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Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2016/2017
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Kerrigooney wrote: »The lads that like giving off about "cliques" now have their own. Yep. Life comes at you fast.
What clique is this you speak of bud. A couple of like minded folk doesn't make a clique
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Amanda Tasteless Lanyard wrote: »Inspiring stuff.
Not very encouraging to say the least. Although I've seen Liverpool linked with Inkai Williams too so maybe not all hope is lost.
https://twitter.com/OptaJoe/status/828898325382447104
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Kerrigooney wrote: »................
I'm done on the subject and you bore me.
Iirc it was you that brought it up bud I'm not part of any clique btw.............. are you?
Going forward if you are almost done on a subject probably not worth bringing it up on a discussion forum
I'd say you are mistaking boredom for confusion too.0 -
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I can see Klopp turning to Sturridge is an attempt to rescue the season
I'd say he'll be turning to a bottle of Jameson
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/frustrated-klopp-snaps-at-his-players-mf7gbs35x
Jürgen Klopp tore into his Liverpool players during half-time of their shambolic defeat by Hull City and questioned their attitude as his patience finally snapped over a season that threatens to unravel.
It was the angriest Klopp’s players have seen him since his arrival at Anfield in October 2015 and is likely to be followed by a shake-up of his team before next Saturday’s crucial showdown with Tottenham Hotspur.
Goalkeeper Simon Mignolet is under pressure once again after his mistake which led to Hull’s first goal with Loris Karius under consideration to come back into the starting line-up.
“Again, that’s another thing where we have to show a reaction,” said Klopp when asked about Mignolet’s form. “That’s causing problems. That’s how it is. For sure, he was not alone around the goal but of course he nearly had it in his hands.
“We cannot ignore this is true and we will not, we don’t lie to ourselves.”
Klopp has struggled to fathom a solution to Liverpool’s alarming down-turn in form which has seen them fail to win a league game in 2017 and exit two cup competitions.
Liverpool entered the year in second place, just six points behind Chelsea, but have gleaned just three points from a possible 15. The ferocity of Klopp’s reprimand feels like a line in the sand, although, worryingly, it elicited only a marginal improvement.
“We don’t look for excuses,” added Klopp. “It’s not that we are trying to blame somebody. We are responsible, the squad, myself especially. We have to work on a solution and we will.”0 -
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Let me start by saying it's great to have a discussion on here. Apologies for splintering your post but you've raised quite a few points that I would like to respond to. Apologies also to the natives who don't like long posts.
At the start of the season there wasn't a weight of expectation on the team. The pressure cranks up after Christmas, especially when Liverpool are at the top end of the table.We didn't seem to be missing them much in the first half of the season.
Chelsea are setup as an Italian team, typically they only need to score once to win the game. They can soak up pressure and then kill you on the break, they are blessed with pace in the side. Liverpool have a different approach. We cannot soak up pressure, that's been the case since Rodgers was manager. And without Mane we lack the pace up front to keep the opposition on their guard.Maybe we'd lose less often, but if you've aspirations towards the top of the table, draws aren't much good.
Chelsea don't have much in the way of volume of goals, but they do have very high frequency. They've still scored in all but about 2 league games.
Rodgers team was repeatedly carved open right through the middle of midfield, Klopp's team is the same. This is hardly surprising given that the same personnel bar Wijnaldum have been involved.We had our defence sorted from the word go with Benitez. We never won the league because up front we didn't have the firepower. We didn't have cover and we didn't have different kinds of threat.
Bren gets the perfect attack force, doesn't bother with defending and nearly wins the league after relatively minimal time to build a squad, at a time when we can't attract anywhere near the same quality of players and are much weaker relative to our rivals.
I wasn't suggesting we sign a Momo Sissoko, a Kante/Mascherano is what we should be looking for. There are a few talented young players that would better suit the role than any of our current lot.A Momo-like player would be a complete non-starter for us because he couldn't pass.
We're an attacking team who average about 65% possession or something, so for me the passing is the most vital thing.
Someone has to do it and it's not really either of Lallana or Wijnaldum.
