Out of control Leilandii

Oldtree

ligertigon wrote: »

So you can prune a 40' tree to 5' without felling?

BTW not being a smart arse

If a felling licence is required for the felling of the 40' tree, the answer is No. Under the 1946 act to cut such a tree under 6 foot means you are felling it and require a licence

ligertigon

so prune to just over 6'.
many thanks

magicbastarder

actually, that would raise a question for someone who wanted to set up a coppice cycle on say a 12 year rotation; as you cut back to a stump, do you need a licence?
once you get it up and running, the trees would be multi-stemmed - does this make a difference regarding the licence?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

ligertigon wrote: »

So you can prune a 40' tree to 5' without felling?

BTW not being a smart arse

That is not pruning, by any stretch of the imagination.

Oldtree

ligertigon wrote: »

so prune to just over 6'.
many thanks

not a good idea

Conrad Rapping Motorboat wrote: »

That is not pruning, by any stretch of the imagination.

Agreed. The law was made a long time ago. It is foolish to take large limbs off a tree, as that leaves large avenues open for decay to set in and create serious problems for the tree owner in the future.

Oldtree

magicbastarder wrote: »

actually, that would raise a question for someone who wanted to set up a coppice cycle on say a 12 year rotation; as you cut back to a stump, do you need a licence?
once you get it up and running, the trees would be multi-stemmed - does this make a difference regarding the licence?

I keep forgetting this bit of info so I checked back over it, old habits die hard, 10 year rule is a misconception.

St. Leibowitz wrote: »

Not true. You need a felling licence to cut down ANY tree, unless it is exempt. Exemptions are below (there are others for road building etc.)

The requirement for a felling licence for the uprooting or cutting down of trees does not apply where:

• The tree in question is a hazel, apple, plum, damson, pear, or cherry tree grown for the value of its fruit or any ozier;
• The tree in question is less than 100 feet from a dwelling other than a wall or temporary structure;
• The tree in question is standing in a County or other Borough or an urban district (that is, within the boundaries of a town council, or city council area).

http://www.teagasc.ie/forestry/technical_info/felling_licences.asp

The ten year misconception comes from the wording on uprooting trees.

""Under Section 37 of the Forestry Act, 1946, it is illegal to uproot any tree over ten years old or to cut down any tree of any age (including trees which form part of a hedgerow), unless a Felling Notice has been lodged at the Garda Station nearest to the trees at least 21 days before felling commences. ""

So, this looks like it specifically prohibits coppicing. It's ok to kill the tree by uprooting it if it's under ten years old, but you can't cut it down to coppice it.

Oldtree wrote: »

You are right, I sit corrected on a 10 year misconseption. It's the same wording on the DOEF website here:

http://www.agriculture.gov.ie/forestservice/treefelling/legalrequirementsfortreefelling/

and to further qualify that the definition of a tree under the act is:

"the word “tree” does not include any hazel, apple, plum, damson, pear or cherry tree grown for the value of its fruit or any ozier, but with those exceptions includes every tree of any age or any stage of growth"

However in Definitions for purposes of Part IV:

"the expression “cut down” means, in relation to a tree, cut through the trunk of the tree at a height of less than six feet from the ground surface to such an extent that the tree falls or is rendered liable to fall under the influence of natural agencies"

"The trunk" is a single trunk, not the multiple stem unually formed for coppicing from a single root! I must immediatly write to the man from the minestry to get a definitive opinion (but I'm covered with a general licence anyway).

So it would be best to get a general felling licence to do a 12 year rotation coppice.

Page 16 Teagasc Energy Crops Manual 2010: but i think biomass crop applies to 1-2-3-4 year rotation mechanically harvested willow:

With forestry you are required to obtain a felling licence when harvesting – this requires
the land to be replanted, which in essence means that forestry is a permanent change of land use. While the
planting of a biomass crop is not restricted by the same regulation it is likely that the decision to plant a crop
will mean that the land will not be available to change to an alternative land use for a substantial period due to
the large initial investment.

https://www.teagasc.ie/media/website/publications/2010/98/Manual_Final_10feb10.pdf

The new Forestry Bill 2013 has been passed and is just awaiting to be enacted and it covers coppicing and a certain threshold of wood allowed to be felled for firewood, from what I remember:
http://www.oireachtas.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=23336

Some of the details were discussed here:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=84403972

magicbastarder

that would then beg the question as to whether you'd need to constantly apply for licences, one per year maybe, to run a coppice cycle?

Oldtree

magicbastarder wrote: »

that would then beg the question as to whether you'd need to constantly apply for licences, one per year maybe, to run a coppice cycle?

A general felling licence runs for 5 years, would cover your holding/lands and it is very easy to apply for.

Yamanoto

CJmasgrande wrote: »

Folks, in the next day or so I'll put in a YouTube video here where I'll do a walk through video showing the sheer scale of what lies ahead for me

Foliage out for the lads.

gaius c

We have four out the back that got topped years ago but the subsidiary branches have grown up in the meantime. Made a start on them yesterday and spent most of the day handling just one of the four. One of the branches we cut had thirteen rings and was about 125mm thick. Do rock climbing and the gear came in handy.

Going to have to take it slowly as they are up against a boundary wall. Will be years worth of firewood once it dries out.

