NEW 2016 Open and Interdepartmental Assistant Principal in Civil Service competition.

tea and coffee

The_Conductor wrote: »

You can clarify this at the interview- the interviewers always have a good note taker amongst them........ I wouldn't worry unduly- lots of people have gaps (for various reasons, ill health, caring or parental duties etc etc). Don't worry- its not unusual........

Thanks The Conductor. Essentially, my first 4 years in the CS is missing! it's going to be quite cringe worthy having to tell the board that I actually worked in X and Y department.

eoinola

For the last AP interview they actually allowed people to amend their form ahead of the interview. They must have changed their approach on this too.

Cupra280

eoinola wrote: »

For the last AP interview they actually allowed people to amend their form ahead of the interview. They must have changed their approach on this too.

Was just going to say this.

However, the amendments could be made 15 months after the original form was submitted. The form for this competition has only been with PAS since the end of 2016

duffer247

The_Conductor wrote: »

To be brutally honest- the whole process, the whole recruitment process- is nuts. You have people who might make brilliant APs (or any other grade) being tossed aside- on the basis of a bad maths test, deviating from one score by over 15%- or other reasons that caused some component of the testing to go skew-ways. You could end up with a complete and utter psychopath- who is good at interviews and sufficient at online testing- who goes on to make everyone's life a misery- or indeed- someone who could gel a dysfunctional Division together could end up discarded.........

There has to be a better way of recruiting candidates.

There's 3 or 4 times the level of psychopathy in management when compared with the general population :eek:

deskbottle

Does anyone know how long these interviews generally are? Thanks!

Winterspring

deskbottle wrote: »

Does anyone know how long these interviews generally are? Thanks!

Last one I did was 50mins

Rosiebeans81

Does anyone have a link to the original spec for this post?? Just wondering what it says re eligibility for the interdepartmental? Or does anyone remember. I thought it said two years in the CS or relevant management experience at a particular level? Just gotten word I don't qualify for the inter just the open because I'm under the two years.

ZolaGood

Rosiebeans81 wrote: »

Does anyone have a link to the original spec for this post?? Just wondering what it says re eligibility for the interdepartmental? Or does anyone remember. I thought it said two years in the CS or relevant management experience at a particular level? Just gotten word I don't qualify for the inter just the open because I'm under the two years.

http://circulars.gov.ie/pdf/circular/per/2016/26.pdf

Rosiebeans81

Thanks for that ZolaGood - looks like I need to learn how to read!!

pfitzp90

Have 2 examples for each competency.

jobbridge4life

I have an interview this week. While preparing I noticed that I somehow managed to submit my pre-read through version of my application form. I literally have no idea how this happened. I thought I had been very thorough. Anyway it is my fault, so no excuses. They aren't spelling mistakes but things that I caught in my read through, such as grammar errors, missing possessive apostrophes etc, missing words.

My question is basically... am I f**ked now? Are you marked on the form itself or just the performance at interview? Obviously the interview panel will have access to and presumably have read through my application form and as such these errors will colour their perception of me.

Despairing at my stupidity here.

Winterspring

jobbridge4life wrote: »

I have an interview this week. While preparing I noticed that I somehow managed to submit my pre-read through version of my application form. I literally have no idea how this happened. I thought I had been very thorough. Anyway it is my fault, so no excuses. They aren't spelling mistakes but things that I caught in my read through, such as grammar errors, missing possessive apostrophes etc, missing words.

My question is basically... am I f**ked now? Are you marked on the form itself or just the performance at interview? Obviously the interview panel will have access to and presumably have read through my application form and as such these errors will colour their perception of me.

Despairing at my stupidity here.

Same thing happened to me and I am usually so careful with that. All you can do is move on and do the best you can at interview.

jobbridge4life

Winterspring wrote: »

Same thing happened to me and I am usually so careful with that. All you can do is move on and do the best you can at interview.

Did you make it through that time?

Winterspring

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Winterspring wrote: »

Same thing happened to me and I am usually so careful with that. All you can do is move on and do the best you can at interview.

Did you make it through that time?

It is for this set of interviews that it has happened so I am facing the same thing as you.

jobbridge4life

Winterspring wrote: »

It is for this set of interviews that it has happened so I am facing the same thing as you.

Ah, I see. Best of luck.

tea and coffee

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Ah, I see. Best of luck.

Me too. I've deleted my original post but in a similar situation.

quad_red

I know it's a kicker to do something like that lads/ladies but at least you know you'll get the chance to do yourself justice at the interview.