William Carvalho (Sporting, 24)
Ruben Neves (Porto, 19)
Leandro Paredes (Roma, 21)
Leander Dendoncker (Anderlecht, 21)
Tiemoue Bakayoko (Monaco, 22)
Franck Kessie (Atlanta, 20)
Amadou Diawara (Napoli, 19)
We have been linked with the first six on that list at various times in the past few years. Of those players, Kessie is the worst passer of the ball by far.
Given a choice I'd take Paredes from Roma. Dendoncker is a good option because he can also play in central defence but Paredes covers more ground. I've spoken about this previously, the only reason I see us not signing one of these types of players is that the manager may see in as Trent-Arnold's position. He's 19 now so signing a player of a similar age is likely to stagnate his development, in which case Carvalho the most suitable option. He's a player for the here and now who could potentially be flogged to Real / Barca / PSG for a profit in a few years when Trent-Arnold is ready to make the position his own.
Henderson's best position is where he excelled during the 2013/14 season. Maintaining his fitness is the only issue. Last summer we were linked with Dahoud and Zielinski. Zielinski joined Napoli and Wijnaldum was signed when it was clear that Dahoud was unavailable. If we sign Dahoud in the summer then Wijnaldum is either benched or needs to find another role, possibly out wide.I wouldn't be opposed to benching Wijnaldum and putting Hendo further up the pitch, with a DM brought in. I think it would improve us.
The opportunity cost is the only issue.
Will that signing be top class or at least, will the partnership with Hendo be better than Hendo's with Gini?
As it stands we have six players who are best suited to two of the three midfield positions. Henderson has played the defensive role in the middle and his understudy Can has been a disaster. For the purpose of this discussion I'm ignoring Lucas.
We won't be signing any world class players unless they are available for a knock down price. If we want a Kante clone, then all we have to do is drop a pile of money (£25-30M) in Lisbon for William Carvalho - he's an absolute tank and he can pass the ball. While we're there we could pickup Gelson Martins for the wing position. But Klopp will more than likely sign players he sees potential in.It's easy to talk about the likes of Leicester getting Kante, but for every signing like that who goes from nothing to world-class at a lower level club, I'm sure there's 50 lads who you wouldn't want within 50 miles of Melwood.
Spurs lost their 20 goal a season forward, it was no surprise the goals dried up but at the same time they didn't lose. We haven't had a 20 goal forward since 2013/14 when we were blessed with two of them.From my perspective, I see the ultimate failure being that the goal threat is gone from the team.
If we're failing in attack to the extent which we currently are, a better defence maybe nicks us a few draws at home to Swansea or away to Hull.
I'm not arsed about us doing that.
You could even see with Spurs. They stopped being able to attack and great, they got a few draws, but that's what killed their chances at the title this season.
In 2013/14 we had pace across the front positions and the opposition feared being carved open. Mourinho's Chelsea team came to Anfield and set out the template for how to contain and beat that Liverpool team. The away games against Burnley and Hull this season are almost carbon copies.
Given our style of play, pace up front is a much needed asset. We were without Mane for the month of January and it handed the initiative to the opposition. I was confused as to why Sheyi Ojo didn't get the opportunity to deputise but today I learned that he has been told that he needs to be more direct if he wants to get into the first team.
We had to find another way to play without that pace but it's a separate issue to our defensive lapses. The opposition know that when they play Liverpool, if they hang in there for long enough we will gift them an opportunity.
Paul Clement after we gifted Swansea their first and third goals: "We frustrated Liverpool and defended really well. We showed great togetherness and it was a massive team effort. At half-time I told the players we would get at least one chance, but to get three was unbelievable."
David Moyes: "I never thought we were out of it. The important thing was to not concede a third goal. In the end we got a deserved penalty."
Fear affects the decision making process in the brain - this is scientifically proven. As far back as the Burnley game Klopp spoke about the decision making issue, it echoes what you posted.I haven't seen fear be an issue for us in our recent struggles.
I've seen a lack of skillsets to open a locked defence, I've seen a lack of players in the areas where they can damage the opposition, I've seen a dogged determination to play the ball through the middle despite there being 2000 defenders in the way, we like booting a load of crosses in despite being a team of midgets and nobody's ever in the box at the time anyway.
"Our decision making was not good. We'd put in a good cross but there were no bodies in the box and then when we had bodies in the box we ended up shooting.
