Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Dog bites kid. What to do with dog.

  • 06-09-2016 12:47am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭


    I have 2 lab cross dogs for about 8 years, rescued from the pound. Today, my wife rang me and told me our 3 year old was bitten by one of them and needed to visit the hospital.

    She has 2 pincture marks on her face. We don't know which dog bit her. We cant trust the dogs anymore, so looking for rehoming advice. My initial thought was to put the biting dog down, but we don't know which dog that is, so it would be wrong to put them both down.

    We don't take pet ownership lightly, but we won't put the safety of our kids on the line now that this has happened. Once bitten...twice shy.

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    Mod edit... Please be advised that it is a requirement of this forum that people post in a respectful fashion. Threads about dog bites tend to bring out posters with diametrically opposed views... You're welcome to debate your point, but please do so with respect and without provocation.
    Thanks,
    DBB


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭Dubl07


    Rehome your wife. She should not have left the 3 year old alone with two dogs. Small children have little impulse control and can't read canine body language. Adult humans should be aware of this. While you know what happened to your child, you have no idea what the child might have done to provoke a snap.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭goz83


    Thanks for the very helpful suggestion. I hadn't realised I posted in AH....oh wait.

    If anyone has practical suggestions, would be much appreciated.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    This is a super website for understanding how to deal with young children and dogs: http://www.dspca.ie/ChildSafetyaroundDogs

    There are plenty of "good" reasons why a dog could bite a child; most of them are not "because the dog is aggressive and untrustworthy". I also like this site that treats the issue fairly: http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/pets/dog-behavior/help-my-dog-bit-my-baby

    Proper understanding of what stress the dog was under and how to manage it, and proper training of a child in how to manage dogs, can save a good dog and make a good human. My family has always been "good with dogs" because we try to understand both.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,626 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    I've heard it all now "good" reasons a dog should bite a toddler in the face !!

    If OP and his wife can't be sure which dog bit the child then both dogs should be destroyed.
    Rehomimg the dogs is just passing on a dog that's been agressive to kids to someone else for the same or worse to happen, it's a cop out of what needs to be done, at least if you do this pass on the truth that the dog bites children.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,779 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    OP also asked for rehoming advice,NOT parenting advice.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,641 ✭✭✭Teyla Emmagan


    _Brian wrote:
    If OP and his wife can't be sure which dog bit the child then both dogs should be destroyed. Rehomimg the dogs is just passing on a dog that's been agressive to kids to someone else for the same or worse to happen, it's a cop out of what needs to be done, at least if you do this pass on the truth that the dog bites children.


    Rubbish. You just rehome the dogs saying they are not suitable for families with children. Putting two healthy dogs down because one of them was poked in the eye by a 3 year old is a terrible thing to do. I'd bite anyone who poked me in the eye too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭minikin


    Whilst I'm somehow given to understand that all teeth need dental care, would it be an option to de-fang both dogs rather than putting them down, if you're queasy about the obvious option? Wouldn't re-home them - risk of another child getting hurt is too great.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,626 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Rubbish. You just rehome the dogs saying they are not suitable for families with children. Putting two healthy dogs down because one of them was poked in the eye by a 3 year old is a terrible thing to do. I'd bite anyone who poked me in the eye too.

    You see, now your just making up stuff to suit your argument. There is no evidence to support the notion that the kid poked the dog in the eye. As far as anyone knows the dog just bit the kid out of the blue.
    And an adult that bites a kid for any reason needs to be put down too, presuming your an adult as it isn't clear.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    _Brian wrote: »
    I've heard it all now "good" reasons a dog should bite a toddler in the face !!

    If OP and his wife can't be sure which dog bit the child then both dogs should be destroyed.
    Rehomimg the dogs is just passing on a dog that's been agressive to kids to someone else for the same or worse to happen, it's a cop out of what needs to be done, at least if you do this pass on the truth that the dog bites children.

    Wow. Just wow. Is everything completely black and white in your world?

