Cannabis/Hemp Products/Medicinal/Legal

jh79

kleefarr wrote: »

How much is a licence?

Do you mean for an actual licence or the steps necessary to get one?

The licence i'd say is free sure it's hardly the same as a tv or dog licence.

To get the licence a small fortune on flights, rent and whatever the treatment cost is for up to a year.

Big weed could easily divert a small % of their billions in profits into funding the best possible research.

But we all knows it wouldn't be a good move financially.

mulbot

jh79 wrote: »

Do you mean for an actual licence or the steps necessary to get one?

The licence i'd say is free sure it's hardly the same as a tv or dog licence.

To get the licence a small fortune on flights, rent and whatever the treatment cost is for up to a year.

Big weed could easily divert a small % of their billions in profits into funding the best possible research.

But we all knows it wouldn't be a good move financially.

Who would this be? And how could it be done?

jh79

mulbot wrote: »

Who would this be? And how could it be done?

Any of those comapnies in the US / Canada. They are making a fortune, right?

They could fund studies the same way they normally are.

mulbot

jh79 wrote: »

Any of those comapnies in the US / Canada. They are making a fortune, right?

They could fund studies the same way they normally are.

I've no idea if they are. Is there not the issue of bias though if this were to happen?

bananabread12

All drugs should be legal to purchase in all stores.

It's not my problem if some down and out junkie wants to OD on heroin in some gutter somewhere. It becomes my problem when scumbags start shooting each other in the street I happen to be walking down.

jh79

mulbot wrote: »

I've no idea if they are. Is there not the issue of bias though if this were to happen?

Bias from where , the lack of a placebo control?

mulbot

jh79 wrote: »

Bias from where , the lack of a placebo control?

Bias from the perspective of the funding company. Why would there be a lack of placebo control in a properly conducted study?

jh79

mulbot wrote: »

Bias from the perspective of the funding company. Why would there be a lack of placebo control in a properly conducted study?

The study design should limit any bias. If its properly designed who funded it isn't important.

The high means its not a proper placebo.

mulbot

jh79 wrote: »

The study design should limit any bias. If its properly designed who funded it isn't important.

The high means its not a proper placebo.

Are many companies now not isolating the various compositions in the tests?-So in theory the "high" as you call it isn't a factor?

jh79

mulbot wrote: »

Are many companies now not isolating the various compositions in the tests?-So in theory the "high" as you call it isn't a factor?

I'm talking about the weed itself or those containing thc.

Those containing cbd only have no obstacles preventing them from getting regulatory approval eg GW pharma's portolio.

Lucuma

evolving_doors wrote: »

jh79 wrote: »

The same has happened down south too.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/cork-boy-3-gets-licence-to-use-cannabis-for-medicinal-purposes-1.2916977

Hold on.... didn't the minister say recently he never received any licence .

However, he said yesterday, “as of now”, there was no application pending in his office for a licence to use medicinal cannabis.

“I have no such application. If I had such an application, it would be absolutely processed expeditiously.”

So how did the boy get a licence!

The minister said he had received no application for Ava Barry, right?
He wasn't saying he had never received an application ever. He was saying he has none right now for Ava.
Which must be because her consultant isn't comfortable applying for one.

kleefarr

Prof Nutt and another report...

http://www.drugscience.org.uk/legislation/whocannabis

jh79

kleefarr wrote: »

Prof Nutt and another report...

http://www.drugscience.org.uk/legislation/whocannabis

Pages 36 to 39 must be depressing reading for those who believe in medicinal marijuana?

kleefarr

jh79 wrote: »

Pages 36 to 39 must be depressing reading for those who believe in medicinal marijuana?

Yeah.

"The trials showed a significant reduction in
mean pain scores but also an increase in CNS related adverse events specifically euphoria"

The shame.

jh79

kleefarr wrote: »

Yeah.

"The trials showed a significant reduction in
mean pain scores but also an increase in CNS related adverse events specifically euphoria"

The shame.

