Protected cycle lanes to schools

Chuchote

The biggest change to cycling in my lifetime has been the disappearance of child cyclists from the roads in recent years.

And the biggest change to cycling could be if Ireland built protected cycle lanes for a mile to every school.

Apart from the enormous difference daily cycling would make to children's health, the fact that children would then be a high proportion of cyclists would immediately end the radio-DJ-rant attitude of some drivers to cyclists.

But the main reason to do it would be health: kids who cycle would have a way lower risk of obesity, diabetes, heart disease; they'd have far greater self-reliance than kids whose parents ferry them to school in the back of the car, so they just hop from the breakfast table to the car to the school desk.

(Giving this its own thread and a poll.)

magicbastarder

main concern that pops into my head is access to the cycle lanes - in that, how far would a child have to cycle to reach one, without carpeting an area around a school with them?

Chuchote

magicbastarder wrote: »

main concern that pops into my head is access to the cycle lanes - in that, how far would a child have to cycle to reach one, without carpeting an area around a school with them?

My first premise is that most kids live within a mile of their school. Lots of kids here cycling to primary school on pavements with a parent.

magicbastarder

i think i mentioned before that one of my cousin's kids goes to a secondary school where only a single pupil cycles in - though to be fair, access to that school is not good at all - mount sackville near castleknock.

Chips Lovell

We need to do better at informing people that cycling isn't dangerous.

Building cycle lanes like these only reinforces the perception that young cyclists shouldn't be on the road.

smacl

I think many kids live further away than this. My daughter will be cycling a number of days per week to her new school, just under 10k each way. For me the important bit is cycling the route a number of times with her, and checking all the potential hazards and how best to approach them. While she's just gone 13, she's very much a novice cyclist with little practise up until now, so we've planned the route very conservatively with pedestrian crossings and even going on the path for congested parts where there's no cycling lane. As she improves, these can be removed, but for now it is very much safety first.

She loves the idea of cycling and the Independence it provides, and has no issues with the 10k. The school is using tablets rather than books for education which makes a huge difference. I'm 100% with you that more kids should be cycling, and suspect one of the biggest blocking factors apart from ridiculously heavy books is parents that don't cycle who have a paranoia regarding road safety. For short trips, I think safe routes can be organised between most places at the expense of speed and efficiency. i.e. the route my daughter will be taking will be 10k, where my route would be 8k, and she'll be stopping for many more lights.

ted1

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

We need to do better at informing people that cycling isn't dangerous.

Building cycle lanes like these only reinforces the perception that young cyclists shouldn't be on the road.

It was dangerous enough this moring, schools are back so random stops by car and door openings are up 900% on yesterday.

It's September watch out for car Doors....

magicbastarder

would be interesting to hear how many posters on here used to cycle to school (or still do!)
i walked to primary school, about one third of a km. cycled to secondary, except for sixth year, and that was just over 3km.

smacl

Cycled to secondary on and off, 8k each way, and last two years in primary about 2k, and used to spend a lot of time on the bike as a kid to get to friends houses.

ted1

Walked about 250m to primary, cycled everyday to secondary 9km each way, usually carried a school bag full of books on my back as we had no lockers and then a sports bag with Rugby gear in it thrown across the handle bar and crossbar.

Chuchote

Bus to primary, cycled to secondary. Didn't let my own cycle alone across city to school until over 14.

Chuchote

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

We need to do better at informing people that cycling isn't dangerous.

Building cycle lanes like these only reinforces the perception that young cyclists shouldn't be on the road.

Cycling is dangerous, if you're cycling among unwary drivers. In every western country where cycling is the norm rather than driving, protected cycle lanes are ubiquitous.

Weepsie

magicbastarder wrote: »

i think i mentioned before that one of my cousin's kids goes to a secondary school where only a single pupil cycles in - though to be fair, access to that school is not good at all - mount sackville near castleknock.

Perfect excuse to be doing repeats of knockmaroon hill if you ask me.

Teacher: "why were you late?"
Pupil: "I was doing hill training and trying for a QoM"

Chips Lovell

Chuchote wrote: »

Cycling is dangerous, if you're cycling among unwary drivers. In every western country where cycling is the norm rather than driving, protected cycle lanes are ubiquitous.

