NEW 2016 Open and Interdepartmental Assistant Principal in Civil Service competition.

Woodenframe

Yeh emailed them last night. Fingers crossed. No word back so assume they aren't in today.

bobbysands81

The_Conductor wrote: »

Bobby- thats very helpful (though a little worrying!)
Sounds a little like the HEO- which I was convinced went disasterously, but apparently, everyone must have done.......
I'm trying to figure how to put together a road-map for myself for the interview (I'm sad- I love mindmaps).
Looks likely I may have to abandon that idea.........
I had suspected a few late nights with policy and position documents beckoned, I may have to reappraise a new approach...........

Even aside from the HEO interview two weeks ago- I guess a few mock interviews all around- might be good for us all- if only there was a ready source of willing current APs/POs to grill us...........

Hopefully we get the familiarisation information for the interviews and who is on the board- sooner rather than later.

I am guessing the background of the board- flavoured the line of questioning? (though- it most certainly didn't for the HEO)?

I had stuff prepared on Brexit, Corporation Tax, possible changes in American tax regime and bar really basic questions it didn’t really come up. If you can coherently put something together regarding challenges facing CS then you’ll be sorted. If I was doing it now I’d be talking about Artificial Intelligence, the threat to traditional workplace by automation (maybe threat not right word!), attracting and retaining talent and the other 3 already mentioned. My board seemed happy that I was aware of these issues more than just drilling me about them. It is a while since I did interview though so hopefully others will pitch in regarding their experiences.

bobbysands81

confusted wrote: »

One final question: has anyone done a prep mock interview with any of the communications companies out there? Worthwhile?

Thanks all, and best of good luck to all in the interview stage.

Frank Sweeney in Carr Communications is excellent though v expensive... but if you get the job it’s worth the investment.

Be fully prepared on the day you’re going to him to get the most out of it.

gazzer

I am in on March 20th too. A friend of mine is in that day also. No Patricks Weekend partying for us

johnboyire

hi all looking through the required paperwork   what information is normally required from the reference, 
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Current Reference Form"  eg  will a contact in HR be suitable? are they looking for specific info etc.[/font]

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]cheers[/font]

AndrewJRenko

johnboyire wrote: »

hi all looking through the required paperwork   what information is normally required from the reference, 
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Current Reference Form"  eg  will a contact in HR be suitable? are they looking for specific info etc.[/font]

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]cheers[/font]

It is a fairly detailed report, confirming dates, role, performance, sick leave record, questions about any problems/issues arising, and any other information.

confusted wrote: »

One final question: has anyone done a prep mock interview with any of the communications companies out there? Worthwhile?

I found this guy to be good, he almost treats the interview as a theatrical performance, and coaches you on giving the best performance you can do.

https://www.brianmcivor.com/

He's not the most likeable of individuals IMHO, but he did work for me.

VONSHIRACH

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

It is a fairly detailed report, confirming dates, role, performance, sick leave record, questions about any problems/issues arising, and any other information.


I found this guy to be good, he almost treats the interview as a theatrical performance, and coaches you on giving the best performance you can do.

https://www.brianmcivor.com/

He's not the most likeable of individuals IMHO, but he did work for me.

I have a few of his career/interview books and have found then useful in the past and attended a few seminars he gave.

DoPoGo

Hi all. Any idea what number they are at in batch 3? Wondering how far beyond the 80s they ve got. Are assignments a mixed bag I wonder or bulked in one or two depts? Cheers.

whampiri

Heard that they were just over 100 and I know that there were at least 119.(I know 119) revenue and dsp are both drawing heavily on the panels as the largest depts. I can tell you that finance and public expenditure and reform won't be drawing from it.

DoPoGo

Wow. I'll be called maybe next week then! Couldn't imagine myself in Revenue!! Will post when get a notification.

delricyo

Well Revenue are in the middle of an internal AP competition (interviews starting soon) so they will be using a lot of their internal allowance shortly

The_Conductor

whampiri wrote: »

. I can tell you that finance and public expenditure and reform won't be drawing from it.

Why not?
Apparently they owe a significant number of posts to both parts of this panel- as they have massively over-promoted from internal panels.
Is there some reason Finance, PERD and the Taoiseach's Department- shouldn't take their quota of candidates from this panel?

