The EPL - beginning of the end ?

TheDoc

Feel that the discussion in general around Skys dropped viewership totally missed the point.

The issue there is in the increase of illegal streaming, dodgy boxes and basically methods to circumvent paying Sky. I'm using these methods a number of years now and no longer have a Sky package.

The premier league, like every league, has a large amount of rubbish games every year. This isn't any different. I'm a United fan, and I watched all of Uniteds games. I'm not interested in West Brom vs Stoke, and have no interest in paying for it either. To say the league is getting worse in excitement or quality is looking back with rose tinted glasses. Every season has a rake of games that are absolutely horrible. Every season the bottom ten are typically poor teams, and the matches they play against each other are typically poor.

The big change is the introduction of Bt Sport. When I went to price both, it came in at over €110 a month, to have both packages to ensure I had covered for United a few years ago. So that is when I decided to change my method. I rang and cancelled Sky Sports and havn't had it since. And with the advent of Netflix and various other stuff, this is the first year I don't have an active paying Sky subscription.

As with anything there is a point where customers just say no. The companies involved typically lose sight of this, they get into these bidding wars and inflate, inflate inflate the pricing expecting people will pay anything. No surprise that they don't and there is a line.

The Champions League is a general issue in terms of quality. The dilution of that tournament with more teams and it's seeding basically make the group stages a formality. There is way too many cannon fodder games. For a few seasons now I'll watch the "odd" group stage game that on paper looks good, but I only get interested and start following it in the knockout stages. The same is happening with the Euros, I didn't like or enjoy the format this year at all and felt I watched way too much stodgy ****e. And the World Cup will just get worse when they expand.

There is a lot to be said for having higher quality teams, player and matches packed into a shorter timeframe. It's why the Uefa Cup has such a bad rep, it's a slog of a tournament yet when you get into the knockout stages, it serves up fantastic games.

Anyway I think the bottom line issue is while Sky and BT get into massive bidding wars, they are forgetting there is simply a line customers will not cross in term of expenditure for football. I'd expect that decrease in viewership to continue as the coverage gets further fragmented across broadcasters. And that will just drive people further into illegal methods. Not only are massive amounts of fans in the UK being priced out of attending games they used too, now they are being priced out of watching the games on telly.

At some point they will need to deal with what the Movie and Music industry have struggled with for two decades. The solution is there, the template is there for what will work and draw in customers, but Sky and whoever will go through years and years of warfare to keep things the way they were, instead of adapting their model. And it is down to Sky and BT. The PL will be happy as larry to get this massive money and have bidding wars. They won't drive the change. Eventually Sky or BT will need to say "nah, sorry, not interested at that price"

TheDoc

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

my local tesco aren't making as much as they used to. I didn't feel like buying food anymore so me and a load of others just steal it instead.

If Tesco raised the price of milk to €20 a litre, you would. Or you would go to a local farmer and cut a deal, or you'd arrange maybe a group purchase scheme with neighbours for milk.

Point being when a commoditity or service reaches the point of longer being justifiably priced, people will begin to look at alternative methods to acquire the same thing cheaper.

I pirated music since internet first came into this country. I was pirating for years and years and years. Then someone had the idea "Well what is we built a platform that is first a really good application, and then provides a model where users consume what they want for a fee"

I'm now a Spotify Premium Subscriber since it first came out.

The counter argument I hear from many, including friends who are in bands, or when I have this debate with people involved in the industry, they typically complain about how they receive pittance or pennies for their work.

What they are actually saying, is that they don't get what they used to, and the gravy train has come to a hault. Surprise everyone, consumers and customers and end users drive the markets and drive pricing. You can try all the tricks and stuff in the world to try keep your little corner, but if customers arn't having it, you need to get smart and get innovative.

TheDoc

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Even better, if Sky offered a Season Ticket option for online viewing so that you could view all your favourite teams games then that would also appeal to people. Particularly if you priced it competitively at say €250/€300 a year.

That is basically the solution. But this will never come about in the short term because of the profits involved. Unfortunately no club is going to dilute their own share of the Tv revenue and go along with this. So when none of the stakeholders have the stomach for it, it will never be on the table.

