Refused Car Insurance Cover By Direct Cannel

Flangeo

peteb2 wrote: »

Pretend it wasn't Allianz you went to for the the purpose of doing away with your different channel notion. Pretend it was Zurich. You went to them and got a quote for 500 cheaper than Allianz - because you failed to declare the claim under your policy.

So your Zurich quote is invalid. If you didn't have a claim on your policy, yes you would be entitled to a cheaper quote. But you do have a claim so you aren't. And that's it in a nutshell.

Thanks for making my argument, the claim is not supposed to affect my premium. But yet it clearly is, as can be seen in the €500 difference. That's all I am querying here?

davo10

Op, go online or phone any insurance company, give them your details, leaving out the claim and ask for a quote, then tell them "oh, sorry I did have a claim and it is still open", then ask them for the quote. I think you would find a substantial difference in the premium when amended to include the claim. Your NCB is a percentage reduction, the cost of your premium is going up but your discount percentage stays the same.

davo10

Flangeo wrote: »

Thanks for making my argument, the claim is not supposed to affect my premium. But yet it clearly is, as can be seen in the €500 difference. That's all I am querying here?

No, the claim is not supposed to effect your NCB discount on your premium, two very different things.

If your NCB is protected and it provides for a 60% discount on a €1000 premium then you pay €400. If your premium goes up to €2000 and your NCB is protected, you still get the 60% discount but you pay €800.

peteb2

Flangeo wrote:

Thanks for making my argument, the claim is not supposed to affect my premium. But yet it clearly is, as can be seen in the €500 difference. That's all I am querying here?

Jesus wept. The difference is the channel you have gone!

Flangeo

peteb2 wrote: »

The difference isn't between the broker and direct price. It's your non disclosure of the claim.

I'm starting to think you are deliberately misunderstanding to suit your own argument.

The NCB protection prevents against losing your NCB. So in this instance your broker quoted you 1500 instead of 3000!! Because you retained your NCB.

Rates change. You've seen the papers right?

And disregard any idea of a direct channel and the pricing. Because it just isn't open to you

And there will always be a price difference between a broker and directly dealing with the broker. That's the price of business.

Now we are finally getting somewhere, this is all that I am arguing, why shouldn't I have access to the direct channel price as the risk is with the same company? The NCB is supposed to protect me to allow for this. They already have all the claim details. Anyway I am going to see what the FSO has to say.

Flangeo

davo10 wrote: »

Op, go online or phone any insurance company, give them your details, leaving out the claim and ask for a quote, then tell them "oh, sorry I did have a claim and it is still open", then ask them for the quote. I think you would find a substantial difference in the premium when amended to include the claim. Your NCB is a percentage reduction, the cost of your premium is going up but your discount percentage stays the same.

I know but what I am arguing is, that this is the same company who is carrying the risk. How can they offer it so much cheaper in one section of the business on a like basis?

Sono

Flangeo wrote: »

Now we are finally getting somewhere, this is all that I am arguing, why shouldn't I have access to the direct channel price as the risk is with the same company? The NCB is supposed to protect me to allow for this. They already have all the claim details. Anyway I am going to see what the FSO has to say.

Look forward to seeing the same reply as you have gotten here but by all means work away. Why did you post it on boards as it looks like you were seeking reassurance that you're being shafted which you clearly aren't but as you have not been told that you're off to complain elsewhere.

Flangeo

davo10 wrote: »

No, the claim is not supposed to effect your NCB discount on your premium, two very different things.

If your NCB is protected and it provides for a 60% discount on a €1000 premium then you pay €400. If your premium goes up to €2000 and your NCB is protected, you still get the 60% discount but you pay €800.

Sorry of course your right, its the difference in price being offered by different areas of the same insurance company is all that I am querying and if this is right. I just think that all customers should be offered the same pricing opportunity. And all as I am saying is that because I have a Protected NCB I should be allowed to use this.

