President 'The Donald' Trump and Surprising Consequences - Mod warning in OP

Akrasia

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Fake alternative facts or alternative fake news maybe?



Ah the internet wizards will find ways around this stuff, we probably all should be using things like vpn's anyway

Internet wizards will, but the average joe sixpack voter in the US will blindly absorb the information that gets spoonfed to them through their tv, radio, tablets, iphones and newspapers, all controlled by a tiny group of politically and economically motivated men who themselves control the purse strings of the two political parties in the U.S.

Professor Moriarty

Trump said these jobs wouldn't be going to Mexico. He lied.

Interestingly, this situation offers a telling vignette that disproves Trump's lie that a rising stock market is good for ordinary American people. As it moves its jobs south of the border, its share prices rise.

Quin_Dub

rgossip30 wrote: »

This is really a petty affair and insignificant .

##Mod Note##

Cut out the one liner replies please.

Wanderer78

Akrasia wrote:

Internet wizards will, but the average joe sixpack voter in the US will blindly absorb the information that gets spoonfed to them through their tv, radio, tablets, iphones and newspapers, all controlled by a tiny group of politically and economically motivated men who themselves control the purse strings of the two political parties in the U.S.

Good point alright but a lot of Americans have had enough of their main news feeds and are searching for alternatives, even setting up their own. I wouldn't be surprised if that country ended in civil war, such is the polarisation that's going on.

demfad

Akrasia wrote: »

Internet wizards will, but the average joe sixpack voter in the US will blindly absorb the information that gets spoonfed to them through their tv, radio, tablets, iphones and newspapers, all controlled by a tiny group of politically and economically motivated men who themselves control the purse strings of the two political parties in the U.S.

Can you substantiate that please? names? proof of political offiliation?

Quin_Dub

Akrasia wrote: »

Internet wizards will, but the average joe sixpack voter in the US will blindly absorb the information that gets spoonfed to them through their tv, radio, tablets, iphones and newspapers, all controlled by a tiny group of politically and economically motivated men who themselves control the purse strings of the two political parties in the U.S.

demfad wrote: »

Can you substantiate that please? names? proof of political offiliation?

Robert Mercer and his company Cambridge Analytica are certainly heavily influencing Online Media

Just over a week ago, Donald Trump gathered members of the world’s press before him and told them they were liars. “The press, honestly, is out of control,” he said. “The public doesn’t believe you any more.” CNN was described as “very fake news… story after story is bad”. The BBC was “another beauty”.

That night I did two things. First, I typed “Trump” in the search box of Twitter. My feed was reporting that he was crazy, a lunatic, a raving madman. But that wasn’t how it was playing out elsewhere. The results produced a stream of “Go Donald!!!!”, and “You show ’em!!!” There were star-spangled banner emojis and thumbs-up emojis and clips of Trump laying into the “FAKE news MSM liars!”

Trump had spoken, and his audience had heard him. Then I did what I’ve been doing for two and a half months now. I Googled “mainstream media is…” And there it was. Google’s autocomplete suggestions: “mainstream media is… dead, dying, fake news, fake, finished”. Is it dead, I wonder? Has FAKE news won? Are we now the FAKE news? Is the mainstream media – we, us, I – dying?

I click Google’s first suggested link. It leads to a website called CNSnews.com and an article: “The Mainstream media are dead.” They’re dead, I learn, because they – we, I – “cannot be trusted”. How had it, an obscure site I’d never heard of, dominated Google’s search algorithm on the topic? In the “About us” tab, I learn CNSnews is owned by the Media Research Center, which a click later I learn is “America’s media watchdog”, an organisation that claims an “unwavering commitment to neutralising leftwing bias in the news, media and popular culture”.

