Strike Action - Schools looking for people to supervise classes?

jamie124

Hi There,
I have just seen on Facebook that schools will be looking for people to supervise classes while all secondary school teachers go on strike?
I am just wondering what type of people can take part in this? (I'm guessing substitute teachers would be on strike too??) - Parents?/College Students?
Could I apply to supervise classes or do I need to be a qualified teacher or what?

Thanks

Westeros

jamie124 wrote: »

Hi There,
I have just seen on Facebook that schools will be looking for people to supervise classes while all secondary school teachers go on strike?
I am just wondering what type of people can take part in this? (I'm guessing substitute teachers would be on strike too??) - Parents?/College Students?
Could I apply to supervise classes or do I need to be a qualified teacher or what?

Thanks

Judging by that article there, no experience/qualifications are necessary.
They seem to be targeting parents first of all - sending home letters and application forms. No harm in asking a school nearby if you're interested though.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/department-to-pay-parents-to-supervise-students-during-strike-1.2830440

jamie124

Westeros wrote: »

Judging by that article there, no experience/qualifications are necessary.
They seem to be targeting parents first of all - sending home letters and application forms. No harm in asking a school nearby if you're interested though.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/department-to-pay-parents-to-supervise-students-during-strike-1.2830440

Excellent thanks very much! will give it a try should I email them?

Westeros

jamie124 wrote: »

Excellent thanks very much! will give it a try should I email them?

You could email them but to be sure of getting your word in I'd call in to them and put your name forward. I'd imagine the secretaries are under pressure at the moment with all that's going on with the strike and the chances of your email being overlooked is probably high. Even a phone call could be enough, at least you'll know for sure then that your name has gone forward.
It may take a while for that to get up and running, and you may need Garda Vetting but definitely no qualifications/training needed.

Starkystark

I can not believe these questions are being asked. I appreciate that there's a hunger for work etc. but the fact that it's a free for all people to apply to supervise is ridiculous and feeds into that garbage that "oh anyone can teach".

And to add also to the fact that the teaching council and department have been so stringent on not paying teachers unless they are registered with the TC.

hytrogen

Garda vetting has to come into play before you'd be cleared to work with minors in any institution now

The_Valeyard

They can have a go with the LCA's and see how they get on.

mtoutlemonde

Starkystark wrote: »

I can not believe these questions are being asked. I appreciate that there's a hungry for work etc. but the fact that it's a free for all people to apply to supervise is ridiculous and feeds into that garbage that "oh anyone can teach".

As I wrote in another thread:
It will definitely be an eye opener depending on where Jamie gets the S&S especially when the students have no homework/books/interest/tough school and someone near enough/the same age as a Leaving Cert student telling him/her to be quiet and do some work. I wonder would Richard and Pascal apply for a few days?

Just wondering is this going to create a them and us situation whereby the teachers have their lunch in the staff room and let S&S recruits (or as someone said in another thread - scabs) supervise the students while we eat our lunch/have a 'free' class?

spurious

Starkystark wrote: »

I can not believe these questions are being asked. I appreciate that there's a hungry for work etc. but the fact that it's a free for all people to apply to supervise is ridiculous and feeds into that garbage that "oh anyone can teach".

On the other hand, let them have six classes in a row of 'We're supposed to have P.E. and you're not a real teacher anyway' and see how easy they find it.

Westeros

Starkystark wrote: »

I can not believe these questions are being asked. I appreciate that there's a hungry for work etc. but the fact that it's a free for all people to apply to supervise is ridiculous and feeds into that garbage that "oh anyone can teach".

As a teacher I don't necessarily agree with it either, just simply answering the questions that Jamie has asked. Without doubt it's going to feed into the "anyone can teach" and "teachers have it handy".
As far as I can see it's going to be mayhem in the class rooms with parents/supervisors sitting in with a group of students that have nothing to do. How they expect to keep them under control is beyond me but it looks like it'll go ahead.
Who do they run to when there's a problem in the classroom then? Teachers? Principal? It's just not going to work.

mtoutlemonde

spurious wrote: »

On the other hand, let them have six classes in a row of 'We're supposed to have P.E. and you're not a real teacher anyway' and see how easy they find it.

