Did you hear about the Irishwoman in prison in Iran?

Ilovemybricks

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

She's not put any effort into it. If it can be rescinded, rescind it.

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

If it can be rescinded, and it can in some cases for naturalised citizens but not natural born citizens, then it should be.

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

and if there's anyway that it can be rescinded then the Minister should do just that.

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

We are not the world police and if we can right a wrong and rescind her citizenship, then do so.

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

If there's a way of rescinding citizenship for such people then the Minister should do so.

It's not enough for you that an elderly woman who is a citizen of this country has been imprisoned for inter alia "dabbling in feminism", you're busily frothing for the Minister for Justice to revoke her citizenship altogether.

The more I read opinions like this, the more I am convinced that universal suffrage sometimes amounts to putting a loaded firearm into the hands of a child. Yours is an utterly warped approach to fair play. Whether or not you agree with the fact of Homa Hoodfar's citizenship of Ireland, it is a fact. The State has no right to order a general hierarchy of citizens, as long as they are citizens.

There is no suggestion that Homa Hoodfar obtained her citizenship through fraud or deception, or has failed in her duty of loyalty to Ireland. Therefore can you now please let go of this irrational preoccupation with the revocation of Prof. Hoodfar's citizenship by the Minister for Justice?

On the other hand I think there is a very distinct possibility that in its very silence in speaking out against an apparent attack on academic and personal freedom, to make a public statement in that regard, and to register its disquiet, the State is failing in its obligation to defend the rights of one of its citizens.

wakka12

Iran is absolutely insane

Carlos Orange

These threads are kinda tedious. The Irish government doesn't stage prison breaks for anyone and other countries governments are sovereign.

psinno

psinno wrote: »

These threads are kinda tedious. The Irish government doesn't stage prison breaks for anyone and other countries governments are sovereign.

It's kind of tedious that you somehow arrived at the conclusion that this thread is about a prison break.

I even accept that the Iranians may be unwilling to engage with the Department of Foreign Affairs or its Embassy in Teheran.

I am simply suggesting that the lack of awareness, the fairly isolated media coverage, and the lack of disquiet and concern being expressed for Prof Hoodfar's welfare at a political level, deserve to be addressed.

The coverage of the arrest of Michaela McCollum Connolly and her co-conspirator in drug trafficking, Melissa Reid, received enormous relative media interest, political discussion, and consular assistance, despite the fact that both women were normally resident in the United Kingdom and, to my knowledge, never resided in this country.

alchemist33

She didn't like the way Tehran it.




Oh sorry, is it too late to get a punchline in?

ohnonotgmail

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

It's kind of tedious that you somehow arrived at the conclusion that this thread is about a prison break.

I even accept that the Iranians may be unwilling to engage with the Department of Foreign Affairs or its Embassy in Teheran.

I am simply suggesting that the lack of awareness, the fairly isolated media coverage, and the lack of disquiet and concern being expressed for Prof Hoodfar's welfare at a political level, deserve to be addressed.

The coverage of the arrest of Michaela McCollum Connolly and her co-conspirator in drug trafficking, Melissa Reid, received enormous relative media interest, political discussion, and consular assistance, despite the fact that both women were normally resident in the United Kingdom and, to my knowledge, never resided in this country.

To be fair you dont know what has been in the background to assist her. If she is still an iranian citizen then the iranians are within their rights to not allow consular assistance. The lack of press about it isnt really surprising either. there have been a couple of article in the irish times but her case is never going to attract the same level of interest. Although she is an irish citizen her links here dont really stretch beyond that. and it lacks the salacious aspect of drug trafficking. there doesnt seem to be a whole lot more in the canadian press and she lives there.

Carlos Orange

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

despite the fact that both women were normally resident in the United Kingdom and, to my knowledge, never resided in this country.

A lot of deluded people in Ireland think Northern Ireland is part of Ireland. Look at the rules for getting citizenship by marriage , you need a couple of years of residence but anywhere on the island will do. Where did Homa Hoodfar live when she was qualifying for citizenship?

mynamejeff

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

The coverage of the arrest of Michaela McCollum Connolly and her co-conspirator in drug trafficking, Melissa Reid, received enormous relative media interest, political discussion, and consular assistance, despite the fact that both women were normally resident in the United Kingdom and, to my knowledge, never resided in this country.

your right neither case is any of our business

both aware of the laws in the country's where they committed their "crimes" and both should be dealt with there.

just like yer man in the Cairo clink

Ilovemybricks

Chuchote wrote: »

These threads are completely predictable; don't bother to read. If the person has a foreign name or brown skin, Irish racists will disown them. Only the Mulligans from Dublin, the McCarthys from Cork and the Ryans from Tipp are 'really Irish'. And maybe the O'Neills… ah no, sure they're Nordies.

She's not really Irish as she's never lived here and has no Irish ancestry. It's absurd to call this woman "Irish".

Grayson

alchemist33 wrote: »

She didn't like the way Tehran it.