SmartinMartin

Flangeo wrote: »

I know but what I am arguing is, that this is the same company who is carrying the risk. How can they offer it so much cheaper in one section of the business on a like basis?

It wasn't on a like basis though. In one application you lied.

Flangeo

Sono wrote: »

Look forward to seeing the same reply as you have gotten here but by all means work away. Why did you post it on boards as it looks like you were seeking reassurance that you're being shafted which you clearly aren't but as you have not been told that you're off to complain elsewhere.

If we all took the advise we got on forums like this or any social media it would be a pretty sad day. The FSO are the professionals and that is what they are there for, to give some comfort around how Customers are treated and not just the opinion of a few. You would be very surprised how they view things. Also, I had verbal confirmation from Allianz that I was on cover while they checked into this.

TheChizler

The reason is that you provided incomplete information, and left out details which would materially affect the quote.

From the Allianz terms and conditions (you would have had to click a box saying you read them when getting the quote):

Quotations: All quotations and any acceptance or declinature by Allianz of your application for cover or renewal of cover are subject to your making full and complete disclosure to Allianz, including disclosure of all convictions, disqualifications, endorsements or pending prosecutions or any other matter materially affecting our assessment of risk, and to your providing Allianz with accurate and complete information. For motor insurance you must be aware that the nature of the driving licence held by you, your age, occupation, driving history, vehicle distribution and any other information which could affect your cover, all materially affect the assessment of the risk and the premium level. You must take reasonable care not to make any misrepresentations. A misrepresentation is where an individual provides inaccurate, misleading or incomplete information. Unless otherwise stated, all quotations are inclusive of levies, and premium taxes.

Once they figured out this omission they have every right to either jack up the quote or decline to provide cover.

Flangeo

SmartinMartin wrote: »

It wasn't on a like basis though. In one application you lied.

The cover is on a like basis. The accident is not supposed to have any affect as it is supposed to be protected that's why I pay the extra for it.

colm_mcm

I don't think you understand how no-claims protection works. That or you're in denial

theteal

Flangeo wrote: »

The cover is on a like basis. The accident is not supposed to have any affect as it is supposed to be protected that's why I pay the extra for it.

If you're just going to ignore the explanations given, why even bother start the thread? This has been explained multiple times now. Your NCB is protected, your premium is not.

SmartinMartin

Flangeo wrote: »

The cover is on a like basis. The accident is not supposed to have any affect as it is supposed to be protected that's why I pay the extra for it.

The cover is not on a like basis. In one quote you have a recorded accident, in the second one you don't. It's that simple. You lied about it and you got caught out. You'll be lucky if the original offer of cover is still available.

beechwood55

You were also asked if you have any claims or convictions - I would be amazed if you weren't

. I have never once applied for car insurance policy without being asked if I had any accidents, claims or convictions.

ptogher14

Why do you keep stating you got quote differently through different channels, when that's not the case. Yes it was the same customer but different criteria. You didn't disclose all the information, the broker clearly did.

Sleeper12

There is a disclosure clause in the T&Cs. You responsible to make them aware of anything that might effect the policy. When they found out that you didn't disclose the open claim they cancelled the policy. Now you have put yourself in the situation where for the rest of your life you have to answer yes when asked if you have ever been refused insurance or had a policy cancelled on you. You'll never be able to get an online quote from any insurance company again as saying yes to canceled policy or refused insurance will automatically decline any online quotes.

Sue Pa Key Pa

Flangeo wrote: »

The question they asked was if I had any accidents in the last 3 years, the answer was no as someone else was driving my car. Regardless of the I had a fully protected NCB and the risk is with the same company. They are not supposed to be penalising me for having an accident as I have a protected NCB? Tks

The question on their website is "Have you or drivers had any accidents, losses or claims within the last 5 years". If you answered No to that, there's your problem

As someone said earlier, a protected NCB only entitles you to the same discount of the gross premium. That gross premium can vary due to your history.

