Coffee Bargains

phelixoflaherty

I only use the red Lavazza for cappuccinos.

1kg of red lavazza beans now on sale for 12 euro in Dunnes Stores

Bargain_Hound

Any use for €35?

http://www.lidl.ie/en/Offers.htm?action=showDetail&id=53999#

jive

Bargain_Hound wrote: »

Any use for €35?

http://www.lidl.ie/en/Offers.htm?action=showDetail&id=53999#

I would stick with aero press / French press / filter than a cheap espresso machine. It'll be extremely difficult to get a good shot and it'll be extremely inconsistent.

Save up and get a decent entry level model espresso machine second hand would be my recommendation if it's espresso that you want!

cnocbui

jive wrote: »

I would stick with aero press / French press / filter than a cheap espresso machine. It'll be extremely difficult to get a good shot and it'll be extremely inconsistent.

Save up and get a decent entry level model espresso machine second hand would be my recommendation if it's espresso that you want!

In my experience, given I have a cheap Aldi espresso machine and decades experience using many french presses, you will get far better coffee out of such a machine than out of a french press. If you want inconsistent, then a manual process chain, as with a french press, is a sure way to get that.

As for properly cleaning a french press - life is too short. Getting anything like a hot enough cup out of a french press is only possible for elite graduates of Hogwarts and requires prodigious amounts of hot water and energy.

A good deal of time spent hunting for expensive coffee machines on eBay can be disappointingly instructive. After a while, you might notice some annoying listings for spare parts for your expensive prey getting in the way. Clicking on these listings can prove a mistake, if you were suffering under the impression you get what you pay for with expensive coffee machines, as you will find that the expensive parts for that Jura - masterpiece of Swiss engineering - you were coveting, will also fit innumerable machines from what you thought were vastly inferior manufacturers, leading to the obvious conclusion they are all made in the same factory. The cheek!

So I would say that cheap machine from Lidl will probably give you far better coffee than you are getting now, once you get the hang of it.

jive

cnocbui wrote: »

In my experience, given I have a cheap Aldi espresso machine and decades experience using many french presses, you will get far better coffee out of such a machine than out of a french press. If you want inconsistent, then a manual process chain, as with a french press, is a sure way to get that.

As for properly cleaning a french press - life is too short. Getting anything like a hot enough cup out of a french press is only possible for elite graduates of Hogwarts and requires prodigious amounts of hot water and energy.

A good deal of time spent hunting for expensive coffee machines on eBay can be disappointingly instructive. After a while, you might notice some annoying listings for spare parts for your expensive prey getting in the way. Clicking on these listings can prove a mistake, if you were suffering under the impression you get what you pay for with expensive coffee machines, as you will find that the expensive parts for that Jura - masterpiece of Swiss engineering - you were coveting, will also fit innumerable machines from what you thought were vastly inferior manufacturers, leading to the obvious conclusion they are all made in the same factory. The cheek!

So I would say that cheap machine from Lidl will probably give you far better coffee than you are getting now, once you get the hang of it.

I have to disagree with you on this. I have a Rancilio Silvia with a PID, so a decent home set-up, and I still whack out the French press and Hario V60. In fact I probably make 80% of my coffee with a V60. The Silvia is a good machine but to get nice espresso you have to wait 20 mins for it to heat up and clean it regularly (same for all espresso machines) which is a bit of hassle as I'm a lazy git.

French press couldn't be any easier or more convenient really. You pour your coffee into the cup and fire everything else down the sink, rinse out with some water right after emptying and you are done.

If it is crema you are after then obviously go with an espresso machine but low-end machines will not make good espresso - acceptable yes but not good. There is way more that you can get wrong with making espresso than with french press, espresso is by far the most difficult way for making coffee at home.

adrian522

cnocbui wrote: »

In my experience, given I have a cheap Aldi espresso machine and decades experience using many french presses, you will get far better coffee out of such a machine than out of a french press. If you want inconsistent, then a manual process chain, as with a french press, is a sure way to get that.