Riskymove

The_Conductor wrote: »

Why not?
Apparently they owe a significant number of posts to both parts of this panel- as they have massively over-promoted from internal panels.
Is there some reason Finance, PERD and the Taoiseach's Department- shouldn't take their quota of candidates from this panel?

The Departments would generally draw from AP1 panel

Some parts of DPER would draw AP like the OGP

whampiri

The_Conductor wrote: »

Why not?
Apparently they owe a significant number of posts to both parts of this panel- as they have massively over-promoted from internal panels.
Is there some reason Finance, PERD and the Taoiseach's Department- shouldn't take their quota of candidates from this panel?

Theres an AP1 and AP2 panel. Finance and DPER pull from AP1 panels.(slight difference in pay)

The_Conductor

whampiri wrote: »

Theres an AP1 and AP2 panel. Finance and DPER pull from AP1 panels.(slight difference in pay)

So do all the other Departments (pull from both AP1 and AP2 panels- and indeed hold internal promotional competitions for AP1 and AP2 panels).

whampiri

AP1 is unique to the depts mentioned. There's a quota system in place for drawing off panels that has to be followed for the most part in the ratio 1:1:1 1 open appointment, 1 interdepartmental and 1 internal. Depts need to balance these. Each dept will have its own depts to balance and that will determine how they pull off the panels.

Riskymove

whampiri wrote: »

AP1 is unique to the depts mentioned.

No it isn't......there are AP1 in every Department but they are not taken from panels. They are uplifted internally based on a previous national wage agreement.

Traditionally all APs and POs in the three Departments are higher grade

The AP1 panel only feeds into the three Departments

Riskymove

whampiri wrote: »

there's a quota system in place for drawing off panels that has to be followed for the most part in the ratio 1:1:1 1 open appointment, 1 interdepartmental and 1 internal.

There is only one AP1 panel which is mostly interdepartmental

It isn't fully open but allowed people in high enough places on AP open to compete which included some outside civil service

So only 1:1 internal and that panel

Swoz

Hi all

I was assigned 2 weeks ago from open panel (though still waiting for paperwork).

Would like to thank everyone on this thread for shedding light on a long and often unclear process.

Woodenframe

whampiri wrote: »

Heard that they were just over 100 and I know that there were at least 119.(I know 119) revenue and dsp are both drawing heavily on the panels as the largest depts. I can tell you that finance and public expenditure and reform won't be drawing from it.

Ok slightly confused about the batches.. if they are currently drawing from batch 4, then what batch are the upcoming interviewees?
Any idea how many they are interviewing? I believe there are 7 days of interviews. Presumably there is more than one interview panel..

Woodenframe

Swoz wrote: »

Hi all

I was assigned 2 weeks ago from open panel (though still waiting for paperwork).

Would like to thank everyone on this thread for shedding light on a long and often unclear process.

Well done

JoeMac7

Woodenframe wrote: »

Ok slightly confused about the batches.. if they are currently drawing from batch 4, then what batch are the upcoming interviewees?
Any idea how many they are interviewing? I believe there are 7 days of interviews. Presumably there is more than one interview panel..

The email with the pre interview email that i got today called us batch 2.1 which I think means the first batch of the second group that was called to stage 2

Woodenframe

JoeMac7 wrote: »

The email with the pre interview email that i got today called us batch 2.1 which I think means the first batch of the second group that was called to stage 2

Thanks, I meant to say that they are currently drawing se
Batch 3 not 4... any idea how many are on that panel?
Is there also a batch 4 panel between batch 3 and the upcoming interviewees?

The_Conductor

Riskymove wrote: »

No it isn't......there are AP1 in every Department but they are not taken from panels. They are uplifted internally based on a previous national wage agreement.

Traditionally all APs and POs in the three Departments are higher grade

The AP1 panel only feeds into the three Departments

I discussed this with APs in two other Departments yesterday- DSP and DAFM- one of them was an AP1 from the panel- the other is on the AP1 panel. It is not the case that they are uplifted internally- perhaps some are- however, doing a quick recce- they were taken from the panel in DSP and DAFM- how many I have no idea- and I imagine the other Departments are similar. Some may be upgraded internally- however, to suggest that a post offered on the AP1 panel is analogous to a post in one of the three aforementioned departments- is inaccurate.

DoPoGo

Woodenframe wrote: »

Thanks, I meant to say that they are currently drawing se
Batch 3 not 4... any idea how many are on that panel?
Is there also a batch 4 panel between batch 3 and the upcoming interviewees?

