Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

bangkok

Robson99 wrote: »

Swap Herrera for Rooney and Rashford for Ibra
Or
Mid 3of Herrera Pogba and Mickey
Front 3 of Mata Ibra and rashford

its a tough one to be honest... rooney was very good thur night, i would keep him in the team, herrera has to come back into the team but i feel it will be at the expense of carrick who i think should also play. rashford will start on the bench i think. Martial has done well against west ham in the past, i think he could start in place of mkhitarayan but may wait until sunday to see

bangkok

Liam O wrote: »

I must be the only one not really on the Herrera bandwagon. I don't really see what he offers a lot of the time. There is some decent interplay between him and Mata but bar that he always seems on a different wavelength to everyone else. Looking at the results when he plays his inclusion doesn't seem to bring a positive impact to the team. He doesn't really produce going forward and his method of defending is to hack the attacking player which you can only do so many times before you are in trouble. His ill discipline (as unlucky as the slip was) cost the team against Burnley and he picks up a lot of silly cards. He's been at United for a while now and has not consistently produced over a sustained period imo.

But he's Spanish and a good passer so will get a pass over other easier targets it seems. I realise I'm probably being harsh on him and he is a likeable character but I'm not seeing what he's done that have people calling him the best player on the team so far this season.

its not a bandwagon, herrera has been excellent this season.

Liam O

Robson99 wrote: »

Couldn't be arsed even debating with someone who cant find a place in the team for Herrera but thinks Rooney has had a decent season.
Baffling

In fairness, results have been better with Rooney over Herrera. Since Rooney was first dropped and Herrera became a permanent fixture in the team United have won 2 games in 7, one of which Rooney played and Herrera was suspended, the other the first game he was dropped for. Obviously there are a lot of variables at play and they don't play the same position but I think the Rooney hate has been way overblown and Herrera is getting away with a lot of average displays.

Robson99

Liam O wrote: »

In fairness, results have been better with Rooney over Herrera. Since Rooney was first dropped and Herrera became a permanent fixture in the team United have won 2 games in 7, one of which Rooney played, the other the first game he was dropped for. Obviously there are a lot of variables at play and they don't play the same position but I think the Rooney hate has been way overblown and Herrera is getting away with a lot of average displays.

Rooney should be competing with Ibra and Rashford for a place. He is not a middle of the park player and certainly not in the same league as Herrera in that position
Herrera has been super the season. The only question surrounding Herrera is what the fuk LVG was doing not playing him consistently

Liam O

Robson99 wrote: »

Rooney should be competing with Ibra and Rashford for a place. He is not a middle of the park player and certainly not in the same league as Herrera in that position
Herrera has been super the season. The only question surrounding Herrera is what the fuk LVG was doing not playing him consistently

Ibra is playing no matter what. Pogba is playing no matter what. It's between the two of them. I think performances have been better with Rooney and Herrera hasn't been super or United's best player this season.

deaddonkey15

Robson99 wrote: »

Couldn't be arsed even debating with someone who cant find a place in the team for Herrera but thinks Rooney has had a decent season.
Baffling

Rooney: 4 goals 7 assists in 21 appearances
Ozil: 8 goals 4 assists in 22 appearances
Mata: 5 goals 1 assist in 17 appearances
Silva: 1 goal 3 assists in 19 appearances
Sanchez 8 goals 5 assists in 17 appearances
De Bruyne: 3 goals 11 assists in 21 appearances
Countinho: 6 goals 5 assists in 13 appearances (unreal)
Hazard: 7 goals 1 assists in 15 appearances.


Herrera: 1 goal 2 assists in 14 appearances.

Seems to me like Rooney is having a very decent season to say the least.

Liam O wrote: »

I must be the only one not really on the Herrera bandwagon. I don't really see what he offers a lot of the time. There is some decent interplay between him and Mata but bar that he always seems on a different wavelength to everyone else. Looking at the results when he plays his inclusion doesn't seem to bring a positive impact to the team. He doesn't really produce going forward and his method of defending is to hack the attacking player which you can only do so many times before you are in trouble. His ill discipline (as unlucky as the slip was) cost the team against Burnley and he picks up a lot of silly cards. He's been at United for a while now and has not consistently produced over a sustained period imo.