Another couple of clicks and I discover that it receives a large bulk of its funding – more than $10m in the past decade – from a single source, the hedge fund billionaire Robert Mercer. If you follow US politics you may recognise the name. Robert Mercer is the money behind Donald Trump. But then, I will come to learn, Robert Mercer is the money behind an awful lot of things. He was Trump’s single biggest donor. Mercer started backing Ted Cruz, but when he fell out of the presidential race he threw his money – $13.5m of it – behind the Trump campaign.

From this Guardian Article

Mr.Micro

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Trump said these jobs wouldn't be going to Mexico. He lied.

Interestingly, this situation offers a telling vignette that disproves Trump's lie that a rising stock market is good for ordinary American people. As it moves its jobs south of the border, its share prices rise.

If jobs are going to be kept in the US, I just wonder what sort of wages will the workers be paid. Big companies locate to other countries to get cheaper labour costs, avoid corporation tax and several other advantages. If suddenly they have to return to the US it will be less profit, higher costs etc. It sounds great and patriotic but in the reality of the modern business world is it feasible?

demfad

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Robert Mercer and his company Cambridge Analytica are certainly heavily influencing Online Media




From this Guardian Article

I agree. To be honest, this article shows that Mercer created the US Web infrastructure that enabled the Propagation and amplification of election related (fake) news. He also created the methodology where themes make it to top of search engines, Twitter eggs can make users popular and their news/fake news trend and eventually MSM News (which echoes trending topics).

Cambridge Analytica also relies on paid social media trolls using specific themes to influence discourse by argument or drown out counter stories by large volume. This 'paid troll' seems to have been subcontracted out to the St Petersburg trolls (Russian Government).

Mercer runs the worlds biggest hedge fund. If there is a full 9/11 style investigation into Trump/Russia it will be Watergate x 1000.

Note that Cambridge is now in the Whitehouse, so Govt policy propaganda can be brainwashed into people.

A puzzle from the article is that CA/Mercer/Bannon worked AGAINST Paul Nutall in Stoke.
But who was Mercer FOR?
Solving an internal UKIP dispute for pal Farage?
Or has Trump promised T May the use of Cambridge Analytica election manipulation on the Britiah electorate as it did for leave.eu?

Edit:

CA may also be used for upcoming European elections (LePen)

Edit2

The other poster claimed that both sides media were controlled by partisan corporate interests.
I'm not sure I agree.

Professor Moriarty

Mr.Micro wrote: »

If jobs are going to be kept in the US, I just wonder what sort of wages will the workers be paid. Big companies locate to other countries to get cheaper labour costs, avoid corporation tax and several other advantages. If suddenly they have to return to the US it will be less profit, higher costs etc. It sounds great and patriotic but in the reality of the modern business world is it feasible?

It's really only a sideshow. Joe Soap's greatest threat is AI and automation. If Joe thinks that Trump and his cronies are going to forego profit to keep him in a job then he is truly deluded.

All is not lost though, he can get work as a soldier fighting the arms industry's wars. He can happily die in draft-dodger The Donald's service.

Professor Moriarty

Billionaire investor Ross as Commerce Sec. Good call, Donald.

listermint

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Billionaire investor Ross as Commerce Sec. Good call, Donald.

The same Wilbur Ross with Ties to both Trump and a Russian Oliarch who paid trump 100 Million Dollars for a property not worth half of that in 2008.

The man is a lynch pin in various Trump dealings with Foreign banks and foreign individuals - Not all of these dealings straight forward..

Professor Moriarty

Trump blaming Obama for protests and leaks. Will any member of the craven GOP object to this lie? Probably not. What a shower of selfish unprincipled cowards.

demfad

listermint wrote: »

The same Wilbur Ross with Ties to both Trump and a Russian Oliarch who paid trump 100 Million Dollars for a property not worth half of that in 2008.

The man is a lynch pin in various Trump dealings with Foreign banks and foreign individuals - Not all of these dealings straight forward..

