EDWARD

ted1

The much advertised European Day Without A Road Death was a failure, 2 lives lost in a single vehicle incident in a Donegal.
It really is beyond a joke that we can't even go 1day without a death.
What needs to happen ? Better driver education for drivers , driving in bad weather etc or something more big brotheresque?

Dartz

We've gone plenty of days without a death this year, I think....

Some days have more than one.

ted1

Dartz wrote: »

We've gone plenty of days without a death this year, I think....

Some days have more than one.

This was a euro wide project

TallGlass

ted1 wrote: »

The much advertised European Day Without A Road Death was a failure, 2 lives lost in a single vehicle incident in a Donegal.
It really is beyond a joke that we can't even go 1day without a death.
What needs to happen ? Better driver education for drivers , driving in bad weather etc or something more big brotheresque?

Sorry. But are you saying in all other member states no one else died? Just the two people in Donegal, RIP to them.

The Backwards Man

ted1 wrote: »

This was a euro wide project

You can't legislate for it though, there's what, 75 road deaths a day Euro wide, you're never going to get a day without a road death in Europe. It's a stupid PR exercise, we have to make every day a day with less road deaths, not pick an arbitrary date to clap ourselves on the back.

NIMAN

I think it reeks of just having another 'day', to add to Left Handed Day, Godparents Day, people who drive blue cars Day....its the way of the world.

I appreciate that this is a more serious issue but if we really have 70+ people dying in road accidents daily in Europe, do they really think they will get one day when no-one dies, simply because they ask us to take care? Do yoo really think boy racers around Europe said today "its Project Edward today, I must slow down and take it easy"?

Educating people earlier in life about how to drive properly is the best approach, not just asking the millions of drivers to watch themselves.

marno21

The whole thing summed up the real problems with Irish roads.

Plenty of checkpoints on urban 4 lane roads in Dublin, speed vans on wide single carraigeways and a speed van on the 6 lane dual carraigeway N7.

The two deaths happened on a narrow twisty country boreen, where none of this "enforcement" occurs.

As long as they target the completely wrong areas and plenty of high volume, key routes in this country are goat tracks, we won't see any reduction in road fatalities.

In 2016, there has been an increase in the number of GoSafe enforcement zones, and also an increase in the number of road fatalities.

Look how much safer the roads from Dublin to Belfast, Galway, Cork, Waterford and Limerick (N1/N6/N7/N8/N9 upgrades) have become. The regular fatalities on those stretches have been eliminated due to the fact that these long distance, heavy traffic routes are now upto the required safety standard. The same can't be said about other key routes, such as the N20 Cork-Limerick Road, which has seen 4 fatalities so far this year and several non fatal crashes in the last week alone, and the over capacity N28 Cork-Ringaskiddy route, which sees frequent collisions.

NIMAN

Completely true Marno, but we also need to ask why are people driving at reckless speeds on small, twisting, unsuitable roads?

A little bit of commonsense and cop-on is needed. Young drivers need to understand that they can't defy the laws of physics when driving fast around country roads.

Do we do any education in schools for those about to hit driving age? We should.

Allinall

ted1 wrote: »

The much advertised European Day Without A Road Death was a failure, 2 lives lost in a single vehicle incident in a Donegal.
It really is beyond a joke that we can't even go 1day without a death.
What needs to happen ? Better driver education for drivers , driving in bad weather etc or something more big brotheresque?

How was it a failure ?

You say we can't go a day without a road death .
Who died yesterday?

Why does an initiative draw such negativity ?

Atlantic Dawn

Have a look at the Garda Twitter account, it's actually surprising the death toll is so low.

ted1

Allinall wrote: »

How was it a failure ?

It's goal was to have zero deaths, it failed.

In many countries they have variable limits to suit the conditions of its raining the limit is reduced, should we look at doing that or without proper enforcement are we wasting our time.


Would GPS speed restrictions help reduce deaths?

marno21

NIMAN wrote: »

Completely true Marno, but we also need to ask why are people driving at reckless speeds on small, twisting, unsuitable roads?

A little bit of commonsense and cop-on is needed. Young drivers need to understand that they can't defy the laws of physics when driving fast around country roads.