But he's Spanish and a good passer so will get a pass over other easier targets it seems. I realise I'm probably being harsh on him and he is a likeable character but I'm not seeing what he's done that have people calling him the best player on the team so far this season.

A very good and accurate summary of Herrera here. Personally, I like him a lot. I think he's a very good player and has been in great form recently - he clearly loves playing for United too which is nice to see. However, he is limited and is by no means indispensable.

deaddonkey15

Liam O wrote: »

In fairness, results have been better with Rooney over Herrera. Since Rooney was first dropped and Herrera became a permanent fixture in the team United have won 2 games in 7, one of which Rooney played and Herrera was suspended, the other the first game he was dropped for. Obviously there are a lot of variables at play and they don't play the same position but I think the Rooney hate has been way overblown and Herrera is getting away with a lot of average displays.

If you dig deeper, you'll see that in some of those games United don't even score until Rooney is on the pitch. This myth that we're a much better side without him is ridiculous.

Backstreet Moyes

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Rooney: 4 goals 7 assists in 21 appearances
Ozil: 8 goals 4 assists in 22 appearances
Mata: 5 goals 1 assist in 17 appearances
Silva: 1 goal 3 assists in 19 appearances
Sanchez 8 goals 5 assists in 17 appearances
De Bruyne: 3 goals 11 assists in 21 appearances
Countinho: 6 goals 5 assists in 13 appearances (unreal)
Hazard: 7 goals 1 assists in 15 appearances.


Herrera: 1 goal 2 assists in 14 appearances.

Seems to me like Rooney is having a very decent season to say the least.



A very good and accurate summary of Herrera here. Personally, I like him a lot. I think he's a very good player and has been in great form recently - he clearly loves playing for United too which is nice to see. However, he is limited and is by no means indispensable.

Herrera is a deep lying midfielder what in the name of god are you doing putting up his stats compared to playmakers.

Herrera without has been poty so far this season.

Flint Fredstone

Jesus lads. Do you not know deaddonkey's shtick? Why even argue?

Robson99

Nuts102 wrote: »

Herrera is a deep lying midfielder what in the name of god are you doing putting up his stats compared to playmakers.

Herrera without has been poty so far this season.

Dont even bother debating it. Anyone who thinks that Herrera isn't worth his place in the team cannot be taken seriously

Robson99

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Jesus lads. Do you not know deaddonkey's shtick? Why even argue?

Agreed

deaddonkey15

Nuts102 wrote: »

Herrera is a deep lying midfielder what in the name of god are you doing putting up his stats compared to playmakers.

Herrera without has been poty so far this season.

My point exactly. Why remove an in form playmaker from a side desperate for a win and some goals in order to put Herrera into a midfield that will dominate the game anyway?

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Jesus lads. Do you not know deaddonkey's shtick? Why even argue?

My shtick: Playing in form and effective players.

Robson99 wrote: »

Dont even bother debating it. Anyone who thinks that Herrera isn't worth his place in the team cannot be taken seriously

I never said he wasn't worth his place in the side.

Liam O

Robson99 wrote: »

Dont even bother debating it. Anyone who thinks that Herrera isn't worth his place in the team cannot be taken seriously

Did the team not look better with Fellaini and Rooney in there the first 3 games or so? Mata getting gametime I'd argue has had the bigger effect than Herrera. I realise it's not s popular opinion that he hasn't been fantastic but I just don't see what's been so fantastic about his performances compared to others when they've played.

NoviGlitzko

It's looking like 4-3-3 is our best formation lately, and as much as I love Herrera an in form Rooney offers much more of a goal threat to a team that finds it hard to score goals.

It's a no brainer for me that Wayne has to start tomorrow.

Sand

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

My shtick: Playing in form and effective players.

And Rooney.

PhlegmyMoses

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

It's looking like 4-3-3 is our best formation lately, and as much as I love Herrera an in form Rooney offers much more of a goal threat to a team that finds it hard to score goals.

It's a no brainer for me that Wayne has to start tomorrow.

How exactly is Rooney in form?

I mean, I think he has earnt the right to play tomorrow, but the term in-form is a massive stretch.

deaddonkey15

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

How exactly is Rooney in form?

I mean, I think he has earnt the right to play tomorrow, but the term in-form is a massive stretch.

In the last 3 games he's started he got a goal against Fenerbahce, 2 assists against Swansea and a goal and an assist against Feyenoord. His recent form is as good if not better than any of our other attackers in terms of getting goals which is what this side badly needs.

