Journalism and cycling

Corca Baiscinn

Eamonnator wrote: »

It just makes a big deal out of cycling. It makes it look difficult and out of the ordinary and not normal.

Possibly the word "audit" creates that impression, whereas if she had said "Look will ya check that your brakes are working and your trouser leg isn't going to catch in your chain" it might have been less of a big deal.

magicbastarder

exactly; plus, i think the word 'audit' was used more in planning a route? can't be certain without watching it again.

Fighting Tao

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Look I dont do it all the time but not doing it one day led to my unfastened pannier strap catching in my spokes and the wheel seizing up so that I had to abandon my trip, lock up bike and walk home. (It was a Sun so no LBS open) The quick bike check is a standard part of Bikeability (UK) and Cycle Right (Irl) training. Can't remember it all but things like squeeze brakes, check chain. Also, Barbara Connolly is not an RSA employee afaik unless she joined recently. She used to work for Cycling Ireland who have responsibility for Cycle Right.

Your point re people who look after their bikes will continue to do so is pointless as it goes without saying that regular riders will have enough wit to try to avoid chain coming off, gears seizing up,brakes failing and their trip being messed up but this family were not experienced riders so a reminder was fair enough.

Agree there's more than enough to criticise the RSA for re their attitude to cycling but we should pick our battles

Sorry, I made a mistake with the representative. It was probably all the RSA branding that got into my head.

I am not picking a battle here. I pointed out that it was pointless as there is very likely near to zero people who watched it and will audit their bike before they go out on it.

Personally, I'd generally know within 100m from home if there was something obviously wrong with the bike. What would have been better is to highlight that the tools to fix an issue are carried while out on the road e.g. pump, spare tube/puncture repair kit, etc., rather than imply that it is a chore to get on a bike.

CramCycle

Haven't seen it yet but I'd pinch the tyres and squeeze the front brake but sin e. This is more than most people do for their cars. My partner has had three cars sieze for not checking oil (admittedly one time was when I borrowed the car). I wouldn't check something like that everytime but once every 3 months or so on my own car. Same with tyres, thank the NCT because the number of bald tyres still on the road, imagine if we didn't have the NCT considering the cutbacks on the Gardai. Even with things that don't need to be checked but should be obvious people are oblivious. Lights is the main one, how can you not notice that you are only on parking lights compared to dims, it is frightening how oblivious some people are. The Rsa are guilty of stirring the sterotype with cyclists, promoting Hi Vis and helmet use over Lights, to the point where people who are not arsed think they are legally compliant and visible with a sh1tty 2 euro Hi Vis.

CramCycle

Just watched it there now, all fairly harmless which is good. The family seemed grand, highlighted the issues without scaring anyone off, Tiernans crowd came off reasonable. I liked the point about % cyclists who are motorists vs the other way around. The RSA lad was not well versed, but then he was only on for a few seconds, I thought himself and the CI spokesperson came off the worst in regards coming across well. She, while correct, was to practised and not natural, made it seem like a job to cycle. He hasn't been on a bike in a city, ever and hasn't a notion of what he is on about, legal or otherwise. The bike messenger is probably the only one who will get a doing on social media as they edit him overtaking a bus turning as he talks about cyclists fitting into spaces that aren't there, and Simon talking about Pedestrians sandwiched with a clip of him cycling through a crowd of pedestrians.

CramCycle

magicbastarder wrote: »

exactly; plus, i think the word 'audit' was used more in planning a route? can't be certain without watching it again.

You are correct, she brings the family on a spin of their regular routes to spot any issues. That's the only time audit is mentioned and I wouldn't have noticed it bar it was mentioned here, perfectly normal way to use the word.

magicbastarder

CramCycle wrote: »

Simon talking about Pedestrians sandwiched with a clip of him cycling through a crowd of pedestrians.

if this is the same one i'm thinking of, there's one where he cycles through a bunch of pedestrians, but he's facing a green light (could be at the bottom of kildare street, where it meets nassau street?) - the all too subtle message there was that the pedestrians just crossed in front of him because there were no cars coming.
that said, it was a fairly wide angle lens on the camera and the traffic light was not exactly prominent in the shot.

CramCycle

magicbastarder wrote: »

if this is the same one i'm thinking of, there's one where he cycles through a bunch of pedestrians, but he's facing a green light (could be at the bottom of kildare street, where it meets nassau street?) - the all too subtle message there was that the pedestrians just crossed in front of him because there were no cars coming.
that said, it was a fairly wide angle lens on the camera and the traffic light was not exactly prominent in the shot.

