Packet lost in post. What to do? Money back?

jestea

Hello,
I send small packet in Ireland. Standar post,
I wrote full address,name,block and eircode.
Person telling me, that she did not get item.
I called to post,they did not find anything.
I apply "lost item" form, and send in post.
Now person asking me full refund.
What to do?
I have proof reciepe, that i send it. (Standart,ofcourse)

Money is small. But...

( item cost 10€, she payd me 12€ with post. I payed 2.85€ for post)

So... what to do? Any advices.? My righs?

Thank you everybody

Lux23

If you're a trader, you're obliged under the law to refund the consumer. If this is a consumer to consumer transaction then technically they would have to sue you to get it back.

slinky2000

If you are a trader and selling items online you should always use tracked postage.

How did they pay? paypal? If they file a claim through paypal, they will automatically give them a refund from your account if you cannot prove where the parcel went.

coylemj

Without registering it, you have no proof that she received since it isn't tracked and An Post will not refund you a penny. Receipt of posting means nothing since it doesn't guarantee delivery, it really only serves to protect the person who posts the item if he/she is an employee of a mail order company and the item goes missing in the post.

jestea

Im not trader.
I sold my child toy.
And she agree to post it by standart post.
I did my job, i post it, i have reciepe.
I applyed lots/stolen item form to post.

Speedwell

You may have a receipt, but does it prove that you packaged the item properly, addressed it properly, or even sent the correct item? Can you prove the customer received the package (a signature on delivery, etc.)? No. That's why you are responsible up to the time that the customer receives the package. You have had full control over the package. The customer has had no control at all.

foggy_lad

How long has it been since sending the item?

jestea

Ok, but its standart post, and she wanted to post by standart post. Not registered
Maybe she recieve and want full money back?
.

endagibson

Since you can't prove that the buyer received the item, it seems fair to refund the buyer.

TheDoc

jestea wrote: »

Im not trader.
I sold my child toy.
And she agree to post it by standart post.
I did my job, i post it, i have reciepe.
I applyed lots/stolen item form to post.

Sounds like a second hand sale, in that case there is no consumer law protection here.

In good faith you should probably refund the buyer since you didn't go registered post. But if you don't, there is no real return for the buyer apart from leaving you negative feedback and potentially taking you to the small claims court.

In future ensure you use registered post, especially for items

Speedwell

jestea wrote: »

Ok, but its standart post, and she wanted to post by standart post. Not registered
Maybe she recieve and want full money back?
.

Or she didn't want to pay nearly as much as the likely cost of the toy to have it shipped to her. Next time you should bear the cost of registered post if you want to protect yourself against non-receipt claims, or else sell only to people willing to pay for registered post.

Del2005

jestea wrote: »

Im not trader.
I sold my child toy.
And she agree to post it by standart post.
I did my job, i post it, i have reciepe.
I applyed lots/stolen item form to post.

How where you paid? If they used PayPal then they will side with her and take the money back, it's a well known scam. If cash or cheque then she'd need to use the small claims court.

Spocker

Sound like you've done more that enough OP; I wouldn't offer a full refund, half at most, as you've lost out by no longer having the toy either

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Spocker wrote: »

Sound like you've done more that enough OP; I wouldn't offer a full refund, half at most, as you've lost out by no longer having the toy either

Look at it from the buyer's point of view. They paid for a product they did not receive. That scam works both ways. The seller should refund as they were the person with the contract with An Post and can lodge a claim for lost post.

Spocker

Axton Hot Water wrote: »

The seller should refund as they were the person with the contract with An Post and can lodge a claim for lost post.

But the buyer asked for standard post though? No claim can be lodged in that case

ssmith6287

Axton Hot Water wrote: »

Look at it from the buyer's point of view. They paid for a product they did not receive. That scam works both ways. The seller should refund as they were the person with the contract with An Post and can lodge a claim for lost post.

Id imagine it's on the seller to prove the buyer received stock rather then the other way around

coylemj

TheDoc wrote: »

In future ensure you use registered post, especially for items

Can we bear in mind that the sale price of this item was €10 and the minimum charge for registered post is €6.25.

