Drive though McDonalds Celbridge

the_syco

mloc123 wrote: »

The medical centre? Have not heard of any new school apart from the temporary one opposite Salesians.

Seems you're correct. It's called "​Celbridge Primary Care Centre", so I'm assuming that whomever told me assumed that the Primary referred to was a school.

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

scheister

the_syco wrote: »

Seems you're correct. It's called "​Celbridge Primary Care Centre", so I'm assuming that whomever told me assumed that the Primary referred to was a school.

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

you spoke to soon 4 objections now. Da Mario's using the owners name and Cllr Young have both objected along with someone from St Rapheals Manor. generally the increased traffic is the main issue

mloc123

the_syco wrote: »

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

dobsdave

mloc123 wrote: »

the_syco wrote: »

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

LOL, "Please don't let Tesco build on their own land because our customers want to park on Tescos parking spaces"
You couldn't make it up.

corm500

mloc123 wrote: »

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

These objections are gas. There are never any cars in that part of the car park anyway its just a gigantic waste of space. I think they are clutching at straws here.

Coopaloop

Yeah I've never seen da marios over run with customers, and let's be honest there is still plenty of space in Tesco to park if they do get a rush of customers, that family and the chip shop are all linked anyway so I'm not surprised they are objecting. Typical.
And how many people would be all using that particular barber at the same time that they would run out of car parking. Laughable. Every business in the village manages to run a business without the abundance of parking those two establishments have.

dobsdave

corm500 wrote: »

mloc123 wrote: »

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

These objections are gas. There are never any cars in that part of the car park anyway its just a gigantic waste of space. I think they are clutching at straws here.

"undermining of hot-foot outlets" :-)
28 food outlets, of which almost half are made up of shops and pubs.

L1011

dobsdave wrote: »

"undermining of hot-foot outlets" :-)
28 food outlets, of which almost half are made up of shops and pubs.

Same adding up of random outlets (and double/triple counting venues with more than one counter) was done in Maynooth to oppose a restaurant. I can only assume people still think its acceptable to go "waah, waah, I don't want competition" in a planning application because sometimes its actually accepted.

Buffman

Thanks to Cllr Young for the comprehensive list of eateries in the town, it'll come in handy next time I want to try somewhere new.:D

I have to say Mario Macari's submission is well written and does have some good points. His town planner really picks apart their Traffic and Transport Assesment Report and explains well what a mess those junctions currently are.

He also points out something I hadn't noticed and just assumed there was, that there is no provision in the plans to relocate the bottle banks, just remove them, so potentially there won't be any recycling on the North side of the town at all.

Now, I would broadly welcome maccy Ds, but I would like them to sort out those junctions while their doing it. Some roundabouts like the ones at Tesco Maynooth would alleviate the problems and work well IMO.

(Link to all the docs)

mloc123

Buffman wrote: »

Thanks to Cllr Young for the comprehensive list of eateries in the town, it'll come in handy next time I want to try somewhere new.:D

I have to say Mario Macari's submission is well written and does have some good points. His town planner really picks apart their Traffic and Transport Assesment Report and explains well what a mess those junctions currently are.

He also points out something I hadn't noticed and just assumed there was, that there is no provision in the plans to relocate the bottle banks, just remove them, so potentially there won't be any recycling on the North side of the town at all.

Now, I would broadly welcome maccy Ds, but I would like them to sort out those junctions while their doing it. Some roundabouts like the ones at Tesco Maynooth would alleviate the problems and work well IMO.

(Link to all the docs)

Agree, DeMario obviously spent a bit of money on a solicitor that has some experience here.

Are opening hours confirmed at 7-23 now?

Joe Public

Re. Da Mario's input:-

"He also points out something I hadn't noticed and just assumed there was, that there is no provision in the plans to relocate the bottle banks, just remove them, so potentially there won't be any recycling on the North side of the town at all."

mloc123 wrote: »

Agree, DeMario obviously spent a bit of money on a solicitor that has some experience here.

Are opening hours confirmed at 7-23 now?

The proposed McDonalds is not planned for the parking area where the bottle banks are.

brian_t

Joe Public wrote: »

The proposed McDonalds is not planned for the parking area where the bottle banks are.

But that's exactly where it's going.

Buffman

Joe Public wrote: »

The proposed McDonalds is not planned for the parking area where the bottle banks are.

Have you looked at the drawings? According to them, where the bottle banks are now beside Mr Macari's house is going to become a landscaped area with trees on it beside the 'drive-thru' lane pick up windows.

That was actually another aspect of Mr Macari's objection which I can understand where he's coming from. (That his house was going to be overlooked by the drive-thru windows and would be subjected to increased noise and light (car headlights) pollution)

Joe Public

Buffman wrote: »

Have you looked at the drawings? According to them, where the bottle banks are now beside Mr Macari's house is going to become a landscaped area with trees on it beside the 'drive-thru' lane pick up windows.

