Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2016/2017

54and56

murpho999 wrote: »

Klopp cannot say in public if they didn't back him but I cannot accept that he would really want Milner and Moreno as his left back options.

For your opinion to be correct it would require Klopp to accept that situation and lie publicly in support of it i.e. his statements about not wanting to buy players etc.

I think Klopp has integrity. If he wasn't getting the financial support he wanted and felt the squad needed I think he'd walk as there are plenty of other clubs with rich owners who'd love to have him. There's no way he'd sit in Liverpool just for the personal cash.

Turtyturd

murpho999 wrote: »

My point is that I don't think they did enough last summer or other times.

Take Dele Ali for example could and should have been signed by Liverpool but they wouldn't pay his wages.

Do you think that is good leadership?

Dele Ali is a great example to pick out in hindsight alright, is the wages thing more speculation or has it been confirmed?

They brought in 3 first team starters who improve them team in the summer, and someone who they thought would be the number one keeper. I think most people were happy with that, you just seem offended that they made a profit, would it be better if they got the same players but spent more on them?

Harry Palmr

murpho999 wrote: »

My point is that I don't think they did enough last summer or other times.

Take Dele Ali for example could and should have been signed by Liverpool but they wouldn't pay his wages.

Do you think that is good leadership?

FSG are the owners not the CEO, Transfer Committee or the manager - that **** up (and what a **** up it was) was down to the TC and Ian Ayre

During Liverpool's title-challenging season of 2013/14, Alli was invited for a tour of Liverpool's Melwood training complex. Gerrard was not present: he had the day. Transfer negotiations dragged on until November 2014, when a deal was agreed with MK Dons worth around £3 million. (less than Jose Enrique's annual salary). Brendan Rodgers told Sky in January that he thought Liverpool had the deal done.

The deal looked nailed on: his MK Dons boss Karl Robinson is a product of Liverpool's academy and had advised his teenage midfielder to go to Liverpool, Alli wanted to go to Liverpool, and the Liverpool manager wanted Alli at the club. Yet it all fell apart.

With that set to go ahead, Liverpool suddenly decided to haggle the price down by half, and negotiations stalled. Tony Barret of The Times reports that the reason the move broke down was because of Liverpool's refusal to offer personal terms that were commensurate with a first team player, instead they offered terms equivalent with an Academy prospect. The deal broke down, and Spurs recognised Alli's full potential and signed him for just £5 million.

murpho999

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

For your opinion to be correct it would require Klopp to accept that situation and lie publicly in support of it i.e. his statements about not wanting to buy players etc.

I think Klopp has integrity. If he wasn't getting the financial support he wanted and felt the squad needed I think he'd walk as there are plenty of other clubs with rich owners who'd love to have him. There's no way he'd sit in Liverpool just for the personal cash.

We have no idea what goes on behind closed doors but maybe Klopp's ethic of building and projects fits perfectly into FSG's thinking.

Umaro

Umaro wrote: »

...............

Just by way of comparison, here are a bunch of other players top speeds:

..........

So compared to them he was never fast and is slower now.
His 2013/2014 max of 32.4km is well off the 35+km attained by the league's speedsters.

IMO it's form not declining pace is the issue.

murpho999

Turtyturd wrote: »

Dele Ali is a great example to pick out in hindsight alright, is the wages thing more speculation or has it been confirmed?

They brought in 3 first team starters who improve them team in the summer, and someone who they thought would be the number one keeper. I think most people were happy with that, you just seem offended that they made a profit, would it be better if they got the same players but spent more on them?

Mane a success so far. Wijaldum so so. Matip looks classy. Karuis poor.
Grujic - poor. Klavan average


Out of that list: Are you really happy with those signings?
Are we shopping at the level we should be? I really don't think so.

I'm not offended at club making profit but it should not be the driver. Make the club successful and that will actually lead to more profits, higher caliblre players attract more fans and in turn make more revenues.

Francie Barrett

Between that Alli story and the Sturridge one, you guys are making me sick this morning.

Don't worry though, I've got a bit of light relief for you all. Brede Hangeland was interviewed on a Norwegian podcast recently. He was asked about his laziest XI and his worst managers. This is what he had to say about the vile and odious Woy.

When he came to Viking we realised he was a quote machine. He was funny without knowing it. He was frustrated, I mean, here is a man of the world who for some reason is in Stavanger.

During one of the first training sessions at Viking he got frustrated at the poor training and he said to us, but mostly to himself I think, ‘I could be in Monaco smoking a cigar but here I am, pushing myself for pocket money’.