As for properly cleaning a french press - life is too short. Getting anything like a hot enough cup out of a french press is only possible for elite graduates of Hogwarts and requires prodigious amounts of hot water and energy.

A good deal of time spent hunting for expensive coffee machines on eBay can be disappointingly instructive. After a while, you might notice some annoying listings for spare parts for your expensive prey getting in the way. Clicking on these listings can prove a mistake, if you were suffering under the impression you get what you pay for with expensive coffee machines, as you will find that the expensive parts for that Jura - masterpiece of Swiss engineering - you were coveting, will also fit innumerable machines from what you thought were vastly inferior manufacturers, leading to the obvious conclusion they are all made in the same factory. The cheek!

So I would say that cheap machine from Lidl will probably give you far better coffee than you are getting now, once you get the hang of it.

I'd disagree with most of what you say here. If cleaning is a problem then I'd switch the FP for an Aeropress.

If you have a decent Grinder, even a good hand grinder the manual brew methods will be very consistent and certainly more consistent than an entry level espresso machine.

flangemeistro

Bean to cup is your only man. No messing with grind fineness just select your strength, cup size, temperature and push a button.

I have a Krups one at home and a Panasonic one In work and I've tried French press, your cheapo lidl/Aldi espresso machines, V60, Tassimo, mocha pots, drip filter, Nespresso and expensive delonghi manual espresso machines and I eventually just paid the money for a bean to cup and I realised all the rest are false economy,

I know you'll get the snobs on here saying you'll never master a perfect espresso shot with a BTC but I've tried perfection with my €230 grinder alongside a manual machine, V60 and French press and I'll take the convenience an consistency of a BTC any day over faffing with grind finesse.

I don't have the time, patience, curly moustache or piercings to put up with that bull.

And for anyone saying you get a totally different experience from a V60 than an espresso and they shouldn't be compared I 100% agree,
I'm just back from a short break in Galway where I couldn't wait to visit the Badger & Dodo cafe as they are my go to beans but Christ was I disappointed when I ordered a V60 and herself got a latte and my V60 brew was like dishwater and her latte was more flavoursome.

cnocbui

jive wrote: »

I have to disagree with you on this. I have a Rancilio Silvia with a PID, so a decent home set-up, and I still whack out the French press and Hario V60. In fact I probably make 80% of my coffee with a V60. The Silvia is a good machine but to get nice espresso you have to wait 20 mins for it to heat up and clean it regularly (same for all espresso machines) which is a bit of hassle as I'm a lazy git.

French press couldn't be any easier or more convenient really. You pour your coffee into the cup and fire everything else down the sink, rinse out with some water right after emptying and you are done.

If it is crema you are after then obviously go with an espresso machine but low-end machines will not make good espresso - acceptable yes but not good. There is way more that you can get wrong with making espresso than with french press, espresso is by far the most difficult way for making coffee at home.

While your 'decent' Silvia takes 20 minutes to get going, my cheap SilverCrest takes 40 seconds to heat up.

The french press method could be easier; a lot easier, actually:

Boil 500 ml of water (takes minutes even with a 3.2 KW kettle)
Pour boiled water into FP and assemble to pre-heat all that heat-sapping metal.
Pour boiled water into cup to heat that also.
Wait another minute for the glass and metal of the FP to heat up.

Pour water out of the FP, and being as quick as possible due to rapid heat loss, remove plunger, put ground coffee in, and pour the hopefully 95° C water over the coffee grounds and then re-insert the plunger.

While waiting the recommended 4 MINUTES! till plunging and pouring, tip the water out of the cup and refill with more hot water, preferably re boiling it first.
After the 4 minutes, plunge slowly, pour hot water from cup and fill cup with coffee from the FP.

When the FP has cooled, try and empty as much of the coffee grounds into the compost bin as possible because you aren't connected to a sewerage system someone else pays for the maintenance of. Then rinse out the FP and after every 2 or 3 uses (once a day), place all parts in a dishwasher or fill with warm water and add bleach, because washing up detergent just doesn't seem to shift those coffee oils, only bleach or a DW will do the trick. Then rinse several times with warm water.

