Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016/2017

Arne_Saknussem

mansize wrote: »

I would consider Sanchez to petulant to be a leader in the tradional sense

I'd imagine Chile would disagree.

yknaa

batistuta9 wrote: »

what about cech or sanchez, would you consider them leaders?

Not when it comes to saving penos - they have the same success rate as the rest of the team

The team does lack some leadership at times - I think Mert has the qaulities but is at the end of his career.

Roaster

Leaders can be bought, but are they better than what we have. A few that spring to mind just in the Premiership.

Ashley Williams - he was available and I would argue better than Per & Gabriel.
Mark Noble - former youth product. Better than Coq and I'd actually say Ramsey at this current time.
Kante - again was available. If we just stopped peeling the orange in the pocket.

With regards to the evolution of a leader, I think Kos is a perfect example although I wish he was more vocal. Ronaldo is the perfect example of the evolution of a leader too (kills me to say that).

Skylinehead

Mark Noble? Ah here

wonga77

I think everyone has a slightly different perception of what makes a good leader. I love to see Coq barking out orders on the field. He seems to be constantly organising and so on. Flamini was another great example, always talking, always pointing and pushing players.
They wouldnt be the type to go and score goals if you needed them to but as I said there are different types of leaders.

Arghus

wonga77 wrote: »

I think everyone has a slightly different perception of what makes a good leader. I love to see Coq barking out orders on the field. He seems to be constantly organising and so on. Flamini was another great example, always talking, always pointing and pushing players.
They wouldnt be the type to go and score goals if you needed them to but as I said there are different types of leaders.

Flamini used to point and shout to disguise the fact that he wasn't much good at running, passing, shooting, or tackling. Really good at pointing and shouting though.

FixitFelix

The way I see it is we can all look around for a leader but as long as you have people like Walcott, Ox, Ramsey at times and Gabriel(although he hasn't been to bad the last few games) who are absolute cowards when it comes to putting their body on the line and getting stuck in, there is nothing any leader can do for them. They don't have it in them, no leader is needed once every player on that team is willing to fight tooth and nail for each other, which I'm afraid doesn't happen we have too many players without either the heart, technical ability or footballing brain to mount any sort of assault on the league.
And in wenger we have a manager who is only too happy to let these lads coast through their careers earning serious money without bringing anything to the table.

One thing I can gaurantee is when we get a new manager( hopefully the summer) the players mentioned above won't last long

Dolph Starbeam

Mustafti looks like a leader, shows a lot of passion, future captain material imo.

I do think that lack of leadership is a poor excuse though, some of the mistakes early in the game against Watford cannot be excused. I actually think we showed good effort in the second half and did enough to get something from the game. Going 2-0 down obviously made if very difficult as Watford just dropped deep.

Time for Wenger to go, I believe he will leave at the end of the season, hope he gets the respect he deserves from the fans. If he decides to stay on then I think things will get ugly.

marvin80

Dolph Starbeam wrote: »

Time for Wenger to go, I believe he will leave at the end of the season, hope he gets the respect he deserves from the fans. If he decides to stay on then I think things will get ugly.

If he does go I'd say he'll get a good send-off. Obviously what he's done for the club has been unbelievable and deserves the utmost respect for all the success he has achieved.
In an ideal world I would have loved to see him win the league and go out on a high but that's not going to happen.

I've said it before but if Wenger does leave I hope they have a good replcement like Simeone lined up, and bringing Griezmann with him as well

tayto lover

Dolph Starbeam wrote: »

Mustafti looks like a leader, shows a lot of passion, future captain material imo.

I do think that lack of leadership is a poor excuse though, some of the mistakes early in the game against Watford cannot be excused. I actually think we showed good effort in the second half and did enough to get something from the game. Going 2-0 down obviously made if very difficult as Watford just dropped deep.

Time for Wenger to go, I believe he will leave at the end of the season, hope he gets the respect he deserves from the fans. If he decides to stay on then I think things will get ugly.[/QUOTE]


This part could be from any of the last 7/8 years.
You can copy and paste it for the end of next season too and the one after.
This club is going nowhere under Wenger.

mansize

Kostafi is a winning combo

Bellerin & Monreal too.