However when you have countries with a lower standard of living, or areas where the population is more dispersed, this option is there. I know in South Korea, other areas of Asia along with some places in India and the middle east, you can purchase a digital season ticket, which provides you TV coverage of all of United's premier league and European matches.

In the States, NBCSports have a setup where they have licensing for all EPL matches every weekend. They retail this in various packages to customers. But even getting the full package which is pretty cheap in comparison, they have a platform via the TV and Online where you can watch matches in 720p.

Their online platform is actually a joy to behold and a brilliant template going forward. They have all the matches available for which you access via an account you get from them when you sign up, and the streams are 720p and not a whiff of lag.

I'd happily pay an annual fee to have just United games. But why would Sky, BT or United want that, when they can bleed me for €110+ a month for coverage? I guess they won't because I'm using alternative methods for which they don't see a penny, which is a pity.

But I'm sure like movies, TV and music, as more and more people move to those methods and realise combating it is nearly impossible, they will finally adopt platforms and technology that bring the customers back paying.

TheDoc

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I've long since thought clubs should run their own match distribution online with licensing deals for local TV markets as they deem appropriate.

As above, they do this in various countries, but just not in the UK or Ireland since its the bread and butter market for the Premier league, where they have the current model of you bleeding you.

Like take for example the guy who sits next to me in work. He is an Everton fan, think he has seen them on TV twice this year, and they only get televised when playing the bigger teams. So he is using illegal streaming to watch them week in week out. There is someone Sky and BT will simply never have as a customer. And yet if they offered a package for Everton fans.....

Like it's easy to forget that the Premier League is not just United and Liverpool, which is the predominant fanbase here for the EPL (I guess) There is so many people that are literally not catered for.

Harry Palmr

TheDoc wrote: »

At some point they will need to deal with what the Movie and Music industry have struggled with for two decades. The solution is there, the template is there for what will work and draw in customers, but Sky and whoever will go through years and years of warfare to keep things the way they were, instead of adapting their model. And it is down to Sky and BT. The PL will be happy as larry to get this massive money and have bidding wars. They won't drive the change. Eventually Sky or BT will need to say "nah, sorry, not interested at that price"

BT are in a much stronger strategic position than SKY, after all they are the backbone company for much of the UK's telecom industry, SKY on the other hand is overwhelmingly reliant on rights for other peoples products. Even Sky Broadband relies on the "last mile" of copper which is owned by Openreach (BT), so if BT bail out they still have so much else, SKY without pay football as the subscription driver will have much less so they'll be the ones who hang on longest in the face of competition from American owned companies.

Buford T. Justice XIX

lawred2 wrote: »

I watch the odd Everton game online... Totally in isolation. Wouldn't have any interest in any other game during the weekend. Wouldn't even know results from the weekend just done. I don't care. The childish love of the game is well and truly gone.

Heard something over the last few days about some club or other putting a salary 'cap' in place for under 17s.

40k a week.

Fck that.

Liverpool have put a 40k/year salary cap on their younger players.

Not a week.

TheDoc

Harry Palmr wrote: »

BT are in a much stronger strategic position than SKY, after all they are the backbone company for much of the UK's telecom industry, SKY on the other hand is overwhelmingly reliant on rights for other peoples products. Even Sky Broadband relies on the "last mile" of copper which is owned by Openreach (BT), so if BT bail out they still have so much else, SKY without pay football as the subscription driver will have much less so they'll be the ones who hang on longest in the face of competition from American owned companies.

Yeah but don't overestimate how Sky could argue competition laws on that ground.

Many people forget we have a Fibre Optic BT infrastructure laid down in many parts of Ireland, that will never be used thanks to Eircom getting an injunction against them back in the day based on competition grounds. Gas isn't it.

They had a judge agree that BT would overnight dominate the market and put Eircom out of business, because of their superior infrastructure and ability to charge lower pricing to customers. Couldn't make it up.

At the same time, I wouldn't underestimate the general business Sky do from their TV packages. While the movies might well be on the wane with the advent of netflix and just general pirating, they have been pretty innovative with their own on demand services. I believe they arn't far off just offering the on-demand service as a standalone thing that doesn't require the base subscription.

