2018 Ryder Cup

Niles Crane

Pdoghue wrote: »

The contest is a bit of a strange dynamic now. I personally think it's a bit OTT. The Europeans, McGinley, et al. take it so seriously, and prepare so assiduously for it, but really it's only an exhibition at the end of the day. One of the reasons it became so big in the 80s was the rise of the golden generation of Euro golfers: Seve, Langer, Faldo, et al. and the cult of Seve in particular who felt the need to put it up to the Americans. It became competitive after '79 when continental Europe came on board. Back then most of the European team played on the European Tour. Now, as someone said above, a lot of these European players play on the PGA tour, live in the US and are chummy with the US players. So I don't really get why they get so up for it. I suppose the rise of Sky has a lot to do with it. And the European Tour's dependence on the Ryder Cup for a lot of its revenue. And or course the Sky deal with the European Tour plays into that, now extended to 2022.

I imagine it's essentially some degree of inferiority complex european golfers have compared to their American counterparts.Also several players have built careers based on the Ryder Cup if Ian Poulter, Montgomerie didn't have their Ryder Cup records their careers wouldn't have been hugely memorable (in spite of both having excellent careers).Paul McGinley had barely anything in his career apart from his Ryder Cup exploits (of which he'll never let us forget about ) .Also it's hard not to get up for it when you see the support and the way the fans get up for it.

When they showed the Sunday Papers on Match of Day last night I noticed on the 3 back pages they showed that the Ryder Cup feature heavily on the back pages.The amount of media coverage the Ryder Cup gets for golf and the way it draws in people who aren't really golf fans shows how massive an event it is it's probably bigger than the 4 majors for getting media coverage.

Joe_ Public

Niles Crane wrote: »

I imagine it's essentially some degree of inferiority complex european golfers have compared to their American counterparts.Also several players have built careers based on the Ryder Cup if Ian Poulter, Montgomerie didn't have their Ryder Cup records their careers wouldn't have been hugely memorable (in spite of both having excellent careers).Paul McGinley had barely anything in his career apart from his Ryder Cup exploits (of which he'll never let us forget about ) .Also it's hard not to get up for it when you see the support and the way the fans get up for it.

When they showed the Sunday Papers on Match of Day last night I noticed on the 3 back pages they showed that the Ryder Cup feature heavily on the back pages.The amount of media coverage the Ryder Cup gets for golf and the way it draws in people who aren't really golf fans shows how massive an event it is it's probably bigger than the 4 majors for getting media coverage.

Agree with a lot of that, though slightly harsh on McGinley (Volvo masters and World Cup victories among others) and just not right on Monty who had a great career despite falling short in the majors.

RikkFlair

Paul McGinley and Darren Clarke are on the selection committee for next captain (last 3 captains) so it's surely gonna be Harrington for 2020.

TCM

RikkFlair wrote:

Paul McGinley and Darren Clarke are on the selection committee for next captain (last 3 captains) so it's surely gonna be Harrington for 2020.

Not necessarily so. Clarke tried to put the knife into McGinley near the deadline date for selection - in favour of Montgomery, who wanted a 2nd captaincy. Understandably things were cool between Clarke & McGinley after that. So one never knows

fullstop

Dr Devious wrote: »

I forgot Henryk Stenson and Justin Rose as future shoo ins; both probably have played their last Ryder cups.

The fella who was world #1 this time last week has now played his last Ryder Cup. If you say so...

Dr. Bre

It means more to Europe cos they don’t win majors as much the USA . Surely a whole continent v a country is unfair lol

Niles Crane

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Agree with a lot of that, though slightly harsh on McGinley (Volvo masters and World Cup victories among others) and just not right on Monty who had a great career despite falling short in the majors.

Monty did have an excellent career.Problem is nobody can remember a lot of his non ryder cup successes because he never did it in a major.I doubt many people can remember many of his individual tournament wins just that he did win lots of tournaments. When it comes down to it pretty much every golfer will be remembered for his exploits in majors whether that's fair or not it's the truth.But people will always remember Montgomerie for his Ryder Cup exploits.

MadYaker

Press conference was funny, id say they are on a mad one tonight

Mantis Toboggan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think Michelson said before he wanted to be a playing captain I doubt he will get to achieve that but a shoe in for captain at some point

I'd say if Michelson was captain he'd pick himself as a wildcard.

