Why can't we leave the clocks on summertime year round?

Jimbob1977

pedigree 6 wrote: »

Right so this Saturday night the clocks go back an hour.
Why do we have to do this?
Does this happen all over the world this weekend?

I get the argument that it was to help schoolchildren get to school in the mornings. But that was when most children walked or cycled to school.
Nowadays kids are driven to school by their parents or schoolbus.

Are there any other reasons why the clocks have to go back an hour?

Can we just not leave it the way it is.
I like my bright evenings.:mad:

Many countries don't operate clock changes.

In West Africa, they tend to use UTC+1 all year. No change at any point.

West Africa tends to be the same time as Ireland in summer because we move to UTC+1 from March to October. They stay at UTC+1.

In winter, we revert to UTC and they stick with UTC+1.... thus opening a one-hour gap.

I believe that Sydney changed into summertime (forward) a few weeks ago.

In our summer, we are nine hours behind Sydney.

For October, we are temporarily ten hours behind Sydney.

Tomorrow, we become eleven hours behind Sydney.

United States will change next week, so NYC is only four hours behind Dublin tomorrow.

As a complete aside, if anyone remembers Around the World in 80 Days, Passepartout accidentally realised they had crossed the International Date Line in the Pacific Ocean and didn't miss the deadline.... they gained 24 hours by crossing a line and made the Reform Club before the bell chimed.

Another piece of trivia (no longer true). Where can you throw a basketball and it will land one hour later?

The school gym in College Corner on the Ohio/Indiana State Line.

One hoop was in Ohio.... it observed Eastern Time. The shooter was throwing from Indiana on Central Time.

A time zone adjustment put an end to this

Capt'n Midnight

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

Many countries don't operate clock changes.

In West Africa, they tend to use UTC+1 all year. No change at any point.

Between the tropics there's 12 hours of daylight every day so there isn't any daylight to save.

Even further north, and further back in time the Romans used a simple time system. When the sun rose it was 6 in the morning. When it set it was 6 in the evening. Flexible hours indeed.

YFlyer

somesoldiers wrote: »

I was trying to organise two separate calls with some colleagues in Sydney & San Francisco during the week and my head almost exploded trying to work out a suitable time that wouldn't mean me coming in a stupid o'clock or them having to stay too late

Oz clocks go forward in Oct back in April
SF are 8 hours behind now but 7 behind GMT which all changes next week when our clocks go back or does it.....I give up

and Muricans seem completely oblivious to any of this going on at all which doesn't help

Nothing worse than having an online meeting with American partners.

The Raptor

It's 18.10 right now and it's getting dark. By tomorrow it'll be getting dark at 17.10.

I don't ever remember it getting dark that early at this time of year.

B.A._Baracus

The Raptor wrote: »

It's 18.10 right now and it's getting dark. By tomorrow it'll be getting dark at 17.10.

I don't ever remember it getting dark that early at this time of year.

Speaking of which, I remember it being dark one year at 4:30pm. Talking 20 years ago or something. My dad was coming in from work. Was a really weird sight.

The Raptor

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Speaking of which, I remember it being dark one year at 4:30pm. Talking 20 years ago or something. My dad was coming in from work. Was a really weird sight.

That was be around Christmas?. It's dark very early then.

B.A._Baracus

The Raptor wrote: »

That was be around Christmas?. It's dark very early then.

Couldn't tell you the exact month as it was so long ago. But your probably right being around Christmas.
It's strange tho as I've never noticed it get dark that early since. Like full on pitch black at 4:30. In recent years closet has been 5pm / 5:15.

I remember working in a call centre about ten years ago doing 12 hour shifts. I'd walk into work when it was still dark and would leave when it got dark again. Seeing how there was a cafe in the building I didn't have to even leave the place on lunch. It was so weird seeing the sun on days off lol.

LordSutch

pedigree 6 wrote: »

Why can't we leave the clocks on summertime year round?

In a word 'Scotland'.

That's the real reason for the clocks changing, what with them being so far north & all that.

CrabRevolution

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Couldn't tell you the exact month as it was so long ago. But your probably right being around Christmas.
It's strange tho as I've never noticed it get dark that early since. Like full on pitch black at 4:30. In recent years closet has been 5pm / 5:15.

I remember working in a call centre about ten years ago doing 12 hour shifts. I'd walk into work when it was still dark and would leave when it got dark again. Seeing how there was a cafe in the building I didn't have to even leave the place on lunch. It was so weird seeing the sun on days off lol.