But they have a lot of TV on the go, and their EPG is far superior to say Virgins here, so that will keep a lot of TV customers happy.

There is just a general trend and change in how consumers "consume" content, and Sky so far have shown to be somewhat flexible and innovative in their offerings, so I wouldn't overly worry about them.

greendom

TheDoc wrote: »

Yeah but don't overestimate how Sky could argue competition laws on that ground.

Many people forget we have a Fibre Optic BT infrastructure laid down in many parts of Ireland, that will never be used thanks to Eircom getting an injunction against them back in the day based on competition grounds. Gas isn't it.

They had a judge agree that BT would overnight dominate the market and put Eircom out of business, because of their superior infrastructure and ability to charge lower pricing to customers. Couldn't make it up.

At the same time, I wouldn't underestimate the general business Sky do from their TV packages. While the movies might well be on the wane with the advent of netflix and just general pirating, they have been pretty innovative with their own on demand services. I believe they arn't far off just offering the on-demand service as a standalone thing that doesn't require the base subscription.

But they have a lot of TV on the go, and their EPG is far superior to say Virgins here, so that will keep a lot of TV customers happy.

There is just a general trend and change in how consumers "consume" content, and Sky so far have shown to be somewhat flexible and innovative in their offerings, so I wouldn't overly worry about them.

Wow - this country never ceases to amaze me !

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Billy86 wrote: »

Unsure on how the finances would work out but, can someone correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I have a memory of new albums being £/€25-30 right around the turn of the century. I was 14 when it turned 2000, and remember not just thinking "what a ripoff" but "where would I even get all that money from in the first place!?" €30 in February 2002 allowing for inflation would be about €38.10 today, apparently.

Was that a thing or is my mind just playing tricks on me?

I remember paying £25 for a CD, unbelievable rip off.


I stream games even if they are on free tv almost out of habit. Sky/BT is so expensive it is hard to justify paying for games.

rob316

I cancelled Sky nearly 2 years ago because for the simple reason, even been a Liverpool supporter I still had to resort to **** streams for a large number of matches as my €100 subscription to Sky and BT didn't cover them. Its scandalous really.

Give me the option of paying €300-€500 per year to watch every PL game on a crystal clear HD stream and I'll pay it gladly.

When the next round of rights bidding comes along and it's less than previous maybe then things will change. It will probably be more though.
SKY and BT are the only ones who can burst this so called bubble.

I'm 30 and I know very few people who watch Sky legally. I have a paid streaming subscription for £1 per week, its not perfect but it does me fine.

Mr.H

I have to say as a pool fan, this season there has been only a couple of games so far not on TV. I have the eir sports pack and sky and even the one or two 3pm kick offs that weren't on TV I hot to see on football first on sky sports that night which suited as I was working until 7 anyway.

I use to stream but it's stressful enough watching the game without cursing at a stream as well.

My2p use to be brilliant when it was active but some if the sites now are rubbish

I assume (hope)it's OK to name a n old streaming site that doesn't exist anymore......

NIMAN

Didn't Sky Italia offer season tickets so you could watch every single game of your chosen team? (at least the away ones, not wanting to affect home attendances eg someone living in Turin couldn't buy a ticket to watch all Juve's home games, but could see all their away games).

Richard Hillman

SantryRed wrote: »

You got to remember that Gamepass isn't available within the United States though.

Also, it's in UK law that live football can't be shown between 2:45-5:15 and that is completely the right thing to do. I can see the package being available internationally soon enough though. NBC already offer this service in the States.

Most people are looking at this from the view of people in Ireland whereas it's more important to view it from the people actually living within the UK.

They have the NFL Sunday Ticket via the TV services. It's basically the same thing as game pass except on TV. The only restriction is the local games are subject to black-outs.

If I just watched my own team and no other games throughout the season I'd be ok with that.

There's a huge potential market for team only subscriptions for sure.

The Sky project is out of date

NIMAN

RoboKlopp wrote: »

If I just watched my own team and no other games throughout the season I'd be ok with that.

There's a huge potential market for team only subscriptions for sure.