From go to coffee in about 8-10 minutes, about 3 times as long and 4 times as much stuffing about as a a cheap Aldi/Lidl Espresso machine - if you like cappucinos, Americanos and the ilk. If like me, you like double shot espressos, you are just so out of luck at the outset so might as well not bother.

I agree, an expensive espresso machine will probably enable you to make a slightly better cup of coffee than a cheap machine will, but you are easily looking at 8-10 time the expense to achieve that.

I told myself I would move on to a more expensive machine when my cheapie died, which I fully expected to happen within it's 3yr warranty period. I am still waiting for the damn thing to die so I can replace it and be elevated to lofty heights of the cognoscenti.

As someone who has used multiple sizes and varieties of FP for more than 30 years, I am speaking from experience when I give my considered opinion that I get far better coffee from my cheap espresso machine than from those FPs, in a third the time and with a quarter the effort.

cnocbui

adrian522 wrote: »

I'd disagree with most of what you say here. If cleaning is a problem then I'd switch the FP for an Aeropress.

If you have a decent Grinder, even a good hand grinder the manual brew methods will be very consistent and certainly more consistent than an entry level espresso machine.

Using the dictionary meaning of 'consitent', which means in this instance, achieving accurately repeatable results, I would be intrigued as to why you think a manual method would be more 'consistent' than an espresso machine based work flow where you perform exactly the same sequence of operations, every time?

dball

heres a coffee bargain ( well maybe not a bargain )


every little helps

jive

cnocbui wrote: »

While your 'decent' Silvia takes 20 minutes to get going, my cheap SilverCrest takes 40 seconds to heat up.

No espresso in the world will be good after taking only 40 seconds to heat up all the elements. Essentially an espresso machine is a glorified boiler but there's more to it than that. I've had cheap machines in the past and it's just not comparable to any decent entry-level proper espresso machine.

A Nespresso machine will give you espresso in <1 minute and it's fine, but it's nowhere near as good as a decent espresso machine nor are any of the machines on offer in Lidl/Aldi. Each to their own but i disagree with you 100%, Nespresso > Bean to Cup > French press/Aeropress > V60 > espresso machine in terms of 'ease of use' at home and also in terms of achieving consistency.

In my opinion, cheapo espresso machines are a waste of money. You'll never get consistently good coffee so you may as well save up for a more expensive machine or go for one of the many cheaper and just as good alternatives (namely French Press / Aeropress / V60).

Anyway, this isn't the thread really for a discussion on this. Different people have different tastes and all that!

adrian522

cnocbui wrote: »

Using the dictionary meaning of 'consitent', which means in this instance, achieving accurately repeatable results, I would be intrigued as to why you think a manual method would be more 'consistent' than an espresso machine based work flow where you perform exactly the same sequence of operations, every time?

Just experience. With an espresso machine like a Silvia I found the temperature of the output to be fairly inconsistent and as a result the final product would vary greatly. Unless I was going to invest in a PID that was not going to change.

The main problem with the espresso machines is the temperature stability which is just not accurate enough to be honest.

I've never gotten to a stage where I was getting easily repeatable, quality shots time after time. The range of tempreture was just too great.

Also in terms of cleaning, there is alot more work in cleaning an espresso machine than there is in cleaning a french press or aeropress.

Using a V60 or an aeropress I can heat water to 95 and work away and the final brew was pretty much spot on every time with the only variable really being the fineness of the grind, which didn't need as much adjusting as it does with an espresso machine as the manual brew methods are a bit more forgiving in that regard.

But I guess each to their own, if you think the results from a machine that takes just 40 seconds to heat up are acceptable then certainly that is the best method for you to use.

cnocbui

adrian522 wrote: »

Just experience. With an espresso machine like a Silvia I found the temperature of the output to be fairly inconsistent and as a result the final product would vary greatly. Unless I was going to invest in a PID that was not going to change.

The main problem with the espresso machines is the temperature stability which is just not accurate enough to be honest.

I've never gotten to a stage where I was getting easily repeatable, quality shots time after time. The range of tempreture was just too great.