You're almost certainly remembering wrong, or lived at a higher latitude at the time. Sunset in December 1996 was just after 4PM, Sunset in December 2016 will be....just after 4PM.

http://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin?month=12&year=1996

http://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin?month=12&year=2016

B.A._Baracus

CrabRevolution wrote: »

You're almost certainly remembering wrong, or lived at a higher latitude at the time. Sunset in December 1996 was just after 4PM, Sunset in December 2016 will be....just after 4PM.

http://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin?month=12&year=1996

http://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin?month=12&year=2016

I don't know when the year was mate. Going back around or over 20 years ago. Was only a kid at the time.

But sheesh you actually went to the trouble of pulling those links?

Capt'n Midnight

LordSutch wrote: »

In a word 'Scotland'.

That's the real reason for the clocks changing, what with them being so far north & all that.

Last time I went to Scotland I had to set my watch back ... to the mid 1980's.

CrabRevolution

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

I don't know when the year was mate. Going back around or over 20 years ago. Was only a kid at the time.

But sheesh you actually went to the trouble of pulling those links?

Newgrange is still in line with the length of day (give or take) after 5000 years, so the idea that the length of day has changed in your lifetime is a bit ridiculous. I just presented the facts.

B.A._Baracus

CrabRevolution wrote: »

Newgrange is still in line with the length of day (give or take) after 5000 years, so the idea that the length of day has changed in your lifetime is a bit ridiculous. I just presented the facts.

Sorry I don't know if it was your intention.. But you kinda come off as petty. I said something in passing.. Hey look maybe your right. But who gives a sh*t like to go off and post links... Then coming back with oh well new Grange etc. Who cares? :pac: is this a serious topic? We're all talking about the clocks going back. It's hardly talking about a referendum.

Not to go off topic... But I've noticed this alot on boards lately. Everyone wants to be right. No matter how small or trivial something is. Even to the point of trying to be right when opinions are expressed.

But alas maybe it's just me. But if I am correct your response to this was you are still right. While I'm still wrong. Right :pac:

LordSutch

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Last time I went to Scotland I had to set my watch back ... to the mid 1980's.

That bad is it? and maybe if they win their 2nd UK exit ref they can have their own time zone too

Failing that, they can keep changing their clocks twice yearly, while the rest of us stay on GMT.

bodhrandude

I'll tell you something I wish we could have just the two seasons, spring and summer and drop the winter and autumn seasons.

citytillidie

Germans did it during World War one moving the clocks forward in the summer time to help save coal during the war now it is used to help save energy in the summer months

The Raptor

Has the time changed yet?

I woke up from a nap and i don't know.

Ghost Train

The Raptor wrote: »

Has the time changed yet?

I woke up from a nap and i don't know.

yes

machiavellianme

Stupid extra hour in work for no extra pay.

Stasi 2.0

The clock on my wall says 2:19 right now and that's the way it's going to stay for the rest of the year and no government of sick corrupt perverted stinking clock molesting bastards will tell me otherwise. They can send the filth around if they like but anyone who tries coming through my door to lay their hands on my clocks will be going out the same door in a six foot wooden box. I'm sitting right here in my rocking chair with my double barrelled shotgun with my eye on the front door ready for the first of them and I have enough ammunition to take out the whole posse. I am not a violent man but I'm not having the scum anywhere near my clocks. If we sit back and let them interfere with our clocks we might as well let them interfere with our kids as well because that's what they'll do !

Stupid extra hour in work for no extra pay.

If it takes you below the minimum wage you should report your employer.

machiavellianme

But your post time says 1:19?

Willie Stroker 1976

machiavellianme wrote: »

But your post time says 1:19?

Dont wind him up he has a double barrell and sounds like a lunatic

RayM

Imagine if we kept putting the clocks back an hour, every hour, like there's no tomorrow. There would be no tomorrow.

Mr. FoggPatches

Every f%cjin year.

cumulonimbus

machiavellianme wrote: »

Stupid extra hour in work for no extra pay.

why do you not get 1hr overtime if you are working an extra hour.
I get paid for the extra hour in autumn timechange and get paid for the full 8 hours even though I only work 7 hours in spring changeover.

meath4sam

RayM wrote: »

Imagine if we kept putting the clocks back an hour, every hour, like there's no tomorrow. There would be no tomorrow.

Sure there's a song about that. If tomorrow never comes.

