Wayne f*cking Rooney

Charizard

Pro. F wrote: »

Ibra's age and stage in his career are irrelevant to the question of whether or not he has played better than Rooney.

I agree that the two roles (CF and #10) are different, but not so different that we can't compare how well the two have played. Scoring, creating, holding onto possession, providing passing options for the deeper players - those are tasks that the two central attackers share. Ibra has scored more, Rooney has done the rest better. That looks to me like the two of them have been at a very similar level of performance overall, given the relative focus of their roles. But some people want to claim that Ibra has been miles better than Rooney. Not a chance.

This is so incorrect its funny. Rooney has had only a negative impact on Uniteds play. There is two players better at 10 playing elsewhere because Rooney needs to be shoehorned into the team.

deaddonkey15

He's not worth keeping around

Charizard wrote: »

This is so incorrect its funny. Rooney has had only a negative impact on Uniteds play. There is two players better at 10 playing elsewhere because Rooney needs to be shoehorned into the team.

Like Mkhitaryan last week.

Pro. F

Charizard wrote: »

This is so incorrect its funny. Rooney has had only a negative impact on Uniteds play. There is two players better at 10 playing elsewhere because Rooney needs to be shoehorned into the team.

He's scored one goal and created two more, so to say that he has had only a negative impact on United's play is clearly wrong, as a matter of fact. If you are sticking by that claim then there's no point discussing further details.

Charizard

Pro. F wrote: »

He's scored one goal and created two more, so to say that he has had only a negative impact on United's play is clearly wrong, as a matter of fact. If you are sticking by that claim then there's no point discussing further details.

There is no point in discussing it because you are clearly ignoring the reality

LuckyLloyd

The sharps in this thread for Rooney, enjoyable read.

Nalz

He's not worth keeping around

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The sharps in this thread for Rooney, enjoyable read.

Not as enjoyable as that time in Lansdowne when.....

Just kidding

wazza bar one awful pass doing ok so far

Nalz

He's not worth keeping around

Nalz wrote: »

Not as enjoyable as that time in Lansdowne when.....

Just kidding

wazza bar one awful pass doing ok so far

Wazza doing great!

Dempsey

A good option from the bench

Doing well while losing is not something to champion him with

He's been bang average

Nalz

He's not worth keeping around

Dempsey wrote: »

Doing well while losing is not something to champion him with

He's been bang average

He's been shíte I was joking.

Awful awful stuff

Dempsey

A good option from the bench

Nalz wrote: »

He's been shíte I was joking.

Awful awful stuff

Sorry mate, my sarcasm detector is hungover today

eagle eye

eagle eye wrote: »

He is not infallible as far as the longer term but until such time as his record at Manchester United falls below 100% he is.

So after 3 losses I assume that literally everything he's done is wrong?

Flint Fredstone

A good option from the bench

The undroppable force. 300k a week captain fantastic, all is fine, nothing to see here.

Nalz

He's not worth keeping around

Dempsey wrote: »

Sorry mate, my sarcasm detector is hungover today

Ha no worries it wasn't very clear

ebbsy

I think Utd should give him a contract extension.

He's not worth keeping around

Rooney the scapegoat. Worse than him on the pitch today

deaddonkey15

He's not worth keeping around

RoboKlopp wrote: »

Rooney the scapegoat. Worse than him on the pitch today

Rooney is the scapegoat even when United win.

super_furry

Honestly think he's finished as a top class striker and he has been for a while. He's just continuing his form of last season and unlike Van Gaal, I think Mourinho will run out of patience with him quickly.

Jelle1880

A good option from the bench

RoboKlopp wrote: »

Rooney the scapegoat. Worse than him on the pitch today

He's the captain, right ?

Of course he's gonna take the majority of flak, especially if he mouths off to the ref and gets carded for it.
At one point Watford were attacking and he was more interested in talking to the linesman than following play.

deaddonkey15

He's not worth keeping around

Jelle1880 wrote: »

He's the captain, right ?

Of course he's gonna take the majority of flak, especially if he mouths off to the ref and gets carded for it.

He mouthed off to the linesman and I think it was the tackle he was carded for.

Nalz

He's not worth keeping around

6 or 7 others playing average or poor does not give any excuse for Rooney's performance

Rubbish individual performance

deaddonkey15

He's not worth keeping around

Nalz wrote: »

6 or 7 others playing average or poor does not give any excuse for Rooney's performance

Rubbish individual performance

Well actually it does to a small extent as it's difficult for any player to perform well when the entire team is out of sorts and being outplayed.

Nalz

He's not worth keeping around

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Well actually it does to a small extent as it's difficult for any player to perform well when the entire team is out of sorts and being outplayed.

A very small extent when you examine all Rooney's fück ups

niallo27

A good option from the bench

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Well actually it does to a small extent as it's difficult for any player to perform well when the entire team is out of sorts and being outplayed.

He is supposed to be a leader though and not giving away stupid free kicks that use up 2 minutes of injury time.

Jelle1880

A good option from the bench

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Well actually it does to a small extent as it's difficult for any player to perform well when the entire team is out of sorts and being outplayed.

Am I wrong in saying that a lot, if not most of ManU's midfield play goes through him ?

So surely if he is playing on a very bad level this will automatically influence others ? The way you make it sound is like he's playing bad because others are too.

deaddonkey15

He's not worth keeping around

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Am I wrong in saying that a lot, if not most of ManU's midfield play goes through him ?

Yes.

Jelle1880 wrote: »

So surely if he is playing on a very bad level this will automatically influence others ? The way you make it sound is like he's playing bad because others are too.

Not automatically no, they're not children. I've yet to see Pogba put in a performance that Carrick isn't capable of. That's not Rooney's fault. Watford should have scored early on today when de Gea and Smalling collided with each other, that's not Rooney's fault. Fellaini giving away a penalty after Bailly cheaply gives away possession isn't Rooney's fault.

niallo27 wrote: »

He is supposed to be a leader though and not giving away stupid free kicks that use up 2 minutes of injury time.

2 minutes is a bit of a stretch. I've seen leaders do far worse on a football pitch. I saw plenty of United players give away stupid free's today.

Nalz wrote: »

A very small extent when you examine all Rooney's fück ups

What exactly were his f*ck ups? He played poorly in a poorly performing team. I don't recall him actually f*cking anything up.

Jelle1880

A good option from the bench

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Not automatically no, they're not children. I've yet to see Pogba put in a performance that Carrick isn't capable of. That's not Rooney's fault. Watford should have scored early on today when de Gea and Smalling collided with each other, that's not Rooney's fault. Fellaini giving away a penalty after Bailly cheaply gives away possession isn't Rooney's fault.

But none of those players underperforming excuses the fact that Rooney has been bang average for at least this and last season, right ?

gosplan

Rooney's getting a larger proportion of the blame because he's playing as the no 10.

Riquelme said about the position that 'when the team don't play well everyone says it's my fault.'

I get that but I don't think Rooney will ever be any use there.

The loss of ability to cross a ball or take a corner is pretty bad though.

Harry Palmr

Given that he plays every league game if fit Rooney is emblematic, a symptom of something rotten within the club. What to do with club legends is problematic, always has been. If you are lucky they are modest enough to know when the game is up - if unlucky they have to be disabused of their own delusions and shoved out the door. That's what a manager is employed to do.

Flint Fredstone

A good option from the bench

Embarrassing

https://twitter.com/fcafkicken/status/777547035746578432

Pro. F

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Embarrassing

https://twitter.com/fcafkicken/status/777547035746578432

You could make a similar - or worse in most cases - video for any of the outfield players today.

gosplan

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Embarrassing

https://twitter.com/fcafkicken/status/777547035746578432

I was wondering if something like that would surface. You can't play in midfield and do that kind of thing.

Edited: just saw stats.

He didn't play a single through ball, didn't create a chance from open play, didn't have a shot on target, didn't take anyone on and didn't tackle anyone.

Only 40 passes, 33 successful and only 6 were forward.

Watching the second half really reminded me of the Neviller's last couple of performances where he was just a liability.

Billy86

Jelle1880 wrote: »

But none of those players underperforming excuses the fact that Rooney has been bang average for at least this and last season, right ?

Oh it's been for a lot longer than that!

Pro. F

gosplan wrote: »

I was wondering if something like that would surface. You can't play in midfield and do that kind of thing.

Edited: just saw stats.

He didn't play a single through ball, didn't create a chance from open play, didn't have a shot on target, didn't take anyone on and didn't tackle anyone.

Only 40 passes, 33 successful and only 6 were forward.

Watching the second half really reminded me of the Neviller's last couple of performances where he was just a liability.

He didn't play in midfield. He played number 10.

Pro. F

Pro. F wrote: »

He didn't play in midfield. He played number 10.

Played number ten in midfield

gosplan

Pro. F wrote: »

He didn't play in midfield. He played number 10.

Sorry, I always consider the no 10 an AMF. Like Mata or Ozil are midfielders.

Anyway, he was sh1te today.

I get what people are saying regarding Martial and Rashford not playing well but they're not undroppable the way Rooney seems to be.

Also the no 10 is so crucial to everything a team does going forward.

The good thing is it's a really easy fix for Jose.

Pro. F

gosplan wrote: »

Sorry, I always consider the no 10 an AMF. Like Mata or Ozil are midfielders.

Anyway, he was sh1te today.

I get what people are saying regarding Martial and Rashford not playing well but they're not undroppable the way Rooney seems to be.

Also the no 10 is so crucial to everything a team does going forward.

The good thing is it's a really easy fix for Jose.

Number 10 isn't any more crucial than CF or central midfield. There was nobody playing well enough today imo and Rooney was far from the worst.

Imo dropping him won't fix the problem and playing 433 won't fix it either. I think Jose needs to settle the defence down (they have been so jittery in possession and then today under high balls too), find two wingers who can put in decent performances and also get the whole team a whole lot fitter.

gosplan

Pro. F wrote: »

Number 10 isn't any more crucial than CF or central midfield. There was nobody playing well enough today imo and Rooney was far from the worst.

Imo dropping him won't fix the problem and playing 433 won't fix it either. I think Jose needs to settle the defence down (they have been so jittery in possession and then today under high balls too), find two wingers who can put in decent performances and also get the whole team a whole lot fitter.

Grand. You'd know more than me anyway (not something you hear on boards very often).

I just think though that we're what, 18 months into the whole Rooney as a midfielder thing?

Can't see how it's going to start working at this stage.

edgecutter

Pro. F wrote: »

Number 10 isn't any more crucial than CF or central midfield. There was nobody playing well enough today imo and Rooney was far from the worst.

Imo dropping him won't fix the problem and playing 433 won't fix it either. I think Jose needs to settle the defence down (they have been so jittery in possession and then today under high balls too), find two wingers who can put in decent performances and also get the whole team a whole lot fitter.

So we keep playing him?

I think he needs to be binned for at least a month and hopefully it will put some fire in his belly.

edgecutter

Pro. F wrote: »

He didn't play in midfield. He played number 10.

He played everywhere today and that isn't a compliment. He was out on the wing, in midfield beside Fellaini and as a number 10 and he offered nothing.

Pro. F

edgecutter wrote: »

So we keep playing him?

I think he needs to be binned for at least a month and hopefully it will put some fire in his belly.

I think himself and Ibra have been the best players in the front four or five so far this season. I think dropping Rooney wouldn't fix anything, so yes, keep playing him.

edgecutter wrote: »

He played everywhere today and that isn't a compliment. He was out on the wing, in midfield beside Fellaini and as a number 10 and he offered nothing.

There's nothing wrong with a number 10 getting involved on the wing and deeper in midfield. It's extremely common to see the best 10s in the world doing these things. He didn't play well enough - nobody did - but I don't agree he offered nothing.

holy guacamole

The fact Mourinho has started Rooney in every league game suggests to me he's lost his edge as a manager.

I could understand stooges like Moyes, Hodgson and Van Gaal having blind faith in a player way past his best, but had really hoped Mourinho would have the courage to dispense with him.

It seems like they're all afraid to be the one to call time on Rooney's career in case it backfires on them.

Contrast it with Guardiola's approach at city; has stamped his authority straight away by sending Joe Hart packing and reducing Toure to a bit-part role.

United's starting XI against Leicester will reveal a lot, if it contains Rooney and Fellaini then I think we'll have to accept that the former won't be dropped no matter how awful he is.

Francie Barrett

A good option from the bench

I feel a bit sorry for Rooney (I mean as far as anyone can be sorry for someone on £300k a week). After a career as a striker, he's dropped into an unfamiliar position, it's clearly not working and the entire world can see it. Unlikely Schweinsteiger (who never really looked like he was trying), you can see that Rooney is desperate to succeed. United have a game against Northampton mid-week, best thing to do would be to move Rooney upfront, hope that he has a good game, so maybe he can recover his confidence, which looks shot.

bucketybuck

Francie Barrett wrote: »

After a career as a striker, he's dropped into an unfamiliar position

I remember somebody making the point how surprising it was that Wayne Rooney himself didn't fight harder for his position as striker at the club.