This thread has said approx 140 on batch 3 and they are calling no. 100 roughly at the moment. At same time batch 4 interviews are taking place.

Riskymove

The_Conductor wrote: »

Some may be upgraded internally- however, to suggest that a post offered on the AP1 panel is analogous to a post in one of the three aforementioned departments- is inaccurate.

well the booklet for the competition clearly states that the panel is for the three departments only

I know a number of people who got on the panel and they have all been offered one of the three departments

I am in the CS over 20 years and have never heard of an AP1 being recruited directly into other Departments - perhaps something has changed but I haven't heard about it

I have been involved in PS Unions in all that time and have never heard of it either through that role

why would APs in DSP and DAFM be happy for some AP1s to be recruited. This would skew the availability of AP1 uplifts for them in future.

one of them was an AP1 from the panel- the other is on the AP1 panel.

I am not clear what you are saying - one of them is on the AP1 panel ? sure thats fine any AP could be on the AP1 panel




From the Circular:

I am directed by the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform to inform you that the Public Appointments Service (PAS) will hold an interdepartmental competition to establish a panel from which appointments as Assistant Principal Higher may be made.

The Assistant Principal Higher is a senior managerial grade in the Civil Service within the Departments of the Taoiseach, Finance and Public Expenditure and Reform. The vacancies to be filled from this competition will most likely occur in Dublin. Please see Appendix I for information about these Departments.

Omnishambles99

This is probably already outlined above but in case not , in all other Dept's other that the finance/dper/taoiseachs triumvirate, AP 1 s and PO1s are made up of two diff types:

(1) those who are uplifted within that dept or having been uplifted in another dept and then transferred in (under the PCW agreements and prior arrangements) and

(2) those who were appointed to either AP1 or PO1 internally or externally in the three main depts and were then transferred at a later stage into one of the other line Dept's

confusted

Hi there, quick note to say thank you to those who made recommendations for mock interviews, not sure yet if it's something I'll go for but definitely considering it. Hope the interview preps are going well.

agnena

I got an email today inviting to the second stage (supervised tests + etray) as Stage 2 Batch 3 with the dates for the first week in April. I am actually shocked and panicking a bit at the moment, as I had no hope of being called to the next stage. As far as I understand Batch 2.1 is going for interviews shortly. What about Batch 2.2? Are they really expecting so many AP vacancies?

Phonecrazy

agnena wrote: »

As far as I understand Batch 2.1 is going for interviews shortly. What about Batch 2.2? Are they really expecting so many AP vacancies?

I understand that this competition runs to November, with all departments drawing off it it’s not surprising that they could run into another batch. Theres a lot of movement all all levels across the cs.

gazzer

Does anybody know if figures can be obtained for the amount of people interviwed so far on this competition and the number of peoole successfully placed?

Langemarck

Apologies if this has already been discussed previously in the thread, but does anyone have a recommendation for good online etray and verbal/numerical reasoning sample tests? I am taking the supervised batch 3 tests in April.

Kigera

agnena wrote: »

I got an email today inviting to the second stage (supervised tests + etray) as Stage 2 Batch 3 with the dates for the first week in April. I am actually shocked and panicking a bit at the moment, as I had no hope of being called to the next stage. As far as I understand Batch 2.1 is going for interviews shortly. What about Batch 2.2? Are they really expecting so many AP vacancies?

What number have they called to now does anybody know?

agnena

Kigera wrote: »

What number have they called to now does anybody know?

I was around 1700 on the open, thus the surprise.

The_Conductor

Langemarck wrote: »

Apologies if this has already been discussed previously in the thread, but does anyone have a recommendation for good online etray and verbal/numerical reasoning sample tests? I am taking the supervised batch 3 tests in April.

Vis-a-vis the e-tray- your best bet is to talk to a few APs- get a feel for them, how they approach work, the manner in which the civil service as an organisation is structured- and how work flow is normally done in a bureaucracy.

The verbal and the numerical- the sample ones you get- will give you a feel for the type of questions- however, the ones you'll actually encounter are a myriad of times more difficult.

Best bet- is to get some books out of the library or Easons- on verbal and numeracy games you can play- and get yourself into the mindset that short passages of text- or tables of figures- are a game and fun to do- rather than a challenge.