    You'd happily put down 2 dogs in abscence of the facts? I sincerely hope you don't own a dog.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,742 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Rubbish. You just rehome the dogs saying they are not suitable for families with children. Putting two healthy dogs down because one of them was poked in the eye by a 3 year old is a terrible thing to do. I'd bite anyone who poked me in the eye too.
    But a dog shouldn't, is the point. Dogs are pack animals, and as far as they're concerned the household is a pack. They should display submissive behaviour towards "senior" members of the pack, which means that if attacked by a senior member you abase yourself and retreat. You don't bite back.

    If the dog responds to a poke with a bite, that means he either thinks he ranks higher in the pack than the three-year-old, or he is contesting seniority. Either of these is a dangerous state of affairs.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    Peregrinus wrote: »
    But a dog shouldn't, is the point. Dogs are pack animals, and as far as they're concerned the household is a pack. They should display submissive behaviour towards "senior" members of the pack, which means that if attacked by a senior member you abase yourself and retreat. You don't bite back.

    If the dog responds to a poke with a bite, that means he either thinks he ranks higher in the pack than the three-year-old, or he is contesting seniority. Either of these is a dangerous state of affairs.

    True. But the state of affairs exists because humans created it. A dog reacting the way you'd expect a dog to under conditions of stress and insecurity is not necessarily a "bad dog".


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,626 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Wow. Just wow. Is everything completely black and white in your world?

    You'd happily put down 2 dogs in abscence of the facts? I sincerely hope you don't own a dog.
    What's not black and white about a dog biting a kid in the face ??


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    goz83 wrote: »
    I have 2 lab cross dogs for about 8 years, rescued from the pound. Today, my wife rang me and told me our 3 year old was bitten by one of them and needed to visit the hospital.

    She has 2 pincture marks on her face. We don't know which dog bit her. We cant trust the dogs anymore, so looking for rehoming advice. My initial thought was to put the biting dog down, but we don't know which dog that is, so it would be wrong to put them both down.

    We don't take pet ownership lightly, but we won't put the safety of our kids on the line now that this has happened. Once bitten...twice shy.

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    Firstly, I'm sorry this has happened. I hope your child is ok?

    Secondly, please rehome your dogs and don't put them down. There are many people who would likely want your dogs. Rehome them with an adult only household if you are genuinely concerned about them around children but this sounds like a one off freak incident rather than a sustained pattern of aggression. There are rescues that can help and advise you on this.

    You could consider engaging a dog trainer/psychologist for training purposes. I can recommend someone if you want to PM me.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    _Brian wrote: »
    What's not black and white about a dog biting a kid in the face ??

    The only time you get to have black and white in your life is when you pour cream into your coffee, dude. You are talking about a living, thinking, feeling being here, not a defective hard drive that ate your data.

    I was almost going to say "not a piece of farm equipment", except that farmers tend to respect their dogs and make sure they are trained and that people are trained to be around them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53,028 ✭✭✭✭ButtersSuki


    _Brian wrote: »
    What's not black and white about a dog biting a kid in the face ??

    Were you there? No.
    Was I? No.
    Do you know which dog bit the child? No.
    Do I? No.
    Do you know exactly what happened? No.
    Do I? No.

    Yet you seem intent on making assumptions.
    For the record, I'm not saying this is fantastic news that the child was bitten. What I am saying is that I don't think destroying two healthy dogs (one of whom did not do this btw) is the correct or indeed only solution here.

    Do you own dogs? I don't know.
    Do I? Yes. I own two. And I'm actively involved with a number of rescues. I've owned dogs all my life.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Putting them in an adult only house doesn't mean they won't be around kids at some point.
    The only safe solution is to put them down.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Knine


    I think you need to give more information before you make any drastic decisions. Contrary to popular belief it would not be very easy to rehome 2 eight year old dogs.

    Was the child alone with the dogs? Or was your wife with them? It is easy to say supervise them better but as anyone who has children will know, these things can happen within a few seconds. Have either of these dogs shown any aggression before? Is there a chance your child was pulling out of one or both of them?

    In the meantime you need to make sure to keep your toddler & dogs separate using stairgates, keeping them in a different area of the house etc until you can decide what to do. If it was me personally I would look at getting these dogs assessed by a suitably qualified person & then hopefully rehomed if suitable. I would make the new owners fully aware that the dogs were suitable for older children only.

