No Clawback on mortgage cash back offers ?

SarahMollie

Earleybird wrote: »

The banks are not allowed clawback.

Yes I know, but I've not seen the Banks acknowledge this anywhere, so it would be good to know if someone here had managed to switch in real life.

Cyrus wrote: »

dont ptsb still have a clawback clause?

They all have the clause, its a matter of whether its enforceable. Evidence suggests not, but personally I'd rather not be a test case!

Cyrus

SarahMollie wrote: »

Yes I know, but I've not seen the Banks acknowledge this anywhere, so it would be good to know if someone here had managed to switch in real life.



They all have the clause, its a matter of whether its enforceable. Evidence suggests not, but personally I'd rather not be a test case!

ebs dont have the clause

The Mulk

SarahMollie wrote: »

Yes I know, but I've not seen the Banks acknowledge this anywhere, so it would be good to know if someone here had managed to switch in real life.



They all have the clause, its a matter of whether its enforceable. Evidence suggests not, but personally I'd rather not be a test case!

PTSB have removed their's recently, it was clause 5 in their original T&C.

5. The Bank reserves the right to seek refund of payment of the cashback if mortgage is redeemed in full within 5 years. The loan applicant must return such sum immediately to permanent tsb.

It will be wait and see for a few people on here

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/bank-of-ireland-to-pay-customers-4500-to-take-out-150000-mortgage-35003874.html

SarahMollie

The Mulk wrote: »

PTSB have removed their's recently, it was clause 5 in their original T&C.

5. The Bank reserves the right to seek refund of payment of the cashback if mortgage is redeemed in full within 5 years. The loan applicant must return such sum immediately to permanent tsb.

It will be wait and see for a few people on here

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/bank-of-ireland-to-pay-customers-4500-to-take-out-150000-mortgage-35003874.html

Yeah I suppose the test will be when people who availed of the offer when the clauses were still included can just ignore the clauses now and move without fear of penalty.

I'm on a fixed rate with BOI and while its not the worst, I think I could do better, and especially in 18months when hopefully more of the promised competitors enter the market.

I want to be able to reduce the interest I pay so that I can maintain payments at their current level but pay the mortgage off sooner, and save myself money in the long term.

I'd say I'm a pretty good mortgage customer (low risk), I'm not overborrowed by any stretch, I work in an industry where there are lots of jobs, I have other savings and I'm close to owning 50% of the property outright (taking into account that prices have risen, I probably already do in real terms). I feel I should be a good candidate to shop around, and after 3 years of paying a fixed rate, BOI will have made more than enough money out of me.

The Mulk

SarahMollie wrote: »

Yeah I suppose the test will be when people who availed of the offer when the clauses were still included can just ignore the clauses now and move without fear of penalty.

I'm on a fixed rate with BOI and while its not the worst, I think I could do better, and especially in 18months when hopefully more of the promised competitors enter the market.

I want to be able to reduce the interest I pay so that I can maintain payments at their current level but pay the mortgage off sooner, and save myself money in the long term.

I'd say I'm a pretty good mortgage customer (low risk), I'm not overborrowed by any stretch, I work in an industry where there are lots of jobs, I have other savings and I'm close to owning 50% of the property outright (taking into account that prices have risen, I probably already do in real terms). I feel I should be a good candidate to shop around, and after 3 years of paying a fixed rate, BOI will have made more than enough money out of me.

it's a good idea to overpay when you can, we did that on our first house, but still took 2 x 6 month mortgage holidays when kids arrived to allow for extended career breaks. We still had a nice bit of equity built up even though the price wasn't that far off what we paid when we sold it.
I'll certainly pay close attention to any new entrants into the market.

tom1ie

In the process of switching my mortgage from aib (ltv<90%) to Ebs variable (ltv<50%) gonna get the 2% payement from Ebs. However the mortgage advisor has told me there is a clawback. When I asked for the literature and terms and conditions to support this he said he'd e mail them on. This was last week so when I get them I'll put up any terms and conditions that could effect people that are in the same boat. As far as I was aware the banks weren't allowed have a clawback.

