Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Note in OP, 13/9

castletownman

Okay it was a good goal, but it was a last minute consolation strike at the end of another performance where he (Rooney) was as culpable for the malaise as anyone. Let's not get carried away thinking it will spark a purple patch.

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

Shaw martial and rashford??

Shaw and Martial are doing nothing to justify their places over the last few months. Both look like sulky teenagers, not top level professionals. At the very least, both need kicks up their asses and significant time on the bench. But if neither will give their all to Jose and the club, and if significant upgrades can be got....

Rashford needs to be played as a striker or not played. You're right, I don't want him sold, but isn't doing anything out on the wing, and has been anonymous for weeks now.

tinpib wrote: »

What do people think of Jose's comments after the game? My gut was that he was blaming the players and throwing them under the bus.

Agree? If so is it justified? My own thought is that it would breed resentment rather than building team spirit.

Team need to accept if they play as poorly as that, they should expect public criticism. Too many soft players who seemed too happy with LVG's expectations of fighting for forth.

adox

MD1990 wrote: »

Not sure he deserves more money.
Man Utd have a very good squad & Mourinho cannot get the best out of them. Look at Chelsea this season. Its not always the players fault.

He's been there less than half a season and has brought in four players. Plenty of the squad have been ****e for a while. It's not always the managers fault.

Look at Cleseas the season before. They won the title.

yabadabado

tinpib wrote: »

What do people think of Jose's comments after the game? My gut was that he was blaming the players and throwing them under the bus.

Agree? If so is it justified? My own thought is that it would breed resentment rather than building team spirit.

He was right 100% what he said in the interview. Only players he mentioned were Blind and Rojo and he wasn't throwing them under the bus just stating the obvious.

Scholes reckons Utd need 3 or 4 more transfer windows.

J. Marston

Mourinho comments on HM...

"He has to do more. It's as simple as that. We have big expectations at the club."

Di Maria 2: Electric Boogaloo.

adox

RoboKlopp wrote: »

Scholes reckons Utd need 3 or 4 more transfer windows.

He may not be far wrong.

Cazale

RoboKlopp wrote:

Scholes reckons Utd need 3 or 4 more transfer windows.

Another 500 million should do it!

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

Shaw and Martial are doing nothing to justify their places over the last few months. Both look like sulky teenagers, not top level professionals. At the very least, both need kicks up their asses and significant time on the bench. But if neither will give their all to Jose and the club, and if significant upgrades can be got....

Rashford needs to be played as a striker or not played. You're right, I don't want him sold, but isn't doing anything out on the wing, and has been anonymous for weeks now.



Team need to accept if they play as poorly as that, they should expect public criticism. Too many soft players who seemed too happy with LVG's expectations of fighting for forth.

That was part of the problem signing zlatan, rashford or martial were not going to get their chance up front. Luke shaw is class, wouldn't be judging him on the last few games

deaddonkey15

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

A real United fan would have known that

A real United fan wouldn't start threads to bash one of the club legends.

bangkok

Lithium93_ wrote: »

Stating the obvious much, City, much as it pains me to say, have been building towards this since they were taken over in '08, whereas United once Fergie upped and retired, United fell into decline, which was going to happen eventually..

Wasn't obvious to a lot of people only last week on here....

adox

adox wrote: »

He may not be far wrong.

2 years though? A lot of people would have thought, myself included, that utd would be a pretty good outfit this season.

The players are there,but it's not a team. That comes from the the manager. He's not a good fit for your club.

rob316

The football been played is just so outdated. Modern football is about high energy pressing, this seems to have passed mourinho by.

Look at all the teams above United in the league they all play fast free flowing football.

Even ferguson knew when he had to change from the old fashioned 442 to continue to be successful.

StringerBell

adox wrote: »

Didn't hear his comments but I'd be kind of glad if he did blame the players. Too many seem to be sleep walking through their time at Utd.

I saw his post match conference, nothing over the top about it. Said Fenerbache started at 100mph, that we didn't, broke down their first goal, the mistakes made in the lead up to it. Said we are suffering because cb is being played at the moment by two left backs, and worse still because Daley is having to play on the right side of the cb. It is particularly hard on the team away from home.