The Raptor

I was up far too early this morning.

fryup

its never going to happen,

pointless having this debate every year

Stasi 2.0

machiavellianme wrote: »

But your post time says 1:19?

Post 118 01:48
Post 119 01:00
I mean what the actual f**k

citytillidie wrote: »

Germans did it during World War one moving the clocks forward in the summer time to help save coal during the war now it is used to help save energy in the summer months

It was actually the UK and when they tried extending it to Ireland in 1916 there was an uprising yet the Quisling traitors of the so-called Free state went along with it.

fryup wrote: »

its never going to happen,
pointless having this debate every year

Its actually twice a year and lots of countries have seen the swindle for what it is (up there with Fiat currency and Incorporation) and did away with it

Anyways Its still 15:07 by my clock and my shotgun is still loaded and ready !

Dirty Dingus McGee

I love it getting dark early in the evenings I hate the long evenings in the summer.

I commute by bus so the long evenings mean I can't sleep as well during the summertime on the journey home but now it's perfect.

Harry Palmr

I'd miss the morning light I have to say but equally on a gloomy day almost dark by 5 is a bit dismal.

Why can't we just invent an extra hour for winter?

r93kaey5p2izun

I'd prefer just leaving the clocks on GMT all year.

myshirt

I agree with the op, I'm sick of this sh't. I didn't even put my clocks back. I'm just going to watch RTE+1 for the next few months. Won't notice the difference.

Sam Kade

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Usually people go on about farmers being the reason for this. I really detest it. Dark at 5pm, it's horrible. I kind of like dark mornings however. If it is to do with farmers, can't they just adjust their working days?

Blame the farmers for everything I'm a farmer and I can tell you that whoever says that, it's baloney.

Sam Kade

Losty Dublin wrote: »

If clocks were left forward the year round then farmers and other outdoor workers lose an hour in the morning, not to mention commuters. In some more northern areas sunrise wouldn't occur until close to 10AM at the most extreme.

I'm a farmer and it's dark when I get up (5:30am) since September, it doesn't make a blind bit of difference to farmers so why is everyone on here blaming them for it In fact I would rather it stayed at summer time all year round as it would suit me better.

LordSutch

Sam Kade wrote: »

I'm a farmer and it's dark when I get up (5:30am) since September, it doesn't make a blind bit of difference to farmers so why is everyone on here blaming them for it In fact I would rather it stayed at summer time all year round as it would suit me better.

But not the farming community of Scotland.

starlit

Officially winter time is the real time is it not before the UK and Ireland introduced it? I much prefer the summer time as well! Longer evenings not so dark than brighter mornings. The hour change didn't make much a difference for me as it would for the summer would miss that hour!

Spanish Eyes

I have jetlag now FFS.

BorneTobyWilde

Only the government would think that it could cut a foot off the top of a blanket and sew it to the bottom of a blanket and then have a longer blanket.
Daylight saving, meh.

long range shooter

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Last time I went to Scotland I had to set my watch back ... to the mid 1980's.

So did i, coming from Norway to Ireland.

Widdershins

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

So standing in the dark is only likely to be a problem for primary school children. The demographic is getting smaller. Shouldn't primary school children be supervised by someone in charge of them anyway?

Isn't that just part of the normal risk of leaving the house? Wouldn't high vis vests be a more measured solution?

Changing the time school starts and ends would be a more measured solution than changing the time zone for the whole country to protect primary school children who should he supervised anyway.

There might be only one or two children at each bus 'stop' (usually the crossroads or somewhere along a country road). Parents either going to work themselves or dealing with other children. Who could do the supervision?
It's generally secondary students though, as most villages have a primary school.

B.A._Baracus

CrabRevolution wrote: »

You're almost certainly remembering wrong, or lived at a higher latitude at the time. Sunset in December 1996 was just after 4PM, Sunset in December 2016 will be....just after 4PM.

http://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin?month=12&year=1996

http://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin?month=12&year=2016

It's 4:43 and its been dark for the last 20 minutes. Couldnt help but remember what you said. So yeah...

md23040

Apologises for digging up an old thread but it's not worth the subject matter starting a new one.

I do not mind the clock going back at the end of October (although it could wait a week), otherwise the morning would be dark to after 9am in late November and December. But what really grates me is that we have to wait until the last Sunday in March until they go forward again. Based on the North West of Ireland being possibly the time zone within GMT that it is last to get light in the morning, there is brightness emerging from 7.20am. So if the clocks went forward now this weekend, it would be lighting up at the latest at 8.20am.

