ASTI OctNov Action *Post 1 for usual plea for restraint Especially New Posters *

judeboy101

feardeas wrote: »

Possibly, yes. However there will need to be at least the progress the other unions got with lpt along with clear unambiguous language that the government intends to have full equalisation in a reasonable timeframe.

Averting closure on Monday is the primary aim of the government I'd say and would be good pr for ASTI. I just think it will mean CP hours etc. The dept need to make it clear to JMB that the 8 up to 10 hours will be flexible.

I believe that the dept want it done. The talks to succeed LRA will possibly be brought forward but I think when this is over the stomach for prolonged industrial action may be weakened.

In my mind damage has been done. In every BOM that has decided to lock teachers out the parents reps have sided with the jmb . staff will ever forget that their own employer was willing to lock the gates and that the parents of every student supported in through their reps.

feardeas

Daisy 55 wrote:

Doubt if JC is being discussed at all.

It was yesterday morning. I imagine it may be part of a comprehensive settlement.

As an English teacher I have to say I hope it's in the mix, way beyond a laughing matter at this stage.

political analyst

seavill wrote: »

This is the second time you posted this comment but everyone ignored it the first time.

How exactly would we have known that it was dependant on acceptance of LRA. LRA did not exist two or three years ago when we signed up to this agreement.
Our agreement was do S&S for the length of HRA and get two payments for this in 2017 and 2018.
Where was it written that we had to agree to another agreement?

Which parts of LRA do we guess are dependant on another agreement in 2 years time? Can you tel us this or do we just guess? Which deals that the government tell us are we supposed to believe and which ones do we guess are linked to something else that doesn't yet exist that may or may not happen in two years time?

Your bull sh1t is really annoying at times.

If we went back to the sign up to HRA and were writing here that the government can't be trusted and they won't follow through on what they promise you would be the first one on here criticising us.

How about you make some meaningful comtribution to the thread rather than just constantly throwing out stupid questions to try wind people up.
I would estimate that 80% of your posts are just questions to wind people up.

Not at all. I was only playing devil's advocate. The way it's understood is that one public-sector pay agreement is a continuation of the previous one.

seavill

judeboy101 wrote: »

feardeas wrote: »

Possibly, yes. However there will need to be at least the progress the other unions got with lpt along with clear unambiguous language that the government intends to have full equalisation in a reasonable timeframe.

Averting closure on Monday is the primary aim of the government I'd say and would be good pr for ASTI. I just think it will mean CP hours etc. The dept need to make it clear to JMB that the 8 up to 10 hours will be flexible.

I believe that the dept want it done. The talks to succeed LRA will possibly be brought forward but I think when this is over the stomach for prolonged industrial action may be weakened.

In my mind damage has been done. In every BOM that has decided to lock teachers out the parents reps have sided with the jmb . staff will ever forget that their own employer was willing to lock the gates and that the parents of every student supported in through their reps.

No one knows what way decisions went at BOMs. Some may have come down to a vote with parents or teachers voting against a proposal but once a decision has been reached that is the decision of the full board so don't be too quick to blame individuals on boards as you don't know what actually happened behind the scenes

seavill

judeboy101 wrote: »

feardeas wrote: »

Possibly, yes. However there will need to be at least the progress the other unions got with lpt along with clear unambiguous language that the government intends to have full equalisation in a reasonable timeframe.

Averting closure on Monday is the primary aim of the government I'd say and would be good pr for ASTI. I just think it will mean CP hours etc. The dept need to make it clear to JMB that the 8 up to 10 hours will be flexible.

I believe that the dept want it done. The talks to succeed LRA will possibly be brought forward but I think when this is over the stomach for prolonged industrial action may be weakened.

In my mind damage has been done. In every BOM that has decided to lock teachers out the parents reps have sided with the jmb . staff will ever forget that their own employer was willing to lock the gates and that the parents of every student supported in through their reps.

No one knows what way decisions went at BOMs. Some may have come down to a vote with parents or teachers voting against a proposal but once a decision has been reached that is the decision of the full board so don't be too quick to blame individuals on boards as you don't know what actually happened behind the scenes

evolving_doors

km79 wrote: »

What difference would that make ?
Nobody in an Asti school will get paid if the doirs are locked right ?
Asti members will sign attendance form take photos etc
What will non union members do?

I think it makes a big difference if principals are being pitted against teachers because of an unrecognised union... who do/does the JMB take their mandate from?

evolving_doors

Daisy 55 wrote: »

Doubt if JC is being discussed at all.

One more ballot could see the ASTI in LR... Or maybe LR 1.1
Then the dept gets its beloved new (Although copied from England) Junior cert, strikes over, everyone in LR. Assuming Gardai jump in.... That'll be a victory worth aspiring to for any minister / party.

km79

2 days of talks and not a peep?
Something's a foot

political analyst

Gebgbegb wrote: »

I think it makes a big difference if principals are being pitted against teachers because of an unrecognised union... who do/does the JMB take their mandate from?