Özil Sanchez and Giroud impact striker all work

3 more players we need. Those that were asked EO step up either haven't, done so briefly or not much more than impact

I'm not including this seasons signings as I'll give them more time

Arne_Saknussem

Should have went all in for Kante.

brianregan09

Xhaka will come good , anytime he's moved he's had a tough settling in period

jonneymendoza

im not even gunna bother tomorrow.

its a pointless match IMO. ir eckon we will win tomorrow then lose or draw against hull

DeclanRe

jonneymendoza wrote: »

im not even gunna bother tomorrow.

its a pointless match IMO. ir eckon we will win tomorrow then lose or draw against hull

Probably the best mindset to have. Its the hope that kills ya!

Mr.Micro

We have a team of 11 players and our one constant, inconsistency.

KaiserGunner

Yeah I'm not confident on Saturday. I just think our makeshift midfield is going to be found out badly and the back 4 were pathetic last Tuesday. So it doesn't look good. I can see us taking the lead but ultimately get beaten 2-1. Everybody in the team has to be at it, no passengers can be allowed in matches like these.

I'd probably start with a front three of Welbeck, Sanchez and Iwobi.

I wouldn't start Walcott as he's a passenger most of the time imo and I'd be looking to bring him on in the second half if we are winning and he can be the outlet against tired legs. Welbeck has proven in the past that he will do the donkey work and track back in games like this. Iwobi played well in the second half I thought, so keeps his place.

I've nothing against Giroud, but I'm really hoping he doesn't start in this match. He would easily be marked out of the game against the three Chelsea centre backs. Pace is key in this match for me and is the only way we win imo.

marvin80

KaiserGunner wrote: »

I've nothing against Giroud, but I'm really hoping he doesn't start in this match. He would easily be marked out of the game against the three Chelsea centre backs. Pace is key in this match for me and is the only way we win imo.

+1 on this - definitely start Sanchez.
Arsenal need to start with all guns blazing - this is a massive game in terms of the league for Chelsea and Arsenal so no excuses for a poor effort by Arsenal

Mr.Micro

KaiserGunner wrote: »

Yeah I'm not confident on Saturday. I just think our makeshift midfield is going to be found out badly and the back 4 were pathetic last Tuesday. So it doesn't look good. I can see us taking the lead but ultimately get beaten 2-1. Everybody in the team has to be at it, no passengers can be allowed in matches like these.

I'd probably start with a front three of Welbeck, Sanchez and Iwobi.

I wouldn't start Walcott as he's a passenger most of the time imo and I'd be looking to bring him on in the second half if we are winning and he can be the outlet against tired legs. Welbeck has proven in the past that he will do the donkey work and track back in games like this. Iwobi played well in the second half I thought, so keeps his place.

I've nothing against Giroud, but I'm really hoping he doesn't start in this match. He would easily be marked out of the game against the three Chelsea centre backs. Pace is key in this match for me and is the only way we win imo.

Against Chelsea, Wenger needs to park a couple of buses. A draw would be good result for us. Hull against Man United the other night. Not our style though.

Skylinehead

KaiserGunner wrote: »

I'd probably start with a front three of Welbeck, Sanchez and Iwobi.

I think Perez for Iwobi and that's my front three, I think he offers a bit more defensively and we're going to need that.

tayto lover

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Against Chelsea, Wenger needs to park a couple of buses. A draw would be good result for us. Hull against Man United the other night. Not our style though.

Not worth a damn. We would still be 9 points behind them.
The league is over for us and has been for some time.

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

Not worth a damn. We would still be 9 points behind them.
The league is over for us and has been for some time.

you'd be equally unhappy with a draw or a defeat ?

marvin80

tayto lover wrote: »

Not worth a damn. We would still be 9 points behind them.
The league is over for us and has been for some time.

We need the 3 points more than Chelsea - they have the league wrapped up but top 4 could turn into a dogfight between a few teams

I'd have no problem with us playing Walcott on the right. He played well against Chelsea last time out, he got a hattrick in his last start, and although he didn't score against Watford, he got into good positions for a couple of chances. He also does more tracking back than Iwobi or Perez.

Sanchez has to start up top, so to me it's a much of a muchness which 2 out of Walcott, Welbeck, Iwobi and Perez start on the flanks. It would be nice to give Danny a start, I just wonder if he'll be undercooked.

Biggest concern is midfield. Wenger has been dropping hints about Maitland-Niles doing a job, which is pretty scary. The Ox has been playing well in midfield, but under little pressure. I'd be worried that we'd be overrun.

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

you'd be equally unhappy with a draw or a defeat ?

I'm equally unhappy with Wenger and the rubbish performances he keeps making excuses for.