Cyrus

tom1ie wrote: »

In the process of switching my mortgage from aib (ltv<90%) to Ebs variable (ltv<50%) gonna get the 2% payement from Ebs. However the mortgage advisor has told me there is a clawback. When I asked for the literature and terms and conditions to support this he said he'd e mail them on. This was last week so when I get them I'll put up any terms and conditions that could effect people that are in the same boat. As far as I was aware the banks weren't allowed have a clawback.

there's no clawback

http://www.newstalk.com/EBS-offers-mortgage-cash-back

nothing here either

https://www.ebs.ie/mortgages/back-in-cash

tom1ie

Cyrus wrote: »

there's no clawback

http://www.newstalk.com/EBS-offers-mortgage-cash-back

nothing here either

https://www.ebs.ie/mortgages/back-in-cash

Yeah but I'd still like to have it in writing from them. It's strange that the mortgage advisor is saying one thing and their pr department is saying the opposite. He said something along the lines of, sure if that was the case everyone would grab their switching money and just switch again.
Which is what I had/have planned.

Cyrus

tom1ie wrote: »

Yeah but I'd still like to have it in writing from them. It's strange that the mortgage advisor is saying one thing and their pr department is saying the opposite. He said something along the lines of, sure if that was the case everyone would grab their switching money and just switch again.
Which is what I had/have planned.

id ask for it in writing if there was any ambiguity but you wont see it in writing anywhere that there is a clawback

im switching away from them as we speak :pac::P

Earleybird

tom1ie wrote: »

Yeah but I'd still like to have it in writing from them. It's strange that the mortgage advisor is saying one thing and their pr department is saying the opposite. He said something along the lines of, sure if that was the case everyone would grab their switching money and just switch again.
Which is what I had/have planned.

In the process of doing the same Tom, very little information as to whether others are taking advantage of the switchers so I'm intrigued to see how the process goes

tom1ie

Earleybird wrote: »

In the process of doing the same Tom, very little information as to whether others are taking advantage of the switchers so I'm intrigued to see how the process goes

OK so I got an e mail today off the mortgage advisor in Ebs saying that there is no clawback. To confirm this I also asked the competition and consumer protection commission (ccpc), who gave me a number to ring belonging to Ebs' parent company Aib. When I posed the question to the person on the phone she confirmed there was no clawback at all.
I was 90% sure there was no clawback as per the advice on here and other forums but I just had to make sure, and I now have the added bonus of an e mail from the bank confirming this. Happy days! Thanks for all your help.

mac.in

Has anyone switched out from PTSB before the completion of the contentious 5 year period, without the clawback enforced upon? I'm planning to switch in Dec 17.

al_E_kat

mac.in wrote: »

Has anyone switched out from PTSB before the completion of the contentious 5 year period, without the clawback enforced upon? I'm planning to switch in Dec 17.

Just coming to the end of a switch from PTSB to KBC. Got the 2% cashback in June 2016 and in April 2017 they sent me a letter to say that the clawback no longer applied. No mention of it during the switching process.

mac.in

al_E_kat wrote: »

Just coming to the end of a switch from PTSB to KBC. Got the 2% cashback in June 2016 and in April 2017 they sent me a letter to say that the clawback no longer applied. No mention of it during the switching process.

Thanks.
Mortgage drawn in PTSB Dec 2016. Finishing my one year fixed rate in PTSB in Dec 17. Planning to switch to other bank for better interest rate. Hopefully, I shall not payback the cashback. I shall update once switch complete.

Earleybird

It's been mentioned a few times already here but just for clarity there is no legal right for any of the banks to clawback the cashback offers, so once you receive the cash... switch away. I've switched from PTSB after less than 6 months, will continue switching for as long as the banks have appetite for me and the offers are on the table.

radharc

Earleybird wrote: »

It's been mentioned a few times already here but just for clarity there is no legal right for any of the banks to clawback the cashback offers, so once you receive the cash... switch away. I've switched from PTSB after less than 6 months, will continue switching for as long as the banks have appetite for me and the offers are on the table.

The banks have thieved people rotten down the years but I still wouldn't do this. In my case I signed a commitment that I wouldn't switch for 3 years and will stick to my end of the bargain even if it's not strictly enforceable. Your word has to mean something.

traveller0101

radharc wrote: »

The banks have thieved people rotten down the years but I still wouldn't do this. In my case I signed a commitment that I wouldn't switch for 3 years and will stick to my end of the bargain even if it's not strictly enforceable. Your word has to mean something.

Are you saying this from a legal or honour/respect point of view?

Earleybird

traveller0101 wrote: »

Are you saying this from a legal or honour/respect point of view?

It's obviously an an honour point of view, there is no such legal agreement that would tie you to a mortgage contract for 3 years. Strange approach but each to their own.