    I hope your child is ok.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭Hooked


    Putting them in an adult only house doesn't mean they won't be around kids at some point.
    The only safe solution is to put them down.

    Absolute nonsense!

    Dogs aren't people. They're dogs. They don't bite because they don't like you. They bite because someone put them in a situation where they felt so threatened that their only reaction was to bite.

    Clearly this 3 year old was unsupervised in the company of TWO dogs. Neither the 3 year old nor the dogs are to blame.

    The mother is.

    And not wanting to address or admit that is the crux of this whole argument.


    The poor child.

    Those poor dogs.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭Glass fused light


    Peregrinus wrote: »
    But a dog shouldn't, is the point. Dogs are pack animals, and as far as they're concerned the household is a pack. They should display submissive behaviour towards "senior" members of the pack, which means that if attacked by a senior member you abase yourself and retreat. You don't bite back.

    If the dog responds to a poke with a bite, that means he either thinks he ranks higher in the pack than the three-year-old, or he is contesting seniority. Either of these is a dangerous state of affairs.

    Even if this theory was still popular a) the 3 year old would be in the position of no longer being a pup who would be protected by the "pack" rankings b) pack positions are not static c) s/he is like any young dog who has to learn/earn where it sits in the pack, so bad behaviour would results in a number of warnings, growl etc before the snap so the bite would be acceptable. The problem is that the 3 year dose not speak dog.

    OP you need to have a detailed talk with your wife about the dogs general behaviour around your child  prior to the bite.  And ask your child what happened with non leading questions.

    While Dubl07's opinion was not well received the basic question has to be asked of why you both trusted your dogs not to react to anything your child did.  If the dogs are +8 years old it's like expecting a 50/60 year old human to pat the child on the head while s/he keeps kicking them in the shin after being asked to stop.  We can all get grumpy as we get older.   Or as a long shot it could have possibly been an accident eg the only time I was 'bitten' by a dog was when the dog was snapping flys and I dropped my toe into her airspace fortunately for me the dog had great reflexes and no hard contact was made so the 'oh ****' look on her face was very funny.

    As you are in a position of not knowing what happened it makes any decision much harder.
      
    If you are not in a position to monitor the dogs and child 24/7 you need to make the hard choice between rehoming and putting them both down.

    This decision should be based on the dogs behaviour in the weeks and even months prior to now eg.  did one of them get up and leave the child's proximity when play got loud etc.  If you are thinking of rehoming  you need to speak to someone who can interpret the behaviour and make sure that the new home is aware of what has happened. So a visit to the vets to rule out any physical / medical issues may be your starting point?

    More  important is that you  work with your child on any fear which may result from what has happened.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    Thing about dogs and kids: virtually all housetrained and calm dogs are utterly safe with babies with adults present. They'll treat babies like puppies. But when a child reaches the toddler stage, the dog is liable to treat it the way it will treat boisterous puppies: give it a nip to teach it a lesson.

    For this reason, I wouldn't allow small children in the same room with dogs at all most of the time; when dogs are present, adults must be too, and the atmosphere must be calm and not shouty or screechy. Certainly don't have kids around when dogs are being fed.

    And dogs should be fed, and then the dishes taken up and washed and put away; a dish of food shouldn't be there all the time - that leads to competition and anger. And dogs shouldn't be fed from the table, for the same reason. As Hooked says, dogs aren't human. They're a loved and cherished part of the family, but they have their own rules, which take their doggy nature into account.

    There can be lots of happy interaction during walks and play (with adults present), but again, watch carefully for any teasing.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭Glass fused light


    Hooked wrote: »
    Absolute nonsense!

    Dogs aren't people. They're dogs. They don't bite because they don't like you. They bite because someone put them in a situation where they felt so threatened that their only reaction was to bite. /QUOTE]

    I would not quite agree with this we had one dog while growing up who took a dislike to one of the childern visiting, its possible that the child may have done something to provoke a reaction, however the dog subsequently made it clear on any further interactions that she did not like the child :).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,748 ✭✭✭ganmo


    Talk to the kid! The kid knows which dog bit him.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,905 ✭✭✭fret_wimp2


    To answer the question directly, have the dogs rehomed In a home that knows how to care for them correctly. The OP's home is not fit for dogs if the parents leave a 3 year old child with two dogs unsupervised.