Do we do any education in schools for those about to hit driving age? We should.

People know they can do what they like on these roads and they won't be caught.

Allinall wrote: »

How was it a failure ?

You say we can't go a day without a road death .
Who died yesterday?

Why does an initiative draw such negativity ?

The whole point of the exercise to have a day without a road death. There was two in Ireland and at least one in the UK. Therefore it was a complete and utter failure.

Stheno

I thought it was nonsense tbh
How much did it cost?

NIMAN

marno21 wrote: »

People know they can do what they like on these roads and they won't be caught.




The whole point of the exercise to have a day without a road death. There was two in Ireland and at least one in the UK. Therefore it was a complete and utter failure.

I live in a rural location and know I can drive like a maniac too.

But I like being alive and so decide not to.

My point is these young people are driving recklessly and have no idea how stupid they are being. We can't have Gardai everywhere, so we need to educate people that driving like a knob isn't sexy or anything to be proud of. We can all do that.

We had deaths recently in Donegal where young drivers were playing chicken in cars, and ended up dying, and lying on the side of deserted country roads for several hours until their bodies were discovered. How can we stop this sort of behaviour?

ted1

Stheno wrote: »

I thought it was nonsense tbh
How much did it cost?

Well the cost to treat a cancer patient is about 500k. If we saved 2 life's today we could say that anything under a million is money well spent

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

Well the cost to treat a cancer patient is about 500k. If we saved 2 life's today we could say that anything under a million is money well spent

I'm completely baffled at how the cost of treating a cancer patient VS the cost preventing a car accident are in any way relatable?

Maybe I just read your post wrong though. Can you elaborate?

endacl

I did my bit. Still alive, and didn't kill anybody today. A good idea actually. I might do the same again tomorrow!

ted1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'm completely baffled at how the cost of treating a cancer patient VS the cost preventing a car accident are in any way relatable?

Maybe I just read your post wrong though. Can you elaborate?

Its a comparison on how much the state is willing to spend to save a life

brightspark

"Days" like this are pointless unless there are some other initiatives in place. No one (with the exception of suicides of course) thinks that will be in a fatal car accident.

If they were serious about it they would have had extra speed checks, inspections for unroadworthy vehicles, checking of drivers for both fatigue and alcohol/drugs.

I once worked in a factory and the safety officer said that we had X accidents last year, this year the target was to only have half that amount. I asked him what changes were going to be made to achieve the lower accident rate and just got a blank stare! No changes just an expectation that things would change even though we would be doing exactly the same thing?

My point is that given certain conditions accidents are statistically certain to occur, only by changing those conditions can the amount of accidents be reduced. Putting up lots of signs and adverts was never going to mean that a fatal accident wouldn't occur, especially as they weren't even suggesting behavioural changes.

As Einstein is alleged to have said " insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results"

Cee-Jay-Cee

ted1 wrote: »

The much advertised European Day Without A Road Death was a failure, 2 lives lost in a single vehicle incident in a Donegal.
It really is beyond a joke that we can't even go 1day without a death.
What needs to happen ? Better driver education for drivers , driving in bad weather etc or something more big brotheresque?

What needs to happen is we need to be a little more compassionate and realise that no one sets out to die in an accident. You have absolutely no idea about how the collision occurred and so to presume some sort of legislation could have prevented it is downright ignorant and ridiculous.

Seeing as you were so quick to jump in and flame about two road deaths here, I presume you researched how many people died in the rest of the EU member states...so please share those figures with us now!

irishgeo

Over the past week. I have witnessed 3 near misses. 2 people trying to overtake on solid white lines and yesterday someone just pulled out of a junction in front of another car.

Driver behaviour is wrong. Lack of enforcement is the issue. We need more traffic core and undercover traffic core cars on the roads.

I'd start by having a traffic core only recruitment into Templemore.

Or maybe mobile go safe vans not worried about speeding but catching dangerous driving and other things like driving while on a mobile phone.

Dravokivich

NIMAN wrote: »

Completely true Marno, but we also need to ask why are people driving at reckless speeds on small, twisting, unsuitable roads?

A little bit of commonsense and cop-on is needed. Young drivers need to understand that they can't defy the laws of physics when driving fast around country roads.

