NEW 2016 Open and Interdepartmental Assistant Principal in Civil Service competition.

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sodacake1968 wrote: »

@ poppy2017 - not a thing - on 3 panels for AP and none are moving! The ironic thing about the process is that we (as civil servants) have made our dealings with the public even more transparent than ever but processes such as this are cloaked in secrecy - In the past month I have seen AP positions suppressed, transfers taking place and people coming back of career break. I'm not too sure that the 1:1:1 sequence is being followed to the letter either - it's unbelievably frustrating!!

Same. Can't get a straight answer out of anyone. Unbelievably frustrated now as it's getting towards the end of these panels.

Poppy2017

sodacake1968 wrote: »

@ poppy2017 - not a thing - on 3 panels for AP and none are moving! The ironic thing about the process is that we (as civil servants) have made our dealings with the public even more transparent than ever but processes such as this are cloaked in secrecy - In the past month I have seen AP positions suppressed, transfers taking place and people coming back of career break. I'm not too sure that the 1:1:1 sequence is being followed to the letter either - it's unbelievably frustrating!!

Yes, I feel your pain !! it is so frustrating especially when you see so many people getting placed in Dublin !!

whampiri

Poppy2017 wrote: »

Yes, I feel your pain !! it is so frustrating especially when you see so many people getting placed in Dublin !!

It's the nature of the jobs that the majority of them are in Dublin and regional panels are going to continue to be used at a snail's pace I'm afraid.

As for posts being suppressed or using internal promotions to fill gaps etc, it makes sense for depts to promote someone familiar with the area than bring someone new in.

sodacake1968

whampiri wrote: »

It's the nature of the jobs that the majority of them are in Dublin and regional panels are going to continue to be used at a snail's pace I'm afraid.

As for posts being suppressed or using internal promotions to fill gaps etc, it makes sense for depts to promote someone familiar with the area than bring someone new in.

Don't have a real issue with regional locations speeds or internal posts being filled by current members of staff but 1:1:1 ratio does not appear to being adhered to. This happened a number of years ago also. It also discriminates against those that are in smaller departments. The lack of transparency is also an issue

whampiri

sodacake1968 wrote: »

Don't have a real issue with regional locations speeds or internal posts being filled by current members of staff but 1:1:1 ratio does not appear to being adhered to. This happened a number of years ago also. It also discriminates against those that are in smaller departments. The lack of transparency is also an issue

That ratio is a guide line that is met every few months. It's possible for a Dept to take 5 or even 10 from an internal panel and then take a few from an inter d panel a few months later. So you'd have 10:3:0. Then they might take a few from an open panel and then take another 1 from an internal panel etc. It's not a case whereby they're forced to stick rigidly to the 1:1:1 ratio.i.e.taking 1 from each panel in succession.

sodacake1968

whampiri wrote: »

That ratio is a guide line that is met every few months. It's possible for a Dept to take 5 or even 10 from an internal panel and then take a few from an inter d panel a few months later. So you'd have 10:3:0. Then they might take a few from an open panel and then take another 1 from an internal panel etc. It's not a case whereby they're forced to stick rigidly to the 1:1:1 ratio.i.e.taking 1 from each panel in succession.

People also tend to forget about the transfer lists and returnees from career break

tfunk

Just for those that are playing the waiting game. I rang Emer in PAS yesterday and she informed me that they are alread up to 'mid 40s' on clearance for the Dublin panel.

Best of luck

Beebie

As regards been pulled off open or interd panels, is one seen as better than the other, I thought both were the same, in that you could b assigned to any department from either panel, but you had to b an existing CS to b eligible for interd. Is there more options/opportunities being on one panel over the other from an assignment point of view?

The_Conductor

Beebie wrote: »

As regards been pulled off open or interd panels, is one seen as better than the other, I thought both were the same, in that you could b assigned to any department from either panel, but you had to b an existing CS to b eligible for interd. Is there more options/opportunities being on one panel over the other from an assignment point of view?