He also bailed Trump out previously, and bailed Kushner out of a $1.8 Bill loan for the disastrous purchase of 666 5th Avenue the most expensive building in the world bought at the height of the boom. Guys called 'Feinburg' and 'Roth' also bailed Kushner out of this, Roth also helped Trump out of another disastrous investment. Feinburg will be tasked with purging the IC. He is literally the 'Lord of war' owned dozens of arms companies.

Ross also designed Trumo's 1.1 Trillion dollar infrastraructure 'plan'.
Here is the crony schematic:



EDIT:

Russian Oliarch who paid trump 100 Million Dollars for a property not worth half of that in 2008

This is Rybolovlev. His plane was spotted several times at the airport beside Trumps during pre election rallies. Same in Florida weekend before Flynn firing. On the concrete right next to Trumps.

Amerika

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Trump blaming Obama for protests and leaks. Will any member of the craven GOP object to this lie? Probably not. What a shower of selfish unprincipled cowards.

How can one object to it when reports indicate the leaks might very well be from some Obama appointees and holdovers?

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/obama-appointees-could-be-behind-leaks/

Leroy42

Amerika wrote: »

How can one object to it when reports indicate the leaks might very well be from some Obama appointees and holdovers?

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/obama-appointees-could-be-behind-leaks/

Because, unless Trump hasn't noticed, he is now the man in charge.

He is very quick to take credit for Intel jobs etc but apparently he has no ability to deal with his own staff.

If he had come in prepared rather than having little or no transition work done, then it wouldn't be a problem.

Christy42

Amerika wrote: »

How can one object to it when reports indicate the leaks might very well be from some Obama appointees and holdovers?

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/obama-appointees-could-be-behind-leaks/

So much wrong with this. A: the paper just had a theory that is shared by a political scientist and a chat show host. No actual reports say this. They are merely reporting on the possibility in a suggestive way.

Second even if it was Obama holdovers then Trump is still lying through his teeth. They are making their own decisions, Obama did not leave orders for them to leak to the press. Obama is not still issuing orders to them.

Laughable defense of the Trump's latest deflection and lie.

weisses

Amerika wrote: »

How can one object to it when reports indicate the leaks might very well be from some Obama appointees and holdovers?

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/obama-appointees-could-be-behind-leaks/

Yes those pesky Obama people doing their job

One of those senior Obama appointees who stayed for the start of the new administration was former acting Attorney General Sally Yates. Yates not only proved herself a partisan figure by instructing Justice Department attorneys not to defend President Trump’s immigration executive orders, but she is also directly connected to the Flynn incident. Yates reportedly first alerted White House officials Flynn may have misled them on the content of his conversation with the Russian ambassador and Yates suggested Flynn could be subject to Russian blackmail.

But wait ... even the republicans are a target

In this case, representatives of the foreign policy establishment of both parties are unified against President Trump and they are focused on taking out General Flynn," Buskirk writes.

"The same people who brought us the failed wars for democracy in Iraq and Afghanistan, the implosion of Libya, the Syrian Civil War, the rise of ISIS, and the concomitant international refugee crisis want Flynn's scalp so they can reassert some control," he continued.

Proper CT territory I think
If not ...what does it say that according to your own link both democrats and republicans want to get rid of Trump ?

Professor Moriarty

Christy42 wrote: »

So much wrong with this. A: the paper just had a theory that is shared by a political scientist and a chat show host. No actual reports say this. They are merely reporting on the possibility in a suggestive way.

Second even if it was Obama holdovers then Trump is still lying through his teeth. They are making their own decisions, Obama did not leave orders for them to leak to the press. Obama is not still issuing orders to them.

Laughable defense of the Trump's latest deflection and lie.

It's just a website for conspiracy theories according to Wikipedia. Not to be taken seriously.