Joe_ Public

Niles Crane wrote: »

Monty did have an excellent career.Problem is nobody can remember a lot of his non ryder cup successes because he never did it in a major.I doubt many people can remember many of his individual tournament wins just that he did win lots of tournaments. When it comes down to it pretty much every golfer will be remembered for his exploits in majors whether that's fair or not it's the truth.But people will always remember Montgomerie for his Ryder Cup exploits.

Yes majors largely dictate reputation and personally I think that’s how it should be. They are the pinnacle of the game after all. However, when it comes to Montgomerie the first thing that comes to my mind is the 7 (or was it 8) order of merits in a row. That was a remarkable achievement, thoroughly dominating European golf at a time when that really meant something. I guess people might forget what a huge deal that was at the time, so you may be right about it.

Mantis Toboggan

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Yes majors largely dictate reputation and personally I think that’s how it should be. They are the pinnacle of the game after all. However, when it comes to Montgomerie the first thing that comes to my mind is the 7 (or was it 8) order of merits in a row. That was a remarkable achievement, thoroughly dominating European golf at a time when that really meant something. I guess people might forget what a huge deal that was at the time, so you may be right about it.

True, winning majors is a good indication but I'm sure if 3 of the majors were held in Scotland every year he'd have won a half dozen. Think this is something which gets largely overlooked. Same for the Irish players and everyone outside of the US.

Joe_ Public

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

True, winning majors is a good indication but I'm sure if 3 of the majors were held in Scotland every year he'd have won a half dozen. Think this is something which gets largely overlooked. Same for the Irish players and everyone outside of the US.

Yeah pga tour is a monster, personally i’d like if the 4th major was staged on the continent somewhere but just never gonna happen.

Funnily enough though, Monty’s Open record was ordinary enough, the US open style courses were the ones made for him. Ridiculous really he never got the job done, was never a fan but the sh!t he had to contend with from the galleries was appalling.

prawnsambo

I like Brooks Koepka's analysis: "“The Europeans kept making those 10-12 footers for par all week, We ran into a buzzsaw.”

MattressRick

Was there much word about what magical celebrity guest speakers and gimmicks Bjorn used to prepare the team? I remember reading an amount about it when McGinley was captain and he seems to bring his captaincy up quite a bit when he's on non-ryder cup duties (including his current stint on an allianz ad). Feels like Bjorn is more understated?

alan partridge aha

Wouldn't want to be European captain next. USA will walk it as they will ensure course will suit them.

Joe_ Public

alan partridge aha wrote: »

Wouldn't want to be European captain next. USA will walk it as they will ensure course will suit them.

Whistling straits is probably as close to a UK/Ire style links course as you’ll get on the pga tour but I’d guess it will be set up without the kind of rough we saw in France this weekend. Always thought it looked a fairly daunting set-up but was a bit dismayed how the pros took it apart during the 2015 pga.

Spideog Rua

alan partridge aha wrote: »

Wouldn't want to be European captain next. USA will walk it as they will ensure course will suit them.

Wonder will next captain will be Harrington or if he'll he screwed over. I'd expect Clarke and Bjorn to pick their mate Westwood over Padraig.

ridonkulous

Spideog Rua wrote: »

Wonder will next captain will be Harrington or if he'll he screwed over. I'd expect Clarke and Bjorn to pick their mate Westwood over Padraig.

I think Padraig will gamble on the 2026 Ryder Cup being held in Adare Manor and not put himself forward for it until then. There is also the chance of the Italian course not being ready for 2022 and Adare have come forward and said that they'd be willing to step in if needed. So I'd say it is either of those he'll go for. In the meantime the lads can pick their mate, it worked for Bjorn this week

RIGOLO

Thank you to all you folks on The Golf forum and Ryder Cup thread for adding to the enjoyment of this win over the last week.

I certainly enjoyed both the Ryder Cup and the company of ye all.
It made a pleasant change from all the angst, dis-respect and general poor behaviour we sadly see so often these days in many other highly paid sporting stars and events..

I found it refreshing. I have to say Im not a major golf nut, I am a big sports fan.
My 2 young boys really got caught up in this Ryder Cup (we have supporters of both teams in the family) and it was a relaxing change to be able let them embrace it all and pick up some of the aspects , the competition, the sportsmanship, the respect, the pride in the jersey, the tension , immense pressure but also the good natured banter and rivalry . I have to say all these positives came across from many of you posters in the thread too.

Pa8301

alan partridge aha wrote: »

Wouldn't want to be European captain next. USA will walk it as they will ensure course will suit them.

