Motorcycle refuelling

listermint

Cienciano wrote: »

Thing is, there's pretty much zero advantage to doing it. So might as well get off the bike

What if its a attendant free credit card only filling location.

I think the advantage speaks volumes.

PrzemoF

Chances * damage = risk, so even with very low chances, but huge damage the risk is still significant. Getting of the bike doesn't change chances, but reduces the damage - you can grab a fire extinguisher, there will be no fuel spill, the fire will be probably contained within seconds if you don't panic.

gerrowadat

PrzemoF wrote: »

Chances * damage = risk, so even with very low chances, but huge damage the risk is still significant. Getting of the bike doesn't change chances, but reduces the damage - you can grab a fire extinguisher, there will be no fuel spill, the fire will be probably contained within seconds if you don't panic.

You don't set yourself on fire bollocks first, that's a big win in my book.

Jimmy Bottlehead

Jesus lads, the stubbornness on this is unreal.

The risk might be low but do you really want to risk burning the giblets off yourself for the sake of sticking it to the man? Most places you've to get off to pay anyways so there's no advantage.

Add to that, if it DOES go tits up you put other people in danger and it just doesn't make sense to do.

Max Headroom

Just in case youre feeling hard done by...We stopped in sandymount early in the morning on the way to the ferry....car full of lads, driver gets out and starts to fill up...pump is stopped and a voice over the tannoy.."Will you please shut your drivers door"....closes the door and pump comes back on...this was last friday..;)

Del2005

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

Jesus lads, the stubbornness on this is unreal.

The risk might be low but do you really want to risk burning the giblets off yourself for the sake of sticking it to the man? Most places you've to get off to pay anyways so there's no advantage.

Add to that, if it DOES go tits up you put other people in danger and it just doesn't make sense to do.

Is it not for the sake of sticking an extra 50ml of fuel into the tank so you can travel 1km more?

Skatedude

The chance of actually a fire while filling up a bike, car or anything is minuscule unless there is a cigarette involved.

But this is the health and safety departments of companies like texaco, esso etc.

gctest50

Skatedude wrote: »

The chance of actually a fire while filling up a bike, car or anything is minuscule unless there is a cigarette involved.
.....

Static will set it off if things are right



Waterproof suit on ? :

Jumper on and get in and out of car a few times :

Cienciano

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

Jesus lads, the stubbornness on this is unreal.

It's what the internet is all about. Arguing about absolute shíte. Imagine even having a conversation about this in real life, never mind a heated debate!

Skatedude

Cienciano wrote: »

It's what the internet is all about. Arguing about absolute shíte. Imagine even having a conversation about this in real life, never mind a heated debate!

So the current debate is?

I'm straddling my motorcycle and It's intimidating the staff and they think I'm gonna ride off without paying?

I'm wearing way to much woollen products and I'm gonna blow up the petrol station with sparks?

I'm quite comfortable on my bike and don't wish to get off?


Note! this is just a summery and no way a admission of belief of one person or persons may be right or may be wrong, er, I think

hobochris

I think it was only last year one of the traffic core bikes went up in flames while fueling up down the country somewhere.


I would rather not risk it personally, I normally start the bike before I get on it also as a precaution after fueling.

I'd rather be running for an extinguisher then rolling on the floor hoping someone will put me out.

Del2005

Cienciano wrote: »

It's what the internet is all about. Arguing about absolute shíte. Imagine even having a conversation about this in real life, never mind a heated debate!

I'm sure it's been discussed at depth in a pub or early in the morning at a house party!!

Skatedude wrote: »

I'm wearing way to much woollen products and I'm gonna blow up the petrol station with sparks?

Static is produced by the bike moving doesn't matter what the rider is wearing.

Max Headroom

I remember this a few years back.....Loks like the bike was just dropped...maybe it was the OP...:)


http://www.broadsheet.ie/2013/07/07/meanwhile-in-goatstown/

cadete

Doesn't the filling hose contain an earth which grounds the vehicle on contact? Hence no static? I'm pretty sure this is the case but could very well be wrong

Lumen

cadete wrote: »

Doesn't the filling hose contain an earth which grounds the vehicle on contact? Hence no static? I'm pretty sure this is the case but could very well be wrong

That sounds like a design which would cause a spark exactly where and when you don't want one.

