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Where now for ASTI? ****ASTI Action- Part III - See 1st Post***

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    #1652
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    acequion wrote: »
    And have you done your bit to make the asti work more effectively?

    Why don't you just leave if you have so little confidence in your union?

    I have very little confidence in Liverpool FC but id never stop supporting them, because i know that one day the Asti just like LFC, will do the business.


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    #1653
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    acequion wrote: »
    And have you done your bit to make the asti work more effectively?

    Why don't you just leave if you have so little confidence in your union?

    I've done what was asked and what I and others voted for. But the silence is deafening. As far as I'm concerned it wasn't ASTI members who called off the agreed upon action in November...
    We were promised talks to stand down but that was as much a charade as lunchtime protests.

    Why don't I leave?
    Because the union is much more than this dispute. I still believe in strength in numbers so I'll be staying for the long haul.


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    #1654
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    No reballot on LRA 😀


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    #1655
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    That was meant to be a smiley face.


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    #1656
    dg647
    Registered Users Posts: 124 ✭✭dg647


    Was there any new developments? Any talk of doing anything such as stopping s&s?


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    #1657
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    dg647 wrote: »
    Was there any new developments? Any talk of doing anything such as stopping s&s?

    That was defeated too.

    Threat of another lockout is just too great.


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    #1658
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    acequion wrote: »
    No reballot on LRA 😀

    Brb, just have to go sacrifice a goat to Satan


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    #1659
    sitstill
    Registered Users Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭sitstill


    So we're just going to do nothing and continue with free s&s??? This is insane.

    I am down over 3000 this year, as are most of us probably and the ASTI are sitting on their hands.

    My school is dual union and since the last vote, 8 teachers have moved to TUI on top of the fact that we had no new people join this year as they all went to TUI. I doubt my school is unique in this regard.


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    #1660
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    Not out of d wood yet!


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    #1661
    dg647
    Registered Users Posts: 124 ✭✭dg647


    Inspector Coptoor wrote:
    Threat of another lockout is just too great.

    Inspector Coptoor wrote:
    That was defeated too.


    That's a pity. Now would be an ideal time to withdraw from s&s. It would disrupt practicals for some subjects. If they lock us out we can say that it's the jmb who are causing the disruption. Where are all the supervisors that they advertised for?

    Also, teachers need to realise that we will get nowhere if we are not prepared to strike. We need to be prepared to take a short term hit to get long term gains. We need to take action and take it when its impact would be greatest.


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    #1662
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    acequion wrote: »
    Not out of d wood yet!

    Goat on standby


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    #1663
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    sitstill wrote: »
    So we're just going to do nothing and continue with free s&s??? This is insane.

    I am down over 3000 this year, as are most of us probably and the ASTI are sitting on their hands.

    My school is dual union and since the last vote, 8 teachers have moved to TUI on top of the fact that we had no new people join this year as they all went to TUI. I doubt my school is unique in this regard.

    Remember their names, and remember what Dante said about the 9th circle.


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    #1664
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    No reballot on JC


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    #1665
    gavwaldo
    Registered Users Posts: 103 ✭✭gavwaldo


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    No reballot on JC

    please please please tell me they've decided to do something


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    #1666
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    gavwaldo wrote: »
    please please please tell me they've decided to do something

    They are getting us all membership forms for NBRU


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    #1667
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    Would ye ever just stop d bitching! D meeting went on til 5.30 and we had to fight 3 attempts to overturn the recent no.The last was extremely sneaky as it looked harmless but was effectively an attempt to get us straight into LRA without even reballoting d members.By d time we were done fighting all of those we tried to get in a gd motion on SnS but it was too late, too many ppl were gone. We will do it in May.A motion fr an immediate ballot to strike if a redundancy was passed.Given how difficult things are I feel we did a good days work.


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    #1668
    mtoutlemonde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,134 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    acequion wrote: »
    Would ye ever just stop d bitching! D meeting went on til 5.30 and we had to fight 3 attempts to overturn the recent no.The last was extremely sneaky as it looked harmless but was effectively an attempt to get us straight into LRA without even reballoting d members.By d time we were done fighting all of those we tried to get in a gd motion on SnS but it was too late, too many ppl were gone. We will do it in May.A motion fr an immediate ballot to strike if a redundancy was passed.Given how difficult things are I feel we did a good days work.

    This post just shows how powerless and hopeless the ASTI are - thankfully we had good representation from the likes of acequion who will keep the fight.


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    #1669
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    acequion wrote: »
    Would ye ever just stop d bitching! D meeting went on til 5.30 and we had to fight 3 attempts to overturn the recent no.The last was extremely sneaky as it looked harmless but was effectively an attempt to get us straight into LRA without even reballoting d members.By d time we were done fighting all of those we tried to get in a gd motion on SnS but it was too late, too many ppl were gone. We will do it in May.A motion fr an immediate ballot to strike if a redundancy was passed.Given how difficult things are I feel we did a good days work.

    Agree totally ye fought the good fight, my point is that ye shudnt have had to defend the democratic will of the unions membership. I'm glad u and other members cec respected my vote.


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    #1670
    MrJones1973
    Closed Accounts Posts: 997 ✭✭✭MrJones1973


    Im pleased with outcome. Would prefer strikes in May but you cant have everything


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    #1671
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    It was my first CEC.
    I'm happy with the outcomes.

    Today was not the day to call a vote on LRA or Junior Cycle with convention only 16 days away.


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    #1672
    mtoutlemonde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,134 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    Inspector Coptoor wrote: »
    It was my first CEC.
    I'm happy with the outcomes.