That's always the way though. Course is set up in accordance with the home team captain's instructions. Hazeltine was set up to massively favour the U.S. in 2016. The rough was cut way down to suit the bombers on the U.S team. It just underscores how big an achievement it is for teams to win away from home.

LuckyGent88

Nice to finally get a sleep in this morning after an exhausting past fe days. Those early starts were worth it though. What an experience. It’s true you probably don’t get to watch as many golf shots as you would on tv but nothing beats being there to experience the true atmosphere.

Can’t say enough good things about the course. Simply spectacular.

After a disappointing first session, Europe got there act together and really drove on. Molinari being the main man. What a player. Just give him player of the year already. Woods won’t want to see him for awhile.

Delighted to see Rahm and Olesen pick up crucial wins in the singles and mean everyone contributed to the win. Mean a huge amount to them. It really does seem true that the Europeans are just more of the team with all the stuff coming out now from the American side with Reed and Speith.

Already looking forward to whistling straights. We will still have a good chance over there as it’s basically a links and a lot of our players have still played at the course previously. As for the captains, I’d expect Stricker for the US but not sure about Europe. I’d have Westwood in Rome and Harrington in Bethpage due do the Irish connection with New York.

Allez le Bleus

Irishdaywalker

Spideog Rua wrote: »

alan partridge aha wrote: »

Wouldn't want to be European captain next. USA will walk it as they will ensure course will suit them.

Wonder will next captain will be Harrington or if he'll he screwed over.  I'd expect Clarke and Bjorn to pick their mate Westwood over Padraig.

To be fair Clarke & Bjorn both picked Padraig as a vice captain for their stints as captain - I heard an interview with harrington recently stating he wants to be captain soon before he is forgotten about in golfing terms, 2026 would be a long time for him to wait IMO, if he was to get the captaincy I think it will be in 4 years time. He would want to have control of the set up of the course I would say. Westwood possibly has ideas on being on the next Ryder Cup side in the states. . so you could be looking at someone like Paul Lawrie? Jimenez would be another option but he is playing on the seniors tour now so may not get a chance to see first hand potential players like Mcginely, clarke and Bjorn did.

Joe_ Public

Looks like inevitable US recriminations have started with Reed, no surprise there you’d say! Suggests Spieth didn’t want to play with him and that egos got in way of US efforts while his own ego showed in his obvious anger at being benched twice.

All feels like old ground when it comes to this tournament. I suspect too that DJ was sulking a bit because Furyk wouldn’t pair him with Brooks. Only supposition on my part though. I’d add that I do think that was a mistake by Furyk, but at same time it emphasizes the point that Europe had so many more options in terms of pairings. There are no cliques in the team which you simply can’t say of their rivals.

First Up

Europe has won 9 of the last 12 Ryder Cups, including 3 held in the US. So much for the inferiority complex.

prawnsambo

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Looks like inevitable US recriminations have started with Reed, no surprise there you’d say! Suggests Spieth didn’t want to play with him and that egos got in way of US efforts while his own ego showed in his obvious anger at being benched twice.

All feels like old ground when it comes to this tournament. I suspect too that DJ was sulking a bit because Furyk wouldn’t pair him with Brooks. Only supposition on my part though. I’d add that I do think that was a mistake by Furyk, but at same time it emphasizes the point that Europe had so many more options in terms of pairings. There are no cliques in the team which you simply can’t say of their rivals.

Yeah. The irony seems to be lost on Reed.

Joe_ Public

That bit where he says they were asked to list their preferred partners was interesting. I guess Spieth didn’t list Reed among his top two anyway! I wonder if anyone did. I would pay good money to see a list of everyone’s choices, would make for fascinating reading I’m certain.

Russman

Irishdaywalker wrote: »

To be fair Clarke & Bjorn both picked Padraig as a vice captain for their stints as captain - I heard an interview with harrington recently stating he wants to be captain soon before he is forgotten about in golfing terms, 2026 would be a long time for him to wait IMO, if he was to get the captaincy I think it will be in 4 years time. He would want to have control of the set up of the course I would say. Westwood possibly has ideas on being on the next Ryder Cup side in the states. . so you could be looking at someone like Paul Lawrie? Jimenez would be another option but he is playing on the seniors tour now so may not get a chance to see first hand potential players like Mcginely, clarke and Bjorn did.

I'd say its next time round for Harrington and then Westwood for 2022 in Italy, possibly the other way round but I doubt it. I think the logic is that PH is more recognisable over there than Westwood. Maybe a bit of a poisoned chalice as the course will probably be set up for the bombers a la Hazeltine and winning away from home is just hard to do.
If PH doesn't get it in 2020 it might just pass him by, but 3 Majors should keep him in the hunt for 2022 anyway.