    A 3 year old child pulls at everything, puts everything in its mouth, its how they discover the world. A dog doesnt know this, its a dog and if a child puts the dogs ear in its mouth, keeps pulling on its hair, tail or poking at it, the dog is naturally going to lash out, in order to stop that behavior in future. Thats how dogs behave. If the child stops, the dog wont need to lash out.

    Dont kill two dogs, two family members, just because you cant control your child.

    Gota question anyone with the mentality that reasons out " i had these dogs for 8 years, they are part of my family but because i dont know which one my child pulled and poked at more, i would consider having them killed".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Hooked wrote: »
    Absolute nonsense!

    Dogs aren't people. They're dogs. They don't bite because they don't like you. They bite because someone put them in a situation where they felt so threatened that their only reaction was to bite.

    Clearly this 3 year old was unsupervised in the company of TWO dogs. Neither the 3 year old nor the dogs are to blame.

    The mother is.

    And not wanting to address or admit that is the crux of this whole argument.


    The poor child.

    Those poor dogs.

    Of course dogs are people. What a nonsense sentence.
    If an animal can't be trusted it gets put down.
    I can't understand people who think of animals as family members and "children" . They are pets. They are animals.
    True, the child shouldn't have been left alone with the animals but it's not always possible to supervise a child 24/7. She thought she could trust the animal
    She found out she couldn't.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 861 ✭✭✭MeatTwoVeg


    Both dogs need to be destroyed. It's that simple. The posters suggesting you all join hands and sing kumbaya around the dogs, are quite frankly, dangerous to listen to.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Jen44


    I think the safest and fairest thing to do is to bring them to an animal sanctuary explain to them what has happened and ask would they be able to help rehome the dogs in a house with no children! I have a beloved westie who is without a doubt the most placid dog in the world even when she is pain she would let us or the vet etc do anything to her! That being said there is definitely a bit of jealousy between her and our 2 1/2 year old! i never ever leave them alone together, if i have to go upstairs etc i call the dog to come with me! She has growled at our little girl twice since she was born, both times were my daughters fault, grabbed her, stood on her tail! Its tough when children are involved but you cant always blame the dog kids dont understand the word gentle or realise they are annoying the poor dog so i think to have them re homed to a house with no kids is the safest option! Its a sad situation really.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Peregrinus wrote: »
    If the dog responds to a poke with a bite, that means he either thinks he ranks higher in the pack than the three-year-old, or he is contesting seniority. Either of these is a dangerous state of affairs.
    Pack theory in domestic dogs has been widely and comprehensively rubbished. They don't follow pack theory, they're not wolves.

    "Taste for blood", "think they're top dog now", "will get more aggressive", all absolute nonsense, folk knowledge that persists despite having no basis.

    Ever see a group of dogs who live together? They snap at eachother all the time when playing or annoyed. A snap is a way of displaying annoyance; a warning to go away.

    If a dog snaps at a human and makes contact, they will tear flesh. They have sharp carnivorous teeth and we have relatively hairless, relatively thin skin.

    If the dog actually attacked, you wouldn't just be dealing with two small puncture marks on the skin.

    OP, I'm not going to try convince you to keep the dogs if you've made your decision. I would recommend you try find a smaller rehoming person or company rather than go to the big places like Dog's Trust or the SPCAs. If only because you will get more hands-on focus on rehoming your dogs.

    Two middle-aged dogs probably shouldn't be rehomed into a noisy house full of kids anyway; the rehoming itself will be distressing enough without absolute madness around them. A couple who have no children in the home would probably be the most suitable new home.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭Glass fused light


    Chuchote wrote: »
    Thing about dogs and kids: virtually all housetrained and calm dogs are utterly safe with babies, which they'll treat like cubs.

    I don't agree with this at all.