I was listening to Sean O'Rourke today and they obviously had a discussion regarding the strike before I tuned in because a listener text in to say that in the last strike outsiders were brought in to the listeners school and he said that they didn't have a clue and they ran rings around them. I can see big problems with this if the outsiders are brought in - I'd want a lot more than a measly €38 for doing this - torture. Subbing can be a nightmare for teachers but at least they have been taught / have experience / have their own techniques to deal with challenging behaviour - what does the average Joe know about things like this? If they do this, I think I might try being a guard for a while - sure it's no bother - anyone can do it!!!

byhookorbycrook

The people taking this work will be paid €38 per hour, a far cry from what teachers would get.

They are also strike breaking.

It will be interesting to see the repercussions- firstly as to how garda clearance will work, seeing as how many qualified teachers and SNAs are caught in the backlog?

Next, are the people taking these posts going to be able to enforce discipline (See Spurious above)?

Are these people used to addressing the needs of children with SEN?

Are they aware that some teenagers are ready and willing to take advantage and are these "supervisors" aware of the possibility of allegations being made against them?

spurious

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Are they aware that some teenagers are ready and willing to take advantage and are these "supervisors" aware of the possibility of allegations being made against them?

The ever popular 'I'll say ya touched me and she'll back me up'.

It's not all 'take out your books now girls and study'.

mtoutlemonde

Westeros wrote: »

As a teacher I don't necessarily agree with it either, just simply answering the questions that Jamie has asked. Without doubt it's going to feed into the "anyone can teach" and "teachers have it handy".
As far as I can see it's going to be mayhem in the class rooms with parents/supervisors sitting in with a group of students that have nothing to do. How they expect to keep them under control is beyond me but it looks like it'll go ahead.
Who do they run to when there's a problem in the classroom then? Teachers? Principal? It's just not going to work.

I'd say the door

punisher5112

Nothing surprises me anymore. Will all the ones on the scratch that always say they would do any job for half the amount come running for the chance to get one over. Not a chance.

Nobody else should even think of getting involved it shouldn't have to come to strike action but it seems the normal thing to do now to Get anyone to listen or work it out.

mtoutlemonde

punisher5112 wrote: »

Nothing surprises me anymore. Will all the ones on the scratch that always say they would do any job for half the amount come running for the chance to get one over. Not a chance.

Nobody else should even think of getting involved it shouldn't have to come to strike action but it seems the normal thing to do now to Get anyone to listen or work it out.

If no one applies - it could happen if the department of social welfare get involved - they send people on courses - I'm sure they can send them to do this work.

byhookorbycrook

If you are being paid to do it, then you need to sort it out. ASTI teachers aren't paid for it, so why would they intervene...
Part of me says let them at it, let them see the reality of the bare bones of supervising, never mind teaching the students something.
But a large part of me says why were people not asked to drive Luas or buses- are we saying those jobs are more skilled than teaching?Apparently the govt. thinks so.

byhookorbycrook

So who interviews these people?If it all goes pear shaped (and it's pretty likely it will) who is responsible???

seavill

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

The people taking this work will be paid €38 per hour, a far cry from what teachers would get.

They are also strike breaking.

It will be interesting to see the repercussions- firstly as to how garda clearance will work, seeing as how many qualified teachers and SNAs are caught in the backlog?

Next, are the people taking these posts going to be able to enforce discipline (See Spurious above)?

Are these people used to addressing the needs of children with SEN?

Are they aware that some teenagers are ready and willing to take advantage and are these "supervisors" aware of the possibility of allegations being made against them?

As far as I know (I think I read it somewhere either today or yesterday) it is €38 for the day not per hour, it works out at 2 hours work for the supervision, and there was something about it being slightly extra then for time over the 2 hours I'll try find it

Edit
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/education/we-want-you-government-in-desperate-recruitment-bid-for-parents-to-run-schools-35142390.html

deiseindublin

Who will actually put this rota together though? In a mostly ASTI school, what person is going to take on the role of chief organiser for this? ASTI principals can't, DPs can't, APs can't.

Who will be sorting it out? Compiling rotas, giving classroom lists, maps of the buildings, rules/regulations, break times, compiling claim forms? There's a hell of a lot of work involved.