I was given a present of a book on arithmetic gymnastics called Shakuntala Devi: Figuring- the joy of numbers. I can't recommend it highly enough. Have a look around though- different ways of preparing may suit different people.

For the verbal- sitting down and spending a few days reading precise English passages- possibly books for people learning English as a second language- which emphasise the nuances of language- might be helpful- our everyday spoken English in Ireland- is actually quite appalling.

Chimichangas

Phonecrazy wrote: »

I understand that this competition runs to November, with all departments drawing off it it’s not surprising that they could run into another batch. Theres a lot of movement all all levels across the cs.

Competition runs until 31st October I think.

hardybuck

Phonecrazy wrote: »

I understand that this competition runs to November, with all departments drawing off it it’s not surprising that they could run into another batch. Theres a lot of movement all all levels across the cs.

At this point they really should be running another competition.

Langemarck

Thanks for the tips!

I sat the etray once before and felt my time management was my biggest downfall. I need to rank higher in the numerical and verbal if I want to get called forward. I am always out of the batch called forward.

VONSHIRACH

For an interview, is there any opportunity to amend the original application details which were made in December 2016?

DoPoGo

VONSHIRACH wrote: »

For an interview, is there any opportunity to amend the original application details which were made in December 2016?

Don't know about that. But at start of mine I said my role etc had changed and that I would address as went through interview. Usually you can go through different examples to what are on form. That's what I did. Most were different. But didn't submit anything new.

DoPoGo

Btw. I was no. 112 in batch 3 and in clearance process now.

Phonecrazy

hardybuck wrote: »

At this point they really should be running another competition.

Is it not planned to be announced before the summer so the next panel is in place when this one runs out?

BobCat123

Does anyone know how many they have called so far? Thanks

tea and coffee

Phonecrazy wrote: »

Is it not planned to be announced before the summer so the next panel is in place when this one runs out?

I would have thought so.

confusted

Langemarck wrote: »

Thanks for the tips!

I sat the etray once before and felt my time management was my biggest downfall. I need to rank higher in the numerical and verbal if I want to get called forward. I am always out of the batch called forward.

Langemarck, you just need to reach the qualifying standard in the verbal and numberical in Stage 2. Your placing for interview is determined by the job simulation and etray. Good news I hope. Others will correct me if I'm wrong. Also, I've been sitting these types of exams for nigh on 20 years for the public service, no kidding, and this is the first time I've made it through to interview. Hope for us all!

The_Conductor

confusted wrote: »

Langemarck, you just need to reach the qualifying standard in the verbal and numberical in Stage 2. Your placing for interview is determined by the job simulation and etray. Good news I hope. Others will correct me if I'm wrong. Also, I've been sitting these types of exams for nigh on 20 years for the public service, no kidding, and this is the first time I've made it through to interview. Hope for us all!

You're right.
Your verbal and numeracy at Stage 2 cannot differ from your stage 1 result by more than 12.5% (if it does- there is an assumption that you cheated at stage 1 and your candidacy is discarded).
You order of merit going forward to stage 3- is based purely on your e-tray and your job simulation exercise. I have no idea whether its 50:50 or what the breakdown is (it would make logical sense to give the e-tray a much higher weighting- however, logic doesn't always enter into it).

noodler

The_Conductor wrote: »

I discussed this with APs in two other Departments yesterday- DSP and DAFM- one of them was an AP1 from the panel- the other is on the AP1 panel. It is not the case that they are uplifted internally- perhaps some are- however, doing a quick recce- they were taken from the panel in DSP and DAFM- how many I have no idea- and I imagine the other Departments are similar. Some may be upgraded internally- however, to suggest that a post offered on the AP1 panel is analogous to a post in one of the three aforementioned departments- is inaccurate.

The poster is quite correct that AP1 is only offered in the three depts.

Once obtained, someone could move on secondment or mobility though and would not lose it.

The_Conductor

noodler wrote: »

The poster is quite correct that AP1 is only offered in the three depts.

Once obtained, someone could move on secondment or mobility though and would not lose it.

I asked both APs I had spoken to previously (DSP and DAFM)- both got AP1 from the panel- and were 'retained' by their own Departments (the DSP one just last Thursday). Sorry if I caused confusion.

whampiri

@Conductor.

I think you may be referring to a higher scale and not necessarily AP1.

JF82

Hi - does anyone have any information on the First Secretary merit list and how many have been placed so far?