Think of the stretched evening if the clocks went forward now and how good that would be for peoples general well being and also the massive savings this would have on central heating, as instead of the house feeling cold at 5.00 after sun down it would be 6.00 o clock. One less hours of heating would save households a considerable amount of money and help Ireland meet its Co2 targets rather than sticking pointless carbons taxes on fuel.

Should governments across Europe change earlier than the last week in March, or can someone explain the rationale or logic behind it. Maybe there should be a petition. I'd like to come home from work these days and be able to go walking etc in more light, and getting outdoors in sunshine, what little bit there is to make the most it.

dxhound2005

md23040 wrote: »

But what really grates me is that we have to wait until the last Sunday in March until they go forward again. Based on the North West of Ireland being possibly the time zone within GMT that it is last to get light in the morning, there is brightness emerging from 7.20am.

You are about 10° West, so 40 minutes different to Greenwich. If you got what you wanted, many people in London might be unhappy.

I can see the logic of changing clocks close to the Spring Equinox. But they don't change again until the end of October. Closer to the Autumn Equinox would be more logical.

r93kaey5p2izun

md23040 wrote:

Think of the stretched evening if the clocks went forward now and how good that would be for peoples general well being and also the massive savings this would have on central heating, as instead of the house feeling cold at 5.00 after sun down it would be 6.00 o clock. One less hours of heating would save households a considerable amount of money and help Ireland meet its Co2 targets rather than sticking pointless carbons taxes on fuel.

Should governments across Europe change earlier than the last week in March, or can someone explain the rationale or logic behind it. Maybe there should be a petition. I'd like to come home from work these days and be able to go walking etc in more light, and getting outdoors in sunshine, what little bit there is to make the most it.

I don't enjoy the long evenings and much prefer the brightness in the morning. Can't you just be happy that you get your fake time for over half the year as it is? More and more studies are showing the adverse effects on health of switching to this artificial time - with little evidence it has much impact on energy conservation at all.

md23040

dxhound2005 wrote: »

You are about 10° West, so 40 minutes different to Greenwich. If you got what you wanted, many people in London might be unhappy.

I can see the logic of changing clocks close to the Spring Equinox. But they don't change again until the end of October. Closer to the Autumn Equinox would be more logical.

Why would people on London be unhappy the clocks go forward start of February? Sunrise there is 7.30am with light building from around 6.50am, and they have sun set about 4.40pm at moment and would gain an extra hours light when most people are out and about. Sunrise is 8.15am in North West Ireland with light emerging from 7.30am. But each to their own.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Dylan Thundering Arena wrote: »

I don't enjoy the long evenings and much prefer the brightness in the morning. Can't you just be happy that you get your fake time for over half the year as it is? More and more studies are showing the adverse effects on health of switching to this artificial time - with little evidence it has much impact on energy conservation at all.

How much brightness do you need. Summertime sunrise is 5 AM but it’s plenty bright before that as the sun doesn’t dip very deep before the horizon. In fact we don’t get real night time.

Franz Von Peppercorn

md23040 wrote: »

Why would people on London be unhappy the clocks go forward start of February? Sunrise there is 7.30am with light building from around 6.50am, and they have sun set about 4.40pm at moment and would gain an extra hours light when most people are out and about. Sunrise is 8.15am in North West Ireland with light emerging from 7.30am. But each to their own.

Yeh he got that totally wrong. Sunrise is later here.


The best compromise is the end of February, not the start. If we set the clocks forward in a month the sunset would be about 7pm and the sunrise about where it is now, which is 40 minutes earlier than a month ago.

And due to the rapid changes in March sunrise will be earlier more than 15 minutes a week.

4 months of winter time makes sense. 5 months makes no sense.

Water John

Interesting to hear that clocks, in the 19thC had a second minute hand, giving local time.
It should change in Mid Feb at the latest. 8 weeks at most, each side of the shortest day. March is ridicolous.

r93kaey5p2izun

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

How much brightness do you need. Summertime sunrise is 5 AM but it’s plenty bright before that as the sun doesn’t dip very deep before the horizon. In fact we don’t get real night time.

I'm referring to now, at this time of the year and throughout Spring. But how much brightness do you need in the evening in June for that matter? Why do we need it to be bright until after 11 pm? Why is that better than 4am?

Why can't we just stick with actual real scientific time? And stop all the associated adverse effects (increased car crashes, increased heart attacks, poorer academic performance, signigicant decreased quality of life for several weeks in Spring) that come from messing around with it.