That was kind of my point though, the show doesn't show him break the law but anyone anti cyclists will not see that, just that he was barging through pedestrians. Happens to me all the time, I used to shout red man or similar, to wake them up but now I just crawl through because the fact is most of them don't notice or care. I see cars doing it all the time as well just driving through with the hand on the horn. Funny that somehow most people watching the car would check the lights, and say "bloody walkign idiots", whereas if the cyclists does it in a far less intimidating way, it is reckells, dangerous, rude etc.

You seen it, I seen it but I guarantee you, anyone with a preconceived view of messengers in Dublin won't and I think the editors know that.

Thinkingaboutit

CramCycle wrote: »

That was kind of my point though, the show doesn't show him break the law but anyone anti cyclists will not see that, just that he was barging through pedestrians. Happens to me all the time, I used to shout red man or similar, to wake them up but now I just crawl through because the fact is most of them don't notice or care. I see cars doing it all the time as well just driving through with the hand on the horn. Funny that somehow most people watching the car would check the lights, and say "bloody walkign idiots", whereas if the cyclists does it in a far less intimidating way, it is reckells, dangerous, rude etc.

You seen it, I seen it but I guarantee you, anyone with a preconceived view of messengers in Dublin won't and I think the editors know that.

Yes, I just have to pick through people who walk out automatically if all they see a bike, or they don't look, and think it a grievous violation. Getting abreast of multi-lanes of car traffic is about safety, so I can't wait for the pedestrian light laggards. That said taxis and the like don't have some right aggressively blow horns at someone crossing when the light changes. My right of way lasts until I complete crossing. I made sure that the last taxi driver who did that know that I'd a severe problem with that. Can't abide anyone who tries to menace, threaten.

magicbastarder

an interesting perspective from the RSA (the original tweet being responded to was lamenting that drivers' point of view was not represented in the program last night):

https://twitter.com/RSAIreland/status/1097606970146725890

mr spuckler

yep, the tone of their engagement on Twitter last night shows a massive change from just a couple of months ago. long may it last.

Hurrache

They're even responding similarly on Facebook. Let's hope it is a new direction and not PR that ends once the TV series runs its course.

Borderfox

magicbastarder wrote: »

an interesting perspective from the RSA (the original tweet being responded to was lamenting that drivers' point of view was not represented in the program last night):

https://twitter.com/RSAIreland/status/1097606970146725890

The "advanced driver" Bob was like a dog with a bone last night, shocking attitude from a supposedly better trained motorist

Thinkingaboutit

Borderfox wrote: »

The "advanced driver" Bob was like a dog with a bone last night, shocking attitude from a supposedly better trained motorist

When I read 'advanced driver' I see in my mind's eye, this or that Autocar columnist or letter writer of yore lamenting that a skilful driver like the writer penalised for driving near to 90 mph on a motorway, ie an over-aggressive driver with an unlimited sense of entitlement.

Duckjob

mr spuckler wrote: »

yep, the tone of their engagement on Twitter last night shows a massive change from just a couple of months ago. long may it last.

Perhaps more than a touch of guilt and embarrassment over the RSA expert / busy bee nonsense.

magicbastarder

'advanced driver' = 'owns an MG and a pair of leather driving gloves, thinks power steering is a terrible thing because it ruins the true driving experience'.

ednwireland

the biggest problem cycling round donegal is car drivers thinking that its ok to squeeze past on a narrow road without slowing down first.
i would cycle around there often if people knocked a bit of speed off it would be fine.

but had a driver on sunday was blown out onto the road on a narrow road so a driver thought ot was ok to toot there horn at me to get out of the way rather than just waiting until i sorted myself out, heard her and got out of the way , my language wasnt sunday morning appropriate i can tell you.

07Lapierre

I was disappointed that the family in Donegal didn’t highlight the fact that although they were wearin Hi viz Jackets and helmets, they still experienced close passes, or “the squeeze” as they called it!

Overall it was a good program and certainly made me very envious of people who cycle in Copenhagen!

07Lapierre

Muahahaha wrote: »

mr spuckler wrote: »

so I don't think there'd have been an issue but who knows?

I think its the 'who knows' bit seems to be part of the problem. In your case the Gardai were willing to prosecute on the basis of video evidence. In others they seem to say there is nothing they can do when presented with same. There doesn't seem to be any legal guidelines on the use of dashcams, helmet cams and their use in court for prosecutions as yet. There was a time years back when CCTV wasn't allowed to be used in courts but thats all changed now. Dash & helmet cams seem to be in that legal space right now that CCTV once was.