The Sky project is out of date

Do you not think you need to see how the opposition is playing sometimes?

Damien360

RoboKlopp wrote: »

If I just watched my own team and no other games throughout the season I'd be ok with that.

There's a huge potential market for team only subscriptions for sure.

The Sky project is out of date

That would work for maybe the perennial top 6 but after that the fan base wouldn't be big enough. It has to make commercial sense otherwise we end up with 2 or 3 dominant teams and then the rest.

Besides, if your team has a bad season and half the fan base refuses to pay in protest, that again would hurt the team.

Sky have a good mobile app with highlights and goals during all the games and if they are on the tv, you have Sky go for the full game. Mobile is the future and they are reaching out to there.

Price is key. I took the sky sports deal at €20 per month. That's my price point for me to forget about streaming for free for the year. Above that and it makes no sense.

NIMAN

I'd consider Sky TV again for 20 a month, but lets be honest that would get you next to nothing from them.

Their prices will never entice me back. I am shock ed to hear what some people pay for their TV packages. How anyone could justify paying the guts of 100/month for TV is beyond me.

Billy86

Richard Hillman wrote: »

They have the NFL Sunday Ticket via the TV services. It's basically the same thing as game pass except on TV. The only restriction is the local games are subject to black-outs.

I think it's home games that don't sell out in the NFL, or sell below 90% or so of their tickets - it was a real problem in Jacksonville, which is part of why their team (the Jaguars) have really been at the forefront of the NFL London games despite being far from a 'showpiece' team for the league. I think the rules have been under a temporary suspension for the last 2-3 years though, due to some FCC ruling.

eh i dunno

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2016/10/25/modern-technology-is-in-danger-of-leaving-the-premier-league-beh/

Fr Tod Umptious

eh i dunno wrote: »

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2016/10/25/modern-technology-is-in-danger-of-leaving-the-premier-league-beh/

That's exactly it, the 90 mins of the game itself is no longer the centre of attention, its it and all the other stuff going on around.

NIMAN

Boards is a good example of it.

On the football match threads, you will have hundreds of comments over the space of a 90min game, everything from "that was never a corner" to more in-depth analysis, all typed by someone on their phone/tablet/laptop whilst giving their undivided attention to the game itself.

Fr Tod Umptious

NIMAN wrote: »

Boards is a good example of it.

On the football match threads, you will have hundreds of comments over the space of a 90min game, everything from "that was never a corner" to more in-depth analysis, all typed by someone on their phone/tablet/laptop whilst giving their undivided attention to the game itself.

So what is the future ?

All games available live online and on demand for a period of time with selected games on TV each week ?

Follow my team packages ?

Red Zone type show with goals and big events as or straight after they happen. ? I notice SSN were doing something like this for the league cup games last night and BT do it for CL.

keith_d99

Reminds me of the time when HMV were looking for £20 (not euro btw) for a CD .... and look at the way that turned out!

Piracy has become more mainstream ... you don't need to be tech savy any more!
It was always going to happen - Sky + BT overpaid so need to squeeze more money from subscribers (even the non-sports ones).

Look at the success of Netflix and Spotify ... People will pay if the price is right!

The way people consume media has changed .... I can't see Sky even existing in 10 years time!

Fr Tod Umptious

keith_d99 wrote: »

Reminds me of the time when HMV were looking for £20 (not euro btw) for a CD .... and look at the way that turned out!

Piracy has become more mainstream ... you don't need to be tech savy any more!
It was always going to happen - Sky + BT overpaid so need to squeeze more money from subscribers (even the non-sports ones).

Look at the success of Netflix and Spotify ... People will pay if the price is right!

The way people consume media has changed .... I can't see Sky even existing in 10 years time!

Oh it will, but it will be selling multiple services on multiple platforms, and it may have even been bought for billions by some much bigger consortium at that stage.

It's not about the illegal streaming even though it's a factor, as been said it's about the way the game is consumed, the traditional sit down at the TV (or even PC) and watch for 90 mins is gone.