Flint Fredstone

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

In the last 3 games he's started he got a goal against Fenerbahce, 2 assists against Swansea and a goal and an assist against Feyenoord. His recent form is as good if not better than any of our other attackers in terms of getting goals which is what this side badly needs.

These are the same kind of stats you were throwing about after the first few games of the season and subsequently no stats were mentioned when the assists and odd goal dried up. He was playing absolutely sh*te then and was rightly dropped.
He has had one excellent performance this season and that was Thursday night.

You're like a broken record and it's boring at this stage.

Cantona's Collars

Its funny how Rooney is better when pushed left,a position he moaned about playing in before. It's as if he's kinda out of the way of the middle of the field where a poor touch is pounced on. He gets a bit more room out there and subsequently looks the better for it. I still wouldn't trust him to play centrally.

NoviGlitzko

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

These are the same kind of stats you were throwing about after the first few games of the season and subsequently no stats were mentioned when the assists and odd goal dried up. He was playing absolutely sh*te then and was rightly dropped.
He has had one excellent performance this season and that was Thursday night.

You're like a broken record and it's boring at this stage.

You are aware there's many United fans who think like him, stop being small minded. :rolleyes:

As well as Rooney's stats, his overall play & movement has improved. He's as good I've seen in a couple of years. Amazing what a bit of confidence and fire under the belly can do. I'm aware of his previous form & I was the first to criticize but who cares, he's playing well NOW, so we need to play him.

deaddonkey15

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

These are the same kind of stats you were throwing about after the first few games of the season and subsequently no stats were mentioned when the assists and odd goal dried up. He was playing absolutely sh*te then and was rightly dropped.
He has had one excellent performance this season and that was Thursday night.

You're like a broken record and it's boring at this stage.

Yes I was saying similar at the start of the season because it was true. Of course I stopped mentioning it when the goals and assists dried up as it was no longer relevant as his position in the team was no longer justified. I was eventually in favour of dropping him. You might recall however that once he was dropped, the United wins seemed to dry up a bit more too and the goals harder to come by. He has responded well though and as I pointed out his recent form in terms of getting the side goals is as good as any one else in the team. Do you disagree with this? Do you disagree that United aren't in need of more goals?

RobertKK

Looks like Griezmann can't stop talking about United whether it is to Sky Sports in Germany or to L'equipe.
More talk of how in the future he would like to play with Pogba. Then he talks about a Beckham documentary came on the TV and how he had to watch it.
How he went to Old Trafford in 2013 with his brother Theo to watch United play Newcastle.
Then the rumours are United have been talking to his people about a transfer for next summer.
A bit like Pogba there is too much noise, and talk from the player.
We were told the Pogba to United started in 2015, well I think the Griezmann to United is underway for next summer.
The fact he is a United fan and a close friend of Pogba makes it far likelier.
It should make all the current players in forward positions buck up.
There is also talk of Willian being a target for Jose, not sure if that would be a January target.

deaddonkey15

RobertKK wrote: »

Looks like Griezmann can't stop talking about United whether it is to Sky Sports in Germany or to L'equipe.
More talk of how in the future he would like to play with Pogba. Then he talks about a Beckham documentary came on the TV and how he had to watch it.
How he went to Old Trafford in 2013 with his brother Theo to watch United play Newcastle.
Then the rumours are United have been talking to his people about a transfer for next summer.
A bit like Pogba there is too much noise, and talk from the player.
We were told the Pogba to United started in 2015, well I think the Griezmann to United is underway for next summer.
The fact he is a United fan and a close friend of Pogba makes it far likelier.
It should make all the current players in forward positions buck up.
There is also talk of Willian being a target for Jose, not sure if that would be a January target.

Willian is class but I don't think it would be of much benefit to United if he was to join. We already have Ibrahimovich, Mata, Rooney, Rashford, Martial, Mkhitaryan, Lingard and probably Pogba and Herrera too competing for the front 4 or 5 positions. Adding Willian will just limit everyone's game time a little bit more making it more difficult for anyone for anyone to maintain some consistent form or play themselves back into form if playing poorly.