The JMB is neither a union nor a staff association; it's pretty much a think-tank. It's Irish voluntary secondary school managements' equivalent of the Association of Chief Police Officers in England and Wales.

km79

It's taking a long time to seek legal advice .......

political analyst

Gebgbegb wrote: »

One more ballot could see the ASTI in LR... Or maybe LR 1.1
Then the dept gets its beloved new (Although copied from England) Junior cert, strikes over, everyone in LR. Assuming Gardai jump in.... That'll be a victory worth aspiring to for any minister / party.

The new JC is not going to be like the English system.

The classroom-based assessments in JC English are carried out by teachers directly for the profile of achievement, which will be separate from the State exam. The written description of the assessments will be externally examined.

judeboy101

seavill wrote: »

No one knows what way decisions went at BOMs. Some may have come down to a vote with parents or teachers voting against a proposal but once a decision has been reached that is the decision of the full board so don't be too quick to blame individuals on boards as you don't know what actually happened behind the scenes

If you are in a jmb school you will get a standard issue letter from the bom. Pre printed just like the decision is pre ordained. Usual strawman argument about health and safety, but jmb advice is that h&s ends when school ends so its ok to open school to outside business e.g. Grind schools, gym training, step aerobics etc.

seavill

judeboy101 wrote: »

If you are in a jmb school you will get a standard issue letter from the bom. Pre printed just like the decision is pre ordained. Usual strawman argument about health and safety, but jmb advice is that h&s ends when school ends so its ok to open school to outside business e.g. Grind schools, gym training, step aerobics etc.

You completely missed my point. Just because a parent or teacher sit on a BOM and the decision of the BOM was to close the school hat doesn't mean they agree with it or voted for it. That was all I'm saying

feardeas

km79 wrote:

2 days of talks and not a peep? Something's a foot

Also very convenient that the guards are centre of attention. I'm thinking announcement Friday evening for the nine o clock news. So maybe deal tomorrow .Assume SC are on stand by to meet Friday.

judeboy101

seavill wrote: »

You completely missed my point. Just because a parent or teacher sit on a BOM and the decision of the BOM was to close the school hat doesn't mean they agree with it or voted for it. That was all I'm saying

Fair enough point taken, although in my experience parent reps tend to vote with the chairman's recommendation and I know one or two teacher reps who didn't two the union line

judeboy101

feardeas wrote: »

Also very convenient that the guards are centre of attention. I'm thinking announcement Friday evening for the nine o clock news. So maybe deal tomorrow .Assume SC are on stand by to meet Friday.

SC are planning on meeting Fri afternoon

km79

judeboy101 wrote: »

SC are planning on meeting Fri afternoon

could they leave it any later ! Sunday evening maybe

judeboy101

km79 wrote: »

could they leave it any later ! Sunday evening maybe

Teachers don't work at weekends ��

judeboy101

Did Ingrid Miley call it a lockout just now on 9o'clock news?

deiseindublin

No, she said teachers think they're being locked out.

Is it just me or does anybody else think that IM actually gets off on the strikes? She sounds absolutely delighted with it, no matter how ugly it gets!

2011abc

Well the TC is spending our sub money on employing her colleagues every year now at their Feilte happy clapathon!

judeboy101

<Mod snip >
Ok enough of the name calling.
Back on point.

political analyst

deiseindublin wrote: »

No, she said teachers think they're being locked out.

Is it just me or does anybody else think that IM actually gets off on the strikes? She sounds absolutely delighted with it, no matter how ugly it gets!

Just because she loves her job it doesn't mean that she has schadenfreude.

CWF

BOM in our school have suggested to parents that they keep their kids at home on Monday because for health and safety reasons. School is open for teachers and we're expected to be available for timetabled periods. Do we still get paid? Any students that arrive will be sent home.

Moody_mona

CWF wrote: »

BOM in our school have suggested to parents that they keep their kids at home on Monday because for health and safety reasons. School is open for teachers and we're expected to be available for timetabled periods. Do we still get paid? Any students that arrive will be sent home.

I'm in the same position. Don't think we'll be paid.

CWF

Moody_mona wrote: »

I'm in the same position. Don't think we'll be paid.

It's a tricky one! The DES have to tell us before Monday, why would we be expected to be in if we're not getting paid?!

Moody_mona

I don't think there's anything for the department to clarify. Their circular says of students aren't in teachers who are unavailable to fulfil their s&s duties won't be paid.

I presume we have to go in case of retrospective pay? But that's naive and optimistic of me.

judeboy101

CWF wrote: »

BOM in our school have suggested to parents that they keep their kids at home on Monday because for health and safety reasons. School is open for teachers and we're expected to be available for timetabled periods. Do we still get paid? Any students that arrive will be sent home.

How will they be sent home? Asti directive means you cant get involved in s&s so who will tell them to leave?

CWF

Moody_mona wrote: »

I don't think there's anything for the department to clarify. Their circular says of students aren't in teachers who are unavailable to fulfil their s&s duties won't be paid.

I presume we have to go in case of retrospective pay? But that's naive and optimistic of me.

Ah right I understand. Thanks

CWF

judeboy101 wrote: »

How will they be sent home? Asti directive means you cant get involved in s&s so who will tell them to leave?

The Principal can send them home, she's TUI.