The buyer agreed to standard post so as this was not a trade sale and the seller has proof of posting, I cannot see how the buyer has any legal comeback against the seller. Unless payment was via PayPal in which case I'd see him probably losing the money as per the usual mail order scam.

Spocker

It's likely not relevant here, and I do have a lot of faith in our postal delivery system, but sometimes this kind of stuff happens: http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0927/819629-dundalk-post-garda-investigations/

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

ssmith6287 wrote: »

Id imagine it's on the seller to prove the buyer received stock rather then the other way around

That's what I said.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Spocker wrote: »

But the buyer asked for standard post though? No claim can be lodged in that case

Simply, not true.

jestea

Ok. I will leave ir and will wait.
Best way she will get 6€
I lost item, i lost money... i have proof of post. And she didnt asked me registered post....

jestea

And sorry, she paid to my bank account .

readytosnap

lesson to be learned here. In future insist on registered mail whether you are sending or receiving, that way both seller and buyer would have some protection, legally i dont think you have to refund the buyer, morally?, well that is your decision. If in future a potential buyer says standard post only, either refuse to sell or insist on reg mail it would of only coast an extra 1.50 to register it.

Spocker

Axton Hot Water wrote: »

Simply, not true.

I stand corrected, the OP can claim back the cost of postage, in stamps or a cheque: http://www.anpost.ie/anpost/maincontent/customer%20service/our%20commitment%20to%20you/our%20commitment%20to%20you.htm

nibtrix

readytosnap wrote: »

insist on reg mail it would of only coast an extra 1.50 to register it.

Minimum reg price is €6.25, so in this case an extra €3.40, fairly significant with the cost of the item being €10.

coylemj

jestea wrote: »

Im not trader.
I sold my child toy.
And she agree to post it by standart post.
I did my job, i post it, i have reciepe.
I applyed lots/stolen item form to post.

The buyer could have opted for delivery by registered post but that would have been disproportionally expensive (>60% of the value of the item) so she elected for standard post. The seller duly posted the item and has a receipt to prove it.

I think this is a grey area, the buyer didn't sign a disclaimer but in law could have been deemed to have taken on the risk by declining the offer of delivery via registered post.

If you think the liability lies on one side or the other, please quote your legal authority.

endagibson

nibtrix wrote: »

Minimum reg price is €6.25, so in this case an extra €3.40, fairly significant with the cost of the item being €10.

Can pass that cost to the buyer, absorb it or anything in between. Right now the OP is looking at having to hand back the tenner.

jestea

Still no ansver from post,
Buyer asking full money back,
I have proof of post,applied "lost item" form
Called four times to post.
Where is my rights??? Im not responsible fot stabdart post.
Bets i can do, give half price, around 5€
She want full.
I will wait. Better will go to court,if she bring me there, but i will not give full money back, because i POst it. I lost my stuff, spend money on post... and what?
It was even eircode on parcel. How it can lost...
People live like this.
Want to get free items..
Of my good side, half price back is good.

slinky2000

For the sake of 10 euro you're willing to go to court?

Just give her the money back as we've explained it's your responsibility to ensure it get's to her.

I know it's a pain to have an item lost in the post, it's happened to me a few times. She may have well gotten the item and is trying to get it for free but neither you or anyone else can prove that as you've no history the item was delivered.

FYI You may be able to claim compensation from an post:

http://www.anpost.ie/AnPost/MainContent/Customer+Service/Our+Commitment+to+You/

An Post will pay compensation for items lost, damaged or substantially delayed in the post (7 days within Ireland; 10 days for international items). Proof of posting such as a certificate of posting, may be required to be eligible for such compensation. Generally, these payments are made in the form of complimentary stamps and cover no more than the cost of postage and directly associated costs

RossieMan

Take it as a lesson learned. Only use registered post. You were a fool to use standard post if it's requested, it's obviously a scam.

jestea

I dont know. If she bring me to small court, i will go. No problem for me..
But why i have to refund full money? dont you think, half price would be good for both sides?
I did all my best, form, calls. Have reciepe...
She will learn and i will learn...
6€ would be max for her...
If she dont want..i dont care anymore...