Our confidence levels fell as we realised how bad we were.

Roy was mostly in control but was a very bad loser. Once he got so mad at Fulham he kicked a metal bag, broke his toe and had to be attended to by doctor.

murpho999

murpho999 wrote: »

..............The truth is that they the price they paid included the debt pay off and it was a very shrewd business decision as the value of the club has increased massively wit he new TV deals.................

Value of the club doesn't matter really unless they sell some or all of it.
It's like a house, it's an asset. They still stumped up the cash to buy it and at the time I don't think folks were commenting that the price was really low.

no doubt they are shrewd.

murpho999 wrote: »

Mane a success so far. Wijaldum so so. Matip looks classy. Karuis poor.
Grujic - poor. Klavan average


Out of that list: Are you really happy with those signings?
Are we shopping at the level we should be? I really don't think so.

I'm not offended at club making profit but it should not be the driver. Make the club successful and that will actually lead to more profits, higher caliblre players attract more fans and in turn make more revenues.

100% agree, our summer signings are talked up as being earth shatteringly fantastic after 20 PL games, 1/2 of them are good ........... the other half are semi sh1t or injured.

Umaro

Its a real shame to miss out on Dele Alli like that. In August 2014 he was an important part of that MK Dons team that trashed Man Utd 4-0, it should've been clear enough to scouts at that stage that he was worth it. Instead we spent the last of the Suarez bonanza, £28 million, on Moreno and Balotelli :rolleyes:

Nowadays I'm not sure where we'd fit him in our preferred formation's best XI - maybe instead of Gini/Can but thats kinda further back than he plays for Spurs.


Also, we would've made a huge profit when we eventually sold him to Man City.

54and56

murpho999 wrote: »

We have no idea what goes on behind closed doors but maybe Klopp's ethic of building and projects fits perfectly into FSG's thinking.

I think thats exactly correct. He likes to build rather than buy. FSG saw how the "buy success" worked out for them under Kenny and BR. Klopp was one of the most coveted managers in world football and he wasn't looking to spunk a load of cash down the swanny to implement his plan.

What wasn't there to like about that for either FSG or fans? Would we have preferred if they overlooked Klopp in favour of another Manager who wanted to spend a shed load of cash?

Je_suis_Jean

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

..............Would we have preferred if they overlooked Klopp in favour of another Manager who wanted to spend a shed load of cash?

If we don't see CL over the next few seasons I expect so tbh.

Suarez, Mane, Firmino etc were all bought for relatively juicy amounts.
Milner, Matip etc were bought for nothing and turned out great too though.

Whatever gets us to CL will be considered successful once it doesn't put the club in a bad financial position, under FSG you can't see that happening IMO

Harry Palmr

My own judgement

Mane - obvious success
Wijaldum - good.
Matip - top quality
Karuis - clearly getting better as judged by his cup games
Grujic - injured.
Klavan - average

murpho999 wrote: »

Out of that list: Are you really happy with those signings?
Are we shopping at the level we should be? I really don't think so.

I'm not offended at club making profit but it should not be the driver. Make the club successful and that will actually lead to more profits, higher caliblre players attract more fans and in turn make more revenues.

Klopp had his list and bar a late failed lunge for Pulisic got players he wanted, he was aware of the effects of churn and lack of CL football as a lure for top level players (so missing on Mario Gotze and Mahmoud Dahoud) also knew he had the likes of Lallana who were improving under his coaching, Now as it happens I think the club should have gone big time for a couple of bodies for midfield and attack but there we are.

brevity

Harry Palmr wrote: »

FSG are the owners not the CEO, Transfer Committee or the manager - that **** up (and what a **** up it was) was down to the TC and Ian Ayre

That's not the first time something like that has happened either.

Didn't the club do something similar to Michael Laudrup?

You would think the club might learn from its mistakes.

Harry Palmr

brevity wrote: »

That's not the first time something like that has happened either.

Didn't the club do something similar to Michael Laudrup?

You would think the club might learn from its mistakes.

Harsh to bring up something from 1983! (luckily it didn't matter)

Turtyturd

murpho999 wrote: »

Mane a success so far. Wijaldum so so. Matip looks classy. Karuis poor.
Grujic - poor. Klavan average


Out of that list: Are you really happy with those signings?
Are we shopping at the level we should be? I really don't think so.

I'm not offended at club making profit but it should not be the driver. Make the club successful and that will actually lead to more profits, higher caliblre players attract more fans and in turn make more revenues.