    Housetraining is just that the dog knows how to behave with existing member of a household and to pee outside. Any dog can be calm until its in a new situation.

    Remember in nature a bitch will den the litter in a space which offers enclosed protection and food is brought back to her. She will not let other pack members near the litter without her supervision until they are a few weeks old and active enough to move away from the den.

    Even the it is possible that a cub may be hurt in play etc. Would you expect a 2/3 year old toddler to play safely with a baby?

    No one should ever, ever think that a baby is safe with a dog.

    Agreed edit in response to Chuchote's edit

    No one should ever, ever think that a baby is safe with a dog and if a adult is present they should act as a physical barrier between the baby and the dog.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    I don't agree with this at all.

    (snip)

    No one should ever, ever think that a baby is safe with a dog.

    I said that housetrained dogs are generally safe with babies with adults present.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,688 ✭✭✭VonVix


    3 year olds don't understand what a snarl means.
    3 year olds don't understand what a growl means.
    3 year olds will unfortunately understand what a bite means. Dogs will escalate if their warning signs are ignored. This is how dogs communicate as animals.

    Dogs should not be expected to tolerate being poked, prodded, hugged, ridden on, pulled on or having their food/toys messed with by a small child generally speaking. This necessarily about the OP's 3 year old as I wasn't there, but for all we know it could be.

    It's irresponsible to leave a toddler alone with dogs, 99% of the time it's the child who cannot be 'trusted' in the sense of leaving a dog alone or being gentle with a dog, they are too young to have that understanding yet. Dogs do NOT understand that toddlers are toddlers, for most dogs they are just really small, annoying humans.

    Unfortunately the OP has possibly learned all the above from this horrible experience. Since it's really up in the air who did what and what triggered it, and that it is highly likely to be a matter of a child not understanding to leave a dog alone when the dog tells it to (given the circumstances mentioned in the first post) rehoming with a view to having them go to an adult only home would be ideal I would think, but it would be important to give a clear history of everything that happened. Given how involved I have been with working with dogs (many with bite histories), it just feels wrong to say these dogs should be put to sleep. Everyone was left vulnerable in this situation when adult human eyes were not around to make sure all involved were safe.

    [Dog Training + Behaviour Nerd]



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    You have these dogs for eight years and they were rescued from the pound.

    What I find surprising is that you seem to have little insight into the character of your dogs after all this time. Apart from this incident, which nobody saw, has there been any indication that one or other of the dogs is agressive? Or will any of them growl or be defensive in particular situations?

    The jury must remain out as to whether either of the dogs has a character problem. What is clear, as others have noted, is that a three year old is too young to be unsupervised with any dogs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    Without beating up on the OP, who has asked an honest question:

    I'd agree with the posters who suggest trying to find a good adults-only home for these dogs. The unfortunate side effect of this is that kids, who probably see the dogs as part of the family, may get the message that bad behaviour will make you disappear from the family. But it's either that or take a very different approach to the time the children spend with the dogs, and a very different approach to dog-owning generally.

    If you do find a home for the dogs, OP, maybe visit with the kids every now and again so they know their dogs are well and happy, even if they're not at home with them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭Glass fused light


    Chuchote wrote: »
    I said that housetrained dogs are generally safe with babies with adults present.

    You may want to edit the first paragraph of your post as what you think you said is not how it is reading.

    .... And I can edit mine to agree once the adult present acts as a physically barrier between dog and baby.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    Good advice, though a rather bullying tone; I've done as you suggested.


  • Registered Users Posts: 571 ✭✭✭Buckfast W


    I wouldn't destroy the dogs (god I hate that phrase). In general dogs shouldn't be left alone with children. I agree with the other posters that the dog might have snapped if provoked in some way, this was not a dog attacking a child as the injuries would be much more severe.

    My mothers dog snapped at my niece a few months back (she's 2), my mother found out after this that the dog had hurt her paw and my niece must have stepped on it or hit it. The solution wasn't to kill the dog, the solution was to put the dog in a different room when my niece visits and my mother will do this until my niece gets older. This was very out if character for the dog and we've never had problems with her before or since this incident. My other niece who is now 8 practically grew up with this dog and there was never a problem. Dogs cant tell you that there in pain or that they've hurt themselves so please be careful with me.