And the price will never be right, it will always be a premium product.

eh i dunno

I'm browsing boards while watching this match. Bring back Nokia 3210s and I might be able to concentrate on the game with out checking Facebook, Twitter, flashscore etc

dr.kenneth noisewater

I know it'll never happen but a season pass for your favorite team would be great. The entry of BT has messed up the market and made everything more expensive as now you need 2 packages. Got Sky's special offer for €20 per month for a year around the Ryder cup but will be cancelling in May when the season is over

citytillidie

dr.kenneth noisewater wrote: »

I know it'll never happen but a season pass for your favorite team would be great. The entry of BT has messed up the market and made everything more expensive as now you need 2 packages. Got Sky's special offer for €20 per month for a year around the Ryder cup but will be cancelling in May when the season is over

BT did not mess up the market, it was OFCOM and EU market rules about competition that made the Premier League split the coverage, 1st with Setanta , then ESPN and not BT. Just BT have more money then Sky

eagle eye

I think the people that are addicted to social media are the ones who made the Premier league as big as it is now. They'll all go off and watch something else eventually but there will always be millions of football lovers and the game will live on and the Premier league will live on. The money might drop a bit but it'll definitely survive.

The one thing that has crept into football is this insatiable appetite for knowledge about footballer's private lives and I'd imagine this is the social media types who are into this stuff. I've never cared a jot about a footballer's private life but I've been forced to read it in recent times because you just cannot escape it.

It's this hunger for knowledge about people's private lives that turns me off social media.

irelandrover

I think the future will be something like the goals show on BT. I live in Holland and pay 10 euro a month for a package for the premier league, la liga and champions league. For the champions league they have a goals show also.

I think eventually it will also happen for the premier league and la liga. They will see that the ratings for this are much better than they get for sunday matches as there is always something happening so people watch it more.

We'll start to see matches played more in groups such as 5 matches 3pm saturday, 4 at 3pm Sunday and maybe 1 on Monday evening. The premier league will realise they are diluting their product too much.

ERG89

irelandrover wrote: »

I think the future will be something like the goals show on BT. I live in Holland and pay 10 euro a month for a package for the premier league, la liga and champions league. For the champions league they have a goals show also.

I think eventually it will also happen for the premier league and la liga. They will see that the ratings for this are much better than they get for sunday matches as there is always something happening so people watch it more.

We'll start to see matches played more in groups such as 5 matches 3pm saturday, 4 at 3pm Sunday and maybe 1 on Monday evening. The premier league will realise they are diluting their product too much.

This weekend Sky have 4 games, 5 if you include the 3pm kickoff. BT have another. You always have 4/5 Serie A games, 3/4 bundesliga and Ligue 1 games every weekend. Then you have Liga NOS, Eredivise, Belgium Jupiler League, Championship and Scottish League . It's probably too much & too expensive to watch but honestly I only fully watch Liverpool games, evening games , MOTD and EFS on Sunday (the new even shorter lets get out of here quick format is an over rushed disaster tho).
I think PL viewing figures are down cause the games can be quite bad to watch half the time. I watched an hour of Middlesbrough vs West Brom earlier this season it was probably the least entertaining contest/match/game in sport this year. The big games then boil down to be one sided wins or drab affairs with an alarming lack of quality for the money spent. With the Champions League the last few years I imagine more people see how the PL teams compare to the best and maybe some question the quality now.
Tbf I don't think that the Champions League or international scene (which I dread) has ever been so bad to watch either which makes me imagine that football bores people away rather than diluting the product too.

irelandrover

ERG89 wrote: »

This weekend Sky have 4 games, 5 if you include the 3pm kickoff. BT have another. You always have 4/5 Serie A games, 3/4 bundesliga and Ligue 1 games every weekend. Then you have Liga NOS, Eredivise, Belgium Jupiler League, Championship and Scottish League . It's probably too much & too expensive to watch but honestly I only fully watch Liverpool games, evening games , MOTD and EFS on Sunday (the new even shorter lets get out of here quick format is an over rushed disaster tho).
I think PL viewing figures are down cause the games can be quite bad to watch half the time. I watched an hour of Middlesbrough vs West Brom earlier this season it was probably the least entertaining contest/match/game in sport this year. The big games then boil down to be one sided wins or drab affairs with an alarming lack of quality for the money spent. With the Champions League the last few years I imagine more people see how the PL teams compare to the best and maybe some question the quality now.
Tbf I don't think that the Champions League or international scene (which I dread) has ever been so bad to watch either which makes me imagine that football bores people away rather than diluting the product too.