P.S. any recommendations on a decent electric chainsaw for them?

magicbastarder

one commenti once heard about electric chainsaws - and people better informed than me about them will correct this if it's wrong - is that they're more torquey than petrol ones, so in certain situations they're less likely to stop than a petrol one.

gaius c

For working at height, weight is a consideration!

Edit: used a hire Stihl mse140c. Very impressed with it but think it's discontinued now.

Curly head

CJmasgrande wrote: »

Folks, in the next day or so I'll put in a YouTube video here where I'll do a walk through video showing the sheer scale of what lies ahead for me

Any update photo or video of your job ahead? I done same about a dozen or so years ago. A huge job to say the least, dry weather a must!

r3nu4l

Had 30 of these taken down last autumn, most about 40 feet tall, a few up to 50 feet. Job cost 3.5 k and required a tractor to pull them down once branches were lopped and base cut was made.

Currently in a massive pile at the bottom of the garden in about 4 ft lenghts.

Question I have is, if I were to get a log splitter, will those lengths be too long for the splitter? Other question, should I cut them with a chainsaw now or wait until they are dry? The guy who took them down said it wouldn't make much difference...

recedite

r3nu4l wrote: »

if I were to get a log splitter, will those lengths be too long for the splitter?

What would you do with 4 foot lengths of split timber? The usual procedure is to cut them to usable length and then spit the rings afterwards. Anything with a diameter of less than about 10 inches doesn't need spitting if you have a decent sized stove.

Best time for spitting is after a month or two, when micro cracks start appearing in the timber. Aim for the cracks. After that, the wood starts to season and gets harder. But your guy is right, its hard work no matter when you do it!

magicbastarder

recedite wrote: »

Anything with a diameter of less than about 10 inches doesn't need spitting if you have a decent sized stove.

you'd want a bloody big stove to throw an 8 inch wide piece of wood into it!

plus as it's leylandii, you want to leave it to season for two years, will season a little bit faster once split.

recedite

magicbastarder wrote: »

you'd want a bloody big stove to throw an 8 inch wide piece of wood into it!

Yours is obviously too small then. When buying stove, the salesman asks about room size and how many kW you want. Ignore all that crap and just measure the firebox size. The kW output depends entirely on how much air is going through it.
If your stove can take 18 inch lengths of 10 inch diameter you'll have a lot less cutting and splitting to do.

magicbastarder

it's okay, i'm trying to heat a room, not a warehouse.

magicbastarder

btw, a piece of wood 18 inches long and 10 inches in diameter is nearly a cubic foot. which would weigh nearly 20kg.
even handling those and getting them into the stove must give you some workout.

recedite

Eh?? The guy is talking above about handling 4 foot lengths and splitting them. And to get timber cut down to those 4 foot lengths, somebody had to handle even bigger ones.

looksee

I recently got a stove; I keep finding myself being hugely impressed that the logs fit exactly into it. Even though they are sold all exactly the same size and described as being for stoves.

magicbastarder

recedite wrote: »

Eh?? The guy is talking above about handling 4 foot lengths and splitting them. And to get timber cut down to those 4 foot lengths, somebody had to handle even bigger ones.

yes, but for carrying into the house and putting them in the stove doesn't usually involve such manual labour!
in four hours of keeping our stove lit we'd probably barely use as much wood in total as in a single one of your behemoths. it's not a big stove, but it's certainly not too small for our needs.

recedite

Well, different strokes for different folks.
If you were the person doing the cutting and splitting, you might look at things differently!

magicbastarder

oh, i've cut and split leylandii for my own stoves. 70 foot of hedging in total, about 12 foot tall.

ligertigon

I have heard rumours, that there are grants available to remove non native/invasive species if replaced by native trees.....
Any truth to this?

magicbastarder

in what sort of context? if you mean in terms of replanting your garden, that's a no.

ligertigon

Well its available via teagasc, tree council of ireland and dep of agri. Just not sure if there are min size limits

magicbastarder

this is an explanatory PDF for the native woodland scheme.

https://www.agriculture.gov.ie/media/migration/forestry/grantandpremiumschemes/schemecirculars/2015/NativeWConsSch230915.pdf

ligertigon

Also, the tree council were providing grants to housing estates for tree planting to better the neighbourhood etc.

So, then conceivably it is possible in a persons garden to benefit from a grant of sorts, not sure if this is still available as no mention could I find on their website..

CJmasgrande

Folks I was too depressed to post here for ages.

UPDATE, I was quoted €25 and €20k in recent months by two separate contractors to take diwn, mulch and remove.

In February I cut down 10 trees closest to the house, I hired an industrial chipper and had to return it and it was bloody useless. It was used on a very wet Saturday and it constantly got clogged and blocked. I ended up making some firewood and moving all the branches to a quiet hidden corner of my garden.

I had a €10k sewerage upgrade installed 3 years ago and now that contractor told me he recently visited a house like mine where the tree roots made a frenzy for the new water source from the new perculation pipes and quickly chocked up the pipes, this may be happening now to mine

The tar in my avenue entrance is now cracking badly from roots.

I also had the road frontage breasted last February and it looks dreadful. I plan to know down road frontage altogether after the bird besting season ends.

Four separate contractors have viewed it and all said they are too high to top. They say it's no more expensive to just take down completely.

It's an absolute nightmare.