Modest effects in three illnesses and no better than whats already available. Some wonder drug alright.

kleefarr

jh79 wrote: »

Modest effects in three illnesses and no better than whats already available. Some wonder drug alright.

Better than the alternative in many cases.
It should be a free choice.

jh79

Pallative Care in Chemo;

A later Cochrane review by Smith in 2015 included 23 RCTs (1326 participants) using
stricter inclusion criteria than Machado. The review showed that cannabinoids were superior
to placebo but there was no difference in efficacy between cannabinoids and
prochlorperazine. In that scenario, participants reported a preference for cannabinoids in
cross-over studies. (Smith LA et al., 2015)

Chronic Pain;

et al., 2009)
The second review by Iskedjian published in 2007 included seven RCTs
(298 participants) of cannabis derivatives for MS related pain or similar neuropathic pains.
Cannabis preparations were more effective than placebo in reducing pain scores with the largest reduction achieved with cannabidiol/THC buccal spray (nabaximols). Cannabidiol and
dronabinol separately also showed effectiveness. Dizziness was the most commonly reported
adverse effect. (Iskedjian M et al., 2007)

MS;

6. Treatment of spasticity in multiple sclerosis
A review by Lakhan et al. in 2009 included 6 RCTs (820 participants). The
intervention was a combined extract of THC and cannabidiol. The studies showed a reduction
in spasticity and improved motility in patients with MS. The authors report that adverse
effects were generally well tolerated. (Lakhan SE and Rowland M, 2009)
A Cochrane review by Mills et al. published in 2007 specifically looked at treatments
for ataxia in MS. Ten studies of different interventions were included but only 2 studies (29
participants) used cannabis making it impossible to draw any meaningful conclusion

Dementia, HIV related illnesses, Dementia, Arthritiis no benefits shown.

And all the above studies are still not up to the normal regulatory standard!

Are we still pretending medical marijuana isn't about making access easier for recreational use?

jh79

kleefarr wrote: »

Better than the alternative in many cases.
It should be a free choice.

In which cases ? What page number in the report?

jh79

From Gino facebook;

"The debate on the future of the Medicinal Cannabis Bill will be now on Thursday 26th October from 5.50pm - 7.50pm. The vote on the debate will take place two weeks later on the 9th November at 1pm. We need as many people to contact their respective TD’s on how they are going to vote. We’ll be organising a protest outside the Dail on the 26th and hope to have the public gallery packed on the night. All indications are that all the main political parties are going to vote against the Bill going any further. This will be an absolute tragedy and condemn people further from getting safe and legal access to Medicinal Cannabis in Ireland. NOW ITS UP TO US TO MAKE THEM THINK AGAIN. MIM MIH."

Vera's Twitter

"Sinn Fein are now planning to propose a bill in November or later surronding medical cannabis which may sadly explain their change of heart in supporting the peoples present oppertunity for leglislation and the inability of their tds to answer phone calls from me which is very saddening and embarrassing for me.

If the present bill is defeated and this new leglislation proposed that leglislation will have to go through the same process and leave us years away from medical cannabis leglislation in Ireland."

theValheru853

Lucuma wrote:

So how did the boy get a licence!

The minister said he had received no application for Ava Barry, right? He wasn't saying he had never received an application ever. He was saying he has none right now for Ava. Which must be because her consultant isn't comfortable applying for one.[/quote]


The minister has recieved several applications for Ava Barry as far as I know. But the goal posts keep moving. The applications from the child's private neurologist were rejected because of just that..she's a private consultant and the public neurologist in the CUH cant apply because its an illegal substance and HSE rules don't allow her.

jh79

theValheru853 wrote: »

The minister said he had received no application for Ava Barry, right? He wasn't saying he had never received an application ever. He was saying he has none right now for Ava. Which must be because her consultant isn't comfortable applying for one.