InTheTrees

I'm noticing that we're slowly moving from "The Emperor Has No Clothes" to "The Boy Who Cried Wolf", as popular opinion moves from saying everything is fine and trump is doing great to general amazement at the number of lies that come out of his mouth. His supporters will explain them away but everyone is noticing. And we're only into the second month.
Interesting times.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/02/21/donald-trumps-unbroken-streak-of-falsehoods-now-stands-at-33-days/?utm_term=.3e83c71cc37a

mcmoustache

Amerika wrote: »

How can one object to it when reports indicate the leaks might very well be from some Obama appointees and holdovers?

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/obama-appointees-could-be-behind-leaks/

I'm still not seeing how this could be Obama's fault. Are you saying that he shouldn't have hired anyone during the 8 years?

I ask because you seem to be suggesting that Obama is responsible for the leaks due to the fact that people who were hired by him might be leaking. While this reasoning might appear sound to an enthusiastic partisan, some minimal investigation shows that this "logic" is, in fact, a load of dingo's kidneys.

The white house needs to be staffed, regardless of who the president is. Obama had a responsibility to keep it staffed as did every other president. If Obama is to be responsible for the actions of staffers who were hired during his term now that another president is in charge, then the only way for him not to be responsible would be to not hire at all.

I can understand the desire to go "but Obama" or "but Hillary" but this is really stretching it.

Professor Moriarty

InTheTrees wrote: »

I'm noticing that we're slowly moving from "The Emperor Has No Clothes" to "The Boy Who Cried Wolf", as popular opinion moves from saying everything is fine and trump is doing great to general amazement at the number of lies that come out of his mouth. His supporters will explain them away but everyone is noticing. And we're only into the second month.
Interesting times.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/02/21/donald-trumps-unbroken-streak-of-falsehoods-now-stands-at-33-days/?utm_term=.3e83c71cc37a

Yeah but that's fake news. Sad.

Rightwing

Obama isn't someone I'd trust, Trump may be onto something, but I doubt it.

demfad

The Obama move by Trump (Bannon) is for his core. The catalyst for teh fury of the Tea Party movement was the election of a Black President.
Citing Obama as the boogie man behind Trump's woes will hit a chord...but very very early for that.


Meanwhile:

What a bleeping coward!

Professor Moriarty

demfad wrote: »

The Obama move by Trump (Bannon) is for his core. The catalyst for teh fury of the Tea Party movement was the election of a Black President.
Citing Obama as the boogie man behind Trump's woes will hit a chord...but very very early for that.


Meanwhile:

What a bleeping coward!

Loth though I am to say it, I think he handled that question well.

BabyCheeses

Amerika wrote: »

How can one object to it when reports indicate the leaks might very well be from some Obama appointees and holdovers?

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/obama-appointees-could-be-behind-leaks/

Trump can't hire and control his own staff but will be great for running the country.

Maybe Trump should have filled it with his own yes men.

Igotadose

Christy42 wrote: »

So much wrong with this. A: the paper just had a theory that is shared by a political scientist and a chat show host. No actual reports say this. They are merely reporting on the possibility in a suggestive way.

Second even if it was Obama holdovers then Trump is still lying through his teeth. They are making their own decisions, Obama did not leave orders for them to leak to the press. Obama is not still issuing orders to them.

Laughable defense of the Trump's latest deflection and lie.

Lifezette, a Laura Ingraham site. Uhuh definitely even-handed.

Igotadose

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Loth though I am to say it, I think he handled that question well.

By doubling down on his endless 'if it's on my team, its the absolute best.' Trying to deflect 'it was started before me.' So what. If you can't stand the heat, loser orange monkey, get out of the kitchen. The buck stops there, I think the Truman plaque is still on his desk.

Farcical. Gutless coward sacrificing the flower of America's youth because he's too busy tweeting about Nordstrom during security briefings or whatever he was doing, perhaps tweeting about inauguration crowds, rather than paying attention.

And, great Generals indeed, which is why every analysis since this tragedy has shown it to be a failure. Where's Trey Gowdy investigating? Jason Chaffetz? Spend only a few million this time?

