President 'The Donald' Trump and Surprising Consequences - Mod warning in OP

Hank Scorpio

Peregrinus wrote: »

They undoubtedly would. She and they are heavily invested in the same "clash of civilisations" narrative, and it would encourage them enormously were she to be elected.

I doubt that this particular attack was engineered to influence the election (or that it will have much influence on the election) but if we do think so, we don't need to invoke Trump or the Russians to account for it.

Oh I agree, I was listening to msnbc the other day and read a few articles on the Huffington post and Salon. They seem to think Putin setup the chemical attack so Trump's people would see it on TV and fire some missiles which in turn would take away from the Russia Trump scandal that there's no evidence for. They didn't offer any evidence for Russia creating the gas attack either but it makes sense. I mean the only other reasonable explanation is that the media has an agenda.

Peregrinus

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Oh I agree, I was listening to msnbc the other day and read a few articles on the Huffington post and Salon. They seem to think Putin setup the chemical attack so Trump's people would see it on TV and fire some missiles which in turn would take away from the Russia Trump scandal that there's no evidence for . . .

Got any links to these articles?

Hank Scorpio

Peregrinus wrote: »

Got any links to these articles?

https://twitter.com/Lawrence/status/850420599428198400?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.rt.com%2Fviral%2F384121-syria-chemical-attack-conspiracy-theories%2F

http://www.msnbc.com/the-last-word/watch/the-trump-putin-theory-on-syria-that-can-t-be-ruled-out-916753987666

Lawrence O'Donnell suggests Putin told Assad to gas bomb his own citizens.

http://www.salon.com/2017/04/07/donald-trump-whos-not-vladimir-putins-puppet-warned-russia-before-airstrikes-on-syria/

Donald Trump, who’s totally not Vladimir Putin’s puppet, warned Russia before airstrikes on Syria "You'll never believe who knew in advance about the U.S. airstrikes on Syria"

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-air-strikes-syria-vladimir-putin-kill-narrative-russia-us-relations-set-piece-chris-a7672256.html

( Chris Matthews ) MSNBC host suggests US president may have colluded with Moscow to plan limited response to chemical weapons claim

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/is-trump-wagging-the-dog_us_58e7040de4b0acd784ca56ee

"This is a cold and calculated move designed to distract from the mounting evidence of a Trump-Putin connection..."

http://www.newsweek.com/did-trump-attack-assad-end-russian-collusion-story-580754

DID TRUMP ATTACK ASSAD TO END THE RUSSIAN COLLUSION STORY?

The video breaks down the msnbc conspiracy theory pretty good I feel.

Itssoeasy

I see AG Jeff sessions has described the federal judge in Hawaii (the 50th US state if you're keeping score) as one "sitting on an island in the Pacific." The trump administration really aren't good at saying the right thing even if you think something else.

Leroy42

FatherTed wrote: »

The FBI are only gettin start and won't release anything unless it is 100% iron clad. After all it took them forever for the multiple Bengazi investigations. Plus they are probably waiting on the likes of Flynn to spill the beans as well. I'd prefer for them to take their time and wait till later this year of perhaps next year mainly because I find Trump and chaotic administration somewhat amusing.

This is where I have my doubts. I don't think FBI/CIA are particularly well known for their wait and see approach to threats. The US is a culture which shots first rather than risk something.

And this isn't just some potential ISIS fighter with a potential attack that they picked up on social media. This is the POTUS, with access to every aspect of the state, who has massive controls and can directly effect the security and safety of every US citizen around the world.

Yet they are going to wait and see what happens? If this is the approach they take, how can anybody have any confidence in their ability to deal with terrorism if they only move once every T is crossed?

They should be interrogating Flynn as we speak, breaking him down, getting what he knows and moving up the chain. WOrst thing is that Trump learns of it and scarpers, but even that his better than a possible infiltrator in the WH.

Leroy42

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I see AG Jeff sessions has described the federal judge in Hawaii (the 50th US state if you're keeping score) as one "sitting on an island in the Pacific." The trump administration really aren't good at saying the right thing even if you think something else.

I think Trump in particular, and his team as a whole, have been very good at playing the part of looking likes fools, people are prepared to accept that what they say they didn't mean but simply said it the wrong way.

But when you actually look through their statements that is not the case. They very rarely say something actually in opposition to their position. Take the recent CVN flotilla for example. Trump actually never mentioned when they would be close to NK, so Spicer is quite right to state that what others took from what he said is not their problem. Of course he meant them to take it exactly as that.