Oh sorry, is it too late to get a punchline in?

Not really. The thread is a bit farsi-cal anyway.



Now that's a pun.

Jawgap

Grayson wrote: »

Not really. The thread is a bit farsi-cal anyway.



Now that's a pun.

What kind of Persian is she anyway?

Grayson

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

She's never lived here and has no Irish ancestry. There's absolutely nothing Irish about her and if there's a way of rescinding her citizenship then do it.

I wouldn't give citizenship to yanks what weren't born here or born to Irish born parents either btw.

Just to clarify, if your parents are Irish but you weren't born here, you're not entitled to Irish citizenship (in your opinion, not according to the law which we know is different)

Ilovemybricks

Grayson wrote: »

Just to clarify, if your parents are Irish but you weren't born here, you're not entitled to Irish citizenship (in your opinion, not according to the law which we know is different)

Read the thread and work on your comprehension.

Ilovemybricks

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

It's not enough for you that an elderly woman who is a citizen of this country has been imprisoned for inter alia "dabbling in feminism", you're busily frothing for the Minister for Justice to revoke her citizenship altogether.

The more I read opinions like this, the more I am convinced that universal suffrage sometimes amounts to putting a loaded firearm into the hands of a child. Yours is an utterly warped approach to fair play. Whether or not you agree with the fact of Homa Hoodfar's citizenship of Ireland, it is a fact. The State has no right to order a general hierarchy of citizens, as long as they are citizens.

There is no suggestion that Homa Hoodfar obtained her citizenship through fraud or deception, or has failed in her duty of loyalty to Ireland. Therefore can you now please let go of this irrational preoccupation with the revocation of Prof. Hoodfar's citizenship by the Minister for Justice?

On the other hand I think there is a very distinct possibility that in its very silence in speaking out against an apparent attack on academic and personal freedom, to make a public statement in that regard, and to register its disquiet, the State is failing in its obligation to defend the rights of one of its citizens.

It's absurd that this Iranian Canadian was ever given citizenship. She's never lived here and isn't of Irish descent. There's absolutely nothing Irish about this person. If the Minister can rescind her citizenship, and from anyone who obtained similarly, then she should.


How can she be "loyal" to three countries at once and to one she's never even lived in? Absurd.

And naturalised citizens are second class citizens. Their citizenship can be revoked. Natural born citizens can't have theirs rescinded.

Anyway, legally, she's an Iranian in an Iranian jail. None of our concern.

Grayson

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

Read the thread and work on your comprehension.

Your grammar isn't great. Not giving out about it. My typing is useless. You'll notice my posts can have mistakes in them. That's why I'm asking. I just want clarification.

Ilovemybricks

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

Read the thread and work on your comprehension.

Ilovemybricks wrote: »

Can you read?

Trying to win the argument by charm!

Anyway, the bottom line is, the State decides who is a citizen or not, not you. And if the State has granted this woman citizenship, your claim that she is not or should not be because you say so is irrelevant. And if she is indeed a citizen, well she should get the same assistance as someone who was born in a Gaeltacht and can sing the Rocks of Bawn.

mzungu

This story has not taken off because unless there is some rock 'n' roll in there, or a human interest* angle to grab readers, then it's all an uphill struggle for the story to gain traction. Otherwise, it might get a few articles here and there in the media, but make no real impact otherwise.

Also, we don't know if Charlie Flanagan is scoping things out via back channels. There might very well be a line of communication open between ourselves and Tehran.

* That is not to say this is not a human interest story, to my mind it is. However, it seems to be mostly the Canadian and US branches of Amnesty coming out to bat for her, with Amnesty Ireland pushing an article or two on their website.

Jesus.

Grayson wrote: »

Your grammar isn't great. Not giving out about it. My typing is useless. You'll notice my posts can have mistakes in them. That's why I'm asking. I just want clarification.

Your maths ain't too hot either

Grayson wrote: »

10,000 would result in a change of 0.002%

Let me put this a different way.

0.002%


That's the only way I can make that number look big.

mcmoustache

She might not be Irish in any way but i would like her to be supported. Ibrahim can stay where he wanted to be. She strikes me as not being a jihadist and more of a political prisoner. If we spent money and lobbying to get her out, i wouldn't have a problem.

Grayson

Jesus. wrote: »

Your maths ain't too hot either

1) you're wrong. I have a degree in Maths. Which makes that mistake really embarrassing. We all have a brain fart sometimes.

2) way to go well out of the way to dodge the question. I just wanted you to clarify what you meant. Did you mean that the children of Irish citizens shouldn't be entitled to be citizens if they were born abroad. Because that's how your previous statement read.

Beta Uprising

If she's technically an Irish citizen then I guess the government should make a formal complaint or something but if she's never lived here and has no real connection with Ireland then it's hard for me to feel any real outrage.

Son Of A Vidic

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Did you hear about the Irishwoman in prison in Iran?

Thread title reads like a joke intro.

