3 phase vs nat gas or oil

TheAdammaka

Hi, I'm currently moving my bakery into a new facility. I will be importing a German deck oven which can be Electric or gas and oil.
I am wondering how the cost of 3 phase compares to nat gas and oil in Ireland?
The facility is wired for three phase but I am unsure how 3 phase is charged for in Ireland. The electric version of the oven will be between 30kw and 50kw depending the size I choose.
Any help on this would be appreciated.
Thanks, Adam

Gloomtastic!

If you don't get any replies to this question here, try posting Heating and Plumbing http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1320

mrawkward

Currently gas and oil are about the same price per Kw/hour and electricity is about double!! See this http://www.seai.ie/Publications/Statistics_Publications/Fuel_Cost_Comparison/Domestic-Fuel-Cost-Comparisons.pdf

Are the capital costs of each version the same?

Have you got a mains gas supply?

Oil storage ( New oil install can be expensive for new tanks/bund walls/sfety piping + Flues etc? You also prepay for oil rather than as you use for electricity or mains gas.

Consider CHP as an option.

Try SEAI for SME advice.

What is best practice for bakeries? do you know?

Many factors at play here, do the homework to make the correct educated decision.

TheAdammaka

Thanks for the info. Those rates are domestic, I think 3 phase is priced differently.

There isn't much price difference as I'll be buying a used machine, Electric does have one advantage in that the decks can be controlled separately to cook different items.

mrawkward

The relativities are broadly similar, I note you did not address the supply or capex issues I raised. So lets see if you are up to speed on Wattless and max demand charges, have you a usage/charge model model you would like to share.

For those less aware of the items mentioned above, please see http://www.seai.ie/EnergyMAP/Learning_centre/Quick_ways_to_start_saving/Bills_analysis/

Bandara

My deal (with Electric Ireland is as follows) - Ive have 20% discounts agreed with EI on a lot of the tariffs (my discounted amounts are shown where applicable)

General Purpose 24 Hour Tariff

Daily Standing Charge €0.6278

Unit Price
Block 1 per kWh (up to 131 units per day) €0.1509 – 20% Discount (€0.1207)

Block 2 (balance of units) €0.1429 – 20% Discount (€0.1143)

If applicable:
Night Storage Heating
Standing Charge
Price per kWh
€0.0277
€0.0822 – 20% Discount (0.0658)

Wattless Unit Price
kVARh in excess of 1/3 of total units €0.00941
Item
PSO Levy per month
Per customer (where customer MIC: <30kVA) €17.88
Per kVA of MIC (where customer >30kVA) €2.76

As your a bakery I'd imagine the Nightsaver tariff will be of interest as well:

Standing Charge €0.6678 per day.

Unit Price
Block 1 per kWh (up to 131 units per day) €0.1730 – 20% Discount (€0.1385)
Block 2 (balance of units) €0.1676 – 20% Discount (€0.1341)
Night per kWh €0.0822 – 20% Discount (€0.0541)

If applicable:
Night Storage Heating
Standing Charge €0.0277
Price per kWh €0.0822 – 20% Discount (€0.0541)
Wattless Unit Price kVARh in excess of 1/3 of total units €0.00972
Item
PSO Levy per month
Per customer (where customer MIC: <30kVA) €17.88
Per kVA of MIC (where customer >30kVA) €2.76

And finally :

Low Voltage Maximum Demand Tariff

Standing Charge €5.6722

Day Units - Summer €0.1144 – 11% Discount (€0.1018)
Day Units - Winter €0.1233 – 11% Discount (€0.1097)
Night Units - €0.0608 – 11% Discount (€0.0541)


Demand Price
Price per KW of metered MD
Summer (Mar-Oct incl.) €0.0000
Winter (Nov-Feb incl.) €0.0936

Maximum Import Capacity (MIC)
Price per kVA of MIC €0.0866

Excess Capacity Price per two monthly bill per kVA** Non QH meters €15.81

Excess Capacity Price per monthly bill per kVA** QH meters €13.175

Wattless Unit Price
kVARh in excess of 1/3 of total units €0.00888

PSO Levy per month
Per customer (where customer MIC: <30kVA) €17.88
Per kVA of MIC (where customer >30kVA) €2.76

** Only incurred if the contract MIC is exceeded

Hope thats of some help to you.