Also in terms of cleaning, there is alot more work in cleaning an espresso machine than there is in cleaning a french press or aeropress.

Using a V60 or an aeropress I can heat water to 95 and work away and the final brew was pretty much spot on every time with the only variable really being the fineness of the grind, which didn't need as much adjusting as it does with an espresso machine as the manual brew methods are a bit more forgiving in that regard.

But I guess each to their own, if you think the results from a machine that takes just 40 seconds to heat up are acceptable then certainly that is the best method for you to use.

I think you might be in the wrong thread. The cost no option for coffee thread is somewhere else. At 6,570 double espressos from a machine that cost €60, I think I might just be in the right place.

Given that I didn't spend over €700 for an espresso machine that takes so long to heat up I don't use it, I'm amused at your attempt to leverage a snide put-down about how short a time mine takes to heat.

adrian522

You asked me a question and I answered it. You've come on here and you've been pretty insulting to everyone who has disagreed with you. As I said each to their own, if you are happy with the consistency you are getting from your €60 machine then by all means carry on.

I and others are just saying that in general you will get a great quality, hugely consistent product from manual brew methods and in general that will be a more cost effective way to a great coffee.

Again this is just my opinion, you don't have to agree with it but it is based on many years of experience of using a variety of different methods.

jive

cnocbui wrote: »

Given that I didn't spend over €700 for an espresso machine that takes so long to heat up I don't use it, I'm amused at your attempt to leverage a snide put-down about how short a time mine takes to heat.

For the record I got a Rancilio Silvia + Gaggia MDF grinder for €70 (total, for both) on DoneDeal last year, hence my recommendation to look for second hand machines. You can pick-up a Gaggia Classic which can last a lifetime and is infinitely better quality than the Lidl/Aldi machines for not much more money.

I'll also say for espresso the grinder is as or more important than the machine. If you're €35 machine is great, wonderful, but you'll need another €200 to get a good grinder, a hand grinder won't cut it. Going by every other brewing method the grinder does not matter as much, hence anyone just dipping their toe into brewing good coffee at home should go for another brew method to espresso machines.

I don't see why you're getting so snide about people having a differing opinion

magentis

Sorry!

I thought this was the coffee bargains thread,must be mistaken.

cnocbui

jive wrote: »

For the record I got a Rancilio Silvia + Gaggia MDF grinder for €70 (total, for both) on DoneDeal last year, hence my recommendation to look for second hand machines. You can pick-up a Gaggia Classic which can last a lifetime and is infinitely better quality than the Lidl/Aldi machines for not much more money.

I'll also say for espresso the grinder is as or more important than the machine. If you're €35 machine is great, wonderful, but you'll need another €200 to get a good grinder, a hand grinder won't cut it. Going by every other brewing method the grinder does not matter as much, hence anyone just dipping their toe into brewing good coffee at home should go for another brew method to espresso machines.

I don't see why you're getting so snide about people having a differing opinion

I could say the same. Perhaps it could be the air of superiority with the absolutist pronouncements.

Thanks for the advice about getting a good grinder, I just knew there had to be a better way than grinding bags of beans with my teeth these past 30+ years.

All My Stars Aligned

Unless you enjoy the taste of **** espresso, as cnocbui obviously does do NOT buy an espresso machine for €35. Honestly, the starting point for a semi manual espresso is probably the Gaggia Classic, around 300 (I think).

Glebee

cnocbui wrote: »

I could say the same. Perhaps it could be the air of superiority with the absolutist pronouncements.

Thanks for the advice about getting a good grinder, I just knew there had to be a better way than grinding bags of beans with my teeth these past 30+ years.

They look delish, almost like two glasses of stout.

cnocbui

It's probably just an optical illusion as that is exactly the same machine I am using. It didn't cost €300 and up so it can't possibly be any good. I mean, if you think about it, there are just so many intricate variables involved in heating water to 90-95 and then pushing it through some finely ground coffee, you would have to be a fool not to appreciate the highly complex engineering and chemistry involved.

