Haye vs Bellew

nacho libre

walshb wrote: »

In fairness even at his best at HW what exactly did he achieve? He beat whom, exactly? Underachiever in my opinion.

He beat the best the division had to offer, only a broken toe thwarted him from unifying the division.

titan18

nacho libre wrote: »

He beat the best the division had to offer, only a broken toe thwarted him from unifying the division.

He beat Harrison, Valuev, Ruiz and Barrett before losing to Wladimir. Valuev couldn't move, Ruiz was 40 and Barrett and Harrison were never the best of the HW division.

Obviously, Wlad and Vitali were much better than everyone else in the division at the time, but guys Haye didn't fight or beat then who'd have been far bigger tests than the 4 he did include Solis, Arreola, Adamek, Chagaev, Povetkin and probably a good few others.

walshb

I think nacho was being facetious.

ebbsy

nacho libre wrote: »

walshb wrote: »

In fairness even at his best at HW what exactly did he achieve? He beat whom, exactly? Underachiever in my opinion.

He beat the best the division had to offer, only a broken toe thwarted him from unifying the division.

😂

dinorebel

walshb wrote: »

In fairness even at his best at HW what exactly did he achieve? He beat whom, exactly? Underachiever in my opinion.

Edit: Yes, a very good puncher who is capable of dropping many a HW.

He was the man at cruiser which is often forgotten even now I think he could beat Wilder.

walshb

dinorebel wrote: »

He was the man at cruiser which is often forgotten even now I think he could beat Wilder.

He could beat Wilder if he found his chin, and Wilder could beat him if he found Haye's chin. On points I would guess very close, as Haye is not some workhorse who throws many punches, plus he is a bit shorter and would probably be surprised at Wilder's boxing ability.

One other thing that I fell could be important is that Haye IMO would be more wary of getting knocked out than Wilder, and this would lead to a more cagey and careful Haye, which would affect his offensive substance and output. Wilder would be more committed and more driven to win as regards his offensive output.

This could work a few ways. He shuts Haye down with his power/offence, or he leaves himself open to a KO counter?

Frank Bullitt

Pighead wrote: »

Rumours on twitter that Haye has an achilles injury and is on the verge of pulling out. If its true hed be probably brst advised to close down his social media accounts. He'll be crucified if theres any truth to it.

Looks like this is untrue and he is all clear. I can never understand how a boxer can get an injury so close to a fight. The last week before a fight should be rest and regenerate.

Although he could have slipped while he was sipping his protein shake from a champagne class on his way to the pool.

boxer.fan

Anyone else rooting for a double knock out here? It would be a fitting result.
Can't wait to hear Carl Froch's Wembley story! Maybe he will challenge the winner.

walshb

boxer.fan wrote: »

Anyone else rooting for a double knock out here? It would be a fitting result.
Can't wait to hear Carl Froch's Wembley story! Maybe he will challenge the winner.

No matter what the result Froch will have it a draw.

Frank Bullitt

The weigh-ins should be fun anyway.

Sweet Science

walshb wrote: »

He could beat Wilder if he found his chin, and Wilder could beat him if he found Haye's chin. On points I would guess very close, as Haye is not some workhorse who throws many punches, plus he is a bit shorter and would probably be surprised at Wilder's boxing ability.

One other thing that I fell could be important is that Haye IMO would be more wary of getting knocked out than Wilder, and this would lead to a more cagey and careful Haye, which would affect his offensive substance and output. Wilder would be more committed and more driven to win as regards his offensive output.

This could work a few ways. He shuts Haye down with his power/offence, or he leaves himself open to a KO counter?

Ok I will bite . Surprised at Wilders boxing ability ? I assume that's sarcasm it's hard to tell in text . The man is an embarrassment . His finish the past weekend was like something from a bad cartoon . His first defences as champ are probably the worst in history . Hopefully he fights someone of note soon gets ko'd

Sweet Science

https://twitter.com/EditinKing/status/836001893621063680

walshb

Sweet Science wrote: »

Ok I will bite . Surprised at Wilders boxing ability ? I assume that's sarcasm it's hard to tell in text . The man is an embarrassment . His finish the past weekend was like something from a bad cartoon . His first defences as champ are probably the worst in history . Hopefully he fights someone of note soon gets ko'd

Haye will still be surprised. Wilder showed some very decent boxing against Stiverne. Wilder is just too preoccupied with power at times, but up until now nobody has outboxed/beaten him. So, it's easy for armchair fans and fans to criticise, but looking at it objectively, Wilder has proved he can win. Skills is a subjective term anyway.

StringerBell

Bellew is playing a blinder I think in generating interest in this, he knows as well as plenty of others he probably doesn't last very long in this match but he is selling that he has the ability to take Haye out well.