Said Fenerbache fully deserved the win because they played from minute 1, they played an emotional game, football is an emotional game and you have to play from the start.

I read that Pogba went off injured, what happened there? Did it look bad? Did Miki make any impression when he came on?

adox

Cazale wrote: »

Another 500 million should do it!

I presume you are in here for a dig and a laugh with the above comment but the money Utd have spent in the last three seasons is a shocking amount for what has been bought.

The club has stumbled from one disaster to another post Fergie. It's been amateur hour at times and it has escalated its own problems by ignoring the symptoms and letting more damage ultimately be done.

The club needs to be shook to its foundations. The culture needs to be changed.
If they have it I would advise them to give Jose all the money he wants and give him free reign at the club.

There's no doubt in my mind that Utd have made a lot of their own problems and have set their potential return to the top flight back by at least two to three seasons with their collective incompetence over the last few years. It is borderline a laughing stock and if I was an opposition fan I'd be having a field day.

Mr.Crinklewood

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

A real United fan would have known that

Don't drop thedeaddonkey

adox

StringerBell wrote: »

I saw his post match conference, nothing over the top about it. Said Fenerbache started at 100mph, that we didn't, broke down their first goal, the mistakes made in the lead up to it. Said we are suffering because cb is being played at the moment by two left backs, and worse still because Daley is having to play on the right side of the cb. It is particularly hard on the team away from home.

Said Fenerbache fully deserved the win because they played from minute 1, they played an emotional game, football is an emotional game and you have to play from the start.

I read that Pogba went off injured, what happened there? Did it look bad? Did Miki make any impression when he came on?

Pogbas was an impact injury, either a dead leg or a hip imjury. He played on for a while after but was clearly in pain.
Miki(I'm probably in the minority here) I though did ok. Still doesn't look quite up to pace but the ball looks very safe with him. Sees a pass and can play it with either foot. He did mis control a ball in the middle of the pitch that led to a Fernebache chance which a lot will remember but I thought he did ok.

Mantis Toboggan

Cazale wrote: »

Another 500 million should do it!

Hopefully, no reason why we cannot challenge for the title if we spend enough money.

StringerBell

RoboKlopp wrote: »

2 years though? A lot of people would have thought, myself included, that utd would be a pretty good outfit this season.

The players are there,but it's not a team. That comes from the the manager. He's not a good fit for your club.

I would disagree he is not a good fit necessarily, it doesn't matter right now though, when you appoint Jose you have to buy in to his "philosophy", you have to allow him to mould the club in his image in the way Ferguson did and that won't happen overnight.

I don't think it will take two years, I do think it will take another couple of windows to get rid of the no longer needed, and get in some good quality that is more in the Mourinho mould. The beginning of next season I would expect this squad to be a lot more what he wants.

I think the team will be fine this season too long term tbh. I think come the end of the season we will be up there in the mix for the title, as unlikely as it seems sometimes. I don't think any team is going to run away with it and I think that with greater consistency which will come, we will at least put pressure on the eventual winners, I think whichever team finishes above City wins the league this year.

adox

RoboKlopp wrote: »

2 years though? A lot of people would have thought, myself included, that utd would be a pretty good outfit this season.

The players are there,but it's not a team. That comes from the the manager. He's not a good fit for your club.

3 windows will be a little over a year away.
There's no doubt it's been a disappointing season and we were expecting more but what the root cause of that is is certainly up for debate. I would never write a manager off so early in his tenure(bar Moyes) and certainly not one of Joses calibre.

I think there are deeper problems at Utd and a culture change is needed. I would give Jose all the power at the club he needs and let him shake and drag it back into shape.

secman

bangkok wrote: »

That was part of the problem signing zlatan, rashford or martial were not going to get their chance up front. Luke shaw is class, wouldn't be judging him on the last few games

Rashford and Martial are regressing under Mourinho , Ibra should be a bit part player. Shaw is only back after a horrific break, needs play time under his belt, he'll come good. Not sure what the problem is with Pogba, is he not the brightest or maybe having Pirlo in the team with him made him look better than he actually is. Rooney is halfway down the other side of the hill.

At best we look 6th or 7th

DM_7

Europa League is a disaster so far when United have a rebuilding job on with a new manager. Too many games with little preperation in between.