All is not lost! Believe in yourselves. You've gotten this far for a reason.

quad_red

I have to say - i'm pretty nervous.

I don't think I've ever read interview documentation that specifically warned candidates that they should expect a challenging interview!

Although it goes without saying I suppose.

Rosiebeans81

quad_red wrote: »

I have to say - i'm pretty nervous.

I don't think I've ever read interview documentation that specifically warning candidates that they should expect a challenging interview!

Although it goes without saying I suppose.

The fact that they feel the need to put it in writing is unnerving tho!

tigger123

I got to interview stage (and no further!) last time; don't be overly concerned about the interview, it's not adversarial in nature.

The structure and set up of competency based interviews means that you need to know and be able to comfortably discuss your competencies, and you can prep before hand for that.

Arcade_Tryer

quad_red wrote: »

I don't think I've ever read interview documentation that specifically warned candidates that they should expect a challenging interview!

I'd imagine it's more of a case of the Civil Service covering themselves, rather than a disproportionately more difficult interview than one would experience for a similar position in the private sector.

Aglomerado

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

I'd imagine it's more of a case of the Civil Service covering themselves, rather than a disproportionately more difficult interview than one would experience for a similar position in the private sector.

I'm fairly sure the same caveat was employed for the recent AO competition interviews.

bobbysands81

tigger123 wrote: »

I got to interview stage (and no further!) last time; don't be overly concerned about the interview, it's not adversarial in nature.

The structure and set up of competency based interviews means that you need to know and be able to comfortably discuss your competencies, and you can prep before hand for that.

Same here for me for the last AP comp.

Didn't get the interview but found it fair and completely non-adversarial although marked very tough.

tea and coffee

Anyone have their interview yesterday? how was it?

quad_red

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Same here for me for the last AP comp.

Didn't get the interview but found it fair and completely non-adversarial although marked very tough.

What level of feedback did you get after?

After commiserating with the folks who made mistakes on their forms earlier in this thread I realised last night that I made a similar clanger in my form. Couldn't believe it. So I'm basically a dead man walking going into this.

I'm gonna have to own up to the mistake as soon as I go in. Basically a paragraph is repeated and the paragraph that should have gone in (representing a core competency) never went in.

Could I bring in a corrected version to give them with the missing text? I'm probably toast anyway and will fall on my sword for the mistake. But there's no point suffering for the lack of an answer if I'm taking the punishment for the mistake.

noodler

quad_red wrote: »

What level of feedback did you get after?

After commiserating with the folks who made mistakes on their forms earlier in this thread I realised last night that I made a similar clanger in my form. Couldn't believe it. So I'm basically a dead man walking going into this.

I'm basically gonna have to own up to the mistake as soon as I go in. Basically a paragraph is repeated and the paragraph that should have gone in (representing a core competency) never went in.

Could I bring in a corrected version to give them with the missing text? I'm probably toast anyway and will fall on my sword for the mistake. But there's no point suffering for the lack of an answer if I'm taking the punishment for the mistake.

I think you might be underestimating how many forms and interviews these guys will be getting through in the coming week or two.

I'd be surprised if they even notice a repeated paragraph in the 5-10 mins they look at your form between them in between interviews.

quad_red

noodler wrote: »

I think you might be underestimating how many forms and interviews these guys will be getting through in the coming week or two.

I'd be surprised if they even notice a repeated paragraph in the 5-10 mins they look at your form between them in between interviews.

That totally explains how I've gotten this far.

But It'll be noticeable as soon as they look at it. A competency hasn't been addressed. At all. Very sloppy.

LucyLou2017

Quad-red, try not to dwell too much on possible clerical errors. I once did an intetview and the feedback was "explained competencies better at interview than on form". I got really decent marks and passed it, so its not a lost cause.

In any event, PAS usually allow you to use a different example on the day if you wish so that suggests to me that very little (if any) weight is given to the form. At my last interview it was really apparent that the interview board had barely even read my form!!!

So what's done is done. Chin up and worry about acing that interview

LucyLou2017

Quad-red, try not to dwell too much on possible clerical errors. I once did an intetview and the feedback was "explained competencies better at interview than on form". I got really decent marks and passed it, so its not a lost cause.

In any event, PAS usually allow you to use a different example on the day if you wish so that suggests to me that very little (if any) weight is given to the form. At my last interview it was really apparent that the interview board had barely even read my form!!!