So the three first team players improve the team, just like I said?

Karius has been poor, Klavan good for a back up CB, and Grujic has been good in most of his appearances but was clearly one for the future. Don't see any reason not to be happy with them and am looking forward to seeing who Klopp adds in the summer to build upon it.

murpho999

Turtyturd wrote: »

So the three first team players improve the team, just like I said?

Karius has been poor, Klavan good for a back up CB, and Grujic has been good in most of his appearances but was clearly one for the future. Don't see any reason not to be happy with them and am looking forward to seeing who Klopp adds in the summer to build upon it.

If you're happy with those signings then you obviously have lower expectations for the club than I do.

brevity

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Harsh to bring up something from 1983! (luckily it didn't matter)

Imagine all the players they did that to that people don't know about....

Baffling behaviour.

Omackeral

Came across this video this morning. The Scouse chap sounds absolutely disillusioned with the club's fanbase from 30 seconds onwards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmNsWzHgxC8

ERG89

Omackeral wrote: »

Came across this video this morning. The Scouse chap sounds absolutely disillusioned with the club's fanbase from 30 seconds onwards.

4th in the table and now this, slowly turning into Arsenal

Harry Palmr

murpho999 wrote: »

If you're happy with those signings then you obviously have lower expectations for the club than I do.

Out of curiosity can you list some of the players you'd have demanded LFC to have signed last summer?

Turtyturd

murpho999 wrote: »

If you're happy with those signings then you obviously have lower expectations for the club than I do.

Or I'm just confident the manager is more competent at identifying the type of players the club needs than you are.

murpho999

murpho999 wrote: »

If you're happy with those signings then you obviously have lower expectations for the club than I do.

Might be after one too many koolade ...........

Turtyturd

Haven't watched that video but judging by the quote it's an attempt to feel better about the chip LoI fans have on their shoulder over local support.

Omackeral

Turtyturd wrote: »

Haven't watched that video but judging by the quote it's an attempt to feel better about the chip LoI fans have on their shoulder over local support.

Who said anything about LOI? Jesus. It's a Scouse fella commenting on the atmosphere of Anfield and the culture of the club slipping away. Maybe watch the video and listen to what he has to say before automatically getting defensive. He talks about the return of standing sections and says he can't get his head around people leaving with 2 mins to go when you're chasing a goal. He makes some great points but whatever, your mind is made up.

Buford T. Justice XIX

ERG89 wrote: »

4th in the table and now this, slowly turning into Arsenal

True dat, Blud...

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

I think thats exactly correct. He likes to build rather than buy. FSG saw how the "buy success" worked out for them under Kenny and BR. Klopp was one of the most coveted managers in world football and he wasn't looking to spunk a load of cash down the swanny to implement his plan.

What wasn't there to like about that for either FSG or fans? Would we have preferred if they overlooked Klopp in favour of another Manager who wanted to spend a shed load of cash?

As far as I can make out, they want Klopp but want him to completely change his philosophy, of mostly buying young players whom he can mould into the players he wants, to spending large quantities of money on big name players?

murpho999

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Out of curiosity can you list some of the players you'd have demanded LFC to have signed last summer?

I'm not demanding anything but we could be doing better.

van Dijk is one player who springs to mind. Would have liked to have seen a bid for him.

At the time, without hindsight, would have tried for Payet as well.

A left back was definitely needed. I'm not a scout but to get no cover for that position is shocking.

murpho999

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

True dat, Blud...

As far as I can make out, they want Klopp but want him to completely change his philosophy, of buying young players whom he can mould into the players he wants, to spending large quantities of money on big name players?

Do people think Klopp doesn't buy players?

Do you forget he beat us to Mkhitaryan a few seasons ago? Why? FSG wouldn't pay the money and get the deal done.

Buford T. Justice V

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

..........

As far as I can make out, they want Klopp but want him to completely change his philosophy, of buying young players whom he can mould into the players he wants, to spending large quantities of money on big name players?

Yup.

Mane was a CB, bought for €2m at 19 years old............ never played on the wing before. Klopp moulded the fnck out of him :pac:

Harry Palmr

murpho999 wrote: »

Do people think Klopp doesn't buy players?

Do you forget he beat us to Mkhitaryan a few seasons ago? Why? FSG wouldn't pay the money and get the deal done.

They went to 22m and no CL football, Dortmund had CL football and matched the amount and a bit more - £23.6 million. Would offering a few million more have made the difference bearing in mind the player clearly preferred an established CL side?