Mr Magnolia

Yeah, bean age, dosed volume, grind size, water temperature, water pressure, water volume, extraction time. No variables there at all practicly.

Belt away with the cheap/basic machines if you're getting coffee you're happy with. I genuinely mean that. Dont get upset when other people point out there are better options though. And there are better options.

cnocbui

Mr Magnolia wrote: »

Yeah, bean age, dosed volume, grind size, water temperature, water pressure, water volume, extraction time. No variables there at all practicly.

Belt away with the cheap/basic machines if you're getting coffee you're happy with. I genuinely mean that. Dont get upset when other people point out there are better options though. And there are better options.

I am happy with it. I never said there weren't better options, just that IMO, these cheap machines can yield a better result than I have experienced from a french press. This thread was supposed to be about bargains, and yet it's been hijacked by coffee snobs banging on about the virtues of €250 grinders and €700+ espresso machines. The thing I find quite interesting is that not one person expressing a negative opinion of these machines has actually used one, yet I have. So baseless opinion based on belief, trumps real experience. This is Ireland, so I shouldn't be surprised

In the better options category, apparently we should all be using cheap Nespresso machines:

In the UK, more than 15 Michelin-starred restaurants use Nespresso, the market-leading capsule system, to make their coffee — including Heston Blumenthal’s Fat Duck in Berkshire, and The Ledbury in London. In France, Nespresso supplies more than 100 Michelin restaurants, including the legendary L’Arpège in Paris. Even in Italy, where the first espresso machine was patented in 1884, more than 20 Michelin restaurants use the new capsule system

Weepsie

They're using those machines as it's quick and convenient to do so. People are there for the food and wine before any after dinner coffee

cnocbui

Weepsie wrote: »

They're using those machines as it's quick and convenient to do so. People are there for the food and wine before any after dinner coffee

No, according to the article it's because of the taste: https://aeon.co/essays/is-nothing-sacred-any-more-the-death-of-artisan-coffee

Mr Magnolia

cnocbui wrote: »

I am happy with it. I never said there weren't better options, just that IMO, these cheap machines can yield a better result than I have experienced from a french press.

You're comparing apples and oranges.

The thing I find quite interesting is that not one person expressing a negative opinion of these machines has actually used one, yet I have.

I've used them in hotels, they're grand. I haven't said otherwise. I've eaten in Michelin stared restaurants before these machines and the coffee was generally deplorable. A real let down after a good meal. It takes time and money to train staff in the ways of a barista, anywhere I've eaten didn't bother and used awful coffee to boot. Just because top restaurants are using them doesn't mean they're the best available option.

This thread was supposed to be about bargains....

Agreed, lets get back on topic please.

adrian522

I feel a need to post this regularly but Nicks "Sweet Espresso" beans from the shop in Ranelagh is great value @ €5.50 with a free small coffee thrown in.

Slaphead07

adrian522 wrote: »

I feel a need to post this regularly but Nicks "Sweet Espresso" beans from the shop in Ranelagh is great value @ €5.50 with a free small coffee thrown in.

Absolutely 100% agree.... I may occasionally stray if I see an "interesting" bag of beans or I think I'm getting a bargain elsewhere but I always come back to Nick's. Superb consistent espresso beans at a very fair price. My staple.

caviardreams

Taken from the Bell Lane FB page:

www.belllane.ie. Just us the coupon code FIVE17, offer expires 31/08/2017."

NATLOR

Rave coffee giving 20% off for new customers if you sign up to their newsletter and free UK (use PM/PW etc) delivery if spending over £25.Decent enough selection,ordered 5 250g bags came in at just over 30 euro including PW cost

https://ravecoffee.co.uk/

caviardreams

NATLOR wrote: »

Rave coffee giving 20% off for new customers if you sign up to their newsletter and free UK (use PM/PW etc) delivery if spending over £25.Decent enough selection,ordered 5 250g bags came in at just over 30 euro including PW cost

https://ravecoffee.co.uk/

Let us know which blends you would recommend when they arrive - tempted to avail of that offer myself!