The minister has recieved several applications for Ava Barry as far as I know. But the goal posts keep moving. The applications from the child's private neurologist were rejected because of just that..she's a private consultant and the public neurologist in the CUH cant apply because its an illegal substance and HSE rules don't allow her.

Not true at all.

"Yvonne Cahalane, who applied to Minister for Health, Simon Harris for the licence, said she was delighted it had been approved just days after they returned to Ireland"

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/cork-boy-3-gets-licence-to-use-cannabis-for-medicinal-purposes-1.2916977

Vera refused to get the evidence that is why she didn't get it. She wanted the licence based on the testimonials of others only.

jh79

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/warnings-over-fast-and-loose-medicinal-cannabis-supply-1.2995827

"Ms Cahalane, from Dunmanway, Co Cork, warned of the risks involved in self-medicating with medicinal cannabis"

"“It’s not just the dose; it’s also the interaction with existing medicines. Doctors can’t give the go-ahead if they don’t know what is going on at home.” Gauging the right level of anaesthetic to give to a child during a severe seizure can be difficult when the amount of medication taken is unknown, she pointed out."

Vera just wanted a licence granted and to administer it herself or for consultant with no experience in med cannabis to do it.

She wasted so much time for reasons we can only speculate about.

theValheru853

Yvonne Cahalane got a ministerial dispensation after being abroad, not a licence. Part of the conditions were that the childs treatment started abroad and then the child is overseen by a HSE neurologist here.
But the HSE neurologist here does not have anything to do with the prescribing of the medicinal cannabis as it is illegal for them to do so.
Vera is campaigning for it to be legal for the neurologist here to be able to prescribe medicinal cannabis

Edited because of misspelling

theValheru853

jh79 wrote:

"Ms Cahalane, from Dunmanway, Co Cork, warned of the risks involved in self-medicating with medicinal cannabis"

jh79 wrote:

"“It’s not just the dose; it’s also the interaction with existing medicines. Doctors can’t give the go-ahead if they don’t know what is going on at home.†Gauging the right level of anaesthetic to give to a child during a severe seizure can be difficult when the amount of medication taken is unknown, she pointed out."

jh79 wrote:

Vera just wanted a licence granted and to administer it herself or for consultant with no experience in med cannabis to do it.

jh79 wrote:

She wasted so much time for reasons we can only speculate about.

You are making it sound as if Vera want to be able to pop down to the shops and get the medicinal cannabis and decide the dosage herself as she sees fit.

You would want to get your facts right. Vera is campaigning to have it legal for Ava's neurologists to be able to prescribe the medicinal cannabis, including the dosage.

Of course Vera would administer it as any parent would any medicine prescribed by a doctor.

Do you think Ms Cahalane has the CUH neurologist calling to her house a couple times a day to administer her son's dosage?

Vera Twomey went to the Netherlands with Ava the understanding that the CUH public neurologist would oversee Ava on her return, not prescribe - oversee, as she does with Ms Cahalane's son. But apparently after a meeting between the dept of health a Ms Cahalane, the neurologist has reneged on her offer.

Anyone care to explain that

jh79

theValheru853 wrote: »

You are making it sound as if Vera want to be able to pop down to the shops and get the medicinal cannabis and decide the dosage herself as she sees fit.

You would want to get your facts right. Vera is campaigning to have it legal for Ava's neurologists to be able to prescribe the medicinal cannabis, including the dosage.

Of course Vera would administer it as any parent would any medicine prescribed by a doctor.

Do you think Ms Cahalane has the CUH neurologist calling to her house a couple times a day to administer her son's dosage?

Vera Twomey went to the Netherlands with Ava the understanding that the CUH public neurologist would oversee Ava on her return, not prescribe - oversee, as she does with Ms Cahalane's son. But apparently after a meeting between the dept of health a Ms Cahalane, the neurologist has reneged on her offer.