Sessions statement about the judge is another example. What he said is techincally correct. So if he is called up on it, the the posters seems to be alluding to, he can legitimately say that all he said was the truth.

Of course, what he is really saying is that the judge is less important that he deems himself to be. A normal person would come out and say that, but Team Trump is smarter than that.

KellyAnne's talk about the Masacre that never happened. 'Oops, of course I didn't mean to say that, silly me". This from a woman who is universally acknowledged as being extremely proficient at her job, a leading reason as to why Trump managed to win. She gets away with it as people treat her s stupid, and that statement proves it. IMO, he proves how smart she is. She completely owned the news agenda for the few days afterwards, taking all the heat of Trump.

They they roll out Spicer, then Sessions, then Trump will tweet, then back to Spicer, get Ivanka to say something etc etc etc.

jooksavage

Leroy42 wrote: »

They should be interrogating Flynn as we speak, breaking him down, getting what he knows and moving up the chain. WOrst thing is that Trump learns of it and scarpers, but even that his better than a possible infiltrator in the WH.

You think Trump can pack a bindle and abscond to Russia Snowden-style?

Leroy42

jooksavage wrote: »

You think Trump can pack a bindle and abscond to Russia Snowden-style?

If the very worst of what is being alleged is true, not saying it is by the way, then what other option would he have? He ain't going to stick around to be put in jail.

I'm just saying that if the FBI have any evidence at all they should move, as the worst case is they stop what is going on but don't get to jail Trump. But surely national security is the bigger fish here, not the individual

Hank Scorpio

Even it was true nothing will happen, it rarely does in Washington , he's bowed to the CIA and whoever else and let them get on with their proxy wars. His fight against the "deepstate" is kaputt.

Billy86

http://uk.businessinsider.com/poll-trump-obama-golf-2017-4?r=US&IR=T

A Thursday poll from the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling shows that 53% of respondents who said they voted for Trump in November said Obama had outpaced Trump on trips to the golf course during each president's first three months in office. Just 20% of Trump voters said Trump played more golf, while 27% said they were unsure.

It's probably fair to say that at least 53% of Trump voters can legitimately be considered cultists at this stage: A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader.

Christy42

Billy86 wrote: »

http://uk.businessinsider.com/poll-trump-obama-golf-2017-4?r=US&IR=T


It's probably fair to say that at least 53% of Trump voters can legitimately be considered cultists at this stage: A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader.

Sure the man they listen to made a point of giving out about Obama's trips and hasn't made an issue of Trump's at all.

Still overall it makes little difference. He has long been shown to have little to do with the decisions. It is more about who can influence him more and get him to sign what they want. Less time thinking about US affairs will hardly make a difference to any decision making. The people working out the details are working in Washington while the golfer is in Florida.

BabyCheeses

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Oh I agree, I was listening to msnbc the other day and read a few articles on the Huffington post and Salon. They seem to think Putin setup the chemical attack so Trump's people would see it on TV and fire some missiles which in turn would take away from the Russia Trump scandal that there's no evidence for. They didn't offer any evidence for Russia creating the gas attack either but it makes sense. I mean the only other reasonable explanation is that the media has an agenda.

I thought it was clear Assad didn't use chemical weapons and they must have hit weapons owned by the rebels? Or that was the story on the_donald until it was dropped like the bomb.

Sonics2k

Well now, this is interesting.

Arrest of Julian Assange a 'priority' in US clampdown on all leaks

THE ARREST OF WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange is a US “priority”, Attorney General Jeff Sessions said, as media reports indicated his office was preparing charges against the fugitive anti-hero.
“We are going to step up our effort and already are stepping up our efforts on all leaks,” Sessions, America’s top cop, said at a news conference in response to a reporter’s question about a US priority to arrest Assange.

I'm genuinely interested to know what Trump will say about this. It's undeniable just how much help Assange and Wikileaks were in his victory in the election, but Trump has repeatedly complained about leaks in the White House while previously praising Assange himself.

InTheTrees

Sonics2k wrote: »

I'm genuinely interested to know what Trump will say about this.

Honestly at this point I wouldn't trust a word of what trump says.

For instance yesterday, tillerson and trump gave completely opposite plans for dealing with Irans nuclear program.

So who does one trust? It turns out Tillerson, the powerless sec of state, because everyone now knows trump barely has a grasp of the basics.

Christy42

Sonics2k wrote: »

Well now, this is interesting.