So what's done is done. Chin up and worry about acing that interview

noodler

LucyLou2017 wrote: »

Quad-red, try not to dwell too much on possible clerical errors. I once did an intetview and the feedback was "explained competencies better at interview than on form". I got really decent marks and passed it, so its not a lost cause.

In any event, PAS usually allow you to use a different example on the day if you wish so that suggests to me that very little (if any) weight is given to the form. At my last interview it was really apparent that the interview board had barely even read my form!!!

So what's done is done. Chin up and worry about acing that interview

This is very true.

The form is somethng for them to go off - it won't save a bad interview.

What happens on the day will take precidence.

tigger123

quad_red wrote: »

That totally explains how I've gotten this far.

But It'll be noticeable as soon as they look at it. A competency hasn't been addressed. At all. Very sloppy.

Don't draw attention to it would be my advice. If they bring it up (which they probably won't) have a brief explanation ready and move on.

Explaining this error isn't going to win you points, and you're up against the clock.

TaurenDruid

The board have very little time to read the form (which is structured terribly anyway), between interviewees. The person teed up to ask you about the competency with the repeated paragraph will probably notice it (and you wouldn't be allowed submit a replacement page at this stage) so just mention there's an error in it and say you've additional examples if s/he'd rather ask you about another one?

deskbottle

Had my interview yesterday. Nothing outlandish in terms of 'thinking on your feet' questions, all rather formulaic and dull to be honest.

Once you have solid examples from your past you can navigate your way through it easily enough.

I will say that I wasn't too impressed with the Board - very little knowledge of my background (in my opinion, having LOADS of candidates to get through is not an excuse for overt unprofessionalism). I also felt rushed purely because of their own poor time management in getting through all their box-ticking......(I wasn't waffling either!)..

quad_red

deskbottle wrote: »

Had my interview yesterday. Nothing outlandish in terms of 'thinking on your feet' questions, all rather formulaic and dull to be honest.

Once you have solid examples from your past you can navigate your way through it easily enough.

I will say that I wasn't too impressed with the Board - very little knowledge of my background (in my opinion, having LOADS of candidates to get through is not an excuse for overt unprofessionalism). I also felt rushed purely because of their own poor time management in getting through all their box-ticking......(I wasn't waffling either!)..

Given the amount of time candidates have to have put in to get this far that's disappointing alright.

How long were you in for deskbottle?

Did different board members handle different questions or was there a specific MC?

ATTY

deskbottle wrote: »

Had my interview yesterday. Nothing outlandish in terms of 'thinking on your feet' questions, all rather formulaic and dull to be honest.

Once you have solid examples from your past you can navigate your way through it easily enough.

I will say that I wasn't too impressed with the Board - very little knowledge of my background (in my opinion, having LOADS of candidates to get through is not an excuse for overt unprofessionalism). I also felt rushed purely because of their own poor time management in getting through all their box-ticking......(I wasn't waffling either!)..

I had this experience in the last interview. The panel just wanted examples from work for the 4 competencies, there was a strict time limit for answering the questions which I only found out about before I went in.

This time it was completely different there was a lot more 'think on your feet' type questions about policy and how I would fit into this role based on my past experience. I had practiced these for the last interview but not for this one.

It seems that it really depends on the panel that you get on the day.

dee75

Hi folks
I am reviewing my application form and I was wondering about how many competencies they ask you about.
I know there are six competencies for AP, being as follows: -
1. Leadership;
2. Analysis & Decision Making;
3. Management and Delivery of Results;
4. Interpersonal & Communication Skills;
5. Specialist Knowledge, Expertise and Self-Development;
6. Drive & Commitment to Public Service Values.

The application form only sought examples of numbers 1 to 4.  So how do you demonstrate the remaining two competencies, if they didn't seek specifics in the form? 
Do they ask you specific questions related to these two remaining competencies in the interview, i.e. tell me of a situation where you have demonstrated drive and commitment to public service values?
Or are they trying to divine how you meet these two from the replies and examples you give for numbers 1 to 4?
I just can't figure it out!

quad_red

ATTY wrote: »

I had this experience in the last interview. The panel just wanted examples from work for the 4 competencies, there was a strict time limit for answering the questions which I only found out about before I went in.

This time it was completely different there was a lot more 'think on your feet' type questions about policy and how I would fit into this role based on my past experience. I had practiced these for the last interview but not for this one.

It seems that it really depends on the panel that you get on the day.

Strict time limit? I've got visions of chess clocks here.