He plans to bring some folks who, sadly, lost relatives to crimes committed by undocumented aliens, to a joint session of Congress. All theater, all politics, all the time, no bar too low for Trump to slither under. Even GWB brought American success stories like Dikembe Mutombo to one of his addresses. Why humiliate these people even more? Can't he leave them in peace? Why make their tragedy be a focus? Does he believe this will aide in making America great again?

The man's a stain on the Republic. His supporters should really take a good hard look in the mirror and ask themselves if they really care about America and it's future, having voted for this manifestly unqualified lying cheat, or were just voting for the hell of it because they had the right to, but didn't realize the responsibility that came along with it? I guess Americans really are as stupid as the rest of the world thinks they are. Can't be having all those low scores academically and not have it be impactful. Generations of underachivement, this is what you get.

I weep for America yet again. Worst president ever; even mediocre would be a huge achievement for him. I tell the people I care about back in the US to find a way out, because it's going to get way worse under Trump before it might get better, no sooner than 2018 should the rubber-stamp Congress switch to the Democrats. Just the other day, the effort to get Trump to produce his tax returns was voted against by Congress along party lines - 100% Republican against, 100% Democrats for. Elections have consequences.

Igotadose

Rightwing wrote: »

Obama isn't someone I'd trust, Trump may be onto something, but I doubt it.

Why not? He produced his tax returns. When will we see Trumps? You trust Trump?

Professor Moriarty

Igotadose wrote: »

By doubling down on his endless 'if it's on my team, its the absolute best.' Trying to deflect 'it was started before me.' So what. If you can't stand the heat, loser orange monkey, get out of the kitchen. The buck stops there, I think the Truman plaque is still on his desk.

Farcical. Gutless coward sacrificing the flower of America's youth because he's too busy tweeting about Nordstrom during security briefings or whatever he was doing, perhaps tweeting about inauguration crowds, rather than paying attention.

And, great Generals indeed, which is why every analysis since this tragedy has shown it to be a failure. Where's Trey Gowdy investigating? Jason Chaffetz? Spend only a few million this time?

He plans to bring some folks who, sadly, lost relatives to crimes committed by undocumented aliens, to a joint session of Congress. All theater, all politics, all the time, no bar too low for Trump to slither under. Even GWB brought American success stories like Dikembe Mutombo to one of his addresses. Why humiliate these people even more? Can't he leave them in peace? Why make their tragedy be a focus? Does he believe this will aide in making America great again?

The man's a stain on the Republic. His supporters should really take a good hard look in the mirror and ask themselves if they really care about America and it's future, having voted for this manifestly unqualified lying cheat, or were just voting for the hell of it because they had the right to, but didn't realize the responsibility that came along with it? I guess Americans really are as stupid as the rest of the world thinks they are. Can't be having all those low scores academically and not have it be impactful. Generations of underachivement, this is what you get.

I weep for America yet again. Worst president ever; even mediocre would be a huge achievement for him. I tell the people I care about back in the US to find a way out, because it's going to get way worse under Trump before it might get better, no sooner than 2018 should the rubber-stamp Congress switch to the Democrats. Just the other day, the effort to get Trump to produce his tax returns was voted against by Congress along party lines - 100% Republican against, 100% Democrats for. Elections have consequences.

Right. I could be mistaken, but I'm guessing you're not The Donald's biggest fan?

demfad

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Right. I could be mistaken, but I'm guessing you're not The Donald's biggest fan?

Come on. He is the commander in chief but he blamed his generals for that mans death. As well as a his death there was also about 30 civillians including about(?) 15 children under age of 13. Its blood boiling.
The story about the intel find is a lie also: The raid was to kill operatives,
There was no significant intel find., there was never meant to be.
The dead seal's Dad refused to meet Trump at the handover of the body, righty idendtifying it as a PR stunt. Infact he reckoned the whole operation was a PR stunt gone wrong.
There wont be an investigation into this, but the military will take notice.