Arne_Saknussem

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

Should have went all in for Kante.

Arsenal (or should I say Arsene) tried twice, failed both times

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38856261

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

I'm equally unhappy with Wenger and the rubbisih performances he keeps making excuses for.

so you'd be unhappy after a win too?

Sometimes its good to enjoy the moment and forget about the big picture.

I'd be delighted with a win and even satisfied with a draw tomorrow even if (when!) we don't win the league in May

Quazzie

Basil3 wrote: »

Arsenal (or should I say Arsene) tried twice, failed both times

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38856261

Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger says he tried to buy Chelsea midfielder N'Golo Kante twice, saying the reason he did not join the Gunners "is quite obvious when you look where he has gone".

So basically we didn't off him anywhere near the going rate for a midfielder who wins leagues. :mad:

Quazzie

Quazzie wrote: »

Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger says he tried to buy Chelsea midfielder N'Golo Kante twice, saying the reason he did not join the Gunners "is quite obvious when you look where he has gone".

So basically we didn't off him anywhere near the going rate for a midfielder who wins leagues. :mad:

I honestly don't think it would be the transfer fee. Look at what we paid for Xhaka, more than Kante cost. Probably more to do with wages, imo.

eagle eye

Skylinehead wrote: »

Mark Noble? Ah here

This is the, he isn't at a big club and he isn't an international, thought brigade. I was having a conversation about the England team after the Euros and brought up Mark Noble and what he would bring to that team. He would bring leadership, he would bring the getting stuck in attitude, he would bring better set pieces and the discipline to do the job he is told to do. My friends agreed too that he would be a good one to have in the England setup.

Mark Noble is a one club man and a legend at his club now. He does his job, doesn't moan about, doesn't be stuck in the papers every day and because of that he doesn't get rated by a lot of people who can't see outside the top six or seven clubs in the EPL.

If you actually ever watched him play a couple of games you would see his actually a really good footballer.

Edit to add: I'm not saying he would be great at Arsenal, just saying he is very underrated by those who only seem to watch the bigger clubs play.

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

so you'd be unhappy after a win too?

Sometimes its good to enjoy the moment and forget about the big picture.

I'd be delighted with a win and even satisfied with a draw tomorrow even if (when!) we don't win the league in May

Where exactly did I say I'd be unhappy with a win?

You should know my feelings on Wenger by now. His teams lack consistency, brilliant one week and rubbish the next. Flattering to deceive every season and being allowed get away with it. I heard him talking about Frank Lampard this morning and how Frank was always "focused and dedicated" in his approach to the game. Wenger wouldn't know the meaning of the words.

tayto lover

tayto lover wrote: »

Where exactly did I say I'd be unhappy with a win?

You should know my feelings on Wenger by now. His teams lack consistency, brilliant one week and rubbish the next. Flattering to deceive every season and being allowed get away with it. I heard him talking about Frank Lampard this morning and how Frank was always "focused and dedicated" in his approach to the game. Wenger wouldn't know the meaning of the words.

Strange. I'd pretty much say Wenger personifies those two words.

tayto lover

Basil3 wrote: »

Strange. I'd pretty much say Wenger personifies those two words.

And his teams?

Quazzie

Basil3 wrote: »

Strange. I'd pretty much say Wenger personifies those two words.

You really think Wenger prepares the team with focus and dedication? You really say that after looking at the first half against Watford?

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

Where exactly did I say I'd be unhappy with a win?

You should know my feelings on Wenger by now. His teams lack consistency, brilliant one week and rubbish the next. Flattering to deceive every season and being allowed get away with it. I heard him talking about Frank Lampard this morning and how Frank was always "focused and dedicated" in his approach to the game. Wenger wouldn't know the meaning of the words.

Glad to hear you'd be happy with the win !

When scoffing at suggested players just stop and think about some of the mediocre and terrible players who Fergie managed to win the league with. There were times you'd look at United's first 11, nevermind squad, and say they were 3-4 players from being top class. Yet Fergie had them winning leagues and European titles.

Quazzie

Quazzie wrote: »

You really think Wenger prepares the team with focus and dedication? You really say that after looking at the first half against Watford?

Firstly, he didn't say that. He said that Wenger doesn't know the meaning of the words....two totally different things.

Secondly, Wenger didn't even say 'focus and dedication' when talking about Lampard. He's complimenting one individual player on his qualities, and is saying that they are qualities that you can't give to a player.