Not really- unless a desirable Department owed a debt to a particular panel- however, as alluded to by many posters- we simply don't know this information.......... And even if we did- some Departments and bodies- seem to be running completely roughshod over the who concept of quotas from different panels- including the likes of DSEAP (social welfare) and the CSO (who are tiny in comparison to other Departments- but the rules don't seem to apply).

The complete and utter lack of clarity, and the random nature in which some Departments and bodies appear not to have rules applied to them- while others are following the letter of the law- is far from ideal, and a recipe for disquiet.

whampiri

The_Conductor wrote: »

Not really- unless a desirable Department owed a debt to a particular panel- however, as alluded to by many posters- we simply don't know this information.......... And even if we did- some Departments and bodies- seem to be running completely roughshod over the who concept of quotas from different panels- including the likes of DSEAP (social welfare) and the CSO (who are tiny in comparison to other Departments- but the rules don't seem to apply).

The complete and utter lack of clarity, and the random nature in which some Departments and bodies appear not to have rules applied to them- while others are following the letter of the law- is far from ideal, and a recipe for disquiet.

As one of the bigger Depts, revenue and DSEAP are always accused of not following quotas but it has to be seen in perspective. Doing a resource review on an org that size with so many moving parts is always going to be difficult.
In relation to CSO, theyll always want ppl with stats background/qualifications and there's always horse trading going on I'm the background so as orgs can get the people with the right skills.

elgicko

tfunk wrote: »

Just for those that are playing the waiting game. I rang Emer in PAS yesterday and she informed me that they are alread up to 'mid 40s' on clearance for the Dublin panel.

Best of luck

That is very fast, we got notification letters for batch 2.1 6 weeks ago and they are up to mid 40’s already. I wonder is that open or inter-d

gazzer

tfunk wrote: »

Just for those that are playing the waiting game. I rang Emer in PAS yesterday and she informed me that they are alread up to 'mid 40s' on clearance for the Dublin panel.

Best of luck

Mid 40's already ??? Bloody hell. That is really quick. Thsnks for the info

miss_miaigi

elgicko wrote: »

tfunk wrote: »

Just for those that are playing the waiting game. I rang Emer in PAS yesterday and she informed me that they are alread up to 'mid 40s' on clearance for the Dublin panel.

Best of luck

That is very fast, we got notification letters for batch 2.1 6 weeks ago and they are up to mid 40’s already. I wonder is that open or inter-d

I was out on leave on Friday but will check with my HR on tuesday if they got anything as I’m mid-40s on the interD.

elgicko

miss_miaigi wrote: »

I was out on leave on Friday but will check with my HR on tuesday if they got anything as I’m mid-40s on the interD.

Thanks - Keep us posted!!

johnboyire

wow had not checked much nice surprise this morning, come on 50s!!

johnboyire

For the larger batches were are people being placed ? I saw dept of health earlier, so would it be safe to assume that you are unlikely to get health on this panel,I am also curious to see which depts are effectively ruled out, cheers

Omnishambles99

johnboyire wrote: »

For the larger batches were are people being placed ? I saw dept of health earlier, so would it be safe to assume that you are unlikely to get health on this panel,I am also curious to see which depts are effectively ruled out, cheers

I'd be thinking justice, children & youth affairs, revenue (general AP type), DBEI, .... And more than likely not finance, taoiseachs, DFAT, .... I'm open to correction though !

Woodenframe

..

whampiri

Omnishambles99 wrote: »

I'd be thinking justice, children & youth affairs, revenue (general AP type), DBEI, .... And more than likely not finance, taoiseachs, DFAT, .... I'm open to correction though !

You're right on the depts that are "excluded" as they use AP1s in finance, dper and taoiseachs, and use secretaries in dfat(which is normally recruited for separately).

At a guess, CSO might also be excluded (or limited) as they generally use statisticians.

sheepstealer

johnboyire wrote: »

For the larger batches were are people being placed ? I saw dept of health earlier, so would it be safe to assume that you are unlikely to get health on this panel,I am also curious to see which depts are effectively ruled out, cheers

When I talked to Health they suggested 3/4 people were being appointed to AP and wanted people to start ASAP.

gazzer

I emailed my HR section earlier and let them know that clearance was now up to the mid 40's. I am hoping that I can stay in my department if possible. They are going to check with PAS to see what number they are at.

miss_miaigi

Do people ring PAS on the general number when checking about the panels? I've emailed them on the email they provided for queries but not getting any response.