Anyway all teams have these near misses, no point in harping on about individual examples to be honest.

Knex*

Rues was also a very big signing for Dortmund. He had two great years with Gladbach and a massive reputation even then. Signed for about 18m, which was big enough money, all things considered.

I'm fairly confident that Klopp will spend money when he wants a player. He's done it with Mane, he's also praised the Firmino buy multiple times, stating he thought it was great value, even at 30m, or whatever it was.

Yeah, we lack some depth at the moment, but we're with Klopp for the long haul and I see no reason to distrust his player judgement and transfer policy just yet.

Everyone with any knowledge of the man before he joined knew that he's a stubborn fecker, and while that can be frustrating at times when you want signings now, or subs on early, or a player to have more or less game time etc, for the most part its something that is to his credit.

I just hope if things do get a little rougher this season, people don't start calling for his head, or anything ridiculous.

Buford T. Justice XIX

murpho999 wrote: »

Do people think Klopp doesn't buy players?

Do you forget he beat us to Mkhitaryan a few seasons ago? Why? FSG wouldn't pay the money and get the deal done.

I changed the post, adding in a 'mostly' buying young players. We know that Klopp has spent some big money like Mickeyhits A Ryan and A. Boomerang and I expect he will again in the future.

But he will do it if he feels the player will bring corresponding value to the team and not so supporters can get a raging hard-on about the money spent.

murpho999

Harry Palmr wrote: »

They went to 22m and no CL football, Dortmund had CL football and matched the amount and a bit more - £23.6 million. Would offering a few million more have made the difference bearing in mind the player clearly preferred an established CL side?

Anyway all teams have these near misses, no point in harping on about individual examples to be honest.

We had CL football and Suarez money and did not shop well either.


Let's hope we get top 4 now and see what is made available to Klopp then and what type of players we sign.

murpho999

Turtyturd wrote: »

Or I'm just confident the manager is more competent at identifying the type of players the club needs than you are.

Of course he is, I am just wondering though how much is really being made available to him.

Turtyturd

murpho999 wrote: »

Of course he is, I am just wondering though how much is really being made available to him.

And that's fair enough. But I think it'd be common knowledge if he wasn't being supported.

If he wants a player and we miss out due to haggling over a million or two then it's a valid criticism but so far he appears to be getting the players he wants.

Agent Coulson

Gomez about to sign a new 5 year contract.


Should really dump him and sign a £50m CB FSG are just being cheapskates.

gafferino

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Gomez about to sign a new 5 year contract.


Should really dump him and sign a £50m CB FSG are just being cheapskates.

lol

Osmosis Jones

Not to get all net-spendy and whatnot but with sales we spent virtually nothing this summer. If Klopp had any other targets the money way there, FSG didn't stop him from signing anyone he just didn't have anyone else available that he wanted to sign.

Nerdlingr

Omackeral wrote: »

Came across this video this morning. The Scouse chap sounds absolutely disillusioned with the club's fanbase from 30 seconds onwards.

He's spot on in everything he says. Football has become more corporate nowadays. I HATE to see what the main stand has become with empty gaps appearing before half time. You see it the last day on TV, you look behind carragher and Le Tissier and half the stand is missing at half time. And most of them arent back till 5 minutes into the second half. The atmosphere has become very quiet in Anfield over the years and yes it is a sign of the times unfortunately. People seem afraid to sing at games now, nearly in fear of upsetting the quiet people around them !! Sure most of the crowd nowadays dont even know YNWA!!, the amount of times I've heard people cheering and sitting down when they think the song is over, only for the last verse to come in...its like oh yeah, forgot about part! Its a pet hate so sorry for the rant. We've accused The emirates, ethiad, stamford bridge, Old Trafford etc of being libraries but were going down the same way. Klopp went from the yellow wall in dortmund to a docile crowd not waking up till 1:30pm last saturday v swansea. The sooner the powers that be figure out how to bring back safe standing the better. They have to give football back to the people/fans or its going to lose its soul.

Harry Palmr

I'm listening to the Anfield Wrap podcast about Sturridge - such a lot of waffle skirting around the bleedin' obvious.

murpho999

Turtyturd wrote: »

And that's fair enough. But I think it'd be common knowledge if he wasn't being supported.

If he wants a player and we miss out due to haggling over a million or two then it's a valid criticism but so far he appears to be getting the players he wants.

We shall see, I just think FSG are structuring the club to make money and be successful on the balance sheet, not the field.

murpho999

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Gomez about to sign a new 5 year contract.


