Feedback on Feedback thread

K-9

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm not Lb, I'm just increasingly frustrated and yes angry the way things are going after all the efforts and hard work of thousands of people across many many communities since the turn of this century. And it's being wasted. Some of the stuff that has happened is beyond a joke. And I'm not even close to being alone in thinking this way. I suppose it's the last vestiges of me really caring about this place and what it means and meant to so many people for so many years.

It's hardly news that many mods are frustrated at the slow pace of change. I presumed this would have been one of the things to come out of the leaks from the mod forum, but I suppose that was probably selective in nature.

_Kaiser_

The reality is that we don't need yet another "tell us what's wrong" feedback thread that will have sporadic but well-intentioned responses from one/maybe 2 of the Admin team... we need responses and plans from the owners themselves - whoever that is this week!
We all know what the issues are.. they've been documented with reasonable and viable suggestions countless times on this forum, but it's all for naught when the thread is locked and those contributions disappear into the void.

If those who own and run this site want to have content to "monetise" I'd suggest they start showing the userbase (and a big concern TBH is how many long-established users and mods/former mods are getting frustrated - what impression does THAT give to newer members?) that their feedback hasn't just been noted.. but is actually being translated into visible actions!

To get ye started...

- Remember that Boards is a discussion forum and users come here for a different reason than they do Facebook, Reddit, Twitter or whatever it is ye think you need to be copying
- Appoint a dedicated team to engage with the userbase. It shouldn't all be on one staffer and whatever Admin has the time to chip in
- Forget this "responsive site" idea. It's no better than a beta, deeply unpopular and thus fundamentally tainted at this point. If you want to do something for mobile devices, improve the apps (although the touch site is pretty good as is TBF)
- Do something about the almost daily technical issues. I'm not sure what that is as I obviously don't have the visibility, but again it gives a very poor impression of the site as a whole

The first 2 of those could be done immediately. An announcement along the lines of the third would generate a lot of goodwill (so long as it was delivered) and give ye space (and resources!) to resolve the 4th. Then set out a list of 10 items that you've gathered from the previous feedback, put them into a poll for a week and let the users vote the priorities. Action then accordingly (insofar as possible - ie: if item 2 has a prerequisite of item 7 then that needs to be done first etc)

Start there, review in 3 months and let's see where we are.

ancapailldorcha

Permabear wrote: »

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Would it help if I informed you that this gig doesn't come with a cushy pension, high wages and job security?

Permabear

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Pelvis Parsley

Boards is the proverbial camel-a horse designed by a committee.

Too many chiefs, which is why the place is smothered in sacrosanct rules, and why nothing ever gets done.

Paradoxically, the volunteers, from the admins down, are the reason this place is still here at all, and but for their goodwill and time, there wouldn't be a "business model" in the first place. Adverts is another example-all those free man-hours, helping to build a community, and for what?

That's what makes the inaction from the top even more bewildering. Okay, Dav is gone, like him or lump him-but we get his replacement for about a week and now she's disappeared as well? Company representation shouldn't rest on one person's shoulders in the first place, never should have. And it certainly shouldn't be left to volunteers. It's above and beyond. and they, and the users, deserve better.

The Wolverine

Pelvis Parsley wrote: »

Company representation shouldn't rest on one person's shoulders in the first place, never should have. And it certainly shouldn't be left to volunteers. It's above and beyond. and they, and the users, deserve better.

This is another thing really boards is a company, an actual business these days from full time staff to making proper business deals with companies like Vodafone, Sky and 3.

It should be represented and have staff more than one community manager engaging users tbh.

In fact I think the owners like using the admins as unpaid staff, they really shouldn't have to fielding all these issues by right. I won't say who but I know of an admin for a fact that's less engaging now as they began to feel like an employee rather just doing it as a community member.


I think what the owners don't seem to realise and I have a gut feeling the odd admin and mod has forgot is its the users who you could call the real customers here, why do you think Sky, 3, etc came here in the first place? Because of its massive Irish user base.

If this place keeps losing numbers they won't be long telling boards get stuffed and good luck making money off ads with small page viewing numbers.