Turty3

miss_miaigi wrote: »

Do people ring PAS on the general number when checking about the panels? I've emailed them on the email they provided for queries but not getting any response.

It took a week to get a reply to my first email, second email was replied to on the same day. It also appears to depend on who replies what level of detail you'll receive. I've been told they can't discuss movement on on-going panels and that no appointments have been made.

I know someone whose papers have been returned to PAS but no appointment has been made yet: two weeks now.

miss_miaigi

Turty3 wrote: »

It took a week to get a reply to my first email, second email was replied to on the same day. It also appears to depend on who replies what level of detail you'll receive. I've been told they can't discuss movement on on-going panels and that no appointments have been made.

I know someone whose papers have been returned to PAS but no appointment has been made yet: two weeks now.

Yet clearly they do provide information to some people given the updates we've seen on here! I'll try my luck later on the phone and see what they say but I think you're right it's all about who you get on the other end.

johnboyire

phoning is always better

elgicko

Confirmed with someone I know in DPER that he is going through clearance, he is mid 40's

whampiri

elgicko wrote: »

Confirmed with someone I know in DPER that he is going through clearance, he is mid 40's

When you say mid, is that 44-46 or higher?.

elgicko

whampiri wrote: »

When you say mid, is that 44-46 or higher?.

Don't know, not that it makes much difference, due to the speeed this batch is moving!

miss_miaigi

elgicko wrote: »

Confirmed with someone I know in DPER that he is going through clearance, he is mid 40's

Do you know is that the open or interD panel?

elgicko

miss_miaigi wrote: »

Do you know is that the open or interD panel?

Open

johnboyire

Quick question for any sucessful external candidates, how long does guarda vetting typically take? / clearance in general?

One more question if you are in clearance and the panel expires do you get a position or is it just tough luck no job?

Thanks

whampiri

johnboyire wrote: »

Quick question for any sucessful external candidates, how long does guarda vetting typically take? / clearance in general?

One more question if you are in clearance and the panel expires do you get a position or is it just tough luck no job?

Thanks

Some depts will appoint pending Garda clearance. It normally takes 6-8 weeks for clearance to come through. (Im familiar with the process)

If you're in clearance you've been selected for a post, so it shouldn't matter if the panel closes. Very early to be worrying about that though.

Woodenframe

6-8 weeks for Garda vetting? Is there any reason for that? External people coming into our Dept recently having been taking 1-3 weeks. Those that have foreign addresses to be checked have been taking longer.

whampiri

Woodenframe wrote: »

6-8 weeks for Garda vetting? Is there any reason for that? External people coming into our Dept recently having been taking 1-3 weeks. Those that have foreign addresses to be checked have been taking longer.

Yes,6-8weeks is my experience anyway but as I mentioned, most depts appointment prior to receiving clearance. It may be that the times I've moved,there has been a high demand.

Just because someone comes into a Dept doesn't mean that they've been Garda cleared. It may be that the Dept has made the decision to take them pending the outcome of the vetting.

Woodenframe

whampiri wrote: »

Yes,6-8weeks is my experience anyway but as I mentioned, most depts appointment prior to receiving clearance. It may be that the times I've moved,there has been a high demand.

Just because someone comes into a Dept doesn't mean that they've been Garda cleared. It may be that the Dept has made the decision to take them pending the outcome of the vetting.

True, these people have used the e-vetting and they seem to receive a notification on their login area that vetting has been completed. However, most of them have not lived abroad. I am aware of one person who lived in Oz for a year and took approx. 8 weeks for vetting which I would expect. All of these people were non-CS at the time of their vetting. Perhaps different departments require different levels of vetting? I see from one of the other threads (the EO one) that those getting appointments with AGS are taking up to 26 weeks!

miss_miaigi

The Garda vetting timeframe also depends on if you've been vetted before - if you have it usually moves a little quicker.

miss_miaigi

I finally got through to someone in PAS this morning and was told they are in the low 40s for the open panel and this corresponds to the mid-30s for the interD panel for clearing.

gazzer

miss_miaigi wrote: »

I finally got through to someone in PAS this morning and was told they are in the low 40s for the open panel and this corresponds to the mid-30s for the interD panel for clearing.

