Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

DART Underground - Why it won't be built.

Options
124»

Comments

  • Options
    #92
    strassenwo!f
    Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    aliveandkicking wrote: »
    I'm afraid I have to call bollócks on this particular point. Have you seen Dublin city centre over the last two years? Many of the busiest areas in the city have been building sites for two years. The Luas cross city works have caused far more disruption than either MN or DU would have. It's not a fear of building anything in busy areas that the problem is, it's a fear of spending big money and lack of political will.

    I agree with most of what you say, and although DU is the main discussion point of this thread (and, yes, I've been in Dublin city centre many times over the last two years), but why is it that Dublin - one of the richest cities in Europe at the turn of the millenium - is only now building something (a feckin' tramline) which it planned to build almost 20 years ago?

    It should have been built then, as we pretty much all knew then, so that further developments (like DU) could happen now.

    Unfortunately Mrs O'Rourke set the standard, with her fear of disruption, and Dublin is paying, and will continue to do so for a long time.


  • Options
    #93
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,026 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    strassenwo!f wrote: »
    why is it that Dublin - one of the richest cities in Europe at the turn of the millenium - is only now building something (a feckin' tramline) which it planned to build almost 20 years ago?
    Because Dublin generated wealth is used to fund most of the public expenditure outside Dublin (excluding some other predominantly urban areas that are also self sufficient). It's better for a bunch of TDs from the provinces to spend Dublin (and Cork etc.) generated wealth on small projects in their constituencies than see it spent where it is generated on big capital projects that would actually help the cities generate even more wealth to redistribute to the provinces.

    tl;dr POLITICS!


  • Options
    #94
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,853 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Having witnessed the joke that is the city centre for the past two years. MN should have been called Luas north. Could have been done in two stages, first one is tunnel from ranelagh preferably or SSG to oconnell st. To connect lines (leave Tbm there until next phase of project I.e to swords via airport. Or maybe Tbm could be extracted somewhere near ocs)...


  • Options
    #95
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Usually TBMs just get driven into the ground when done with don't they?


  • Options
    #96
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Having witnessed the joke that is the city centre for the past two years
    Is the city centre really that bad? Yes it's unslightly at the moment and there is some minor inconvence but that's about the sum of it
    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Or maybe Tbm could be extracted somewhere near ocs)...


    To borrow a meme "One does not simply extract a TMB". It's an expensive job and requires a portal big enough, as pointed out above they are often burred


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #97
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,026 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Usually TBMs just get driven into the ground when done with don't they?
    They usually strip the innards out of them and leave the chassis if they are abandoning underground.


  • Options
    #98
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,853 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    To borrow a meme "One does not simply extract a TMB". It's an expensive job and requires a portal big enough, as pointed out above they are often burred

    yeah that's why I mentioned extracting it near ocs, if there is a practical greenfield site nearby...
    Is the city centre really that bad? Yes it's unslightly at the moment and there is some minor inconvence but that's about the sum of it
    in my opinion it is more how it is going to severely increase travel times on other modes of transport, primarily the cities backbone i.e. buses...

    Actually with my proposal in that case, the tbm would obviously be extracted at some point in the future, on complete of phase two, i.e. out to swords. A long long time from now, in an era far away...


  • Options
    #99
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Grandeeod wrote: »
    I've discussed this new thread with a mod and got permission to start it. In general DU threads, there appears to be a negative reaction to posters talking about this project never being built. So for all who want to discuss this possibility without affecting the general DU thread, this can be the place. Personally I don't mind if posters who believe it will be built contribute here too with their opinions. Debate is good.

    I am convinced that DU or any variation of it, will not be built in my lifetime. Im in my 40s. There is no political will to invest in this kind of rail infrastructure. Our poltically divided system also contributes to the problem. As one side plans something, the other side changes or cancels it. The luas debacle of the late 90s is the most recent example that can be compared to the recent deferral of DU. In fact the luas itself is a watered down version of the DART plan from the early 70s. We got Howth - Bray and after that it was a case of re-invent the wheel time after time.

    So lets here your nay or yay and why.
    I was hopeful after the election results this year that a FG/FF government would tackle long term infastructure and both parties could in the future claim credit of coming up with the idea.


  • Options
    #100
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,853 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    proper transport solutions and serious solutions to the housing crisis in Dublin, would be top of my agenda, when it comes to deciding who to vote for ... If I vote for any of them... No doubt there will be something on the reverse side of the election manifesto for all parties. Their bit on infrastructure " increase infrastructure spend" the end....


  • Options
    #101
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,892 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »
    I was hopeful after the election results this year that a FG/FF government would tackle long term infastructure and both parties could in the future claim credit of coming up with the idea.

    Why were you hopeful for that when they have been the governing parties that have spurned PT projects?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #102
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    proper transport solutions and serious solutions to the housing crisis in Dublin, would be top of my agenda, when it comes to deciding who to vote for ... If I vote for any of them... No doubt there will be something on the reverse side of the election manifesto for all parties. Their bit on infrastructure " increase infrastructure spend" the end....

    The transportation infrastructure deficit is part of the issue with housing.


  • Options
    #103
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,853 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    The transportation infrastructure deficit is part of the issue with housing.
    I totally agree and have made this point myself on other threads recently. they go hand in hand... what needs to be done is so bloody obvious its infuriating! every other half decent run country has done it decades before, they dont need to reinvent the bloody wheel!


  • Options
    #104
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Zebra3 wrote: »
    Why were you hopeful for that when they have been the governing parties that have spurned PT projects?

    It may sound stupid but they both try to reinvent the wheel when they get in power. They won't do something that a previous government proposed in order to avoid giving credit. If they were both in power they could follow through with them in the future if either was in government in the future.


  • Options
    #105
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 69,006 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    D.L.R. wrote: »
    Housing planners of the 50s and 60s have a lot to answer for leaving us with that sh*t sandwich.

    Late 50s onward only. The GNR(I) was planning an eventual quad and built structures to match for some time


  • Options
    #106
    Yourself isit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,257 ✭✭✭Yourself isit


    murphaph wrote: »
    Because Dublin generated wealth is used to fund most of the public expenditure outside Dublin (excluding some other predominantly urban areas that are also self sufficient). It's better for a bunch of TDs from the provinces to spend Dublin (and Cork etc.) generated wealth on small projects in their constituencies than see it spent where it is generated on big capital projects that would actually help the cities generate even more wealth to redistribute to the provinces.

    tl;dr POLITICS!

    Maybe. But other cities across the world have local tax raising powers. Given the hostility to the property tax that isn't going to happen in Dublin.


  • Options
    #107
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,026 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Yourself isit wrote: »
    Maybe. But other cities across the world have local tax raising powers. Given the hostility to the property tax that isn't going to happen in Dublin.
    If Dublin could only keep it's property tax it would probably do the trick.


  • Options
    #108
    Grandeeod
    Registered Users Posts: 12,179 ✭✭✭✭Grandeeod


    The big news! No surprises either. The NTA are literally playing the game and bringing us back 10 years.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/metrostyle-green-line-upgrade-to-add-capacity-35425965.html

    At least in this thread I can say that none of this will ever be built, without offending a few moaners who don't like to hear it. Honestly though, we are facing into at least another 5 to 7 years of talk shop and lots of repitition. Mark my words folks, after 7 years, we won't be any closer.


Advertisement