decent thing and followed the law and EPA standards. Its a pity you cant pursue them for further damages without costing yourself even more money. These kind of tenants are the pits and make honest LLs like yourself turn hard against all tenants, the majority of whom are honest people too. Had you known them long?

Thanks. And you're right. I've certainly hardened up as a result. In fact I've taken my house out of the long term rental market and will now make my years income from April to September.
I had known 1 of them for almost a year and a half, and his (As it tuns out) crazy boyfriend for just about 8 months. Looking back I should have smelt a rat earlier. The BF had said early on "Wow, this contract is really easy". Commenting that the terms were not were severe etc.. He also said that he read the contract from cover to cover and that he always does that etc.. Just a bit odd. I on the other hand was super relaxed about everything. I even forgot my copy of the contract on their coffee table and never collected it hence why he could alter his contract with such confidence, He knew I couldn't disprove him. However he stupidly didn't initial the changes or sign them. He also forgot that they presented the original unaltered contract to the park-rite office to get their Parking Permit. I was able to get a copy of this.
All in all a lot of hassle but they know the truth. And they LOST in the end.. Which is great to know

gustus

jamesthepeach wrote: »

So you won but you lost.

Just about sums up the current situation between tenants and landlords.
Having some issues of my own at the moment as both tenant and landlord.

Definitely better off being a tenant than a landlord these days.

Agreed. Landlords dont have a chance. The PRTB is like a doting mother when it comes to tenants. LL are the big bad wolf personified in their eyes. The Tenants really need to mess up to be found accountable and even then it takes times investment and stress to get a result...

jamesthepeach

Masala wrote: »

Hopefully you can screw them over if you ever contacted for a reference down the line....

It's amazing how many people don't check references properly. They'll probably get away with it.
I have a standard set of questions that i ask that i gathered up over the years to weed out problem tenants. I am currently renting and the landlord didn't even ring and only asked for one reference. While it suited me he did leave him self wide open to risk.

gustus

jamesthepeach wrote: »

So you won but you lost.

Just about sums up the current situation between tenants and landlords.
Having some issues of my own at the moment as both tenant and landlord.

Definitely better off being a tenant than a landlord these days.

I guess I did win but lose... But I won more than I lost and thats all that matters. He walked out of there quiet, withdrawn, and financially down. He also lost psychologically which will hit him hard as hes that kind of person. ALWAYS thinks hes right and smarter than anyone else... SO the money plus the look on his face was enough for me

beauf

jamesthepeach wrote: »

It's amazing how many people don't check references properly. T...

Its amazing how many people think references can't be faked.

Because we have no system like a govt bond, or deposit system there is no way other than using your instinct and past experience to know who is a good or bad tenant or landlord.

gustus

beauf wrote: »

Its amazing how many people think references can't be faked.

Because we have no system like a govt bond, or deposit system there is no way other than using your instinct and past experience to know who is a good or bad tenant or landlord.

Its a minefield... Its no wonder more and more LL's turning to Airbnb. And it will continue. Property cleaned after each booking, twice the rent, less wear and tear, no one ever 'Moves in'..

beauf

gustus wrote: »

I guess I did win but lose... But I won more than I lost and thats all that matters. He walked out of there quiet, withdrawn, and financially down. He also lost psychologically which will hit him hard as hes that kind of person. ALWAYS thinks hes right and smarter than anyone else... SO the money plus the look on his face was enough for me

If someone had the nerve to do this to a "friend" I suspect they could care less. As its their nature.

jamesthepeach

beauf wrote: »

Its amazing how many people think references can't be faked.

Because we have no system like a govt bond, or deposit system there is no way other than using your instinct and past experience to know who is a good or bad tenant or landlord.

Which is why you need to check them properly.
And check last 3 landlords by calling them too.

You can't get rid of the risk of them being faked altogether , but you can make sure you minimise the risk that they are by doing everything i your power to.

beauf

rawn wrote: »

Can you imagine the outrage if the tenants weren't lying though, and the LL knowingly moved new tenants into a house that wasn't safe??! Yes it turns out they were lying, but as a LL (or any businessman) surely you legally have to err on the side of caution until you get a professional in to declare it safe?

How does the risk compare sharing a house with smokers.

Considering its was 99% likely to be complete scam.

beauf

jamesthepeach wrote: »

Which is why you need to check them properly....You can't get rid of the risk of them being faked....

Which is the point. There is no way to check them "properly". I'm not disputing that you do the best you can do. We are sorely lacking some better system though.

Masala

gustus wrote: »

I dont think theyll be using me as a reference. But one of them owns a fairly new barber shop in the city centre hipster district.. Needless to say Ive told anyone and everyone about his antics.. Not that he'll feel it that much but what else can I do...

... who knows!!!! This data needed by Garda Clearance. Maybe by Banks fir credit purposes???? What goes around .. comes around!!!

To bad you didn't get them to court.... a bad Credit Referance is a silent killer!!

jamesthepeach

beauf wrote: »

Which is the point. There is no way to check them "properly". I'm not disputing that you do the best you can do. We are sorely lacking some better system though.

Harder to fake the last 3 all successfully though wouldn't you agree. We can only do our best and hope it's enough.

I always ignore the current landlord though, for obvious reasons.

mrslancaster

jamesthepeach wrote: »

Harder to fake the last 3 all successfully though wouldn't you agree. We can only do our best and hope it's enough.

I always ignore the current landlord though, for obvious reasons.

what if its a first time tenant with no previous landlord?
does anyone know when the rtb holding deposits is due to come in? it was in one of the the rta amendments I read but not sure which.
it would stop the bad tenants who do not pay rent or cause damage and stop the bad LL's who treat tenants badly. maybe better all round..