Mid 30's for Inter There was me thinking I was about to go for clearance lol

Omnishambles99

miss_miaigi wrote: »

The Garda vetting timeframe also depends on if you've been vetted before - if you have it usually moves a little quicker.

I think it's probably been mentioned here before - certain depts vetting takes longer depending on the nature of the work, e.g. : justice

miss_miaigi

gazzer wrote: »

Mid 30's for Inter There was me thinking I was about to go for clearance lol

Me too!

gazzer

miss_miaigi wrote: »

Me too!

Ah its still near enough. Probably another few weeks more than I was expecting. Gives me a bit more time to save a deposit for when I move to Dublin

confusted

Really surprised by how quickly things are moving along although probably shouldn't be given pace of previous panels. Can anyone external who received a posting, or someone in the know, give an indication of the extent to which their background, previous experience, etc. was factored in to their posting? Or is it just a case of you're offered a spot wherever it arises. Happy Friday all my fellow lurkers/ waiting for the call/ers!

Turty3

Spoke with PAS who confirmed a new competition will begin Sept/Oct this year but current panels will only 'expire' when new competition results are known.

AFAIK there's no skills matching done for appointments because that may affect the order of merit being followed.

elgicko

Turty3 wrote: »

Spoke with PAS who confirmed a new competition will begin Sept/Oct this year but current panels will only 'expire' when new competition results are known.

AFAIK there's no skills matching done for appointments because that may affect the order of merit being followed.

You will be assigned to a Department by PAS. Engage with the HR of the Department, explain your skills, before you start you may/may not be accommodated. As you get up higher in the CS options reduce. For example someone working in IT as a HEO will have limited opportunities as a AP to get back into IT.

whampiri

Turty3 wrote: »

Spoke with PAS who confirmed a new competition will begin Sept/Oct this year but current panels will only 'expire' when new competition results are known.

AFAIK there's no skills matching done for appointments because that may affect the order of merit being followed.

There is restricted skill matching done. By restricted I mean depts attempt to match skills with roles. E.g. sports,tourism and the gaelteacht, and finance both need an AP. Next person on the list is a gaelgoir with no stats or finance background and due to go to finance. Following person has 25 years working in a bank due to go to gaelteacht. Finance and gaelteacht can chat and agree which of the 2 individuals they want.

Obviously this doesn't work where requests are coming in drips and drabs or where there may be an urgent need to fill a role.

Riskymove

whampiri wrote: »

There is restricted skill matching done.

like people have said if there are 5 people being assingnd they may look at the 5 vacancies and the skillsets of next five people

they wont skip 20 people to assign someone with particular skills

confusted

Okay thanks all, what you're saying about skill matching and OOM etc. makes sense.

I'm curious to know how external people who've been placed found the transition? Obviously in broad strokes, or DM me, although all who have been placed may have left this thread never to return again.

JoeMac7

confusted wrote: »

Okay thanks all, what you're saying about skill matching and OOM etc. makes sense.

I'm curious to know how external people who've been placed found the transition? Obviously in broad strokes, or DM me, although all who have been placed may have left this thread never to return again.

Departments also will sometimes go on the hunt for certain skills. I know our place wants as many lawyers as possible at AP level so will give PAS a heads up that they’re after a solicitor or barrister and wait to put in their request until it gets to the point where one of those is in the next batch

Crunchymomma

Turty3 wrote: »

Spoke with PAS who confirmed a new competition will begin Sept/Oct this year but current panels will only 'expire' when new competition results are known.

AFAIK there's no skills matching done for appointments because that may affect the order of merit being followed.

So glad you got an answer on a time line for new comp. I couldn't get anything out of them

Phonecrazy

Any assignments yet (after #26)?