Anyone care to explain that

Sorry you misunderstood my post. Vera wanted to get it and admin it herself without getting the clinical evidence. She could of went to Holland a year ago but chose not too. Rather than spending a year getting the clinical evidence she wasted it campaigning with Gino.

Care to explain the delay in going to Holland to get the clinical evidence when it was always clear this was required to get the licence?

jh79

theValheru853 wrote: »

Yvonne Cahalane got a ministerial dispensation after being abroad, not a licence. Part of the conditions were that the childs treatment started abroad and then the child is overseen by a HSE neurologist here.
But the HSE neurologist here does not have anything to do with the prescribing of the medicinal cannabis as it is illegal for them to do so.
Vera is campaigning for it to be legal for the neurologist here to be able to prescribe medicinal cannabis

Edited because of misspelling

Exactly, you summed it up better than i did. She wasted over a year campaigning instead of doing what Yvonne C did.

She could of went to Holland at the beginning and have the dispensation by now.

harry Bailey esq

Winterlong wrote: »

My boss has MS and he finds smoking cannabis to be a massive help to him.

Its not a bad drug, certainly no worse than alchohol. I know some people say it is a 'gateway' to stronger drugs but I have yet to meet a violent stoner.

Government should legalise it and reap the rewards of the tax.

A mate of mine also has MS. He always smoked, but now we make edibles. He's able to play his guitar again and he's much better on his feet so there's no denying it works. Medicinal yes. Recreational no. The cannabis industry employs thousands in Ireland, not gangsters for the best part. If would leave all those people unemployed.

Lucuma

theValheru853 wrote: »

jh79 wrote:

"Ms Cahalane, from Dunmanway, Co Cork, warned of the risks involved in self-medicating with medicinal cannabis"

jh79 wrote:

"“It’s not just the dose; it’s also the interaction with existing medicines. Doctors can’t give the go-ahead if they don’t know what is going on at home.†Gauging the right level of anaesthetic to give to a child during a severe seizure can be difficult when the amount of medication taken is unknown, she pointed out."

jh79 wrote:

Vera just wanted a licence granted and to administer it herself or for consultant with no experience in med cannabis to do it.

jh79 wrote:

She wasted so much time for reasons we can only speculate about.

You are making it sound as if Vera want to be able  to pop down to the shops and get the  medicinal cannabis and decide the dosage herself as she sees fit.

You would want to get your facts right. Vera is campaigning to have it legal for Ava's neurologists to be able to prescribe the medicinal cannabis, including the dosage.

Of course Vera would administer it as any parent would any medicine prescribed by a doctor.

Do you think Ms Cahalane has the CUH neurologist calling to her house a couple times a day to administer her son's dosage?

Vera Twomey went to the Netherlands with Ava the understanding that the CUH public neurologist would oversee Ava on her return, not prescribe - oversee, as she does with Ms Cahalane's son.  But apparently after a meeting between the dept of health a Ms Cahalane, the neurologist has reneged on her offer.

Anyone care to explain that

The CUH public neurologist has reneged her offer just for Vera or has reneged her offer for both Ms. Cahalane and Vera? 
If the former, then are you implying that Ms Cahalane told the neurologist something that would make the neurologist not want to work with Vera?

theValheru853

To my knowledge she was attempting to get it legalised here, so that she wouldn't have to take the Ava abroad and split up her family.

There should be no need to gather more clinical evidence of its effects on epilipsy. There was already plenty clinical evidence out there.

As long as her daughter is on the medicinal cannabis in holland and it is not legalised here, the little girl cannont come home...ever.

jh79

theValheru853 wrote: »

To my knowledge she was attempting to get it legalised here, so that she wouldn't have to take the Ava abroad and split up her family.

There should be no need to gather more clinical evidence of its effects on epilipsy. There was already plenty clinical evidence out there.

As long as her daughter is on the medicinal cannabis in holland and it is not legalised here, the little girl cannont come home...ever.

So why can't she get the dispensation like the other family?