Not borne out by accident or injury statistics.

If even cyclists are telling people that cycling is dangerous, don't be surprised that so few people are willing to take up cycling, let alone let their kids on the road.

magicbastarder

shane ross has just announced that cycle lanes will be mandatory, but every citizen will get their own personalised cycle lane:
http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/eu-orders-ireland-to-recoup-up-to-13bn-in-unpaid-taxes-from-apple-1.2772919

smacl

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

We need to do better at informing people that cycling isn't dangerous.

Building cycle lanes like these only reinforces the perception that young cyclists shouldn't be on the road.

While I agree with the sentiment, going in through it at the moment I have to say that it is a difficult argument to win. From a pragmatic standpoint, I think the best usage for all the cycling infrastructure already built is to help kids and novice or occasional cyclists get around on bikes. Having used it a bit, I think it needs to be finished as it is currently very gappy and in some places simply not fit for purpose.

Lumen

IMO cycling to school doesn't really make sense for distances under a mile. At those distances it's quicker to walk/scoot once you factor in prep time and hassle of locking/unlocking bikes.

Whilst cycling on roads is safe, the major issue is getting through the gridlock of cars full of other people's children.

Chuchote

Parents won't let kids cycle unless there's a protected lane. Protected lanes will bring kids on to the roads as cyclists. Once kids are cycling, the whole question changes.

Chuchote

magicbastarder wrote: »

i think i mentioned before that one of my cousin's kids goes to a secondary school where only a single pupil cycles in - though to be fair, access to that school is not good at all - mount sackville near castleknock.

On the edge of the Phoenix Park?

Lumen

Chuchote wrote: »

Parents won't let kids cycle unless there's a protected lane. Protected lanes will bring kids on to the roads as cyclists. Once kids are cycling, the whole question changes.

If they're in a protected lane they're not really "on the roads".

magicbastarder

Chuchote wrote: »

On the edge of the Phoenix Park?

yep.

Lumen

I would prefer there to be lane widening without any changes to lane markings (i.e. no marked cycle lanes at all).

Chuchote

magicbastarder wrote: »

yep.

Pretty good cycling access then.

Macy0161

I voted yes, but not because I think protected lanes are necessary for children to safely cycle, all things being equal, but more to ensure they have space from the ridiculous parking anywhere/ pulling up in traffic flow to drop off etc that goes on near schools. It's actually other parents of the same school I'd have concerns about!

Lumen

Chuchote wrote: »

Pretty good cycling access then.

Posh kids don't cycle. This is nothing new.

A boardsie once told me he was the only gay in the village cyclist in his fee-paying south Dublin secondary school back in the 1990s.

Chuchote

Cycling to school in the Netherlands

Chuchote

Belgium…

magicbastarder

Chuchote wrote: »

Pretty good cycling access then.

it's not far from castleknock, sure. but the main access road is hairy if you're not a confident cyclist.

magicbastarder

Lumen wrote: »

Posh kids don't cycle. This is nothing new.

A boardsie once told me he was the only gay in the village cyclist in his fee-paying south Dublin secondary school back in the 1990s.

i went to a fee paying school in the late 80s/early 90s - plenty of people cycled. it was in the suburbs, so wasn't a long trek for most.

ted1

Lumen wrote: »

Posh kids don't cycle. This is nothing new.

A boardsie once told me he was the only gay in the village cyclist in his fee-paying south Dublin secondary school back in the 1990s.

Nonsense , most the kids in my school cycled (Terenure) and I know that Mary's and High school was the same.

Chuchote

Lumen wrote: »

IMO cycling to school doesn't really make sense for distances under a mile. At those distances it's quicker to walk/scoot once you factor in prep time and hassle of locking/unlocking bikes.

Whilst cycling on roads is safe, the major issue is getting through the gridlock of cars full of other people's children.

Which is why protected lanes would be good: a good proportion of those protective parents would a) feel confident to cycle with their kids at first, then let their kids cycle on their own; and b) realise that they'd save thousands per year by not having to do the school run.