Arrest of Julian Assange a 'priority' in US clampdown on all leaks



I'm genuinely interested to know what Trump will say about this. It's undeniable just how much help Assange and Wikileaks were in his victory in the election, but Trump has repeatedly complained about leaks in the White House while previously praising Assange himself.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2017/01/04/politics/kfile-trump-wikileaks/index.html

He also previously called for the death penalty in this case!!!

Seriously though as another poster said Trump is unimportant in all this. It is all about who can influence him the best. Trump does not know what or where he is and just wants to play golf and think he is great.

It is important to look at those close to him to see what direction they are pulling in.

demfad

Leroy42 wrote: »

If the very worst of what is being alleged is true, not saying it is by the way, then what other option would he have? He ain't going to stick around to be put in jail.

I'm just saying that if the FBI have any evidence at all they should move, as the worst case is they stop what is going on but don't get to jail Trump. But surely national security is the bigger fish here, not the individual

What exactly should they do when they 'move' I'm curious?
Perhaps the slowness could also reflect the size and depth of the 'problem' here.

InTheTrees

Christy42 wrote: »

Trump does not know what or where he is and just wants to play golf and think he is great.

There's been some speculation about Early Onset Dementia. The narcissism doesn't explain the fact that he doesn't seem to know where he is or what he's doing at times.

The hand over the heart incident was pretty bizarre. More and more trump is giving the appearance of someone who is completely at sea with what's going on around him.

Hank Scorpio

Yeah if Trump's admin pull Assange out of that embassy his chance of re-election is zero, even Obama wasn't so brazen. Media outlets publish confidential leaks all the time, where do you draw the line.

demfad

http://occupydemocrats.com/2017/04/13/government-just-admitted-voting-machine-issues-5-trump-swing-states-2016/

Following the unprecedented upset in the 2016 Presidential Election, the National Association of Voting Officials (NAVO) made a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request asking the Justice Department to share any errors and inconsistencies in voting machines.

In a letter to NAVO secretary Brent Turner, the Justice Department just confirmed 90 instances of “concerns about voting machine malfunctions in Florida, Michigan, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin” and “at least 527 responsive documents remaining in the system that relate to other types of voting issues.” (Full letter below.)

The Justice Department has yet to send the documents to NAVO, but we can expect them to shed at least a little more light on one of the strangest elections in U.S. history. President Trump lost the popular vote by more than two percentage point but pulled out a narrow electoral college victory by winning Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin by fewer than 80,000 combined votes.

With all three of those states among those with reported irregularities, these documents could bring even more uncertainty to an election that has been flooded with evidence of Russian collusion.

The letters received from the FOIA request are printed at the bottom of the page. Note 'instances' = 'pages'.

It also throws up other issues in that areas with faulty machines cannot be recounted. See below, half the votes in Detroit could not be recounted by Michigan law.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-elections/us-election-michigan-recount-donald-trump-broken-voting-machines-hillary-clinton-a7458231.html

In 392 of the city’s 662 voting precincts, the number of votes recorded on machines was not the same as the number of voters registerered by polling station staff.

According to Michigan state law, voting precincts where polling registers do not match with voting machines cannot be included in a recount. In that situation, the original election result will stand.

Itssoeasy

Well now that's interesting.

...And Justice

demfad wrote: »

http://occupydemocrats.com/2017/04/13/government-just-admitted-voting-machine-issues-5-trump-swing-states-2016/



The letters received from the FOIA request are printed at the bottom of the page. Note 'instances' = 'pages'.

It also throws up other issues in that areas with faulty machines cannot be recounted. See below, half the votes in Detroit could not be recounted by Michigan law.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-elections/us-election-michigan-recount-donald-trump-broken-voting-machines-hillary-clinton-a7458231.html

All huff and bluster by the democrats that are still in position in the FBI. Same as the JW Bush /Al Gore affair, except the American government were rigging the election so Bush got in.

As someone said earlier, the American government have been interfering with foreign elections for decades to further their foreign policies.

For some reason people cannot except DJ Trump as president. All of the dementia allegations...well then he could start WW3 to stop impeachment. Suspend the constitution etc...

Hank Scorpio

BabyCheeses wrote: »

I thought it was clear Assad didn't use chemical weapons and they must have hit weapons owned by the rebels? Or that was the story on the_donald until it was dropped like the bomb.

I read on the Huff post that whites shouldn't be allowed to vote, you see what I did there?

demfad

...And Justice wrote: »

All huff and bluster by the democrats that are still in position in the FBI. Same as the JW Bush /Al Gore affair, except the American government were rigging the election so Bush got in.