"The season is still pretty young. It doesn't look like we are 100% fine-tuned. But it's only the start of the season and I can see a lot of good things.
"The lesson here is don't give the ball away like we did twice today. We will work on it 100%. We need to have a plan for deep defending teams. We have a few things to do - that is clear."
Klopp has since struggled to explain what happens when the team go out and fail to execute the plan put in place during match preparation. Everything seems perfect on the training pitch and then for no apparent reason, things go tits up when the players are on the pitch. We've seen this before under Rodgers. Should we be surprised?
I think the answer lies in the recruitment policy of Benitez, where possible he filled the team with leaders: Agger, Mascherano, Alonso, Kuyt, Torres. Each of them had the mental strength to put the fear out of their mind. They may not all have been the best technical players but they had the mental toughness required to play for Liverpool. Rodgers spoke about the weight of the Liverpool jersey but during his time we assembled a cast of players who would not question his authority. The only player in the group with the nerve to face down Rodgers and Gerrard was Dejan Lovren.
How many times have we spoken about the lack of mental strength in the Liverpool team on this thread? How many leaders do we have in the current Liverpool team?
I'd say you were getting tired when you reached this point.Maybe Kante or someone like that is so good that he really can hoover up everything coming at our back 2 (because the full backs are usually around the edge of the box), but even if that DM really was so legendarily good they could hold the fort pretty much by themselves,
We don't need Superman for the role, we need somebody that can read the game and is mobile. If the holding player can hold up a counter attack, it gives the rest of the team a chance to recover their position. When we're in possession they should be composed enough to be able to turn and try to get the team going forward rather than just boot it into the path of an opponent or out for a cheap corner. Remember how Xabi Alonso would turn on the ball or draw a foul? He made it look so easy.
The reason we found ourselves in the position on Saturday was because of Emre Can's inability to turn on the ball. Replace Can with a player better suited to the role and the team has a platform for going forward instead of placing the defence under unnecessary pressure. We didn't start playing our game until the second half.I don't see how that affects the central issue, which is that we're putting ourselves in situations where we're giving the ball away where we can be counter-attacked and there's no chance of having any payoff for that risk, because our attack is utterly static and clueless.
If you go back to the Sunderland game, we were winning 2-1 when Can (deputising for Henderson) trampled over the Sunderland player who was facing a wall of Liverpool defenders. It was a needless foul, Mane handled the ball from the free kick and they scored the penalty. The two points dropped in that game are due to Can's decision making.
I could go through each of the results from January and point to the unforced defensive errors that were made, but it won't add to the discussion. Individual errors have been costing us results for years, that's not going to change until the personnel are changed.
In an ideal world Klopp would sign a new spine for the team (GK, DC, DM & FC), but that's not his way. He made the bare minimum adjustments to the team last summer and I expect to see the same again if we don't qualify for the Champions League this season.0 -
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anyone else just done with the season or is it just me? ya we still have a shout for top 4,but the last couple of months has broken me,so much promise. ive given up on the season,you would need a very good reason to get me away from watching lfc whenever we were on tv or streams, and by good reason i mean a really good reason,id be stroppy if i missed one.
couldnt give a fcuk now for the rest of the season. the talking is over,are we a big club or not,this summer will prove everything,because,will be 6th or 7th for a long long time if we fall further behind as city,utd,arsenal,spurs,chelsea and maybe everton could and most likely will get stronger.
team full of nearly men,they are nearly good enough most of them,some are,most are not.
sad face
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marklazarcovic wrote: »anyone else just done with the season or is it just me? ya we still have a shout for top 4,but the last couple of months has broken me,so much promise. ive given up on the season,you would need a very good reason to get me away from watching lfc whenever we were on tv or streams, and by good reason i mean a really good reason,id be stroppy if i missed one.
couldnt give a fcuk now for the rest of the season. the talking is over,are we a big club or not,this summer will prove everything,because,will be 6th or 7th for a long long time if we fall further behind as city,utd,arsenal,spurs,chelsea and maybe everton could and most likely will get stronger.
team full of nearly men,they are nearly good enough most of them,some are,most are not.
sad face
This is the boom bust cycle in text form! :pac:
I feel your pain but plenty to play for, I'm not quite done yet!0 -
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