Chorus_suck

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The Hill Billy

You are not being ignored. Far from it. And as for mods being volunteers, etc - that's a fact of life & it is not going to change. They make a massive contribution to the running of this site, whether you realize/appreciate it or not.

tHB

ancapailldorcha

Chorus_suck wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

It's not the same thing. Being a mod is a commitment that's a bit more formal than simply posting. You can post as you please but I'm expected to put time into modding and posting the forums I mod. There's a responsibility there that is not present with simply being a member of the site.

Lovely Bloke

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I'm expected to put time into modding and posting the forums I mod.

No, you're not.

In fact it's the opposite, every single time any "normal user" brings up a lack of moderation in any forum at any time, they are told in no uncertain terms that "you can't expect volunteers to be available all the time".

I personally know one moderator who did no modding for 3 years, and was recently asked politely if they'd mind stepping aside.

There is actually zero expectation on any moderator to moderate.

LoLth

Lovely Bloke wrote: »

I personally know one moderator who did no modding for 3 years, and was recently asked politely if they'd mind stepping aside.

that says more about the mod than it does about the site to be honest.

The fact that they were politely asked is hardly a negative. What if there was a valid reason for lack of activity?

cowboyBuilder

What about an expiration on perma bans ? - at least for reregs

Does it really matter if someone was banned 5 years ago and are still
totally banned from entering ?

What if they want to post normal stuff and trolling/spamming is behind them ?

KERSPLAT!

There was a big clean up in my cat done recently. It's not finished but it is something being worked on. I can't take credit myself, another cmod did it all and put a lot of work into it.

KERSPLAT!

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

What about an expiration on perma bans ? - at least for reregs

Does it really matter if someone was banned 5 years ago and are still
totally banned from entering ?

What if they want to post normal stuff and trolling/spamming is behind them ?

Banned reregs are normally banned again because they come to the attention of mods, cmods or admin and are then banned. There are loads of banned reregs floating around on new accounts, not causing issues and not getting banned.

Wibbs

Chorus_suck wrote:

This post has been deleted.

To be fair C, there is something to it. Particularly on the high traffic forums. I've seen people take all sorts of bashing for not responding to reported posts or whatever at 3 in the bloody morning. I have had a few gobshítes PM me giving out yards because I didn't fix something on a forums I have nothing to do with. I regularly get it with After Hours and for some reason the Politics Cafe. Yep and when I politely point this out, some were cool but more than a few still weren't happy. You know the type C, the never happy with any service they get and only get the horn when complaining. Oh and never provide solutions. Those muppets can go and head off as far as I'm concerned.

Well, and this might come as news to you, the non-mod contributors are also volunteers here. We spend our valuable time contributing to the site ... we ARE the community

I agree 100% and have always seen it this way. I don't like the whole mod layer all in it together mindset. I prefer the we're all Boardsies mindset. It's more reflective of reality. As you say everyone who posts here is a "volunteer" and is a content generator and without us the site dies.

... and we are being ignored.

Trust me C, that's a feeling doing the rounds.

Lovely Bloke wrote: »

There is actually zero expectation on any moderator to moderate.

Frankly that's bollocks. Sure, some mods, particularly on the quieter forums, can fade into the background and yes some do put in more effort than others, but the expectation is most certainly there to stay on top of things.

cowboyBuilder

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

Banned reregs are normally banned again because they come to the attention of mods, cmods or admin and are then banned. There are loads of banned reregs floating around on new accounts, not causing issues and not getting banned.

Hmm maybe, but I know for a fact there has been banned users and re reg.

a few months down the line after totally harmless posting - boom banned, reason - rereg.

K-9

There's always a reason though, you just might not see it as it would be discussed in the mods or admin forums.

If a poster re-regs to start up where they left off well they'll end up where they ended. That's the posters responsibility, not the mods.

There has been cases were they did start afresh and are posting away, no problems.

As for ignoring feedback, mods are users too and many things mods do now are because of poster feedback.

Taltos

Update

Taltos wrote: »

Upcoming immediate changes based on feedback
1. Prison - due to the sensitive nature of some of the site bans and the call to stop embarrassing posters (genuine or other) we'll shortly make this forum private.
2. DRF - similarly we'll review with your continued input if we should replicate that to the Dispute forum and are looking at how we can streamline the review process by removing one of the layers to make it simpler for everyone.

Starting with DRF. Will be staying Public.