TaurenDruid

dee75 wrote: »

Hi folks
I am reviewing my application form and I was wondering about how many competencies they ask you about.
I know there are six competencies for AP, being as follows: -
1. Leadership;
2. Analysis & Decision Making;
3. Management and Delivery of Results;
4. Interpersonal & Communication Skills;
5. Specialist Knowledge, Expertise and Self-Development;
6. Drive & Commitment to Public Service Values.

The application form only sought examples of numbers 1 to 4.  So how do you demonstrate the remaining two competencies, if they didn't seek specifics in the form? 
Do they ask you specific questions related to these two remaining competencies in the interview, i.e. tell me of a situation where you have demonstrated drive and commitment to public service values?
Or are they trying to divine how you meet these two from the replies and examples you give for numbers 1 to 4?
I just can't figure it out!

Each interviewer will ask you very specifically about each of the competencies at 1 to 4 above. The remaining two were dealt with more generally, at least for me - I was asked about how I would deal with arriving into a new role to bring myself up to speed with it, which let me answer #5; the Drive & Commitment to public service is sort of covered by all the others.

GorSin

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Each interviewer will ask you very specifically about each of the competencies at 1 to 4 above. The remaining two were dealt with more generally, at least for me - I was asked about how I would deal with arriving into a new role to bring myself up to speed with it, which let me answer #5; the Drive & Commitment to public service is sort of covered by all the others.

Competency number 3 on the form covers two competencies- 3 & 6, Management and delivery of results including drive and commitment.

In the interview are you asked to expand on one competency per example or is it more fluid than that?
Thanks

TaurenDruid

This time it was mostly one main example per competency, then maybe a followup related question.

quad_red

TaurenDruid wrote: »

This time it was mostly one main example per competency, then maybe a followup related question.

How long were you in for Tauren?

TaurenDruid

Around 45 minutes, I think. It flew by!

ZolaGood

I'm dreading it just because I am away with work from Sunday morning until Tuesday night and I'm on at 12 on Wednesday-my prep time is severely impacted and I know my lack of prep screwed me last time. I will have to cram it in where I can. PAS told my boss that the panel will be in place by end of March so the agony will be over soon

Rosiebeans81

ZolaGood wrote: »

I'm dreading it just because I am away with work from Sunday morning until Tuesday night and I'm on at 12 on Wednesday-my prep time is severely impacted and I know my lack of prep screwed me last time. I will have to cram it in where I can. PAS told my boss that the panel will be in place by end of March so the agony will be over soon

They seem to be moving through this comp very quickly do they? Or are they normally this fast?

tea and coffee

It's pretty quick. HEO started in April 2016, but first panel not formed til approx November

Unknowed

ATTY wrote: »

This time it was completely different there was a lot more 'think on your feet' type questions about policy and how I would fit into this role based on my past experience. I had practiced these for the last interview but not for this one.

It seems that it really depends on the panel that you get on the day.

Sorry if this is a stupid question but when you talk about "think on your feet type questions about policy", would you mind sharing a bit more about what you mean? What kind of questions would they be? The familiarisation material seems pretty focused on the competencies...

I'm brand new to this whole experience so any insight would be much appreciated.

ATTY

Unknowed wrote: »

Sorry if this is a stupid question but when you talk about "think on your feet type questions about policy", would you mind sharing a bit more about what you mean? What kind of questions would they be? The familiarisation material seems pretty focused on the competencies...

I'm brand new to this whole experience so any insight would be much appreciated.

Hi, I was just quoting deskbottle's post, but I would see them as the type of questions that you would get in a normal interview rather than a pure competency based interview where the focus is just on real examples of your past work. So they would be questions like 'how does your past experience fit with this role', 'how would you go about improving a team that feel they are not working well together' or 'if you were asked to write a report on X where would you begin'.

In terms of policy questions I wasn't quizzed on my knowledge of policy but got questions like 'Policy X states that we should be looking at Y in the future what do you think are the advantages and disadvantages of this approach'

You have to try to understand from the question what competency they are looking for and then throw in some key words, so in the team question it is leadership so think about what makes a good leader so talk about influencing people, listening to people or leading by example etc.. (although this is easier said than done now that I'm finished!)

Omnishambles99

Rosiebeans81 wrote: »

They seem to be moving through this comp very quickly do they? Or are they normally this fast?

The 2015 AP panel expires end of march so hence the hurray on this comp

quad_red

So each panel has a two year life span?

I'm sorry if this has been answered before but does anyone know how far they got into the current panel?

Starblue

Pretty sure I messed my interview up today - any ideas when they're likely to run the competition again? Can't believe I'll have to do those bloody tests again 😱