It's oft said that the Gardai can't be on every street corner. But when you think about the thousands of people using dash & helmet cams they have the potential to be a very powerful policing tool. They can literally increase the ability of AGS to detect road traffic offences several thousand fold. Its a no brainer to use them imo.

That’s an interesting point. If CCTV footage is admissible in court, why isn’t dash cam footage given the same status?

magicbastarder

maybe it's something to do with the fact that to install/maintain CCTV, you need a licence - perhaps CCTV footage from a licenced system carries more credibility than a dashcam?

07Lapierre

Fighting Tao wrote: »

at1withmyself wrote: »

Not sure of the total number but a neighbor passed away from a bicycle malfunction so that's at least one.

I give up though, I thought it was good and if people are going to find fault with doing a safety check for 30 seconds then so be it....

Ah. The old if it saves one life. Let’s ban everything to save one life.

People who look after their bikes will continues to do so. On the flip side, people who don’t are very unlikely to start because some RSA person said to do it.

We had a kid turn up for a club spin (accompanied by his dad) and his front brake had no brake pads fitted!

Experienced cyclists will check their bikes but even a quick scan of this cycling forum and you’ll see examples of bikes very poorly maintained.

magicbastarder

07Lapierre wrote: »

We had a kid turn up for a club spin (accompanied by his dad) and his front drake had no brake pads fitted!

a drake applying brakes properly:

mr spuckler

magicbastarder wrote: »

maybe it's something to do with the fact that to install/maintain CCTV, you need a licence - perhaps CCTV footage from a licenced system carries more credibility than a dashcam?

I don't know - it seems extremely inconsistent in that the Gardaí ask for dashcam footage after collisions, armed robberies etc yet claim that they couldn't trust bike camera footage because it might be edited. then they turn around and accept mine with no questions asked!

I think if you make a sworn statement saying that the video evidence submitted is unedited then they'd be accusing you of falsifying evidence or contempt of court if they suggested it might have been tampered with...that's a pretty rocky path to go down!

zell12

Liveline callers criticising RSA ads on motorist road deaths, now
apparently too graphic

CramCycle

zell12 wrote: »

Liveline callers criticising RSA ads on motorist road deaths, now
apparently too graphic

I actually thought it was a great ad and only graphic in how it brought the point home. The father who lost his wife and child, christ of almighty that packed a punch to the gut but like everything, i doubt it made one iota of difference to a poor drivers behaviour.

Cetyl Palmitate

https://castbox.fm/vb/129372650

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1jCg3Ma8NckFE4HnKsR2Mz?si=hCMWCNgcSFykU-TPqi019Q

Interesting podcast on the history of infrastructure funding.
It contains some interesting details on the powerful US cycling lobby of the 19th century, the league of American wheelmen, being overtaken by the motorcar lobby of the early 20th century.
Also contains a history of policy making differences in post war Europe and USA.

zell12

RSA CEO Moya Murdock currently live on Liveline

Fian

zell12 wrote: »

RSA CEO Moya Murdock currently live on Liveline

And what did she say?

Muahahaha

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Possibly the word "audit" creates that impression, whereas if she had said "Look will ya check that your brakes are working and your trouser leg isn't going to catch in your chain" it might have been less of a big deal.

I think its just the usual 'elf and safety gone overboard. Its similar with motorbiking, anyone gone through the biking tests will remember learning the acronym Powder BC which is an eight point check of petrol, oil, water, damage, electrics, rubber, brakes and cables that you are told to do every time before you get on the motorbike. I seriously doubt anyone actually does it but you have to know it to pass the test.

Anyway I thought the program last night was decent enough. Also I was surprised to learn that it is not just a one off feature as I thought but its actually a series of four programs. That's a fair undertaking by RTE on the subject of cycling/vulnerable road users, they are giving it the attention it needs so kudos where its deserved. Hopefully over the four programs it will finally provide some balance to the way the likes of Newstalk cover cycling knowing well their audience is all motorists stuck in evening traffic.

Corca Baiscinn

07Lapierre wrote: »

Overall it was a good program and certainly made me very envious of people who cycle in Copenhagen!

Yea, by end of Programme 4 we'll all have decamped to Copenhagen, Seville, Eindhoven and Amsterdam but sure with only a quarter of us in each city, we can sneak in and they wont really notice!