Firearms instructor/coach qualification

Wadi14

Ex military I was qualified in a number of firearms courses, including coaching, instruction, and conducting live firing on ranges.

What I am wondering is for me to coach a shooter on my local range do I need to do a civilian course ?
if so who runs these courses ?
is there any legal standing to them ?

I don't have a problem doing any course, if its beneficial to the club.

Sparks

Wadi14 wrote: »

What I am wondering is for me to coach a shooter on my local range do I need to do a civilian course ?

No. The local range might have a rule that says you need to do one, but that would just be them so you'd have to ask them. There's no legal requirement or national standard course.

if so who runs these courses ?

There are a few courses run to train coaches or instructors (in FETAC-speak, instructors are a lower grade of diploma than coaches so there would be more than one course in some sports); generally I'd say ask your sport's NGB because usually the courses vary according to what kind of shooting sport you're doing.

is there any legal standing to them ?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=95486051#post95486051

TL;DR - nope, not a jot, not an iota, it's a total and utter ****show.

cookimonster

I'm not sure about rifle and pistol disciplines but a couple of lads I know have done coaching courses with national clay pigeon bodies. I'm not sure of the details but the guys shoot national and international disciplines.

I don't know your sports shooting background but as a serving member (logs background only) and having had contact with some of the civilian ranges (pistol and rifle) I can tell you that none of our military experience will carry over to the organization, marshalling and to a certain degree civilian rangediscipline and protocols.
Like the army the civilian clubs will have designated personal trained in the running of routine range days etc. Most clubs require you to be a member for regular use of the range and conducting your own business may infringe on the owners business plan on so many levels.
A group of us serving in the PDF did NRA based shootgun safety instructors course as a prerequisite to the establishment of the Defence Forces Clay Pigeon Club. Many of us used this 'qualifications' to run safety courses in our own game and clay clubs. The course is similar to that of the NARGC one. If you follow other threads you will see that this courses are not officially recognized by the GS but will suffice for the student when they are required to do a firearms safety course.
I know of people who have received recognition by the GS to run safety and coaching courses but they had to jump a lot of hurdles to do so. Effectively they have the same recognition as a clay ground that can accommodate unlicensed individuals who want to have a days clay pigeon shooting.

Anyhow that's my penny's worth, no doubt someone else will weigh in if they haven't all ready while in typing.

Sparks

cookimonster wrote: »

I know of people who have received recognition by the GS to run safety and coaching courses but they had to jump a lot of hurdles to do so. Effectively they have the same recognition as a clay ground that can accommodate unlicensed individuals who want to have a days clay pigeon shooting.

Unfortunately, there's absolutely no legal basis for that in this country (the GS recognising courses that is). The Commissioner herself could "recognise" a course and Superintendent Bloggs could refuse to accept it as proof of competence and there wouldn't be a legal way to force him to. So what hoops these people jumped through I don't know, but they haven't gotten anything that would stand up in court as an end result.

(Also, any range can accommodate unlicenced individuals who want to shoot on the range like that, it requires no special permissions from anyone, just that it be done in a certain manner and not use restricted firearms).

cookimonster

Sparks wrote: »

..........(Also, any range can accommodate unlicenced individuals who want to shoot on the range like that, it requires no special permissions from anyone, just that it be done in a certain manner and not use restricted firearms).

Okay I haven't made myself clear. The individuals in question are teaching safety courses / coaching, it is not the recognition of the training but the issue of the legality of a secound party using a firearm without the relavant license.
This training is not taking place on a range but on clay pigeon grounds. Based on what I've been told they have received sanction to do so. The hurdles are basically proof of competency on their part, proof of whereabouts and facilities to do so in a safe and controlled environment. This is what I assume is mentioned by authorization.

Wadi14

thanks for the information guys, I'd love to get my hands on what's covered on the courses, would be interesting reading as I'm sure I have folders full of the topics in the attic lol.

Sparks

issue of the legality of a secound party using a firearm without the relavant license.

No such animal. Section 2(4)(d) covers the use of a firearm by an unlicenced person on any range or place recognised under section 2 or section 4A. That means all rifle ranges and pistol ranges (both of which go down the 4A route most of the time) and all clay pigeon shooting grounds which have section 2(5) authorisation from the local Super which is all of them. And it's been that way since 1925.

Not sure what the people you're talking to have been put through, but my guess is that it wasn't for any good reason, and they haven't gotten anything from it which they didn't legally have beforehand.

cookimonster

Sparks wrote: »

......and all clay pigeon shooting grounds which have section 2(5) authorisation from the local Super which is all of them. And it's been that way since 1925.

Cool, and this is not an argument but more of a brain picking on my part......

Clay Pigeon Shooting requires no 'authorization' and does not attract the same legalities as zeroing or target practice with rifles. So based on my assumption I can set up a fairly extensive clay ground on private property, once obviously I'm not causing a nuisance or safety issues?
If the latter is so and I then want to have my grounds recognized then I would have to apply for a section 2(5) authorisation. If so then this is what has occurred.

Sparks

Basically, yes. But you would also need planning permission and so on.