Homelessness on the rise

Hitman3000

Deleted User wrote:

Focus Ireland and other homeless groups need the homeless to justify their existence. Imagine if all the millions given to them by the Government every year was used to build homes instead. Now, there’s an idea.

They still use agreed metrics to arrive at figures, the minister seems to be using his own.

Sleeper12

Deleted User wrote: »

Focus Ireland and other homeless groups need the homeless to justify their existence. Imagine if all the millions given to them by the Government every year was used to build homes instead. Now, there’s an idea.

You do realize that homeless charities have built & bought homes out of money donated.


https://www.pmvtrust.ie/peter-mcverry-trust-begins-construction-six-new-social-housing-units/

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You do realize that homeless charities have built & bought homes out of money donated.


https://www.pmvtrust.ie/peter-mcverry-trust-begins-construction-six-new-social-housing-units/

Yes. The Government could build more if they weren’t propping up numerous organisations, paying huge salaries with money that would be better spent on building more homes for those in need.

Sleeper12

Deleted User wrote:

Yes. The Government could build more if they weren’t propping up numerous organisations, paying huge salaries with money that would be better spent on building more homes for those in need.

You are talking about the 100,000 euro plus each member of the Dail gets?

I totally agree. TDs should take a cut in pay, allowances and pensions. They are a drain on the country and you are correct this money should be spent elsewhere

Vizzy

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You are talking about the 100,000 euro plus each member of the Dail gets?

I totally agree. TDs should take a cut in pay, allowances and pensions. They are a drain on the country and you are correct this money should be spent elsewhere

If they all took a €10k paycut you would have enough to build 4 or 5 houses in Dublin or maybe 8 in Roscommon or Tipperary.

That will solve the issue alright.

Sleeper12

Vizzy wrote:

If they all took a €10k paycut you would have enough to build 4 or 5 houses in Dublin or maybe 8 in Roscommon or Tipperary.

Well its better than Maryanne84s idea to stop funding the organisations that actually deal with the homeless people. The government don't actually deal with them at all. They just get in the way.

It's the charities and people working for them that clean up the puke and piss on a daily basis not to mention dealing with the dead bodies that every shelter has to deal with every year. The minister is only good for a photo opportunity when a nice shiny shelter is open. He wouldn't be caught dead in an up & running shelter with real humans inside.

Just heard on RTE one that minister took over 700 people off the list that should still be on it meaning that we have over 10k homeless people each month since May

Hitman3000

Sleeper12 wrote:

Just heard on RTE one that minister took over 700 people off the list that should still be on it meaning that we have over 10k homeless people each month since May

Massaging the figures. Focus Ireland made the same comment about the figures. Whatever method they are using to reduce the numbers they are not being transparent.

Villa05

Deleted User wrote:

Focus Ireland and other homeless groups need the homeless to justify their existence. Imagine if all the millions given to them by the Government every year was used to build homes instead. Now, there’s an idea.

I seem to remember reading that these groups are far more efficient at housing people than the state.

Hitman3000

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Massaging the figures. Focus Ireland made the same comment about the figures. Whatever method they are using to reduce the numbers they are not being transparent.

I think you’ll find that those people were housed.

The numbers are going down.

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You are talking about the 100,000 euro plus each member of the Dail gets?

I totally agree. TDs should take a cut in pay, allowances and pensions. They are a drain on the country and you are correct this money should be spent elsewhere

You’re such a wag!

Though I do think that the Seanad should have been reformed. A much smaller number would suffice.

Homeless charities are big business. There are too many of them replicating the same services. Money that would be better spent on building, buying or refurbishing homes for those they claim to serve.

Sleeper12

Deleted User wrote:

I think you’ll find that those people were housed.

I think you will find that these people would have been classified as homeless by the government last April. They have since changed the way figures are calculated without telling anyone or including any homeless organisations on what these changes are.

Deleted User wrote:

The numbers are going down.

The real figures have increased

average_runner

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You are talking about the 100,000 euro plus each member of the Dail gets?

I totally agree. TDs should take a cut in pay, allowances and pensions. They are a drain on the country and you are correct this money should be spent elsewhere

And how much is the head people of Focus Ireland getting for a salary?

Sleeper12

average_runner wrote: »

And how much is the head people of Focus Ireland getting for a salary?

Focus Ireland deal directly with homeless people. They provide a service that the government won't do. The government wont run hostels. McVery trust & organizations find accommodation for most of the homeless people in Ireland. The government don't/can't do this work properly



I'd love the government to take away the homeless hostels from religious groups. I don't believe that the church should be involved with our state schools or hospitals.



Unfortunately until the government is willing to get it's hands dirty we are stuck with charities doing the work that the state is supposed to be doing.

Hitman3000

Deleted User wrote:

I think you’ll find that those people were housed.

With all due respect it depends on whose figures you trust. The lack of transparency from the minister reduces the credibility of his figures in my opinion.

Hitman3000

Deleted User wrote:

The numbers are going down.

