**Nov 2016 Teacher Dispute / See post 1 for Warning **

km79

judeboy101 wrote: »

Ok so I opted out of s&s, circular made it plain that on monday 7th my opt out disappeared. So what do I do tomorrow? Am I suddenly opt out again?

What a mess

deiseindublin

Villain wrote: »

I can't see how WRC or LC can give them anything outside Lansdowne so sounds like ASTI have begun the walk back down the hill!

Surely the WRC/LC can't ignore the commitments of HRA? If they just paid the S&S, the schools would have remained open on Monday.

Well in a way you guys have won, the labour courts and WRC will offer you something just as they did with the Gardai.

In the long run it will just encourage every other union to join the que, and the WRC will hand out increases like confetti. Eventually the country will be at breaking point and the current government will swan off into retirement with their gold plated pensions whilst the rest of us have to pick up the pieces AGAIN.

On a plus side you will be back at work and the children will be educated again.

Inspector Coptoor

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Well in a way you guys have won, the labour courts and WRC will offer you something just as they did with the Gardai.

In the long run it will just encourage every other union to join the que, and the WRC will hand out increases like confetti. Eventually the country will be at breaking point and the current government will see them retire with their gold plated pensions whilst the rest of us have to pick up the pieces AGAIN.

On a plus side you will be back at work and the children will be educated again.

So have you stopped your hand wringing hysterics?

I told you it would be sorted.

trilobite80

km79 wrote: »

What a mess

Ditto.

Hope the WRC are inundated by opt-out gang.
A colleague actually had to break out the payslip before people believed her.

Inspector Coptoor

Inspector Coptoor wrote: »

So have you stopped your hand wringing hysterics?

I told you it would be sorted.

Im delighted Teachers are back at work tomorrow for all concerned. The WRC should have been the first port of call for any action.

hopefully this draws a line under the matter for all concerned.

Walter2016

ASTI have lost a substantial number of members in the past week.

It was turning into a flood.

They had no option but to grasp at whatever straw they could latch onto.


What I do find amazing is that retired teachers who have a discounted "membership" of ASTI were allowed to vote on landsdowne agreement even though the effect on them was totally insignificant.

What a shambles of a trade umion.

Inspector Coptoor

Walter2016 wrote: »

ASTI have lost a substantial number of members in the past week.

It was turning into a flood.

They had no option but to grasp at whatever straw they could latch onto.


What I do find amazing is that retired teachers who have a discounted "membership" of ASTI were allowed to vote on landsdowne agreement even though the effect on them was totally insignificant.

What a shambles of a trade umion.

Completely and utterly False.

Retired teachers are not allowed to be members of the ASTI

Time to stop the flaming, personal attacks and totally off topic rubbish. Please keep on topic MOD

maude6868

So I have been paying to opt out of s&s but Gov decided as and from Monday 7th that 'irrevocable' contract was scrapped. So now I assume I am no longer deducted seeing as the contract was deemed void. What does that mean for me, my contract no longer exists according to the Gov.

Time for a short holiday from the forum. Please keep on topic folks

dory

maude6868 wrote: »

So I have been paying to opt out of s&s but Gov decided as and from Monday 7th that 'irrevocable' contract was scrapped. So now I assume I am no longer deducted seeing as the contract was deemed void. What does that mean for me, my contract no longer exists according to the Gov.

It's a mess. For now you're still not on the S&S roster I suppose. Will have to wait and see what the next pay check says.

purplecow1977

VERY interesting points being made on the pay & expenses of TDs on Prime Time right now............!!!

Bass Reeves

It always amazes me the way public service workers can live within a cocoon. The ASTI have lived in a cocoon within that cocoon. I wonder what make second level teacher believe that they are a special case. They have this idea that just because they have qualification X that they are entitled to the same pay as other that have that level of qualification.

In general most Second Level teachers get a general Arts degree and continue on to do a H Dip. Some do that qualification as a special degree. Because there is more people willing to become teachers than there are teaching jobs there employers now look for a masters qualification. If you look at the application for any teaching position I expect that it is worded H Dip qualification Masters an advantage. Just because a worker decides that they need a master to teach at second level this is not a requirement that pay should reflect that.

There is a misconception right across the public service where people are overqualified for the jobs they are often doing that there pay should reflect this. ASTI teachers have cocooned themselves into believing that they are hard done by. In the early noughties they pulled a stunt whereby they refused to carry out what was a core duty S&S and a populist FF government caved in.

While teachers have a short week and school year the quid quo pro was that they had to carry out extra work outside there normal hours and some extra curricular acitivities. There has been a weakness right across public service management in the role of managing staff and services. In teaching this has developed the situation where some teachers consider that these functions are no longer part of there working week.

ASTI teachers seem to think that the 33 hours a year should include this extra curricular work They fail to understand that other public servants had to take on thsi work load. Nurses had about 70 hours a week added to there year as had Guards. It a matter of stopping to accept what you hear in the staff room about being hard done by and looking outside the cocoon. If teacher are under paid over time it will fail to attract people into the profession at present that is not an issue. I am not sure what it costs the state to train a teacher to train a nurse is about 4-5 times that. In the states view who are the most important to retain

Villain

Regarding holidays and payments depending on contract and getting back in topic, remember TUI teachers get CID after 2 years now, there are positives to what they have achieved even if it isn't enough. ASTI need to be realistic as to what more can be achieved above what TUI have got!

doc_17

If I remember correctly, the WRC don't tend to get involved unless there is appetite on both sides for dialogue and concessions. So, ASTI to restart CP hours, maybe pro rata after Christmas, and....this is where I get stuck. It's ASTI and DES that are going to the WRC and LPT pay is a PS wide issue that the DES or WRC can't change. I can't see the way out.

gaiscioch

Never heard Diarmuid de Paor speak before. He was quite articulate on Prime Time tonight focusing straight in on the unequal pay issue, repeatedly mentioning "issues of fairness". Hammer that one home.

Also on PT, TDs are expecting a pay increase this week and Katie Hannon notes that in basic salary alone TDs earn €26,000 more than the EU average pay for members of parliament.

Furthermore, between 1997 and 2008 Oireachtas members received no fewer than 27 pay increases. The basic pay of a new TD went from €44,068 to €100,191. The allowances on top of all this are extraordinary.

The FG rep on Prime Time said he's taking the increase, citing the Buckley Report as his justification, the very report in 1999 which led to politicians' pay rocketing in the first place. Brazen.

spurious

gaiscioch wrote: »

N
Furthermore, between 1997 and 2008 Oireachtas members received no fewer than 27 pay increases. The basic pay of a new TD went from €44,068 to €100,191. The allowances on top of all this are extraordinary.

As I'm fond of recalling, when I started teaching, a TD's salary was the same as a starting teacher's salary. My, how they have looked after themselves since.

We will have to close this thread now to delete lots of off-topic stuff.

Early night boys and girls, once you've finished the prep work.

Add.: Moved some posts on contracts and pay here http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057668535 with other warnings and off topic stuff
Replies to trolling may end up being deleted so as tempting and all as it is, maybe just dont feed. Trying to keep the flow of the topic going here
Ta MOD