PropJoe10

I'd be shocked if Harrington wasn't captain at some point, considering hes a 3 time Major winner and one of the best ever European Tour players. Westwood will definitely captain a team as well, assuming they both want it, obviously. Jimenez is another good candidate.

PropJoe10

Was thinking over the weekend, considering there's a pretty competitive Seniors tour I'm surprised there's never been talking of a senior Ryder Cup. Would be cool to see Monty/Langer/Olazabal etc teeing it up again against the US.

kiers47

Fairly sure i seen an interview with Harrington where he mentioned that he would rather be an away captain possibly for 2020. Perhaps it was in his OTB interview from a month or so back.

Loafing Oaf

PropJoe10 wrote: »

Was thinking over the weekend, considering there's a pretty competitive Seniors tour I'm surprised there's never been talking of a senior Ryder Cup. Would be cool to see Monty/Langer/Olazabal etc teeing it up again against the US.

On a related note, the new Laver Cup is apparently intended to replicate the Ryder Cup buzz in tennis. Only the Europeans have a stronger sense of identity in this case as they're up against 'Team World'.:p

HighLine

:D

https://twitter.com/RyderCupEurope/status/1046688393005060096

valoren

6.5 points delivered by Bjorn's wildcard picks.
2 points delivered by Furyk's wildcard pick Finau.

The other 3, nadda. Even worse when you see that Bjorn had 3 to pick whereas Furyk had the seeming luxury of 4 wildcards.

Bjorn took some criticism in the lead up by picking an out of form Garcia. The notion of giving mates a nod came into question.
Yet he got 3 points so Bjorn was vindicated. Same could be said for picking Woods and Phil. I guess the Tiger comeback came full circle the past few weeks i.e. winning on tour and then disappointment at the Ryder Cup.

Telecaster58

Am I the only one sick of Poulter's schtick, with chest beating, contorted face, air punching etc.?

slave1

Bob Harris

I was quite surprised that both Mickelson and Woods were taken along. Both are only mediocre points scorers having lost more than they've won in previous Ryder cups and neither are exactly team players.
Woods especially is only beginning to find form and seems very fragile mentally.
Mickelson won in january and since then not a Top 10 finish and was a long way off in some tournaments. Neither won so much as a half a point.

Pa8301

valoren wrote: »

6.5 points delivered by Bjorn's wildcard picks.
2 points delivered by Furyk's wildcard pick Finau.

The other 3, nadda.

Bjorn took some criticism in the lead up by picking Garcia. The notion of giving mates a nod came into question.
Yet he got 3 points so Bjorn was vindicated. Same could be said for picking Woods and Phil. I guess the Tiger comeback came full circle the past few weeks i.e. winning on tour and then disappointment at the Ryder Cup.

I must admit I thought Bjorn left himself as a hostage to fortune picking Garcia but he was completely vindicated.

I don't think Furyk can be hammered too much for his wild card picks. They were the obvious choices. Finau did pretty well for him. Tiger was always going to be picked if he was playing halfway decent. Dechambeau couldn't really have been left out after his wins. Mickelson turned out to be an horrendous pick but at the time he was picked he had just finished outside the qualifying mark and had won the WGC in Mexico this year. This allied with his (not always positive) Ryder Cup experience, I can see why he was picked.

slave1

I think the US were also hampered by having players qualify from great golf too long ago and not in form at all recently e.g. Bubba and Reed

Bob Harris

Pa8301 wrote: »

I must admit I thought Bjorn left himself as a hostage to fortune picking Garcia but he was completely vindicated.

I don't think Furyk can be hammered too much for his wild card picks. They were the obvious choices. Finau did pretty well for him. Tiger was always going to be picked if he was playing halfway decent. Dechambeau couldn't really have been left out after his wins. Mickelson turned out to be an horrendous pick but at the time he was picked he had just finished outside the qualifying mark and had won the WGC in Mexico this year. This allied with his (not always positive) Ryder Cup experience, I can see why he was picked.

I think they were obvious choices as in two to leave at home. Just my opinion but no surprise to me so see them contribute nothing and probably drag the team down.

slave1

Pa8301 wrote: »

I must admit I thought Bjorn left himself as a hostage to fortune picking Garcia but he was completely vindicated.