Should really dump him and sign a £50m CB FSG are just being cheapskates.

Assume this is directed at my posts, if so, shows you didn't really read them or get any of my points.

brevity

Nerdlingr wrote: »

He's spot on in everything he says. Football has become more corporate nowadays. I HATE to see what the main stand has become with empty gaps appearing before half time. You see it the last day on TV, you look behind carragher and Le Tissier and half the stand is missing at half time. And most of them arent back till 5 minutes into the second half. The atmosphere has become very quiet in Anfield over the years and yes it is a sign of the times unfortunately. People seem afraid to sing at games now, nearly in fear of upsetting the quiet people around them !! Sure most of the crowd nowadays dont even know YNWA!!, the amount of times I've heard people cheering and sitting down when they think the song is over, only for the last verse to come in...its like oh yeah, forgot about part! Its a pet hate so sorry for the rant. We've accused The emirates, ethiad, stamford bridge, Old Trafford etc of being libraries but were going down the same way. Klopp went from the yellow wall in dortmund to a docile crowd not waking up till 1:30pm last saturday v swansea. The sooner the powers that be figure out how to bring back safe standing the better. They have to give football back to the people/fans or its going to lose its soul.

I think that people don't know how to support their team.

I mean if I went, I wouldn't know what the **** to do. Do I sing? No one else is singing?!? I only know some of the words. I'll sound silly. I'll stand up and clap and shout "C'MON LIVERPOOL". Now people are telling me to shush and sit down and a mountain in a Hi Vis Jacket is coming towards me.

I know people slagged Chelsea for the plastic flags but at least it was an idea to get something going...

Safe standing is an idea but would take a lot to organise.

Dunno how to fix it.

Locals turning against day trippers is definitely not going to fix it.

Luap

Gomez will be our cb for many seasons.

Still only 19, looks a great prospect.

Can only get better barring injuries.

Agent Coulson

I have to say I thought the Leicester City clapper was a great simple way to create an atmosphere inside a stadium.

garra

murpho999 wrote: »

A lot of supporters seems to believe that FSG have been heroic knights in shining armour rescuing the club by buying it and then afterwards paying off its debts. The truth is that they the price they paid included the debt pay off and it was a very shrewd business decision as the value of the club has increased massively wit he new TV deals.




I don't agree with this, they have a net spend of around £160m in 6 years which is not that much and the last few season has been mostly funded by sales despite there being much more TV money available.

They said when they took over that they are here to win and that wages is no object and I think they have failed in that regard.

Klopp cannot say in public if they didn't back him but I cannot accept that he would really want Milner and Moreno as his left back options.

I cannot believe they said that "wages is no object", or anything which would suggest that money (used to pay wages) is no object.

They have always said they are running the club as a business, so what if they are shrewd business people who are running the club in a financially prudent manner? The manager likes to operate within those controls and has never hinted otherwise.

This is a long term project for Klopp, if he doesn't get the players he wants now because the clubs wont sell them until the summer, that's the way it goes.

I think we are lucky to have the owners & manager that we have, some people are just moany holes and if they are not getting their "glory fix" - expecting to win trophies - they will have their little moan.

Agent Coulson

garra wrote: »

I think we are lucky to have the owners & manager that we have, some people are just moany holes and if they are not getting their "glory fix" - expecting to win trophies - they will have their little moan.

Looks like they are happy for Liverpool to be on a bit of a bad run so they can just come in and moan.

J Mysterio

Umaro wrote: »

This image is doing the rounds, concerning Daniel Sturridge's loss of pace over the past 4 years:



Just by way of comparison, here are a bunch of other players top speeds:

Shane Long! Aboy the kid, totally underrated!

Moist Bread

You're all ****ing mad. If there's nothing to argue about you'll invent reasons to get ****ty with other posters.

Lunatics. Maniacs. You're all out of control.

J Mysterio

J Mysterio wrote: »

Shane Long! Aboy the kid, totally underrated!

Juat saw the below comments from Carragher:

"I'm a fan of Shane Long," Carragher said on Sky Sports following the game.

"He's always the type of player that, when he comes on, you’re thinking: 'he'll cause a problem with his pace'.

"I've played against him. It's not just his pace, it's his strength, the low centre of gravity. There was one [incident] where he just knocked [Joel] Matip completely over when he jumped for a ball.

Sign him up.

sword1

J Mysterio wrote: »

Shane Long! Aboy the kid, totally underrated!

Speed is over rated, no Chelsea player on that table yet they top the one that matters