I used to keep an eye on Champions league games with one eye while doing something else. Now i find i sit down and watch for the full games because i am getting the exciting moments of all 8 games. Therefore there always seems to be something happening to keep my interest.

If the same thing happens with the premierleague with 5 games on a saturday then id also sit down to watch it. As even 5 boring games have enough happening to keep my interest. So freom that terrible Middlesborough vs West Brom game you'd only see the exciting moments.

Fr Tod Umptious

irelandrover wrote: »

I used to keep an eye on Champions league games with one eye while doing something else. Now i find i sit down and watch for the full games because i am getting the exciting moments of all 8 games. Therefore there always seems to be something happening to keep my interest.

If the same thing happens with the premierleague with 5 games on a saturday then id also sit down to watch it. As even 5 boring games have enough happening to keep my interest. So freom that terrible Middlesborough vs West Brom game you'd only see the exciting moments.

And that's why NFL Red Zone works so well.

Most games are still in the traditional time slot of 1pm and 4pm starts, so you have from 1pm to approx 7.30pm of coverage.

The premiere league is all over the clock.

10 games could be in two blocks of 4 with two others then on the own at other times

Too many casual fans who flitter away when their team isn't doing great. Majority of EPL fans in Ireland fall into this category

eagle eye

RoboKlopp wrote: »

Too many casual fans who flitter away when their team isn't doing great. Majority of EPL fans in Ireland fall into this category

I don't agree with this at all. The social media aspect disappears because nobody is interested in discussing their team with them anymore once they get relegated.

I rarely talk about Blackburn Rovers on here these days because nobody wants to talk about them but I'll happily discuss them with anybody that wants to talk about them anytime. I still follow the team and that will never change even if they get relegated out of the league, which isn't beyond reality without our current owners.

I've a lot of friends who follow Championship clubs and they'll have a chat with me about them when I ask or if they are playing Rovers. It's just the media loving types that don't want to talk about clubs not in the Champion's league or at least the Premier league and they dominate most discussion online about soccer these days.

Dirty Dingus McGee

RoboKlopp wrote: »

Too many casual fans who flitter away when their team isn't doing great. Majority of EPL fans in Ireland fall into this category

What exactly would you expect from fans in Ireland.

They're never going to have the same feeling for a team as fans who come from the city the team is based in.

eagle eye

eagle eye wrote: »

I don't agree with this at all. The social media aspect disappears because nobody is interested in discussing their team with them anymore once they get relegated.

I rarely talk about Blackburn Rovers on here these days because nobody wants to talk about them but I'll happily discuss them with anybody that wants to talk about them anytime. I still follow the team and that will never change even if they get relegated out of the league, which isn't beyond reality without our current owners.

I've a lot of friends who follow Championship clubs and they'll have a chat with me about them when I ask or if they are playing Rovers. It's just the media loving types that don't want to talk about clubs not in the Champion's league or at least the Premier league and they dominate most discussion online about soccer these days.

I know a lot of people who follow mainly utd and liverpool, follow being the word. Basically, watch them every now and again especially when on a good run. A quick conversation and you know they aren't big fans. No issue with this by the way. It's just in relation to the thread topic and watching on tv

mikeym

A lot of interesting comments that are relevant to Irish Premier League fans.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/oct/26/football-fans-stream-sky-bt-sport-live-viewers?


People are simply sick of paying too much for an over-hyped product.

keeponhurling

In the Netherlands, the cost to add FOX Sports - who show all the English Premier League games - is €10-15 per month.
Obviously they feel that people won't pay more than that.

It will come down in Ireland or UK, once people stop paying.

NIMAN

The product just isn't as enticing any more....I mean Sky has had an advert running towards the end of last week and into the weekend, advertising its games.