Prison. - Due to the feedback here as well as from the mods and cmods, the admin team revisited making Prison private and have agreed with the objections raised and so Prison too will stay Public.

Cheers everyone for the feedback. It was very helpful.

_Tombstone_

K-9 wrote: »

There's always a reason though, you just might not see it as it would be discussed in the mods or admin forums.

If a poster re-regs to start up where they left off well they'll end up where they ended. That's the posters responsibility, not the mods.

There has been cases were they did start afresh and are posting away, no problems.

Admins breed trolls by continually banning folk for being a rereg. I think its to keep position on the league of b@stards.

I remember 1 guy, can't remember what he was banned for, use to post almost solely in Tech, every rereg he'd answer querys/post news. Good poster.

He'd ask in prison and be told feck off rereg, its not us its you. Went on for months.

Then he started "trolling" the sh1t outta the place


And ya have admins crying about reregs!

Its quieter now I think, I couldn't be bothered looking at prison/assume league still exists.

You say cases of starting afresh, theirs fecking cabinets full going the other way.

K-9

I don't think anybody bothers with the league of bastards thing anymore except yourself T! Seriously, it was brought up recently and it really was a blast from the past.

Cases like that have come up before, thankfully rarely enough. One poster was very good in weather I think it was, but was causing bother everywhere else. I suppose we could ban him from everywhere except weather but that's a bit draconian in my eyes. Just stop trolling would work better.

It really is up to the poster there, not the mods. We can't be expected to babysit trolls when they are wasting mods, and more importantly other users time across the site. Many a good poster ends up with a card or ban because of these "helpful" posters.

Again, most of the responsibility lies with the posters, not the mods there.

And again, far too many posters don't start afresh with new accounts, their responsibility, not ours. Keep doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is the definition of madness.

cowboyBuilder

I just had a look at that page, ~75k users banned ?

Stheno

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

I just had a look at that page, ~75k users banned ?

There are two individuals who probably make up 10000 of those bans

The Hill Billy

Not to mention the thousands & thousands of professional spammers over the years.

Zaph

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

I just had a look at that page, ~75k users banned ?

We had a huge problem a number of years ago where hundreds of Chinese, Indian, etc. spammers were signing up every day. A huge number of the 75k were these guys and they were banned over a relatively short period of time.

Cookie_Monster

Taltos wrote: »

Update



Starting with DRF. Will be staying Public.

Prison. - Due to the feedback here as well as from the mods and cmods, the admin team revisited making Prison private and have agreed with the objections raised and so Prison too will stay Public.

Cheers everyone for the feedback. It was very helpful.

Cool, the system at work

Now, just need to get everything else moving that fast :pac:

eman66

To me the biggest issue Boards has at the moment is how it manages the transition from the community it had become, to a commercial entity (or a commercial community, if you want to argue that)? Is it going very well, satisfactorily enough, or not so good? Is what we see now, it, or will there be further commercialisation, or indeed any retraction if the plan is not going to plan?
Is the fact that registrations are down, as has been said, an indication of a problem? Where are we in the grand scheme of things? Or is that none of my business, as a user?

Boards became what it is, or was, beacuse of the posters. It boomed into an amazing thing because of it's users. It was very simple. Now, Boards is not the users any more. Boards owns the users. We are a number, a quanitity of something that you can trade for money. I think a lot of the noise that can be heard right now is the sound of the community and the business grating against each other.

What is boards now? Can it be the two things, a commercial community? You obviously think it can and that the trade-off required is worth it. I'm not so sure, but who am I?

That's the reason I won't be investing (any more) tonight. I'm out.

maregal

The above poster is being a bit over-dramatic. At the end of the day, this is only a website. Some of the "power posters" who have post counts in the thousands treat their account as an extension of themselves. Their life revolves around this site. How sad and empty their existence must be.

My question is: when this site inevitably goes offline in the coming months, what will happen to all the content? Will it be archived somewhere? Who will pay for the server space? I'm sure the discussions here will be of interest to historians in 100 years time.

Esel

The above poster is being a bit over-dramatic.

LuckyLloyd

Well I raised the question of what the exit strategy from a content preservation perspective would be when the site fails commercially earlier in the thread. I assume the current answer would be 'we're not contemplating commercial failure'.