Journalism and cycling

magicbastarder

i suspect they've reused a stock photo while also reusing the caption.

Steoller

magicbastarder wrote: »

i suspect they've reused a stock photo while also reusing the caption.

Yup, seeing as it's at least twice that for the year. Paper of record my foot.

Final line of the IT piece "Seven cyclists have died on Irish roads this year."

Yeah, how many of those ran a red light.

Macy0161

I think this is a positive story for cycling. For too long the narrative has been no enforcement on cyclists, while "shooting fish in a barrel" with motorists*. I also don't have an issue with enforcement on any/ all road users.

*obviously that's a whole different narrative, about how some illegal and dangerous behaviours are so normalised for motorists that they feel they can give out about enforcement

Borderfox

Following up about the 2000 on the spot fines given to cyclists on Lunchtime Live, all the usual strawman arguments being rolled out by the callers

Bernard sounded like a taxi driver I heard on Liveline

eclipsechaser

Dr Paul Corcoran, chairman of the Dublin Cycling Campaign, said breaking red lights was an issue “among a small percentage of cyclists”.

Seven cyclists have died on Irish roads this year.

That is unbelievably insensitive to the families of those who died. I'm pissed enough to cancel my subscription for that line.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We need to have a list of every fatal cycling incident and publicly publish the findings of the cause. Only then will it become clear that light-breaking is not why cyclists are dying. Cyclists can also learn when they are at most risk and be appropriately educated. They do such a database for Scuba - they should do it for fatal RTA's.

Corca Baiscinn

eclipsechaser wrote: »

That is unbelievably insensitive to the families of those who died. I'm pissed enough to cancel my subscription for that line.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We need to have a list of every fatal cycling incident and publicly publish the findings of the cause. Only then will it become clear that light-breaking is not why cyclists are dying. Cyclists can also learn when they are at most risk and be appropriately educated. They do such a database for Scuba - they should do it for fatal RTA's.

I have seen Dr Mike McKillen of the Dublin Cycling Campaign say something similar re the publicatiion of thorough and painstaking results of Air Accident Investigations versus RTA's.

Agree with you re the sloppy, insensitive journalism, there is no evidence at all of any connectiion between the 7 fatalities this year and RLJ. However, I wouldn't cancel my subscription as I still want to know what they're saying about cycling as well as everythig else

ED E

eclipsechaser wrote: »

That is unbelievably insensitive to the families of those who died. I'm pissed enough to cancel my subscription for that line.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We need to have a list of every fatal cycling incident and publicly publish the findings of the cause. Only then will it become clear that light-breaking is not why cyclists are dying. Cyclists can also learn when they are at most risk and be appropriately educated. They do such a database for Scuba - they should do it for fatal RTA's.

Big problem there is the glacial speed of the system. Inquests typically only start 18mo after the incident with findings often closer to 2yrs after. Thats another 30 deaths and 2900 serious injuries before we get to learn from it.

Melodeon

ED E wrote: »

Big problem there is the glacial speed of the system. Inquests typically only start 18mo after the incident with findings often closer to 2yrs after. Thats another 30 deaths and 2900 serious injuries before we get to learn from it.

Even let it take 2 or 3 or 4 years for inquest findings to be published, it'd still be very useful information.
We'd now be getting detailed breakdown of incidents that happened in 2014-2015, for example, which is still plenty recent enough to be relevant.

magicbastarder

to contrast with the story about the fines issued to cyclists:

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2018/0731/982306-garda-road-traffic-figures/

Rechuchote

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

“Tuesday evening’s road death brings to three the number of cyclists who have lost their lives on Irish roads so far this year”

Where did that happen? Couldn’t see an article on it.

Incorrect. It was already 8 dead (including two who died in hospital) by 5 May this year.

eclipsechaser wrote: »

That is unbelievably insensitive to the families of those who died. I'm pissed enough to cancel my subscription for that line.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We need to have a list of every fatal cycling incident and publicly publish the findings of the cause. Only then will it become clear that light-breaking is not why cyclists are dying. Cyclists can also learn when they are at most risk and be appropriately educated. They do such a database for Scuba - they should do it for fatal RTA's.

The facts are collected long before the inquest and should be available within a week of a death: where the crash happened, what vehicles were involved, the sobriety of drivers/cyclists/pedestrians involved, the direction of travel, the time of day, the light (eg low sun glare or bad street lights), the visibility of vehicles and cyclists, whether the crash happened at/near/before/after a bend or junction, the road design generally (pavements, camber, signage…), whether the crash happened at a place identified as an 'accident black spot', the age of drivers/cyclists/pedestrians involved, the speed at which drivers/cyclists were travelling, the quality and upkeep of the road (eg potholes), how soon ambulance arrived, how soon gardaí arrived, what witnesses saw the crash and what they said on the spot/later…

There should be a standard form to be filled out by everyone present and returned to the gardaí; there should also, surely, be a Garda section specialised in dealing with crashes and collating and centralising the information as well as dealing with the aftermath, from talking to the bereaved to assisting with any court or inquest appearances.

amcalester

magicbastarder wrote: »

to contrast with the story about the fines issued to cyclists:

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2018/0731/982306-garda-road-traffic-figures/

Too busy catching the real dangerous road users, all those rogue cyclists.

Pinch Flat

https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2018/0801/982349-pope-mass-phoenix-park/

It’s okay folks. They’ll be providing plenty of bike parking instead. Looks like joe Duffy will be a busy man the following Monday...

magicbastarder

**** brexit. i'm stockpiling food for that weekend. you won't be able to go *anywhere* in dublin. it'll be like the purge, except with old people.

Pinch Flat

Another bread crisis...