He had the status and the goal scoring record to almost demand the role of headline striker yet for years now he is seemingly content to faff about in deeper roles. Striker is undoubtedly his best role so why hasn't he been privately demanding to play as a goalscorer and doing everything in his power to make it happen?

Cue answers of "he's just doing what the manager asks and he's putting the team first", but to be honest I think there is more to it than that.

Lord TSC

Francie Barrett wrote: »

United have a game against Northampton mid-week, best thing to do would be to move Rooney upfront, hope that he has a good game, so maybe he can recover his confidence, which looks shot.

Games like Northampton should be when the likes of Rashford is starting up front, for his development.

edgecutter

Pro. F wrote: »

I think himself and Ibra have been the best players in the front four or five so far this season. I think dropping Rooney wouldn't fix anything, so yes, keep playing him.



There's nothing wrong with a number 10 getting involved on the wing and deeper in midfield. It's extremely common to see the best 10s in the world doing these things. He didn't play well enough - nobody did - but I don't agree he offered nothing.

This is the same nonsense that has been going on for 3 years now. The idea that he has to play when the likes of Mickey, Herrara, Young and Mata get dropped when they put in one poor performance is beyond stupid. He needs to be dropped and I mean dropped for 3-4 games at least, and if we are still playing rubbish then I will concede that you have a point.

However, today was shocking and he is becoming a big hinderance in stopping the right players play in their natural positions because 5 years ago he was considered a top player. If reputation is keeping him playing then Bobby Charlton may tog out for Wednesday.

edgecutter

Francie Barrett wrote: »

I feel a bit sorry for Rooney (I mean as far as anyone can be sorry for someone on £300k a week). After a career as a striker, he's dropped into an unfamiliar position, it's clearly not working and the entire world can see it. Unlikely Schweinsteiger (who never really looked like he was trying), you can see that Rooney is desperate to succeed. United have a game against Northampton mid-week, best thing to do would be to move Rooney upfront, hope that he has a good game, so maybe he can recover his confidence, which looks shot.

He had a number of games last year to show what he could do up front and he was poor. His physical strength is poor, pace is now gone and his footballing brain has slowed down. hence why he no longer warrants to play as a striker.

Billy86

Some of Rooney's best years came playing off the striker when he first arrived at Old Trafford. It's kind of amusing to hear the excuses that he's not used to playing there etc.

He simply hasn't taken care of himself and its been showing for a long time now. He won't ever be what he could have been, and he won't reach where he once was. He does t need to be sold, but he needs to be made expect David in terms of the first XI. He in no way warrants be g undroppable and I'm beginning to get very worried that it's not a strictly footballing decision to wedge him in, game after game.

Flint Fredstone

A good option from the bench

Billy86 wrote: »

Some of Rooney's best years came playing off the striker when he first arrived at Old Trafford. It's kind of amusing to hear the excuses that he's not used to playing there etc.

He simply hasn't taken care of himself and its been showing for a long time now. He won't ever be what he could have been, and he won't reach where he once was. He does t need to be sold, but he needs to be made expect David in terms of the first XI. He in no way warrants be g undroppable and I'm beginning to get very worried that it's not a strictly footballing decision to wedge him in, game after game.

I was listening to a podcast last month where a guy jokingly said that Rooney's constant inclusion may be down to an advertising deal or contract clause.
The way things are heading in the game today I actually wouldn't be all that shocked if that turned out to be true :pac:

~Rebel~

Billy86 wrote: »

Some of Rooney's best years came playing off the striker when he first arrived at Old Trafford. It's kind of amusing to hear the excuses that he's not used to playing there etc.
.

From what i've seen of him, he's playing 20 yards deeper than he did back then though. Rather than right off another striker, ready to break through the line, he's just in front of the midfield... it's a very different role in that space. It's the difference between Second Striker, and CAM.

Billy86

~Rebel~ wrote: »

From what i've seen of him, he's playing 20 yards deeper than he did back then though. Rather than right off another striker, ready to break through the line, he's just in front of the midfield... it's a very different role in that space. It's the difference between Second Striker, and CAM.

The problem is he is playing 20 yards deeper, 30 yards deeper, 10 yards to the left, 10 yards to the right, and 10 yards further forward. At all times. He doesn't seem fully aware of what he is supposed to do, where he is supposed to be, or what his team mates are up to.