Flint Fredstone

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

You are aware there's many United fans who think like him, stop being small minded. :rolleyes:

As well as Rooney's stats, his overall play & movement has improved. He's as good I've seen in a couple of years. Amazing what a bit of confidence and fire under the belly can do. I'm aware of his previous form & I was the first to criticize but who cares, he's playing well NOW, so we need to play him.

I'm not being small minded, he's been pigheaded all season about Rooney.

As for the "he's been as good as I've seen him in a couple of years"
He's had one really good game. He's been generally poor for the last couple of seasons so he doesn't even have to play all that well to look better.

deaddonkey15

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

I'm not being small minded, he's been pigheaded all season about Rooney.

Untrue, apart from the start of the season I didn't speak about him much at all until this week. I'm sure your comment will bring in the thanks though and that's what it's all about. Remember, you're the one that started the thread about him and you probably post about him as much as I do - just with the opposite opinion.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Herrera > Rooney. End of.

Flint Fredstone

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Untrue, apart from the start of the season I didn't speak about him much at all until this week. I'm sure your comment will bring in the thanks though and that's what it's all about. Remember, you're the one that started the thread about him and you probably post about him as much as I do - just with the opposite opinion.

I started a thread about him because people here were sick of this crap day in day out.

Backstreet Moyes

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

My point exactly. Why remove an in form playmaker from a side desperate for a win and some goals in order to put Herrera into a midfield that will dominate the game anyway?

Your definition of being in form is having one decent game laughable.

Again if Rooney plays it wont be as a deep lying midfielder like Herrera so again I have no idea why your putting up stats to compare two players who play in different positions.

NoviGlitzko

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

I'm not being small minded, he's been pigheaded all season about Rooney.

As for the "he's been as good as I've seen him in a couple of years"
He's had one really good game. He's been generally poor for the last couple of seasons so he doesn't even have to play all that well to look better.

To be fair I'm only going by his last few posts (I'm only a semi-regular visitor to this thread), so said I'd give my 2 cents.

But yeah, I don't think that should really matter tbh - He's been more than decent since his hiatus and looks to be getting better and better. And the 'he's been as good as I've seen him in a couple of years' comment just shows how unbelievably bad he's been. All year I've been ranting about getting Rooney out of the team but I don't dislike any United player really, so if he's offering something positive to the team like in Rooney's case, I say put him in.

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Herrera > Rooney. End of.

I don't doubt that, but again with the team lacking up front it would benefit us more to start Rooney instead of Herrera IMO.

But then again, Carrick might be dropped and we'll have to play the two of them. :pac:

NoviGlitzko

Nuts102 wrote: »

Your definition of being in form is having one decent game laughable.

Again if Rooney plays it wont be as a deep lying midfielder like Herrera so again I have no idea why your putting up stats to compare two players who play in different positions.

One has to be dropped to play 4-3-3 or 4-5-1 assuming Carrick isn't dropped.

Cantona's Collars

The League table on this day when The King Signed.



Look what happened at the end of the season.

Flint Fredstone

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

To be fair I'm only going by his last few posts (I'm only a semi-regular visitor to this thread), so said I'd give my 2 cents.

But yeah, I don't think that should really matter tbh - He's been more than decent since his hiatus and looks to be getting better and better. And the 'he's been as good as I've seen him in a couple of years' comment just shows how unbelievably bad he's been. All year I've been ranting about getting Rooney out of the team but I don't dislike any United player really, so if he's offering something positive to the team like in Rooney's case, I say put him in.

I don't doubt that, but again with the team lacking up front it would benefit us more to start Rooney instead of Herrera IMO.

But then again, Carrick might be dropped and we'll have to play the two of them. :pac:

He's earned a place for the next game. I've no problem with that.
My problem is with someone continuously saying he was playing well when he wasn't.
That opinion became untenable when he was dropped for club and country.
Now there's some crawling out of the woodwork after he's had a good game.

deaddonkey15

Nuts102 wrote: »

Your definition of being in form is having one decent game laughable.

Where did I define in form as "one decent game"? In fact I cited 3 different games - the last 3 games that Rooney started - not one, as evidence that in terms of getting the side goals he has been as much if not more so in form for that as anyone else on the team. Do you understand now?

It's ironic though, Mkhitaryan only had the one decent game on Thursday too and there isn't anyone suggesting he should be removed from the side.