I wish it was used just to give the squad players more time and put faith in them, sink or swim, so be it. Its foolish to have Mata, Pogba and Zlatan travelling to Turkey and end up playing a part in yet another game. They should be preparing for the league.

Rayne Wooney

Tonight doesn't bother me too much, mostly second string players who Mourinho will chuck out when he gets the chance.

fuzzydunlop85

Don't know where to start with that. People saying we have a squad good enough to win the league have their head in the clouds, fourth will be a serious struggle.

PhlegmyMoses

Lord TSC wrote: »

Scholes was talking about it there on BT sports a few minutes ago. Said we can't just keep switching managers and asking them to start over agains. At some point, you have to look at the players, cause the manager can only do so much once the players walk onto the pitch. Said he thinks/hopes the team will look very different in 18 months if Jose is given the chance.

Other than DDG, Mata and Herera, there isn't many players from pre Jose I wouldn't mind seeing replaced, especially when you look at the level of players Jose is able to attract.

The problem is that if I'm the likes of DDG, I'll be looking at all of this and thinking I can head off to Real and earn similar cash and win some trophies. Or if we don't get CL this year the crop of players you're looking at shortens. I'm in full agreement with Scholes that Mourinho needs to be given time and that the players need to take the blame, but he still needs to get some semblance of consistent performance out of them and drag us back to the CL to give us a platform to build on.

yabadabado

RoboKlopp wrote: »

2 years though? A lot of people would have thought, myself included, that utd would be a pretty good outfit this season.

The players are there,but it's not a team. That comes from the the manager. He's not a good fit for your club.

So less than 6 months into the job and he's not the right fit

bangkok

DM_7 wrote: »

Europa League is a disaster so far when United have a rebuilding job on with a new manager. Too many games with little preperation in between.

I wish it was used just to give the squad players more time and put faith in them, sink or swim, so be it. Its foolish to have Mata, Pogba and Zlatan travelling to Turkey and end up playing a part in yet another game. They should be preparing for the league.

Too be honest I think it's our best route to the champions league at this stage winning the Europa league

adox

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Tonight doesn't bother me too much, mostly second string players who Mourinho will chuck out when he gets the chance.

Who out of tonight's team will he be chucking out?

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

Too be honest I think it's our best route to the champions league at this stage winning the Europa league

Disagree. Grinding out forth in a league competition will be far "easier" than winning a dozen more knockout games against some of the best teams in Europe.

Schwiiing

adox wrote: »

Who out of tonight's team will he be chucking out?

Darmian Rooney Ibra hopefully.

Rayne Wooney

adox wrote: »

Who out of tonight's team will he be chucking out?

I'll be shocked to see Rojo, Schneiderlin, Rooney, Darmian here past next summer for one reason or another, Blind is easily replaced too. Shaw will probably get some competition as I don't think he's ready yet.

All I care about is a win on Sunday.

fuzzydunlop85

adox wrote: »

Who out of tonight's team will he be chucking out?

Rojo, Darmian, Rooney, Schiederlin, Blind. I get the impression he doesn't fancy Martial either.

jimmytwotimes 2013

Records like no European away win since 2013 (excluding qualifiers) and no away league win in London with 17 months point to ongoing problems.

Though statistics can be used to prove any argument, 77% of people know that.

Jose needs time and some of our players are not at the level of where United want to be. I said in a previous post that a RB, CB, DM, creative mid and a striker are needed, near half a feckin team.

yabadabado

adox wrote: »

Who out of tonight's team will he be chucking out?

I could see Darmian,Blind,Rojo ,MS and Rooney gone within 1 or 2 windows.

Ordinary man

Jose needs to find a formation to suit the players or players to suit the formation he wants to play, hopefully the former. Against swansea it would be nice to see a 4-3-1-2 with mata behind rashford and martial. The pace and runs of the front 2 would create acres of space for mata

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

Disagree. Grinding out forth in a league competition will be far "easier" than winning a dozen more knockout games against some of the best teams in Europe.

Hope so but can you honestly see us finish ahead of city, arsenal, Liverpool or Chelsea at this stage?

StringerBell

adox wrote: »

Who out of tonight's team will he be chucking out?

From looking at the line up, Schneiderlin and Rojo, Darmian doesn't seem to be his ideal right back........thats all I can remember off the top of my head.

DM_7

bangkok wrote: »

Too be honest I think it's our best route to the champions league at this stage winning the Europa league

A focused league campaign is a far smarter route than Europa League.

Its also the only way they can have any chance of winning or challenging for the league during a significant rebuild.

Rayne Wooney

I'm just waiting on the inevitable Pogba 2 month layoff news to compound the misery

jimmytwotimes 2013

yabadabado wrote: »

I could see Darmian,Blind,Rojo ,MS and Rooney gone within 1 or 2 windows.

Were they all Van Gaal signings? bar Rooney obviously

adox

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I'm just waiting on the inevitable Pogba 2 month layoff news to compound the misery

Doubt it's anything serious. Dead leg or brushing on the hip would be my guess.

Won't be as a big as miss as anticipated if he does miss some games IMO.

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

Hope so but can you honestly see us finish ahead of city, arsenal, Liverpool or Chelsea at this stage?

City just had a six match run without a win, Arsenal are Arsenal, not worried about Chelsea. Pool look very good. I'd also add Spurs. I put "easier" in quotations though because its still going to be very, very hard, but I'd still bet it would be easier to achieve than putting our eggs into the basket of a knockout tournament when we don't have the consistancy to go on a massive cup run against some of the best teams in Europe, especially at the latter stages...

Mantis Toboggan

bangkok wrote: »

Well moyes spent 60m van gaal 250m and Jose spent the rest.

First 2 got sacked

Yeah but I'm not sure the manager is signing the players e.g. Don't think Moyes wanted Mata, also lvg didn't want Shaw, Herrara Sneiderlin Falcao or Di Maria imo.

Mikey T? Certainly not a Mourinho player.

StringerBell

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Were they all Van Gaal signings? bar Rooney obviously

Blind has been a good signing
Morgan was welcomed and heralded as a good signing
Darmian is a good full back
Rojo is alright as a cb, but I'd be happy to see him gone just as easy.

There is an old saying about transfers, that if you get 1 of every 3 to be a success story you are doing well. That does hold true to an extent, many transfers simply don't work out for various reasons, doesn't mean they were bad signings at the time of signing though.

deaddonkey15

Blind, Schneiderlin, Mata, Mkhitaryan, Di Maria, Falcao, Darmian, Pogba, Ibrahimovich are all good players and good signings and are definitely enough for a club to make top 4.

adox

Tyson Fury wrote: »

Yeah but I'm not sure the manager is signing the players e.g. Don't think Moyes wanted Mata, also lvg didn't want Shaw, Herrara Sneiderlin Falcao or Di Maria imo.

Mikey T? Certainly not a Mourinho player.

Who do you think was buying those players?

StringerBell

Tyson Fury wrote: »

Yeah but I'm not sure the manager is signing the players e.g. Don't think Moyes wanted Mata, also lvg didn't want Shaw, Herrara Sneiderlin Falcao or Di Maria imo.

Mikey T? Certainly not a Mourinho player.

Could you not simply come straight out and jump back on the Woodward is bad soapbox?

Its hilarious to think that you believe none of Shaw, Herrera, Morgan, Falcao or Di Maria were wanted by LVG. That 5 players were signed against a managers wishes....

Won't even get in to Miki.

adox

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Blind, Schneiderlin, Mata, Mkhitaryan, Di Maria, Falcao, Darmian, Pogba, Ibrahimovich are all good players and good signings and are definitely enough for a club to make top 4.

Falcao,while an exciting signing at the time turned out to be an awful signing and certainly wouldn't be good enough for a top 4 club IMO. Schneiderlin hasn't impressed me at all since the day he signed and I wa delighted when we signed him. Jose doesn't seem to fancy him and I reckon he will be out the door.

Blind, although a good player, would be borderline for me and a no no if played at CB consistently. The rest I would agree with.

Just so I'm clear, are there some proposing that Jose should be able to buy a starting 11 of his own before we can expect him to be successful at the club?

Schwiiing

Who would people want in instead of all these players?