Do we do any education in schools for those about to hit driving age? We should.

This accident might have nothing to do with young drivers though. Only one person of the 3 in the car was young and I haven't seen anything state who was driving.

Their is another issue I feel, in that there is a lot of complacency from experienced drivers, who've driven for years and let their standards slip. We all see it every day on the road.

Atlantic Dawn

There should be publically available reports in to all road deaths like the marine casualty investigations board release. Full details of the condition of the car including tyres, body, estimated speed, whether the car had valid nct or not should all be present for the public to view. The drivers blood or drug alcohol levels, the drivers experience driving, the drivers previous penalty points, no claims history and the driving conditions on the day the crash occured also included.

seamus

Stheno wrote: »

I thought it was nonsense tbh
How much did it cost?

Nothing probably, given the fact that the only promotion of this seemed to be changing the gantry signs on some motorways.

The first mention I heard of it in the media was on the evening news yesterday. "Please drive safely. 12 hours ago".

Genius.

ted1

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

What needs to happen is we need to be a little more compassionate and realise that no one sets out to die in an accident. You have absolutely no idea about how the collision occurred and so to presume some sort of legislation could have prevented it is downright ignorant and ridiculous.

Seeing as you were so quick to jump in and flame about two road deaths here, I presume you researched how many people died in the rest of the EU member states...so please share those figures with us now!

In most parts accidents are preventable. To flog them of as being not preventable is far more ignorant. Some legislation can save lives. Be it speed , road design etc.

In this case they hit a pole on a bend. Maybe we. Like look at replacing certain type poles with ones that crumble. It wasn't the first death on that stretch of road

Wossack

Personally, I try not to die on the roads every day

philstar

endacl wrote: »

I did my bit. Still alive, and didn't kill anybody today. A good idea actually. I might do the same again tomorrow!

good lad, now stay off the road :P

Riskymove

ted1 wrote: »

It's goal was to have zero deaths, it failed.

it was always likely to fail.

It is simply an attempt to raise awareness and try and get people to pay attention to road safety

But sometimes accidents are just that, I have no idea for the reasons for what happened yesterday but it may not have been due to any inappropriate road behaviour

It is easy to point out that people did die...but almost impossible to measure how many people did reflect on the message and perhaps drove with more care yesterday

The garda should as a matter of cause when a fatal road accident happens publish following facts:

1. Did everybody wear seatbelts
2. Was excess speed a factor
3. Was another car involved
4. If it was raining did the crashed car run on Chinese ditchfinders
5. Driver's BAC

antix80

ted1 wrote: »

The much advertised European Day Without A Road Death was a failure, 2 lives lost in a single vehicle incident in a Donegal.

They mustn't have gotten the memo.

jackofalltrades

EDWARD is just another failed campaign at "raising awareness".
The increase in roads deaths is mainly down to the lack of enforcement on our roads.
The government/RSA seem to think that speed vans and fancy ads can replace the traffic corp.
Well they can't, they need to bring it back to it's previous strength.
And actually target drivers on back roads where there is no enforcement.
I can't see this happening, because there is little to no creativity when it comes to reducing road deaths in this country.
They'll just keep repeating the "speed kills" mantra until they're hoarse.

ohnonotgmail

jackofalltrades wrote: »

EDWARD is just another failed campaign at "raising awareness".
The increase in roads deaths is mainly down to the lack of enforcement on our roads.
The government/RSA seem to think that speed vans and fancy ads can replace the traffic corp.
Well they can't, they need to bring it back to it's previous strength.
And actually target drivers on back roads where there is no enforcement.
I can't see this happening, because there is little to no creativity when it comes to reducing road deaths in this country.
They'll just keep repeating the "speed kills" mantra until they're hoarse.

are the road death stats not going down?

jackofalltrades

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

are the road death stats not going down?

Last year there were 166 fatailites on Irish roads.
This year so far there have been 137.
That works out at around 15 per month.
At that rate we'll have exceeded last years total by the start of December.

marno21

Road deaths are up 23 (137 from 114) year-on-year, that's a 20% increase.

The current attempts to reduce road deaths are simply not working, and what's worse is that more and more resources are being put into these methods.