Edit: Also, I think he has increased his chances by a couple of % by genuinely getting under Haye's skin which he has undeniably done at this point.

Sweet Science

StringerBell wrote: »

Bellew is playing a blinder I think in generating interest in this, he knows as well as plenty of others he probably doesn't last very long in this match but he is selling that he has the ability to take Haye out well.

Edit: Also, I think he has increased his chances by a couple of % by genuinely getting under Haye's skin which he has undeniably done at this point.

There is always a chance with people of that size . If Haye walks onto one it could happen . However Haye is very slick with good defence.

I'm actually going to open myself up here for slagging but Haye has always been one of my favourite boxers to watch ( when he unified cruiserweight ) . Fast Slick and power in his hands.

nacho libre

walshb wrote: »

Wilder has proved he can win. Skills is a subjective term anyway.

Wilder's last two opponents, particularly the one before Washington, were giving him a lot of problems, and these are guys below top level. Once he steps it up, he won't get away with his wild swings and lunges, he will be punished and likely knocked out because he has a suspect chin. No doubting his power, but that isn't enough at the top level. Joshua, Haye, and Ortiz will likely beat him.

nacho libre

Sweet Science wrote: »

I'm actually going to open myself up here for slagging but Haye has always been one of my favourite boxers to watch ( when he unified cruiserweight ) . Fast Slick and power in his hands.

Speaking of fast, as the great Manny said in the build up to the Wlad fight, Haye will be surprised by how quick Wlad is for a big man. I liked Haye as a a fighter in his crusierweight days, but he lost all credibility with his sore toe excuse and ducking meaningful fights prior to the Wlad fight. He can't have too much complaint with Bellew's antics given what he did to get the Wlad fight.

FM Regen

What time is the ring walk?

walshb

FM Regen wrote: »

What time is the ring walk?

I'd say not before 2230 hrs....

Sweet Science

walshb wrote: »

I'd say not before 2230 hrs....

Yeah think Hearn tweeted around the 10.45pm mark. Even if the fights before it end early they will still wait until around that time

Sweet Science

By the way how good is it that Joshua Klit and Brook Spence will be on at peak time . Makes such a difference

walshb

Sweet Science wrote: »

Yeah think Hearn tweeted around the 10.45pm mark. Even if the fights before it end early they will still wait until around that time

They will wait around, no doubt. The under-card is terrible from what I have seen...

dinorebel

Sweet Science wrote: »

By the way how good is it that Joshua Klit and Brook Spence will be on at peak time . Makes such a difference

It's great that so many top fights are at a decent time am still staying up for Garcia Thurman though.

megadodge

walshb wrote: »

Haye will still be surprised. Wilder showed some very decent boxing against Stiverne. Wilder is just too preoccupied with power at times, but up until now nobody has outboxed/beaten him. So, it's easy for armchair fans and fans to criticise, but looking at it objectively, Wilder has proved he can win. Skills is a subjective term anyway.

He showed a good jab against a smaller man who has poor head movement. That's about it.

I'm genuinely shocked that you cannot see the flaws in Wilder's boxing. He is so wary of getting hit, he reminds me of Audley Harrison at times. I'm serious. Just watch the exaggerated movement away from any perceived attack or feint. That's why he doesn't throw much against bigger men, he's so worried about getting hit, he just waits and waits until it's his 'turn' to throw, then his punches are wild, very wild. He certainly has power, but his composure is so poor the top guys will defeat him handily.

I actually think Breazle would have a very good chance against him. Breazle will just keep coming and he has shown a lot of toughness in his last two fights. Plus he's huge and Wilder just isn't used to not being the bigger man. For someone with composure issues, a bigger guy who just won't back off is a nightmare scenario. That's why I'd be surprised if the fight happens and I'd be prepared to have a decent punt on Breazle if it did.

dinorebel

walshb wrote: »

They will wait around, no doubt. The under-card is terrible from what I have seen...

Mathews v Davies and Eggington v Paulie are decent enough.

walshb

Brezeale is big and strong and awkward, but a sitting duck for Wilder's power. I reckon Wilder gets him out of there early.

Frank Bullitt

This was entertaining, probably more exciting that the fight.

I do like Bellews David Hayefaker, nicely played.

zweton

blade1 wrote: »

Katie Taylor fighting anyway.

any idea what time she will be on around?

Burial.

Haye looked in serious shape at the open workout!

Sweet Science

walshb wrote: »

Brezeale is big and strong and awkward, but a sitting duck for Wilder's power. I reckon Wilder gets him out of there early.

The sensible money considering the odds would be on Brezeale .