    If a person has an off day or a bad argument we can chalk it down to a particular reason and draw a line under it. However if an animal does this then we seem to lose all trust in them. I'm not saying don't take precautions but don't overreact on behaviour that is out of character for an animal.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,767 ✭✭✭SterlingArcher


    Jen44 wrote: »
    I think the safest and fairest thing to do is to bring them to an animal sanctuary explain to them what has happened and ask would they be able to help rehome the dogs in a house with no children! I have a beloved westie who is without a doubt the most placid dog in the world even when she is pain she would let us or the vet etc do anything to her! That being said there is definitely a bit of jealousy between her and our 2 1/2 year old! i never ever leave them alone together, if i have to go upstairs etc i call the dog to come with me! She has growled at our little girl twice since she was born, both times were my daughters fault, grabbed her, stood on her tail! Its tough when children are involved but you cant always blame the dog kids dont understand the word gentle or realise they are annoying the poor dog so i think to have them re homed to a house with no kids is the safest option! Its a sad situation really.

    you have a dog you know is jealous of your child. Don't trust the dog around the child. And are giving saftey advice to others... Interesting.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    What is it with the hostile tone of many posts here? I don't think I'm coming back to this part of boards.ie.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭Hooked


    If a 3 year old was left unsupervised in a kitchen with 2 pots on the boil... and the mother soon thereafter discovered a screaming child with terrible burns, would the natural reaction be to ask where to dispose of those 2 pots?

    I know the OP asked what to do with the dogs.. but I feel the off-topic answers are warranted in a thread like this. It's about so much more than destroying a dog (dogs).

    My sister-in-law recently posted a pic to facebook of her 2 year old asleep in the dogs bed WITH the dog. An event that was only allowed to take place as she was in the shower and the dog unsupervised. Cute, right? WRONG!

    That picture could just as easily have been on the front page of the Sun, the Mirror, etc. With the headline of 'vicious dog attack leaves 2 year old scarred for life'.

    The difference?

    PARENTING!

    When are mammy and daddy going to realise that the dog(s) are not the problem.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    Wow. Just wow. Is everything completely black and white in your world?

    You'd happily put down 2 dogs in abscence of the facts? I sincerely hope you don't own a dog.

    Absolutely, if it came to it - the kid is more important than the dog, both the biter and the innocent one, end of story.
    I'd try find someone who didn't have kids first to take them, but failing that - bye bye doggies. It's not a chance worth taking.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,054 ✭✭✭✭tk123


    At least get them both checked over by a vet in case there's something underlying that the child could have hurt or a potential owner would need to know about. You owe them that at least after 8 years.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭Hooked


    Chuchote wrote: »
    What is it with the hostile tone of many posts here? I don't think I'm coming back to this part of boards.ie.

    It's appearing hostile because many pet owners, like myself, understand that dogs need supervision and special attention around kids. And that a post of this nature - completely focusing on destroying the dogs - and not the scenario that allowed the dog to bite, is infuriating.

    It's emotive. The dogs need protecting. As much as the child does. And in a situation where only one short-sighted side of an argument is being considered, people are going to get emotional trying to draw attention to the real issue here. The attitude of (some) parents towards kids, pets and supervision.

    I could have been the OP - were it not for the great advice I've received since becoming a dog owner 5 years ago. Today, I understand dogs better - and I use threads like this to TRY and educate people that it's about far more than a dog needing to be destroyed.

    Proactive parenting and pet ownership.
    Not knee-jerk reactive solutions.

    I really hope the OP sees past the 'blame' replies such as my own, and takes a more balanced view on things away from this thread. And I hope the child heals with no scars. Physical or emotional... And doesn't spend a life in fear of dogs.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 268 ✭✭fox0512


    Dubl07 wrote: »
    Rehome your wife. She should not have left the 3 year old alone with two dogs. Small children have little impulse control and can't read canine body language. Adult humans should be aware of this. While you know what happened to your child, you have no idea what the child might have done to provoke a snap.

    you might not like that comment but dub makes a valid point..