Finally, insurers use vastly different rating structure through different distribution channels. You will find everybody will get different premiums from Allianz & Allianz Direct

Sue Pa Key Pa

Flangeo wrote: »

The cover is on a like basis. The accident is not supposed to have any affect as it is supposed to be protected that's why I pay the extra for it.

Apart from my explanation above and many others before me, why did you decide to interpret protected NCB that way?

NATLOR

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

But why would I pay extra for a discount, when they can just hike up the premium to cover the difference?

I won't call it a scam but it's a bit of a swizz, as the OP has just found out.

Not always the case.I have protected no claims with Aviva am allowed 2 unlimited claims in 3 years. Had an accident 2 years ago cost €10000 in total and my premiums have stayed the same since. Wouldn't be without it.

peteb2

Flangeo wrote:

Now we are finally getting somewhere, this is all that I am arguing, why shouldn't I have access to the direct channel price as the risk is with the same company? The NCB is supposed to protect me to allow for this. They already have all the claim details. Anyway I am going to see what the FSO has to say.

Are you kidding?? Because you don't fit the criteria for the direct channel price. You have a claim you didn't notify them of.

HeidiHeidi

colm_mcm wrote: »

I don't think you understand how no-claims protection works. That or you're in denial

That's because, as numerous posters have pointed out, it's No Claims BONUS protection. (Not a dig at you, colm-mcm, directed at OP whom I suspect at this stage is just trolling, or an ostrich).

Can't believe I went off for a few hours and this thread is still rolling along.

Good luck with the FSO, OP. Let us know what they say, will you?

Sono

If you lie on one application and tell the truth on the other how can you compare one price with another? This is just ridiculous!

HeidiHeidi

Sono wrote: »

If you lie on one application and tell the truth on the other how can you compare one price with another? This is just ridiculous!

I wouldn't go so far as to call it a "lie".

Strategic (and knowing) omission of relevant information.

Same result, though.

davo10

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

I wouldn't go so far as to call it a "lie".

Strategic (and knowing) omission of relevant information.

Same result, though.

A liie by omission occurs when an important fact is left out in order to foster a misconception. Lying by omission includes failures to correct pre-existing misconceptions.

Sleeper12

HeidiHeidi wrote:

I wouldn't go so far as to call it a "lie".

No. It's a lie. Hiding the truth from an insurance company is considered a lie. Because of the lie Op has now officially been refused insurance and had a policy cancelled. Op will have to explain this every time he wants a quote. This includes home insurance. Op made a huge mistake on this one.

HeidiHeidi

davo10 wrote: »

A liie by omission occurs when an important fact is left out in order to foster a misconception. Lying by omission includes failures to correct pre-existing misconceptions.

Lie by omission was the phrase I was looking for.

Not long out of the bed, brain not fully up to speed.

But as I said, same result in the end.

Nody

Flangeo wrote: »

Sorry of course your right, its the difference in price being offered by different areas of the same insurance company is all that I am querying and if this is right. I just think that all customers should be offered the same pricing opportunity. And all as I am saying is that because I have a Protected NCB I should be allowed to use this.

No you are comparing apples and oranges.

Try to put in the following in Allianze website:
30 year old man with 5 year NCB and no accident in last three years on insurance
30 year old man 5 year NCB and one accident in last three years on insurance

You got quoted for the second at 1300 and went to their web site and put in the first and are now trying to claim that the circumstances (and associated risk) are the same for both scenarios which is not true.

What you have is the NCB discount which is a fixed discount on a quoted rate; the rate however is variable depending on the bolded part above.

Sue Pa Key Pa

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Because of the lie Op has now officially been refused insurance and had a policy cancelled. Op will have to explain this every time he wants a quote. This includes home insurance. Op made a huge mistake on this one.

The OP will find this a bigger issue than his o/s claim if the insurer had to go through the official cancellation process to come off cover