Nuts102 wrote: »

Again if Rooney plays it wont be as a deep lying midfielder like Herrera so again I have no idea why your putting up stats to compare two players who play in different positions.

I'm not comparing them. I questioned why, when the team has struggled for goals, should Rooney who has provided a few goals in his last few games be removed from the team in order to bring Herrera into a midfield which will more than likely control the game regardless of if he plays or not. United have dropped points recently because we couldn't put the ball in the net, not because we couldn't control games and dominate teams. Taking out Rooney to put in Herrera instead simply reduces the teams goal threat. You should try actually reading my posts and the posts I respond to instead of simply trying to join in on the gang and make room for yourself on the anti-deaddonkey bandwagon.

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

I don't doubt that, but again with the team lacking up front it would benefit us more to start Rooney instead of Herrera IMO.

Exactly the point I'm making. Hardly rocket science is it? A lot of people seem to be getting very upset about it though.

bmcc10

We have no luck at all play Burnley they defend like heros, 2 comical goals for City today

bucketybuck

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

My problem is with someone continuously saying he was playing well when he wasn't.

Continuously saying he was playing well when he wasn't, and then after one good game immediately shouting "I told you so".

Such behaviour in relation to any topic would be deserving of contempt.

Cantona's Collars

bucketybuck wrote: »

Continuously saying he was playing well when he wasn't, and then after one good game immediately shouting "I told you so".

Such behaviour in relation to any topic would be deserving of contempt.

It's like saying the sun will shine some day,then when it eventually comes out,gloating over it.

deaddonkey15

bucketybuck wrote: »

Continuously saying he was playing well when he wasn't, and then after one good game immediately shouting "I told you so".

I never said he played well when he didn't. I never said "I told you so" or implied it following Thursday's game. Why let that stop you making stuff up though? Childish to say the least.

Korat

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

I never said he played well when he didn't.

Every game.

...even when he wasn't playing.

deaddonkey15

Korat wrote: »

Every game.

...even when he wasn't playing.

Untrue. Nice try though.

Korat

I hope doesn't jinx him to say it but Phil Jones has had a couple of decent games.

Such a frustrating player.

bangkok

well feck that.....theres a massive 3 points for city

Bret Hart

bangkok wrote: »

well feck that.....theres a massive 3 points for city

Our title chances died a long time ago.Spurs and Arsenal,are who we have to be worrying about.

bangkok

Bret Hart wrote: »

Our title chances died a long time ago.It's Tottenham Arsenal,who we have to be worrying about.

never over until its over. just have to keep winning and see where it takes us

RobertKK

The league is not won or lost in November.

United have come from 15 points down to win the league.

J. Marston

bangkok wrote: »

well feck that.....theres a massive 3 points for city

Pff, I'm already in "Anyone but Liverpool" mode.

Lord TSC

RobertKK wrote: »

The league is not won or lost in November.

United have come from 15 points down to win the league.

I mean, we're only a few weeks gone from City having "won" the league already, right before their massive gap at the top disappeared.

Do I think we will win the league? No. Do I think we can? So long as its mathematically possible, absolutely, and we should be aiming as such.

bucketybuck

Korat wrote: »

I hope doesn't jinx him to say it but Phil Jones has had a couple of decent games.

Such a frustrating player.

I've always said that he had the potential, but he will need to have a lot more than 2/3 games under his belt before I stop considering him unreliable. It would be nice to reach the end of the season with Jones having been an ever present but unfortunately its more likely that within the next 5/6 games Jones will once again be out with some niggle or another.

We'll cross our fingers and see how it goes, but its hard to get excited about Jones at this stage.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Bret Hart wrote: »

Our title chances died a long time ago.Spurs and Arsenal,are who we have to be worrying about.

**** that. No top 4 bollocks just yet.

TheDoc

Unless this team really clicks into gear can't see them doing a 8-10 in streak which it needs to consider the title.

Considering how tight it will be dropped points against Burnley , Stoke and Watford is a pretty big deal and more will probably come.

Think our title credentials are dead in the water which is disappointing to say the least. But I simply cannot fathom anything short of top 4.

Would be totally unacceptable with that squad.

Bret Hart

bangkok wrote: »

never over until its over. just have to keep winning and see where it takes us

We've not put back to back league wins together in over 3 months,we're not consist enough to challenge.Simple as that.We are just about hanging onto Arsenal's coattails,right now.