Everton v West Ham (a big game in the 70s and 80s, but no more)
Southampton v Chelsea (an interesting enough one, given how Soton are playing)
...and then the big one for Monday Night Football
Stoke v Swansea.....sweet Jesus....

batistuta9

What do you want them to do? You can only tell after the fact if the game will be any good.

Everton & west Ham would be two of the best supported clubs in England too.

NIMAN

batistuta9 wrote: »

What do you want them to do? You can only tell after the fact if the game will be any good.

Everton & west Ham would be two of the best supported clubs in England too.

I know they have to show a certain team a certain number of times, and some will say that they are getting the muck games out of the way, in the hope that they can show bigger teams at the 'business end' of the season.

But bottom line is that in a world where people are watching less and less live games, the likes of Stoke v Swansea isn't going to help.

batistuta9

NIMAN wrote: »

I know they have to show a certain team a certain number of times, and some will say that they are getting the muck games out of the way, in the hope that they can show bigger teams at the 'business end' of the season.

But bottom line is that in a world where people are watching less and less live games, the likes of Stoke v Swansea isn't going to help.

Are people watching less games though?
Red Monday was Sky's biggest audience for 3 years. Whether that figure is all games or just liv-man u idk.

Stoke, I used to read a thread on a fan site of theirs about an online steaming service.
Those guys loved it, the ol tinternet means they or any teams fans can watch all the games they want.

The steamers would tell you the same though, less bandwidth required for certain teams.

NIMAN

batistuta9 wrote: »

Are people watching less games though?
Red Monday was Sky's biggest audience for 3 years. Whether that figure is all games or just liv-man u idk.

Stoke, I used to read a thread on a fan site of theirs about an online steaming service.
Those guys loved it, the ol tinternet means they or any teams fans can watch all the games they want.

The steamers would tell you the same though, less bandwidth required for certain teams.

To be fair, Sky did hype it to the hilt.
I even started watching it myself, but didn't make it to 90mins due to the entertainment value of zero which was on offer.

I'll know not to buy into the next Red or Blue whatever.

Richard Hillman

Stoke and Swansea is borderline insulting for subscribers.

Unfortunately with the appearance rule, Champions League and UEFA Cup we get sub standard games that are meaningless.

batistuta9

I don't know guys, I'm not really sure what you want then.
Big game - turns out poor, don't want that anymore.
Other matches are judged on quality before they're played.

Is it cost of the subscriptions is the issue or what?

Fr Tod Umptious

batistuta9 wrote: »

I don't know guys, I'm not really sure what you want then.
Big game - turns out poor, don't want that anymore.
Other matches are judged on quality before they're played.

Is it cost of the subscriptions is the issue or what?

People want choice, they want everything.

If hyped up game A is terrible they want to switch over to low profile game B that is 3 all.

I don't watch NFL games on a Sunday anymore, I watch Red Zone where I can watch every game.

EPL needs the same.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

People want choice, they want everything.

If hyped up game A is terrible they want to switch over to low profile game B that is 3 all.

I don't watch NFL games on a Sunday anymore, I watch Red Zone where I can watch every game.

EPL needs the same.

That's can work in a stop/status game like American Football but soccer is more dynamic with the ball in play more than not. An NFL game lasts 4 hours with one hour of play. Soccer lasts less than 2 hours with the ball in play for over an hour.

A team subscription would be my desire, I really don't care about watching other games much.

If there was an adequate broadband service available, I wouldn't have a sports subscription at all.

batistuta9

The choice is there though.

Is Redzone similar to the CL show on BT?

If it is you aren't really watching every game, like a live match of the day

lawred2

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

That's can work in a stop/status game like American Football but soccer is more dynamic with the ball in play more than not. An NFL game lasts 4 hours with one hour of play. Soccer lasts less than 2 hours with the ball in play for over an hour.

A team subscription would be my desire, I really don't care about watching other games much.

If there was an adequate broadband service available, I wouldn't have a sports subscription at all.

Same. I barely watch Everton games. Couldn't give a fiddlers about all the other hyped up non events.

If you just want entertaining games week in week out you're probably not a massive fan anyway.

Football doesn't work like that. There will be plenty of dull matches throughout the season.