I do agree with on one point MA, there would be no need for these charities if the government whose members we pay handsomely actually done what they are supposed to do instead of outsourcing so they can use plausible deniability, it would be far better.

Graces7

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Focus Ireland deal directly with homeless people. They provide a service that the government won't do. The government wont run hostels. McVery trust & organizations find accommodation for most of the homeless people in Ireland. The government don't/can't do this work properly



I'd love the government to take away the homeless hostels from religious groups. I don't believe that the church should be involved with our state schools or hospitals.



Unfortunately until the government is willing to get it's hands dirty we are stuck with charities doing the work that the state is supposed to be doing.

You avoided the question ie how much pay?

and the church is not involved. Period. It lets YOU, Joe Public, pay when it could house everyone in need.

Sleeper12

Graces7 wrote:

You avoided the question ie how much pay?

No one has asked me this question yet. If they did I would answer this :it's cheaper for the government to support charities to run the homeless crisis than for the government to do it itself.

Are you suggesting that FG are that thick to outsource this at a higher price? If if this is true than FG have a lot to answer to.

The only reason we have charities running the homeless shelters is because they can do it much cheaper than the government. I'd gladly volunteer my time free of charge to St Vincent Depaul, McVerry Trust etc but if the government ran it I would need to be paid for my services.

Graces7 wrote:

and the church is not involved. Period. It lets YOU, Joe Public, pay when it could house everyone in need.

I'm sorry but the church is very definitely involved. They are involved in all of the homeless charities (did you not see the pope actually visit a Catholic shelter), schools and hospitals.

The government needs to step up to the plate and stop relying on the good will of the public and charities. The government needs to provide these services themselves.

Nitrogan

Is there any effort being made to house the 'homeless' from Dublin in unused social housing elsewhere in the country?

Claw Hammer

Nitrogan wrote: »

Is there any effort being made to house the 'homeless' from Dublin in unused social housing elsewhere in the country?

What unused social housing?

Sleeper12

Nitrogan wrote:

Is there any effort being made to house the 'homeless' from Dublin in unused social housing elsewhere in the country?

No. There is an effort to take part of the property tax generated in Dublin and spread it out to counties that don't pay anywhere near as much as we do in Dublin. This needs to be stamped out. An OAP in a mid terrace house in Dublin pays more than someone living in a 5 or 6 bed property in Cavan on an acre of land. It makes no sense. Property tax needs to be on the size of the house or land. This way we can put Dublin tax into Dublin homeless

Sleeper12

Claw Hammer wrote:

What unused social housing?

In Dublin there are hundreds of council houses & flats unused and boarded up. Maybe this is what is meant

Claw Hammer

Sleeper12 wrote: »

In Dublin there are hundreds of council houses & flats unused and boarded up. Maybe this is what is meant

He said the rest of the country, so he hardly meant housing in Dublin.

Gatling

Claw Hammer wrote: »

What unused social housing?

Apparently in navan they have more social houses than they have people on their housing list.

Housing shortage yet seems some local authorities have surpluses

Sleeper12

Claw Hammer wrote:

He said the rest of the country, so he hardly meant housing in Dublin.

I live in Dublin so I can only speak about what I see daily. However I have heard of boarded up council housing in Limerick and Cork on the radio

Nitrogan

Apart from the unused social housing there are still unfinished Celtic Tiger era developments in rural areas that could be restarted and completed long before new builds in Dublin, if getting people into a permanent home was the priority.

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

They haven't expanded the net in decades. Up until April they calculated homeless people in the same way as the 70s, 80s 90s 0s. The only thing that has changed is the numbers as more & more people became homeless under FGs rule.


Since April the government has been manipulating the figures in a ridiculous attempt to make the figures below 10K when they broke that number months ago.



You mightn't be happy with how we have ALWAYS calculated the homeless figures & you are entitled to feel that way but its totally false to claim The 'homeless' net has expanded.

I think the vast vast majority of people always (and still do) consider homeless to mean sleeping on the street. Its only in the last year or so that people are realising that the gov consider many more people homeless and its quite surprising for most.

They are attempting to or have already expanded the net also. Never in a million years should someone living at home be considered homeless for example yet they are trying to add these if they haven't already.

Tony EH

Vanessa Billions Strapless wrote: »

I think the vast vast majority of people always (and still do) consider homeless to mean sleeping on the street.

Well, they're wrong and it's always been wrong to consider it as such.

Tony EH

Tony EH wrote: »

Well, they're wrong and it's always been wrong to consider it as such.

theyre right

now where are we?

hmmm

Tony EH wrote: »

Well, they're wrong and it's always been wrong to consider it as such.

Well then we need more refined definitions.

E.g. "Rough sleeper" which should be a priority for being helped.

If someone is "homeless" because they've never worked and don't like living at home with their parents, I don't consider this a housing emergency.

Tony EH

Deleted User wrote: »

theyre right

now where are we?

They're not right. Homeless means without fixed abode, like it always has.

Having a temporary roof over one's head or "shelter" is not a home.