    Today was not the day to call a vote on LRA or Junior Cycle with convention only 16 days away.

    It never seems to be the day - that's why this dispute is going on and on and on and on .........


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    #1673
    Icsics
    Registered Users Posts: 2,048 ✭✭✭Icsics


    Great credit is due to those on CEC (like Acequoin) who fought to uphold the no vote today, could have easily been a different story tonight.


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    #1674
    MrJones1973
    Closed Accounts Posts: 997 ✭✭✭MrJones1973


    The redundancy ballot is not a fait accompli. You cant assume all Yes or no voters will back it. If that ballot fails then we are heading back to LRA. I expect it to pass but I urge a bit of caution.

    I also think this whole thing needs to be resolved by September. Unfortunately the ASTI machinery shuts down over summer leaving the Department to plot and scheme.
    SC must meet regularly over summer.


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    #1675
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    Mrwhite1970 wrote: »
    The redundancy ballot is not a fait accompli. You cant assume all Yes or no voters will back it. If that ballot fails then we are heading back to LRA. I expect it to pass but I urge a bit of caution.

    I also think this whole thing needs to be resolved by September. Unfortunately the ASTI machinery shuts down over summer leaving the Department to plot and scheme.
    SC must meet regularly over summer.

    Sure who is left in Asti to be made redundant? Anyone over quota and at risk would have been told by their principal and they have prob all moved to tui or indicated as much to principal. Personally no matter what your stance on lra or jc any union member who wont go on strike over forced sacking should leave the union now. Its the core to what any union is about.


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    #1676
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Sure who is left in Asti to be made redundant? Anyone over quota and at risk would have been told by their principal and they have prob all moved to tui or indicated as much to principal. Personally no matter what your stance on lra or jc any union member who wont go on strike over forced sacking should leave the union now. Its the core to what any union is about.

    There's truth in what you say.
    There's under 10 people in line to be made redundant according to a report yesterday.
    However, if even one member is made redundant, we have to down tools.
    Simple as that.


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    #1677
    Mekekka
    Closed Accounts Posts: 108 ✭✭Mekekka


    Very glad a reballot wasn't called; it was queried at our branch meeting if a reballot can even be called on something when the terms haven't changed.. can anyone shed light on this, just for my own curiosity? The adoption of the policy that JC reform and teacher conditions be treated separately in future talks/negotiations is a welcome step, albeit one that should have been the case all along.


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    #1678
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    Mekekka wrote: »
    Very glad a reballot wasn't called; it was queried at our branch meeting if a reballot can even be called on something when the terms haven't changed.. can anyone shed light on this, just for my own curiosity? The adoption of the policy that JC reform and teacher conditions be treated separately in future talks/negotiations is a welcome step, albeit one that should have been the case all along.

    That was always the intended union policy.

    However, the minister and the DES have said they will only deal with all three of our issues at the moment as a collective which is why the question on the last ballot was such a clusterfcuk.


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    #1679
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    Inspector Coptoor wrote: »
    There's truth in what you say.
    There's under 10 people in line to be made redundant according to a report yesterday.
    However, if even one member is made redundant, we have to down tools.
    Simple as that.

    Down tools? If even one member is sacked ill b organising wildcat pickets on all non Asti schools using burners and 4chan.ill channel my inner Arthur scargill them them all.


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    #1680
    Mekekka
    Closed Accounts Posts: 108 ✭✭Mekekka


    Inspector Coptoor wrote: »
    That was always the intended union policy.

    However, the minister and the DES have said they will only deal with all three of our issues at the moment as a collective which is why the question on the last ballot was such a clusterfcuk.

    Oh I know! Incredibly frustrating that it has to be reiterated but at least it is clarifying it for members.
    However, based on general chat in school/at branch I wonder if they had been separated last ballot would LRA related elements have gone through but JC still have been a no...? Not ideal but that is the vibe I get from some.


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    #1681
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    Icsics wrote: »
    Great credit is due to those on CEC (like Acequoin) who fought to uphold the no vote today, could have easily been a different story tonight.

    Yes it could indeed have been a different story Icsics. But thankfully we still have a majority on CEC who uphold democracy and who have the courage of their convictions. Not an overwhelming majority mind,but a decent majority nonetheless. And I would ask the members to stand with them and to try to have patience as these campaigns are not easy to fight, but the longer it takes the more chances we have of gaining some ground. It's only a matter of time before negotiations start for LR2 and I really feel that our principled stance in staying outside LR1 will help to secure better concessions going forward.I hope so anyway.
    Mekekka wrote: »
    Very glad a reballot wasn't called; it was queried at our branch meeting if a reballot can even be called on something when the terms haven't changed.. can anyone shed light on this, just for my own curiosity? The adoption of the policy that JC reform and teacher conditions be treated separately in future talks/negotiations is a welcome step, albeit one that should have been the case all along.

    It is indeed a good step forward that LR and JC are now official separate campaigns in ASTI policy. The Govt should never have been allowed to muddy those waters as they did and they will probably do their best not to recognise our official separation of the two. But if so, it only shows up their intransigence and bullying all the more.

    As for your question on how a reballot could even be possible,I agree with your branch. I first heard about that threat here on this thread and could not believe it. But it seems that anybody on SC or CEC has the right to table such a motion.Democratic and all as I am,that's a step too far in my opinion.Ballot results are constantly being undermined in Ireland and a reballot on this, a bare 8 weeks after the first,with zero changes, would have been a new low. Somebody made the point at CEC that Scotland will not revisit the Independence question for a number of years,yet in Ireland somebody throws a wobbly and there's a new ballot on just about anything. Lunacy!

    .


This discussion has been closed.
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