Amazing that Wenger complimenting a legend of the game can somehow be used as a dig against him. It really doesn't matter what he says these days.

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

Glad to hear you'd be happy with the win !

Nothing to say about the rest of the post?

greendom

tayto lover wrote: »

Nothing to say about the rest of the post?

like you say it is old ground - I'm trying to stay positive and not get into arguments

tayto lover

Basil3 wrote: »

Firstly, he didn't say that. He said that Wenger doesn't know the meaning of the words....two totally different things.

Secondly, Wenger didn't even say 'focus and dedication' when talking about Lampard. He's complimenting one individual player on his qualities, and is saying that they are qualities that you can't give to a player.

Amazing that Wenger complimenting a legend of the game can somehow be used as a dig against him. It really doesn't matter what he says these days.

He did mention focus and dedication.

gitzy16v

I think the only thing Wenger can do now to make up for these last few years is to go extremely close in either the CL or PL.
Anything else is the same old same old.
Its getting more and more frustrating following Arsenal,especially this past 3/4 seasons when the financial restrictions are basically gone,but we've stayed the same level as the past 10 seasons.
I still want a new manager with new ideas,it all just feels stale to me.

tayto lover

tayto lover wrote: »

He did mention focus and dedication.

Guess you can hear what you want to. Sure, you could have used any of the other superlatives he did....just pulling you up on putting words in Wenger's mouth, and twisting it into a dig at him.

It's the equivalent of lazy journalism :pac:

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger says he tried to buy Chelsea midfielder N'Golo Kante twice, saying the reason he did not join the Gunners "is quite obvious when you look where he has gone".

So basically we didn't off him anywhere near the going rate for a midfielder who wins leagues. :mad:

Here's a team of the players Wenger says he tried to sign over the years ha ha -

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/15118/10754260/arsenals-nearly-xi

tayto lover

Basil3 wrote: »

Guess you can hear what you want to. Sure, you could have used any of the other superlatives he did....just pulling you up on putting words in Wenger's mouth, and twisting it into a dig at him.

It's the equivalent of lazy journalism :pac:

It was the words "focus and dedication" I found funny coming from a man who sent out the team against Watford and how they performed in the first half. Not to mention Bournemouth etc etc

Skylinehead

eagle eye wrote: »

This is the, he isn't at a big club and he isn't an international, thought brigade. I was having a conversation about the England team after the Euros and brought up Mark Noble and what he would bring to that team. He would bring leadership, he would bring the getting stuck in attitude, he would bring better set pieces and the discipline to do the job he is told to do. My friends agreed too that he would be a good one to have in the England setup.

Mark Noble is a one club man and a legend at his club now. He does his job, doesn't moan about, doesn't be stuck in the papers every day and because of that he doesn't get rated by a lot of people who can't see outside the top six or seven clubs in the EPL.

If you actually ever watched him play a couple of games you would see his actually a really good footballer.

Edit to add: I'm not saying he would be great at Arsenal, just saying he is very underrated by those who only seem to watch the bigger clubs play.

He's a decent player at his level. He doesn't have England caps because he's not really good enough (although I will say that worse players do have England caps, eg Danny Drinkwater).

And get the boat with the patronising "if you ever actually watched him play" - he's been at West Ham for 13 years now, I've seen plenty of him. I don't just watch Arsenal games you know.

Albert_Camus

Basil3 wrote: »

Strange. I'd pretty much say Wenger personifies those two words.

I'd agree with that.

Looking forward to the game tomorrow. Should be entertaining anyway!

Dolph Starbeam

tayto lover wrote: »

Here's a team of the players Wenger says he tried to sign over the years ha ha -

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/15118/10754260/arsenals-nearly-xi

I'd say every manager has a list like this, can't sign them all. I have heard that Ibrahimovic quote so many times, he is talking through his hole, not a hope he said that when offered a trial.

tayto lover

Dolph Starbeam wrote: »

I'd say every manager has a list like this, can't sign them all. I have heard that Ibrahimovic quote so many times, he is talking through his hole, not a hope he said that when offered a trial.

Yeah, it's mad. Couldn't believe a word most of them say.

Skylinehead

No idea why Pogba's on that list when we would have got Yaya Toure but for work permit issues.

KaiserGunner

The arrogance of Chelsea fans towards tomorrow's game is really starting to grate me, in the words of a certain Kevin Keegan, I'd love it if we beat them, love it!