I'm baffled as to who will be doing it.

2xj3hplqgsbkym

deiseindublin wrote: »

Who will actually put this rota together though? In a mostly ASTI school, what person is going to take on the role of chief organiser for this? ASTI principals can't, DPs can't, APs can't.

Who will be sorting it out? Compiling rotas, giving classroom lists, maps of the buildings, rules/regulations, break times, compiling claim forms? There's a hell of a lot of work involved.

I'm baffled as to who will be doing it.

BOM?

mtoutlemonde

seavill wrote: »

As far as I know (I think I read it somewhere either today or yesterday) it is €38 for the day not per hour, it works out at 2 hours work for the supervision, and there was something about it being slightly extra then for time over the 2 hours I'll try find it

Edit
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/education/we-want-you-government-in-desperate-recruitment-bid-for-parents-to-run-schools-35142390.html

I think it's €19 per hour after

coillsaille

All one has to do is read what has been said in this thread already to know it would be absolute chaos. Personally I think it would be a great development for the future of the teacher-parent relationship if parents and other non-teachers undertook supervision for a few weeks. But I just can't see BOMs agreeing to go ahead with it. The lessons of the past were well learned on this one.

Iused2likebusts

I really hope this goes ahead. It can only be a positive for teachers. The students will run rings around almost anybody that does it . Whoever ends up doing it will have earned their money that's for sure. Sitting in a room with 20+ teenagers that will have no respect for you and trying to keep them under control when everybody will know that there is nothing you can really do. Its only going to end one way.

Jamfa

The same thing happened back in 2003 and there was no drama in my school. The students were supervised by an adult who came in and everyone just got on with their work. Things could be different this time but more because of lack of vetted people than the inability of a responsible adult to supervise a class.

Iused2likebusts

Jamfa wrote: »

The same thing happened back in 2003 and there was no drama in my school. The students were supervised by an adult who came in and everyone just got on with their work. Things could be different this time but more because of lack of vetted people than the inability of a responsible adult to supervise a class.

All depends on the school the majority of schools, classes won't be like that.

deiseindublin

Alena Scary Mush wrote: »

BOM?

I just can't see it Alena Scary Mush. There's a lot more involved not with vetting and procedures have tightened up a lot. BOM members are hard pressed enough for time and find it a big commitment, and a lot of nominal input too. Sorting out supervisors, rotas, claim forms etc is definitely more than they signed up for.

cupcake queen

deiseindublin wrote: »

I just can't see it rosebush. There's a lot more involved not with vetting and procedures have tightened up a lot. BOM members are hard pressed enough for time and find it a big commitment, and a lot of nominal input too. Sorting out supervisors, rotas, claim forms etc is definitely more than they signed up for.

Also they would need to do the rostering on a daily basis as absences arise. No Asti board member could do it and the others on the board would not be staff members and so would not on the premises day to day. Dont see how it would work.

evolving_doors

Alena Scary Mush wrote: »

BOM?

Yup I reckon in most schools it'll probably be Da BOM (maybe non-union members sit on the BOM, retired teachers who may have left the union!).

evolving_doors

Jamfa wrote: »

The same thing happened back in 2003 and there was no drama in my school. The students were supervised by an adult who came in and everyone just got on with their work. Things could be different this time but more because of lack of vetted people than the inability of a responsible adult to supervise a class.

I'd say there might be quite a few NQT's who would have vetting in other schools so it mightn't be too difficult to update them to a new school (as opposed to 1st timers)... then again, what's to say that the vetting will be as straightforward and expeditious as it alwaysnever is? Gardai are refusing to access the pulse system on the 21st and 28th of october... then strike 4,11,18,25th November. Is the vetting section separate?.

So maybe it's in the Govt's interest to fix the gardai ASAP as it affects their plans for a speedy successful Substitution and Supervision Substitution scheme.

mirrorwall14

I don't understand why they don't just pay the ASTI for the sand S. They are going to end up paying more for it in hassle and wages and paying them off would remove one of the ASTIs biggest bargaining chips. It's ludicrous. Fight the ASTI on NQTs sure. Fight them on work they should be paid for? Mental