Julez

Saw an EDWARD advertisement on the notification board on the m50 last week, a huge chunk of text, I'd be surprised if no one crashed trying to read it.

brightspark

marno21 wrote: »

Road deaths are up 23 (137 from 114) year-on-year, that's a 20% increase.

The current attempts to reduce road deaths are simply not working, and what's worse is that more and more resources are being put into these methods.

It would be interesting if someone could properly analyse the statistics. I suspect the drop in accidents for a number of years was simply due to a reduction of road usage caused by the recession with less cars, less travelling for work and less money to spend on fuel etc. and now the economy is recovering (for some) people are driving more, both for work and for pleasure and the number of accidents is once again increasing.

tossy

LIGHTNING wrote: »

And by resources you mean speedcamera's cos everybody knows they stop road deaths. It's a good thing they are located at accident black spots and not places where they can just generate revenue

/s

Exactly, as soon as the powers that be stop this speeding kills BS and start focusing on proper enforcement of the rules of the road, proper education for drivers and proper road repair and upkeep things will start to improve!

They showed us how serious they were about this back in the day when Gay byrne got that job ffs.

Cheensbo

Banning ditchfinders would be a good place to start for reducing road deaths IMO.

Actually, wait, once a tyre has an E on it, it's as good as any other tyre out there.



Tyres are tyres - Conon Faulknan.

Special Circumstances

brightspark wrote: »

It would be interesting if someone could properly analyse the statistics. I suspect the drop in accidents for a number of years was simply due to a reduction of road usage caused by the recession with less cars, less travelling for work and less money to spend on fuel etc. and now the economy is recovering (for some) people are driving more, both for work and for pleasure and the number of accidents is once again increasing.

I'd be nearly certain this is the biggest factor.
But the quangos can pat themselves on the back when things get better and the public are to blame when they don't. Cushy number wha?

H3llR4iser

jackofalltrades wrote: »

...
The government/RSA seem to think that speed vans and fancy ads can replace the traffic corp.
Well they can't, they need to bring it back to it's previous strength.
And actually target drivers on back roads where there is no enforcement.
I can't see this happening, because there is little to no creativity when it comes to reducing road deaths in this country.
They'll just keep repeating the "speed kills" mantra until they're hoarse.

Unfortunately, it's not an "Irish only" issue; A lot of other countries are caught in the very same idiotic equation: road safety = speed cameras.

Places like Italy invested idiotic amounts of money for "average speed detection" systems on the motorways; The government loves to parade how "fatalities on the motorways have gone down X%", and the public laps it up; A quick check of the statistics will show how the vast majority of fatal events happened, surprise surprise, on secondary and rural roads. Sounds familiar?

Just a superficial look at the RSA statistics tells one important tale: most of the accidents resulting in casualties happen on Sundays, which aren't the heaviest traffic days. It needs to be seen how this is related to the average number of vehicle occupants (e.g. most likely to have an entire family of 4 or 5 in a car on a sunday, and just 1-2 people in it during the rest of the week), but taken at face value, this data suggests a few things:

- Drivers are more likely to crash when they are "relaxed";
- How many of these crashes were due to "turning to the back seat to fight with the kids"?
- How many of those crashes involved drivers who only go out in the car occasionally?

As I have countless times pointed out, the three big issues are distracted driving, lack of awareness and lack of experience (skills). The only way to improve things is to radically change the way we approach the concept of driving; As long as we see the driver doing 160 Kph on a perfectly paved motorway as a criminal worth resuming the death penalty for, and the one frustrating a column of other drivers by doing 50 on a single-lane, 100 Kph N road engrossed in conversation with the passengers and/or humming along with the radio as a "safe driver", nothing will change.

brightspark wrote: »

It would be interesting if someone could properly analyse the statistics. I suspect the drop in accidents for a number of years was simply due to a reduction of road usage caused by the recession with less cars, less travelling for work and less money to spend on fuel etc. and now the economy is recovering (for some) people are driving more, both for work and for pleasure and the number of accidents is once again increasing.

Another extremely interesting point - other countries that went through a similar "recession" phase are seeing the same trend: road fatalities decreased, the media sang songs about the marvels of speed cameras, then the economy picked up, the traffic increased, the fatalities went up again...