I don't think Furyk can be hammered too much for his wild card picks. They were the obvious choices. Finau did pretty well for him. Tiger was always going to be picked if he was playing halfway decent. Dechambeau couldn't really have been left out after his wins. Mickelson turned out to be an horrendous pick but at the time he was picked he had just finished outside the qualifying mark and had won the WGC in Mexico this year. This allied with his (not always positive) Ryder Cup experience, I can see why he was picked.

Agreed, really nothing wrong with either Captain's picks in fairness.
Just felt sorry for they way they were paired off, Woods with a brual Reed and Phil in foursomes, that was just plain stupid

kiers47

Hindsight is great. Sher people were absolutely up in arms about Sergio getting picked and he didnt do to bad.

As i said before the ryder cup captain is probably the most over rated job in world sport. Golf is so volatile that you are a complete hostage to fortune.

tayto lover

PropJoe10 wrote: »

I'd be shocked if Harrington wasn't captain at some point, considering hes a 3 time Major winner and one of the best ever European Tour players. Westwood will definitely captain a team as well, assuming they both want it, obviously. Jimenez is another good candidate.

Can't wait for Jimenez to get the captaincy. That will be fun. Probably 6 years time.

RikkFlair

Jimenez English isn't the best, with the speeches and all that, especially if he's after throwin back half a bottle of wine

Telecaster58 wrote: »

Am I the only one sick of Poulter's schtick, with chest beating, contorted face, air punching etc.?

I'd ****ing hate him if I was American that's for sure

valoren

kiers47 wrote: »

Hindsight is great. Sher people were absolutely up in arms about Sergio getting picked and he didnt do to bad.

As i said before the ryder cup captain is probably the most over rated job in world sport. Golf is so volatile that you are a complete hostage to fortune.

The US Ryder Cup captaincy has become the golf equivalent of what used to be the England manager's job. A poison chalice. High profile, prestigious and lucrative but ultimately destined for perpetual disappointment and then hounded by the media.

The US Ryder Cup teams are the equivalent of the England squads which featured an embarrassment of riches for selection. They were super players with their clubs but as a collective team they disappointed.

Look at the improvement in England's squad since dispensing with the ageing star players i.e. Beckham, Rooney, Lampard, Gerrard, Cole et al. They reached the semi finals this year with a 'Europe' like ego-free collective mentality. A big improvement all told.

What else can Furyk think?

He had a team with 9 major winners on it. They are really good golfers, he doesn't need to tell them how to get the ball in the hole. Form wise, 6 of the last 7 major winners were in his team. And they lost. Again.

There is only 7 majors collectively between the whole of the European team, the majority of them belonging to McIlroy.

Maybe a solution to that would be a rolling captaincy, at a minimum they should get a home and away go at the role before reserving judgement. It should not become a once off gig. Look at how Davis Love got a second stab at it. They won well, second time around albeit with home advantage. So let go the idea of Task Forces and all that. The PGA of America should be talking to Furyk and planning his right of reply at Whistling Straits.

slave1

You know, an independent venue every third holding might be interesting

Cork Boy 53

slave1 wrote: »

You know, an independent venue every third holding might be interesting

The Ryder Cup is largely all about the atmosphere that home support generates. If that was diluted by moving it to a neutral continent it would seriously devalue the competition in my view.

Roger_007

The Ryder Cup team captains should have a completely free hand to pick whoever they wanted on the team irrespective of rankings, in other words all picks should be wild cards. Some golfers are just not cut out for match play and fitting in to a team mentality. Current form and attitude should be prioritised over ranking.

slave1

Roger_007 wrote: »

...Current form and attitude should be prioritised over ranking.

This could be partly achieved by reducing the qualification period to the last 4 months or so...

PropJoe10

tayto lover wrote: »

Can't wait for Jimenez to get the captaincy. That will be fun. Probably 6 years time.

Could be sooner, he's mid 50s now. I'd say he'd want it before he's 60 but it'd definitely be good craic! Man's a legend.

Pa8301

prawnsambo wrote: »

Yeah. The irony seems to be lost on Reed.

I don't know what Reed was hoping to achieve with that interview apart from having a bitch about not being picked with his favoured partner and being dropped. All it's done is make it less likely that Speith will ever want to play with him again! And he was lucky to play 3 games considering the rubbish he was playing. He couldn't hit a fairway in the second morning fourballs.

At least when Mickelson had his tirade against Watson in 2014 it seemed like he was trying to start a debate on what needed to be done to give the US a better chance in Ryder Cups.