Hurrache

Pinch Flat wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2018/0801/982349-pope-mass-phoenix-park/

It’s okay folks. They’ll be providing plenty of bike parking instead. Looks like joe Duffy will be a busy man the following Monday...

Heard someone on radio complain yesterday that catering for people and families cycling to the event would take up too much space and add too many delays at the gates. Morons.

Borderfox

they would park at the cross if they got the chance

magicbastarder

there's a cross event that day in the park too? bit early in the season, no?

Schrodingercat

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/father-of-cyclist-killed-by-drink-driver-questions-lack-of-alcohol-evidence-at-inquest-1.3582443


The father of a teenage cyclist who was killed when struck by a drink-driver has questioned why no evidence was heard at the inquest about the motorist’s alcohol intake. (3 times over the limit)
The jury at his inquest returned a verdict of accidental death due to a road traffic collision.


Happened half an hour after sunset. Very easy to not realise the time and get caught out without lights on a long spin.

Pinch Flat

I think light or no lights the outcome would have been the same. RIP to the cyclist. The victim blaming has started on the IT Facebook page already. We really do have some peculiar attitudes to drink driving.

mr spuckler

Deedsie wrote: »

The ignorant uncaring "parking" of cars is one thing. Saw a guy block up Portlaoise town centre last week so he could pop over to the ATM. Was grand though his hazard lights were on.

I saw a fella this morning park up in the cycle lane opposite me, get out of his car, leave the door wide open across the main traffic lane while he did God knows what and then head off across the road without properly looking for traffic or even closing the door of his car!
he then had to stop all traffic to saunter back across the road to close the door before walking across the road again.

when I passed by again about 10 mins later he was sitting in his car, which was still parked in the cycle lane and with the door wide open again.

unfortunately I didn't have my camera on although it was so ridiculous it almost had the look of a hidden camera show moment!

Thinkingaboutit

magicbastarder wrote: »

to contrast with the story about the fines issued to cyclists:

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2018/0731/982306-garda-road-traffic-figures/

Catching hooligan cyclists, donut special in Red Circle (or whatever the name)... Cars breaking red lights is at times prevalent, and that's not just the usual amber gamblers.

Pinch Flat

Popped up the blanchardstown shipping centre to pick up something on Sunday. Plenty of parking, but some tool was parked on a double yellow, hazards on. Presumably waiting for something critical from Argos.

Muahahaha

Schrodingercat wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/father-of-cyclist-killed-by-drink-driver-questions-lack-of-alcohol-evidence-at-inquest-1.3582443


The father of a teenage cyclist who was killed when struck by a drink-driver has questioned why no evidence was heard at the inquest about the motorist’s alcohol intake. (3 times over the limit)
The jury at his inquest returned a verdict of accidental death due to a road traffic collision.

Heres the bit that stood out for me

Forensic crash investigator, Garda Ray Sweeney, said it was impossible to say whether Mr Cooper was cycling in the carriageway or the hard shoulder when he was hit, but his body was found 39 metres from the point of impact, while the Landcruiser stopped 146 metres from the point of impact.

He estimated the Landcruiser was doing between 69kph and 82kph when it hit Mr Cooper, and it took Mr Collins between 4.87 and 6.37 seconds to brake after impact. He said 85 per cent of drivers would be expected to brake within 1.5 seconds of impact, so he was slow to brake.

So the driver wasnt speeding but it took him a full 5 seconds to hit the brakes and this was after his windscreen had shattered on impact. He was three times over the legal drink drive limit which is the reason why.

eeeee

That story is horrific (about the teen getting killed by a drunk driver). The overall tone of the piece is disturbing, serious victim blaming. How the drink driving bit didn't come into consideration in the verdict is completely baffling. Makes no sense. It's surely the biggest contributory factor in the whole thing.
Driver should never have a license again, he killed someone. You wouldn't give a gun license back to someone who shot someone else, it's ridiculous.

average_runner

Muahahaha wrote: »

Heres the bit that stood out for me



So the driver wasnt speeding but it took him a full 5 seconds to hit the brakes and this was after his windscreen had shattered on impact. He was three times over the legal drink drive limit which is the reason why.

Can never understand why people drink and drive.

3 times over the drink limit is 3 pints, that wouldn't explain the 5 sec delay, the fact is he was over the limit and doing something else at the time while driving, or even falling asleep.

They are definitely leaving out a few parts of this story.

tomasrojo

There's a bit in the reporting about the drivers who'd passed the cyclist before the collision occurred, and they reported how hard he was to see.

Might be true, but I've been told how hard I am to see with a Lunar R2 on the back of the bike, plus reflectors, and the person telling me had clearly seen me at least 100m away (they slowed down and switched to the left lane when I signalled I was changing lane to go straight on), so I'd take that with a pinch of salt.

Grassey

Says it all really..... 20k views... no comments...

If it was anything cycle related comments would be multiples of the views!

Annie get your Run

tomasrojo wrote: »

There's a bit in the reporting about the drivers who'd passed the cyclist before the collision occurred, and they reported how hard he was to see.

Might be true, but I've been told how hard I am to see with a Lunar R2 on the back of the bike, plus reflectors, and the person telling me had clearly seen me at least 100m away (they slowed down and switched to the left lane when I signalled I was changing lane to go straight on), so I'd take that with a pinch of salt.

Yes but they still saw him, they weren't drunk and they were driving (presumably) correctly for the conditions at the time which allowed them to avoid hitting him. It's funny how they didn't interview anyone about Mr Collins driving before the crash. Shocking bias being shown all round.

magicbastarder

Grassey wrote: »

Says it all really..... 20k views... no comments...

If it was anything cycle related comments would be multiples of the views!

what site is that from?