    Anyway we all make mistakes... there only one thing can do in this situation unless you are prepared to isolate the dog from kids 24/7..

    More people are bitten by labs than staffs and many other on the restricted list...

    Best of luck


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,948 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    The solution is simple. Have the dogs live outside, and the kids inside. When the kids want to use the garden unsupervised put the dogs in their secure pen.

    There is no need for rehoming or destroying the dogs there was no agressive behaviour shown.

    It can be scary when kids get nipped especially when its in the face but some common sense will prevent that situation from being repeated.


  • Registered Users Posts: 750 ✭✭✭Ashbx


    So funny, the Animal and Pet issues forum tends to have the same bunch of people offering advice on it. But when it comes to biting a child, every tom dick and harry are dog experts with pitchforks at the ready!

    Awful situation OP, sorry you had to go through it. But OP, please do not get the dog (especially both!) put down....putting down both is plain cruel. As another poster said, could you not just ask your child which one bit him? Might help the elimination process a bit.

    Unfortunately, we don't know what happened in this instance. You said you have the dogs 8 years, and your child for 3 years and nothing has happened up until this point. Which leads me to believe, like many other posters have said, the child did something to provoke this bite. While I agree with people saying that children need to be taught how to act around dogs, that's not so easy for a three year old to comprehend. Unless you are willing to keep the children and dogs separate at all times (which is nearly impossible), these dogs need to be rehomed....simple as that. Please do not immediately resort to euthanizing!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,476 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    goz83 wrote: »
    I have 2 lab cross dogs for about 8 years, rescued from the pound. Today, my wife rang me and told me our 3 year old was bitten by one of them and needed to visit the hospital.

    She has 2 pincture marks on her face. We don't know which dog bit her. We cant trust the dogs anymore, so looking for rehoming advice. My initial thought was to put the biting dog down, but we don't know which dog that is, so it would be wrong to put them both down.

    We don't take pet ownership lightly, but we won't put the safety of our kids on the line now that this has happened. Once bitten...twice shy.

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    the dogs need to be put down..

    they attacked your child

    I wouldn't be happy to pass a potentially serious issue on to others..


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    lawred2 wrote: »
    the dogs need to be put down..

    they attacked your child

    A well-reasoned, compassionate, thoughtful, and carefully presented argument, sure.


  • Registered Users Posts: 666 ✭✭✭sadie1502


    You've no idea what happened. The dogs could of been play fighting and your child got caught in it. I have two lab crosses and often this happens they are play fighting biting each other I have put my hand in mesing too and got nipped. I would never ever ever trust any dog around a toddler. But if your wife didn't see what happened you don't even really know the circumstances it may not be anything sinister you just don't know.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,476 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Speedwell wrote: »
    A well-reasoned, compassionate, thoughtful, and carefully presented argument, sure.

    If a neighbour's three year old was bitten in the face drawing blood by one of these dogs - would you be suggesting rehoming?


  • Registered Users Posts: 666 ✭✭✭sadie1502


    lawred2 wrote: »
    the dogs need to be put down..

    they attacked your child

    I wouldn't be happy to pass a potentially serious issue on to others..

    To be fair they don't know what happened. They weren't present.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 813 ✭✭✭kathleen37


    I think this must have been very shocking for the OP and I really hope their child is ok.

    To seems to me that if the first reaction is to destroy the dog, then that means trust is now gone - whatever the circumstances of the incident.

    I in no way think that either dog should be destroyed. Two puncture marks are not representative of a dog in full attack mode, as is sadly evident in situations where people/children are killed by dog attacks.

    So, as has been mentioned, I think that trying to re home the dogs in a household with no children would be the way to go.

    I have to say that as a dog owner, I have never, never left any of my dogs unattended or unsupervised with small children. My parents never left us unsupervised with our dogs growing up either. It's part of the responsibility of dog ownership.

    Sorry this has happened, OP. Like I said, I hope your kiddy is ok. I also hope you do the right thing for your dogs, too.


  • Advertisement
This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement