Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016/2017

CatInABox

Lads, it's the kindergarten cup. No one cares, or at least, no one should care.

wawaman

CatInABox wrote: »

Lads, it's the kindergarten cup. No one cares, or at least, no one should care.

If you have won the league in the last few years or got past the last 16 in the CL lately, then you can belittle it. We cant afford to turn our nose up at a trophy

greendom

wawaman wrote: »

If you have won the league in the last few years or got past the last 16 in the CL lately, then you can belittle it. We cant afford to turn our nose up at a trophy

Players performed badly last night. I thought we would see the Ramsey that plays for Wales last night, in his favoured position but he wasn't at the races. Perez tried hard but it was always going to be a tough ask playing for 90 minutes after being away for so long. I actually think he improved as the game went on - his passing in the first half was atrocious.b

Iwobi did well but Reine Adelaide is not up to the task yet. Not much to choose between Jenkinson and Maitland Niles at full back which is quite worrying.

Gibbs had a poor game as did most of the team. A win on Saturday and I'll forgive them.

emmetlego

Anyway, onto the weekend and a meaningful competition!

The Hammers aren't exactly kicking on from last season, but if still be weary of them, as we're not exactly firing on all guns! Good to see Perez last night with plan B Giroud a doubt. Is Hector back for this or is it next week?

Edit: Just saw on physioroom that hector is back the 18th and Ollie and Elneny are only slight doubts for the weekend

wonga77

CatInABox wrote: »

Lads, it's the kindergarten cup. No one cares, or at least, no one should care.

I dont really care, I dont think we're in a position to belittle any competition but anyways there are bigger fish to fry. Its also great that so many players got a chance to have a rest.
What I do care about is the fact that our so called reserve team (which I actually though was a decent line up) displayed the same poorish form and traits that we have seen the last few weeks, a real lack of desire or any meaningful penetration up front.
A few years ago we used to put out proper reserve teams in the cup and often there were players I hadnt even heard of playing for us, almost all those last night are well seasoned pro's and didnt do their prospects of breaking into a first team any good.
And what the hell is up with playing Elneny if they knew he was sick?

Roaster

It's the lack of pace in both the first team (and last night's) that's alarming for me. Teams are breaking through our midfield and bar Bellerin (and Kos positional) sense there is no pace. Same going forward. Sanchez broke away at the weekend and the furthest up field was Ozil. That's saying something.

keano_afc

Its still ok to criticise a pretty pathetic performance without admitting its a competition we dont really care about. They're not mutually exclusive.

greendom

keano_afc wrote: »

Its still ok to criticise a pretty pathetic performance without admitting its a competition we dont really care about. They're not mutually exclusive.

Of course - I think it would be wrong to complain about team selection though. Squad needs to keep its freshness and players on the fringes of the squad need game time. It's a good exercise as it shows who can be counted on and who can't be when first team players are out.

Gringo180

Skylinehead wrote: »

Really? Outrageous? Get the ****in boat, there's utterly nothing in it

What sort of signal does it send out to the players when the gaffer is smiling at the final whistle after been put out of a quarter final of a cup at home after a timid performance. Cop on would you.

Gringo180

CatInABox wrote: »

Lads, it's the kindergarten cup. No one cares, or at least, no one should care.

I think its the performance or lack of, that people are disappointed with. Could hold our heads up high if we went out showing a bit of fight. That performance last night was pathetic. No passion whatsoever.

Flatzie_poo

Gringo180 wrote: »

What sort of signal does it send out to the players when the gaffer is smiling at the final whistle after been put out of a quarter final of a cup at home? Cop on would you.

Oh come on, if we just won the League Cup and nothing else, the season would still be a massive failure. It just clogs up our fixtures list.

It's just a glorified way into Europe for smaller teams, and a distraction for everyone else.

Gringo180

Flatzie_poo wrote: »

Oh come on, if we just won the League Cup and nothing else, the season would still be a massive failure. It just clogs up our fixtures list.

It's just a glorified way into Europe for smaller teams, and a distraction for everyone else.

Are you happy with that performance last night? I dont care about the league cup but its the manner of going out of it that I care about. Some players just did not want to know last night and then they come off the field and see there manager smiling. Thats not right to me.

AdamD

Wenger clearly didn't want two more fixtures in January. I'll judge whether that decision has paid off at the end of the season.

Skylinehead

Gringo180 wrote: »

What sort of signal does it send out to the players when the gaffer is smiling at the final whistle after been put out of a quarter final of a cup at home after a timid performance. Cop on would you.

MAN SMILES. STOP THE PRESS

There's really nothing to it. Is he not allowed to be nice/put on a smile when seeing a former protege of his at the final whistle? Jesus, if that's the height of our problems, a man smiling, then everything is grand. (I don't think everything is grand, but jaysis this is the most innocuous thing)

Flatzie_poo

Gringo180 wrote: »

Are you happy with that performance last night? I dont care about the league cup but its the manner of going out of it that I care about. Some players just did not want to know last night and then they come off the field and see there manager smiling. Thats not right to me.

I'm neither happy nor unhappy. Indifferent.

It's done. it's over. We move on.

Sometimes games don't go your way. We had a team out that's not used to playing with each other, and had a LOT of senior players rested and injured.

The way I look at it, is that it gives one less excuse for us blowing a league or champions league run.

The only thing Wenger's smile shows is the lack of importance of that trophy.

Gringo180

Flatzie_poo wrote: »

The only thing Wenger's smile shows is the lack of importance of that trophy.

It also shows that mediocrity is accepted. Its why it has creeped into the club so often.

Flatzie_poo

Gringo180 wrote: »

It also shows that mediocrity is accepted. Its why it has creeped into the club so often.

Look you're entitled to your opinion, and I'm not going to keep going back and forth.

Just 2 final points I'd like to make.

1) I think the smile has been blown all out of proportion, and has McClaren's "wally with a brolly" press idiocy/sensationalisation written all over it.

2) This teamsheet is nowhere near our full strength;

greendom

AdamD wrote: »

Wenger clearly didn't want two more fixtures in January. I'll judge whether that decision has paid off at the end of the season.

I don't think he would have minded the 2 additional fixtures as long as he didn't have to play the likes of Sanchez, Ozil, Kos etc.

FixitFelix

Gringo180 wrote: »

What sort of signal does it send out to the players when the gaffer is smiling at the final whistle after been put out of a quarter final of a cup at home after a timid performance. Cop on would you.

It sends out the same opinion everyone else has, "who gives a **** about this cup" and that's how I feel it's a waste of time

Also the same people on here saying he should win it are the ones who will want him gone if that's all he wins, which just hammers home my point.
It's a worthless cup

FixitFelix

FixitFelix wrote: »

It sends out the same opinion everyone else has, "who gives a **** about this cup" and that's how I feel it's a waste of time

Also the same people on here saying he should win it are the ones who will want him gone if that's all he wins, which just hammers home my point.
It's a worthless cup

He has to win this cup and everything else. Anything else is a failure, and anyone who says any different is only accepting mediocrity....

mansize

Really Wenger smiling is being over analysed like tabloid trash here. Should he have been roaring his head off?

Don't sweat the small stuff

Hyzepher

I don't mind taking the EFL cup lightly. I don't mind using it as a mechanism to blood new players and I certainly don't mind that we are out of it. But I do take exception to the manner in which the players approached the game. They are for the most part fringe players and they looked as if they couldn't care less.

It's a disturbing trend within the club that has been with us for a number of years now. Everyone is all smiles when things are going to plan but no one wants to step up and put in a real shift when things start to go south. I'd say we have 2 or 3 players who can change a game and the rest are looking to be led. Sadly none of these leaders were on the pitch yesterday and the rest are more focused on their pay check and how their hair looks to be bothered about Arsenal and how it affects the fans.

emmetlego

Gringo180 wrote: »

It also shows that mediocrity is accepted. Its why it has creeped into the club so often.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion. But I really feel you're reading way too much into it.

Not pointing at you, but some people would use any stick to beat Arsene with.

Anyway, Elneny and Giroud possibly fit for West Ham. I'd certainly start Elneny along with Xhaka in the middle. Out right is where we may see a change. Theo? Ox? Will Gabriel start as right full? Will Iwobi start on the left? He looked at least interested last night.

Ramsey needs to take some bench time to get back on track. I'd say Jenks may not darken our bench for some time too.

FixitFelix

Basil3 wrote: »

He has to win this cup and everything else. Anything else is a failure, and anyone who says any different is only accepting mediocrity....

I'm not accepting it, I'm just saying the EFL cup is a joke and is for fringe players. And no he doesn't have to win this cup, but he must win the 2 REAL trophies

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Does anyone else just feel beaten down by supporting arsenal?

Never ending cycle of mediocrity...

I rarely enjoy watching matches anymore... So what if we beat this club or that club...it inevitability ends nowhere at the end of the season... It's just the same season over and over.

greendom

Just to cheer everyone up, Santi's surgeon has recommended surgery on his problematic achilles. This will put him out for a good chunk of the season, should they go ahead.

Hugh Mungus

Hugh Mungus wrote: »

Does anyone else just feel beaten down by supporting arsenal?

Never ending cycle of mediocrity...

I rarely enjoy watching matches anymore... So what if we beat this club or that club...it inevitability ends nowhere at the end of the season... It's just the same season over and over.

To be honest, I feel a lot worse about supporting them when I come on here and read comments like yours. I wish I had the strength to stay away

greendom

Hugh Mungus wrote: »

Does anyone else just feel beaten down by supporting arsenal?

Never ending cycle of mediocrity...

I rarely enjoy watching matches anymore... So what if we beat this club or that club...it inevitability ends nowhere at the end of the season... It's just the same season over and over.

I feel sorry for the supporters who turned up last night and had to put up with that dross. But that's the nature of football. It doesn't always go your way and you have to put up with the dross to see the moments of glory.

It's up to you to decide whether its worth it or not.

L'prof

Basil3 wrote: »

Hugh Mungus wrote: »

Does anyone else just feel beaten down by supporting arsenal?

Never ending cycle of mediocrity...

I rarely enjoy watching matches anymore... So what if we beat this club or that club...it inevitability ends nowhere at the end of the season... It's just the same season over and over.

To be honest, I feel a lot worse about supporting them when I come on here and read comments like yours. I wish I had the strength to stay away

3 points from top in league and joint top in cl group going into final game, yet going out of the league cup sends fans into absolute dispair. I genuinely don't know whether people are being sarcastic, trying to wind people up or are just too highly strung! I was disappointed with the resukt, but dropping points to West Ham would have a far bigger bearing in my mood!

Ol' Donie

greendom wrote: »

I feel sorry for the supporters who turned up last night and had to put up with that dross. But that's the nature of football. It doesn't always go your way and you have to put up with the dross to see the moments of glory.

It's up to you to decide whether its worth it or not.

Feell sorry for them? Cos they went to a match that wasn't great?

Even though everyone in the world new the match was literally the least important game between now and the end of the season (except that dead rubber CL game we have to play)?

greendom

Ol' Donie wrote: »

Feell sorry for them? Cos they went to a match that wasn't great?

Even though everyone in the world new the match was literally the least important game between now and the end of the season (except that dead rubber CL game we have to play)?

yes, they spent money and time and ended up being pretty disappointed. It's not a big deal though and I'm sure the vast majority willl get over it. If not they won't go again. That's their choice just like it's Hugh's

keano_afc

Arseblog reporting Cazorla is having an op, gone for 3 months.

tayto lover

It's funny that I actually agree with little bits of nearly every post since last night.

I am not too interested in any of the cup competitions. I am entirely interested in winning the EPL. Always was. We won't win the Champions League because we are not god enough and will go out where we always go out.
Not too interested in the cups. We might win a F.A. Cup or the Mickey Mouse Cup but the EPL is the bread and butter. The 38 games that define for me what is the best competition in football. Played home and away for 3 points a game, played in all weathers and conditions, played in every ground either well known or of newly promoted teams.
Not having won that with the players we have had for the last 12 years is not good enough. I actually believe we won't win it again under Wenger who seems to me to have lost his mojo.

Last night didn't cost me a thought either. I watched it on a stream just for the craic. I didn't see much effort except from Iwobi and Ox when he came on. Even in a friendly players should play with a bit of pride in the jersey and represent their club with a bit of dignity and effort.

FixitFelix

Ol' Donie wrote: »

Feell sorry for them? Cos they went to a match that wasn't great?

Even though everyone in the world new the match was literally the least important game between now and the end of the season (except that dead rubber CL game we have to play)?

This +1

wonga77

tayto lover wrote: »

It's funny that I actually agree with little bits of nearly every post since last night.

I am not too interested in any of the cup competitions. I am entirely interested in winning the EPL. Always was. We won't win the Champions League because we are not god enough and will go out where we always go out.
Not too interested in the cups. We might win a F.A. Cup or the Mickey Mouse Cup but the EPL is the bread and butter. The 38 games that define for me what is the best competition in football. Played home and away for 3 points a game, played in all weathers and conditions, played in every ground either well known or of newly promoted teams.
Not having won that with the players we have had for the last 12 years is not good enough. I actually believe we won't win it again under Wenger who seems to me to have lost his mojo.

Last night didn't cost me a thought either. I watched it on a stream just for the craic. I didn't see much effort except from Iwobi and Ox when he came on. Even in a friendly players should play with a bit of pride in the jersey and represent their club with a bit of dignity and effort.

This is my thoughts exactly, im not too worried about being out of the cup, Im not devastated by the result. Im more concerned about the rubbish performance, you have to play to the best of your ability at all times cause you cant (and we have proven this many times over) switch it on whenever you feel like it. Winning is a habit and despite having a very good balanced squad imo, Id be a bit worried at the poor attempt by some of those last night who should be trying their best to impress the management.

On saying all that the weekend is of far greater importance, one of City/Chelsea will be dropping points so its important to capitalize on that. Id expect Liverpool to beat Bournemouth too
It would be sweet if Spurs dropped points and we could stretch the gap out a bit but thats being a bit hopeful

gosplan

The only worry about last night was Ramsey.

After his performances in the Euro's, this idea that he's the second best no.10 at the club has emerged.

So we play him with Iwobi and Jeff on each side and Perez up front.

You pretty much couldn't get a rawer line up in terms of experience together so they huffed and puffed but couldn't get through the back line at all.

It's silly to call the players lazy and lacking in spirit though, it was just a performance with no cohesion and no spark ... which is why it looked slow and ponderous. There was no automaticity.

But back to the point about Ramsey. Now we can't play him in the wing, we can't play him with our CMF options because he's not creative enough and he didn't work well at no10.

There was a lot of responsibility on him last night but it didn't work for him at all.

I'd never fault Ramsey's application but it's getting harder and harder to see where he fits in and clearly all this moving around isn't helping him. He seems very unsure of what to do in each position.

wonga77

Gosplan, would you not agree that the performances with no cohesion or spark seem to be very common for us though? Thats my biggest concern. It wasnt that long ago that we went some 3 or 4 games in a row with only a small handful of shots on target.

I agree about Ramsey though, I dont think the management or himself know quite where he fits in, he looks a completely different player for his country, perhaps its a confidence thing?

gosplan

wonga77 wrote: »

Gosplan, would you not agree that the performances with no cohesion or spark seem to be very common for us though? Thats my biggest concern. It wasnt that long ago that we went some 3 or 4 games in a row with only a small handful of shots on target.

I agree about Ramsey though, I dont think the management or himself know quite where he fits in, he looks a completely different player for his country, perhaps its a confidence thing?

I think it's a style thing. It's common when...

A: you take out all our best attacking players
B: we're up against a good defence

I'd point out that we were good the other day against Bmouth, got in good positions, created lots of chances right from the off.

I don't think it's cause we were trying harder or more switched on though.

wonga77

I thought we were very flat against Bournemouth for the first half, Id disagree that we created lots of chances, 4 shots on target, probably one of the lowest for any team playing at home last weekend. I didnt feel comfortable until Sanchez knocked in that last goal
Maybe its the way teams setup against us but I think our creativity is poor, considering the attacking talent we have. Id like to see a little more of perez, think he offers something different at least

jonneymendoza

Haha hilarious. Cazorla out for a further 3 months

mansize

Ramsey has been disappointing this season

Ol' Donie

jonneymendoza wrote: »

Haha hilarious. Cazorla out for a further 3 months

It's not f*cking hilarious.

This is an ACTUAL problem for us. A far bigger deal than pr*cking about in the Carling Cup.

jonneymendoza

mansize wrote: »

Ramsey has been disappointing this season

His been rubbish for 2 and half seasons..

gosplan

wonga77 wrote: »

I thought we were very flat against Bournemouth for the first half, Id disagree that we created lots of chances, 4 shots on target, probably one of the lowest for any team playing at home last weekend. I didnt feel comfortable until Sanchez knocked in that last goal
Maybe its the way teams setup against us but I think our creativity is poor, considering the attacking talent we have. Id like to see a little more of perez, think he offers something different at least

There was a few other chances too. Blocks in the first half and poor shots going everywhere but the goal.

I take your point though - it wasn't our best performance ever.

But I think that in general when we're let play we look much much better. When we're denied space we start doing the back and forth thing and it's mistaken for not trying.

I think it's very unfair on our players.

extra gravy

Really disappointed with that Cazorla news, love watching him play.

omega man

extra gravy wrote: »

Really disappointed with that Cazorla news, love watching him play.

It's terrible news really and will cost us in my opinion.

Also fans turning their nose up at league cup amuses no end. We as fans continuously say we've bigger fish to fry but yet when it comes around to it we don't even compete at the business end. I hope I'm wrong but let's see come May if fans still belittle the league cup trophy.

wonga77

I just watched the interview with Gabriel after the match, he was very emotional talking about the Chapecoense disaster. He was good friends with and knew alot of them. A tough watch, I would hope that it was he who asked to speak about it and not that he had a microphone shoved in front of him

mansize

Carzola is the link between the defence and attack without him Özil is far less potent

tayto lover

Cazorla has been and still is a fine player and a very important cog in the Arsenal wheel. Like all players he has had his bad days though.
However he is in his last year or two at our club so maybe we need to unearth a successor if Wenger hasn't already one at the club.
One player never made a club. Strength in depth does help though.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

L'prof wrote: »

3 points from top in league and joint top in cl group going into final game, yet going out of the league cup sends fans into absolute dispair. I genuinely don't know whether people are being sarcastic, trying to wind people up or are just too highly strung! I was disappointed with the resukt, but dropping points to West Ham would have a far bigger bearing in my mood!

This is what I hate. It's not just about being 3 points off the top of the league.

It's about not winning it in 13 years.