That was actually another aspect of Mr Macari's objection which I can understand where he's coming from. (That his house was going to be overlooked by the drive-thru windows and would be subjected to increased noise and light (car headlights) pollution)

I was confused by a post here on the 1st Sept that showed a different part of the car park as being the proposed site but now on checking the KCC planning site I see it is where the bottle banks are.

Mr Macari's rented house has been an eyesore for many years often with loads of dumped stuff piled in heaps for all to see and the house could do with a facelift. Despite that moan I suppose he is entitled to make his objections.

One of those big "M" signs would not go down well at this location especially with the workhouse graveyard directly across the road, Lidl had to keep their signs at ground level for the same reason.

The Mulk

Joe Public wrote: »

I was confused by a post here on the 1st Sept that showed a different part of the car park as being the proposed site but now on checking the KCC planning site I see it is where the bottle banks are.

Mr Macari's rented house has been an eyesore for many years often with loads of dumped stuff piled in heaps for all to see and the house could do with a facelift. Despite that moan I suppose he is entitled to make his objections.

One of those big "M" signs would not go down well at this location especially with the workhouse graveyard directly across the road, Lidl had to keep their signs at ground level for the same reason.

Yeah a McDonalds facing a famine memorial, progress!

Anyone hear of an Eddie Rockets for over at SuperValu or is this the rumour mill ramping up again

Buffman

Joe Public wrote: »

I was confused by a post here on the 1st Sept that showed a different part of the car park as being the proposed site but now on checking the KCC planning site I see it is where the bottle banks are.

No worries, I can see where you're coming from. They probably wouldn't try for that location as it's pretty close to a number of houses in Dara Court.

Joe Public wrote: »

One of those big "M" signs would not go down well at this location especially with the workhouse graveyard directly across the road, Lidl had to keep their signs at ground level for the same reason.

There's a 12m high illuminated sign in their plans to be located in the corner opposite the graveyard.

Buffman

Planning permission for this refused according to the online system.

scheister

Buffman wrote: »

Planning permission for this refused according to the online system.

Wonder will they release the reason why it was refused

L1011

They have to. Docs usually take a day or two.

dobsdave

Could this be dead in the water, or is it one of things that they have to change something and re-apply I wonder.

Edit: I see that there are a few new files on the system from different departments looking for further info.

Joe Public

I see one of the reports points out the lack of mention of the recycling bins and they would need to be relocated not closer than 50m from a dwelling. They were very close to Macari's rented house so that must not have been an issue when Tesco's expanded or maybe there was some other reason.

Buffman

scheister wrote: »

Wonder will they release the reason why it was refused

After scanning through the council reports online, it appears to be a combination of issues.

As Joe says, lack of documented replacement recycling facilities was one.

Most of the others related to traffic, including the safety of the proposed HGV access, and the incomplete/inaccurate traffic and car park survey. For example they ignored the second entrance in their survey.

There was also an issue raised in some of the toilets ventilating into the wash up area.

Most of the technical issues raised in Mr Macari's submission have cropped up. I guess it shows the importance of having a 'professional' submission rather than just the "Not In My Back Yard" tone of some of the other submissions.

brian_t

The 4 reasons for the refusal are now up on the KCC site.

L1011

Design and traffic survey/layout. All correctable for a future application.

Joe Public

Reasons given for refusal.

fitz

Joe Public wrote: »

Reasons given for refusal.

That first reason certainly doesn't sound like it's something that will be easily addressed by just a modified resubmission... Could be a full redesign required, might leave it dead in the water.

Buffman

Ye, I'd say given point 1 of that refusal, it's dead in the water at that location.

There aren't many other sites around the town that are far enough away from schools to avoid the 'Greystones' issues McD's had. Maybe in between Lidl and Colourtrend behind the new primary care centre, or beside the Lucan Road Applegreen, or behind the Esso/Topaz on the Clane Road. Beside Aldi might have worked also, except there's now a housing estate going there.

Another alternative could be an ordinary smaller pedestrian only restaurant where the large newsagents closed down at the bridge on Main Street, which is for sale at the moment.

dobsdave

I would think the drive through is a deal breaker for McD, they said they had looked at two other sites,I wonder will they reconsider those now.

brian_t

McDonalds are appealing.

Appeal documents have been added to the original application.

http://webgis.kildarecoco.ie/PlanningEnquiry/ - 16919

Buffman

I had a quick scan through the new drawings, the main changes seem to be the reduction of the sign size from 12m to 6.5m, and the provision of a loading bay for the delivery truck which involves less reversing. There're a few other cosmetic changes but I don't see anything which would address points 1 and 2 of the councils refusal.

The An Bord Pleanála decision is due by 29-03-2017.

http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/247561.htm