PrzemoF

The whole thing is a bit more complicated as flowing non conductive fluid (petrol) can cause static build up, so you want to have electrical connection between the car/bike ant the pump while refilling. Static is supposed to be discharged before starting the operation:

cadete

Lumen wrote: »

That sounds like a design which would cause a spark exactly where and when you don't want one.

Quick Google suggests the hose is grounded and that is bonded with the car through the filler door, it appears that the spark is usually caused by the person being statically charged and causing the spark, now a bike is a different but I would think that by taking off your gloves and filling with one hand on a metal part or the bike you should be fine

Del2005

cadete wrote: »

Quick Google suggests the hose is grounded and that is bonded with the car through the filler door, it appears that the spark is usually caused by the person being statically charged and causing the spark, now a bike is a different but I would think that by taking off your gloves and filling with one hand on a metal part or the bike you should be fine

The bike isn't earthed unless the stand is down, rubber tyres and soles on boots are insulators.

GBX

Del2005 wrote: »

The bike isn't earthed unless the stand is down, rubber tyres and soles on boots are insulators.

Even in cold weather I've always removed gloves. I guess that's something. But I've seen lads with an extra plate(?) added to the end of their stand which to me looked rubber. Wouldn't help earth so ?

Lumen

Del2005 wrote: »

The bike isn't earthed unless the stand is down, rubber tyres and soles on boots are insulators.

OK, but I think petrol hoses (the bit going to the pump) are grounded by design.

If you have two grounded things you can't get a static discharge.

So putting the kickstand down whilst sitting on the bike would eliminate the chances of static discharge ignition. In any case I'm not convinced that car tyres are insulators, I think it's a myth.

http://machinedesign.com/blog/6-dangerous-myths-about-electrical-safety

And also from Excel Preliminary Physics:



If these two things are true then static discharge between fuelling hose and bike ought to be impossible. Maybe there is MORE risk of static discharge from the standing rider to the hose or bike, in which case it would be safer to refuel sitting on the bike while safely grounded.

Hotblack Desiato

Tyres contain a decent percentage of carbon black which is conductive, before this was introduced in the 1920s or so tyres were light grey (I read somewhere. I'm not that old.) That said, I haven't tested the resistance of my bike to earth

Plenty of aircraft have blown up / burnt out due to failure to connect the earthing wire before refuelling. Most of them use kerosene which is a lot harder to ignite than petrol!

Static is definitely an issue to be concerned about in hot/dry atmospheres i.e. not Ireland usually. In the US they have pumps which you can leave on automatically and static fires appear to occur in dry atmospheres where the driver has left the pump on and then got back into the car/opened or closed the door. Incidentally that knocks the earthed pump hose theory on the head, at least in the US, because if the hose was earthed it wouldn't matter what you did while pumping, and any fires would occur on insertion :eek:

Anyway it'd be the chemical burn from spilling petrol on my crotch I'd be most concerned about - given the shape of most bike tanks it's obvous where any spillage is going to go. If you really, really need to get the last drop in (inadvisable, unless you're going to burn it off before it can vent off) then dismount, put the sidestand down, bike in gear and push backwards on the left handlebar to raise the bike towards vertical, while refuelling with your right. Still more risk of spilling it and if you panic and let the bike roll forwards it can come off the sidestand and you're back to square one... :pac:

Hotblack Desiato

Max Headroom wrote: »

I remember this a few years back.....Loks like the bike was just dropped...maybe it was the OP...:)


http://www.broadsheet.ie/2013/07/07/meanwhile-in-goatstown/

Was that KTRIC or whatever he's called now

ted1

cadete wrote: »

Doesn't the filling hose contain an earth which grounds the vehicle on contact? Hence no static? I'm pretty sure this is the case but could very well be wrong

That could cause a spark as the energy jumps from the bike to ground. Exactly the same way lightening works

cadete

ted1 wrote: »

That could cause a spark as the energy jumps from the bike to ground. Exactly the same way lightening works

The nozzle is used to bond the car to the pump and there is a wire mesh in the hose which is grounded on the pump side,
Here seems to be some good information on the issue,
http://www.nacsonline.com/Research/FactSheets/Motor%20Fuels/Pages/GasolineMythsFacts.aspx