Beta Uprising

Beta Uprising wrote: »

If she's technically an Irish citizen then I guess the government should make a formal complaint or something but if she's never lived here and has no real connection with Ireland then it's hard for me to feel any real outrage.

There is no "technically" about it.

Nor are there levels of citizenship.

Our Constitution refers to all people born in Ireland and all qualified by law to be citizens as part of the Irish Nation. Article 9 States that acquisition and loss of nationality and citizenship shall be determined by law. Not blood, not connection, not living here. I appreciate that this does not mean you must be outraged, but rather that the State has the same duty to this person as it has to any other Irish citizen.

foggy_lad

This is just another bleedin heart activist trying to act the martyr for their cause while painting the country or regime as evil and anti women and family.

The Iranians know how to handle such people. She got what she wanted, I hope it doesn't cost her life but hey if you walk a tightrope with no balance pole you should expect to fall.

Jesus.

Grayson wrote: »

1) you're wrong. I have a degree in Maths. Which makes that mistake really embarrassing. We all have a brain fart sometimes.

2) way to go well out of the way to dodge the question. I just wanted you to clarify what you meant. Did you mean that the children of Irish citizens shouldn't be entitled to be citizens if they were born abroad. Because that's how your previous statement read.

Grayson I'm seriously starting to worry about you. That 0.002% thing was my only post in this thread.

conorhal

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

The Irish nation is not a geographic entity. JUst look at all those Yanks who've never been outside their tri-state area, who legitimately enjoy Irish nationality.

Our genetic history is one of coming and going, and dispersing all across the world, a bit like the Jews or the Roma. Uniting us, however, are the principles we live by and the community with which we identify.

I for one couldn't be happier to have as a member of our society an Iranian-born scholar who started a family with an Irishman, and apparently has a strong interest in Irish culture and history, and whose life's work involves the promotion of women's liberty. This might not have been such a grim little island over the past 100 years, especially for women, if we had had more Homa Hoodfars.

What a load of bollox.

Irish citizenship is nothing but another comodity to be traded and monitized these days. Just ask the Lithuanian girl my mate works with. She got her Irish citizenship last year. When he asked her why (since as an EU member citizen she hardly needed to apply for it) she had chosen to become an Irish citizen he reply was effectively, "Do you know what a pain it the ass it is to get a visa to go shopping in New York with a Lithuanian passport?" What principles and community does that reasoning represent prey tell?

kunst nugget

foggy_lad wrote: »

This is just another bleedin heart activist trying to act the martyr for their cause while painting the country or regime as evil and anti women and family.

The Iranians know how to handle such people. She got what she wanted, I hope it doesn't cost her life but hey if you walk a tightrope with no balance pole you should expect to fall.

Was she in the country protesting or out trying to publicly embarrass the government? I can't see any evidence of that. As far as I can make out she was in the country visiting family and researching women's participation in elections since 1906. Her only crime seems to be writing about issues that face Muslim women and being unlucky enough to be visiting the country at the wrong time so in that regard her being arrested for being part of a feminist conspiracy doesn't do much for assuaging the fears that Iran as a country isn't anti-woman.

And though she has written articles on Iran, the country where she was born was in no way the focus of her academic research. Although her reasons to visit Iran this year were entirely personal, she conducted some archival research while there. More importantly, however, her visit coincided with the Iranian elections in which the most women in the history of the country were voted into government positions.

Perhaps therein lies the key to her abrupt, unfounded detainment. The election marked a further shift toward the reformist policies championed by President Hassan Rouhani, since the 14 women elected in March are all reformists themselves. Many religious hardliners in the country, including the Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, Iran’s supreme leader, have not welcomed the move toward reform; and while more progressive-minded leaders are increasingly gaining power within government, there is a strong divide in the nation because Khamenei still controls the national broadcast media as well as the armed forces, including the Revolutionary Guard that detained Hoodfar.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/truthdigger_of_the_week_homa_hoodfar_expert_on_the_20160723

She also suffers from Myasthenia gravis so her being imprisoned without medical treatment could be a very serious issue for her. I can't say my feeling towards her imprisonment would be one of 'good enough for her'. Canada doesn't seem to have any direct diplomacy with Iran but Ireland has an Iranian Embassy in Dublin so I think Ireland should try to help this woman in her time of need.

Jesus.

kunst nugget wrote: »

Her only crime seems to be writing about issues that face Muslim women.

In that case she might be better off where she is. God knows what the Islam loving feminists of the west would do if they got a hold of her.

Grayson

Jesus. wrote: »

Grayson I'm seriously starting to worry about you. That 0.002% thing was my only post in this thread.

ah jaysus

Musketeer4

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

I'm not 100% au fait with this lady's history with Ireland and how she came to be a citizen but I do think that the ease of which people have gained citizenship in Ireland in recent years has made us (the public) a little indifferent to the predicament of people who are seemingly Irish on paper only.

Just my theory.

You're dead right.

A case that jumps to mind is that one of the ' "Irishman":rolleyes: rotting in an Egyptian prison'.

Irish me hole!!