As someone said earlier, the American government have been interfering with foreign elections for decades to further their foreign policies.

For some reason people cannot except DJ Trump as president. All of the dementia allegations...well then he could start WW3 to stop impeachment. Suspend the constitution etc...

The letters confirming the issues was a response from the US Justice department to the the National Association of Voting Officials FOIA. Neither of these parties are democrats.

For the reason people cant accept Trump see bolded section below. Note also the fact that several of his campaign team have lied about contacts with Russia amonst many other reasons. Americans might not be too happy with the POTUS as an agent of influence of a country pointing several thousand nuclear war heads at them. Could you blame them?
My own concern is that having a clueless, unstable potentially treasonous fool as POTUS might increase the chances of the break up of the EU and nuclear war, none of which outcomes are desirable for me or my family.

demfad wrote: »

It's looking like Trump's upcoming problems will be coming from two directions:

1: The FBI's investigation into Trump/Russia and associated Congress/DOJ/Pantagon investigations.

-- Guardian article (reported earlier by someone)

“They now have specific concrete and corroborative evidence of collusion,” the source said. “This is between people in the Trump campaign and agents of [Russian] influence relating to the use of hacked material.”

InTheTrees

...And Justice wrote: »

For some reason people cannot except DJ Trump as president.

The reason is he lost the peoples vote by three million votes. I think Clinton actually got more votes than any other presidential candidate ever although I could be wrong on that.

...And Justice

demfad wrote: »

The letters confirming the issues was a response from the US Justice department to the the National Association of Voting Officials FOIA. Neither of these parties are democrats.

For the reason people cant accept Trump see bolded section below. Note also the fact that several of his campaign team have lied about contacts with Russia amonst many other reasons. Americans might not be too happy with the POTUS as an agent of influence of a country pointing several thousand nuclear war heads at them. Could you blame them?
My own concern is that having a clueless, unstable potentially treasonous fool as POTUS might increase the chances of the break up of the EU and nuclear war, none of which outcomes are desirable for me or my family.

There was concrete proof that Al Gore won the presidency in 2000. I remember watching David Letterman and he was called Mr President when he walked out.

It didn't change anything. In fact when 9/11 happened everyone rallied around Bush and forgot that Al Gore won and that the fraud that was carried out in Florida with "electronic elections" was forgotten about.

Donald Trump is president, forget all the bluster from CNN and NBC, it's done, he's in power because certain interests want him to be.

InTheTrees

...And Justice wrote: »

There was concrete proof that Al Gore won the presidency in 2000. I remember watching David Letterman and he was called Mr President when he walked out.

It didn't change anything. In fact when 9/11 happened everyone rallied around Bush and forgot that Al Gore won and that the fraud that was carried out in Florida with "electronic elections" was forgotten about.

Donald Trump is president, forget all the bluster from CNN and NBC, it's done, he's in power because certain interests want him to be.

I think you'll find George w bush tops most polls for Worst American President. He was a disaster.

I don't think anyone "forgot" who actually won, just as they won't forget trump lost the popular vote.

InTheTrees

...And Justice wrote: »

Donald Trump is president, forget all the bluster from CNN and NBC, it's done, he's in power because certain interests want him to be.

No idea what your point is. The end of the fourth estate?

Are you suggesting people stop criticising the president? We should all just sit back and let him do what he wants?

That doesn't make any sense.

InTheTrees

...And Justice wrote: »

It didn't change anything.

It actually did.

Bush had the same plans for social security as trump and failed to pass any reforms.

He also had the same useless plan for healthcare reform (tax free savings accounts for the poor!) that also failed as badly as trump moronic "plan".

What else? Oh yes tax reform. Just like trumps plan: take from the poor and give to the rich and it failed as well.

What notable legislation did George w bush actually pass?

If it hadn't been for 9/11 he would never have won a second term.

Christy42

InTheTrees wrote: »

There's been some speculation about Early Onset Dementia. The narcissism doesn't explain the fact that he doesn't seem to know where he is or what he's doing at times.

The hand over the heart incident was pretty bizarre. More and more trump is giving the appearance of someone who is completely at sea with what's going on around him.

Eh it does not need to be dementia, though I would like him to get a serious doctor's note. It could quite well be pure idiocy.

BabyCheeses

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

I read on the Huff post that whites shouldn't be allowed to vote, you see what I did there?

Continue to show the Trump supporter's obsession with identity politics?


I'm sure you have a point, why don't you get to it?