The Mulk

Earleybird wrote: »

It's obviously an an honour point of view, there is no such legal agreement that would tie you to a mortgage contract for 3 years. Strange approach but each to their own.

Unless you have a 3 year fixed, you will be liable for an exit clause if you exit within the 3 years, Variable you can exit anytime.

Earleybird

The Mulk wrote: »

Unless you have a 3 year fixed, you will be liable for an exit clause if you exit within the 3 years, Variable you can exit anytime.

Would depend on how rates had gone since entering the fixed period, in some cases there would be a nil exit cost. Generally a cashback offer would more than compensate where there was a break fee to be paid.

The Mulk

Earleybird wrote: »

Would depend on how rates had gone since entering the fixed period, in some cases there would be a nil exit cost. Generally a cashback offer would more than compensate where there was a break fee to be paid.

Can I ask what you roughly paid to a solicitor to handle the switch?
I'm starting the process, just finished 1 year fixed with PTSB.
By paying the same repayments with UB(as PTSB variable) i can knock 3 years off the mortgage!

Earleybird

The Mulk wrote: »

Can I ask what you roughly paid to a solicitor to handle the switch?
I'm starting the process, just finished 1 year fixed with PTSB.
By paying the same repayments with UB(as PTSB variable) i can knock 3 years off the mortgage!

Paid just over €1,000 which included solicitor fee plus all Deed, Land Registry and additional fees.

The Mulk

Earleybird wrote: »

Paid just over €1,000 which included solicitor fee plus all Deed, Land Registry and additional fees.

Thanks, i've a similar quote, so i know i'm not getting ripped off. I'll start gathering all my paperwork!

Interested Observer

This thread is quite informative, I'm currently shopping around and the BOI 5 year fixed at 3% interest with 2% cashback looks pretty attractive. But I couldn't find clarity on their site as to clawback and I was wondering if we did the 5 years and then kept our options open to moving provider if they'd come looking for the 2% back. So it looks like clawbacks are not a thing, which is great. The 2% cashback would be a serious help getting us set up in the new house.

Cyrus

Interested Observer wrote: »

This thread is quite informative, I'm currently shopping around and the BOI 5 year fixed at 3% interest with 2% cashback looks pretty attractive. But I couldn't find clarity on their site as to clawback and I was wondering if we did the 5 years and then kept our options open to moving provider if they'd come looking for the 2% back. So it looks like clawbacks are not a thing, which is great. The 2% cashback would be a serious help getting us set up in the new house.

no they cant clawback, one thing to check though is that you get another 1% from them at the end of year 5 so you can compare that against interest savings by switching

Interested Observer

Cyrus wrote: »

no they cant clawback, one thing to check though is that you get another 1% from them at the end of year 5 so you can compare that against interest savings by switching

Their variable rate is absolutely awful, think it's 4.5%, so yeah could be worth fixing for another year and getting the 1%. I assume they're just trying to drive people to fixed rates.

Going from 3% to 4.5% could add over €200 per month onto the payments :eek:

Cyrus

Interested Observer wrote: »

Their variable rate is absolutely awful, think it's 4.5%, so yeah could be worth fixing for another year and getting the 1%. I assume they're just trying to drive people to fixed rates.

you will get the 1% at the end of year 5, before you move onto variable, you could be substantially down the road with another bank on remortgaging just as you move off the fixed and onto the variable

it would be a timing thing i guess

Interested Observer

Cyrus wrote: »

you will get the 1% at the end of year 5, before you move onto variable, you could be substantially down the road with another bank on remortgaging just as you move off the fixed and onto the variable

it would be a timing thing i guess

And of course if they're still offering those competitive fixed rates in 5 years time we could just fix again and save the hassle.

But yes fair point, could start talking to the new bank/solicitor with a few months to go before we hit the 5 year point.

Earleybird

Cyrus wrote: »

you will get the 1% at the end of year 5, before you move onto variable, you could be substantially down the road with another bank on remortgaging just as you move off the fixed and onto the variable

it would be a timing thing i guess

The landscape of mortgages will be vastly different in 5 years in all likelihood, a 4.5% variable might not look so odd anymore. It's a buyers market for now though so do your homework, do your maths and you can't go too far wrong.

Resurrecting an old but informative thread:
Did anyone who was going through the process of repaying early or switching get clarity on whether BoI would claw back the 2% cashback?

I saw several people say they couldn't or wouldn't but I'm not sure if anyone tested the theory in practice.