Hyundai Ioniq, Volkswagen E-Golf, BMW i3 vs Nissan Leaf - electric vehicle group test

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Hyundai Ioniq, Volkswagen E-Golf, BMW i3 vs Nissan Leaf - electric vehicle group test

By autocar

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/hyundai-ioniq-volkswagen-e-golf-bmw-i3-vs-nissan-leaf-electric-vehicle-group-test

J.pilkington

Not surprised at all with the finishing position of the leaf in that test given the competition.

Oh dear..... I just had to shake my head when I read this.

The Nissan Leaf and Mitsubishi i-MiEV came along first and adopted a 110V DC system called ChaDeMo, which the Kia Soul EV also uses. But some of Europe’s EV makers have since adopted another 110V DC system, called CCS (used by the BMW i3 and VW e-Golf and e-Up), while others (such as Renault) prefer an AC rapid charge solution.

The Leaf has some body roll ? so what, it's not a sports car and on 17" wheels rides very well and I think it's great on Irish roads. Comfortable and can take corners well. I've heard way too many complaints about the I3 suspension and I doubt it would suit me. If anyone finds the Leaf bad in bends then you're driving way too fast and should be on a track.

It's no surprise that a 6 year old Leaf model isn't the best most efficient car today, it was designed at a time when battery costs were incredibly more expensive than they are today and it's highly commendable what Nissan achieved at the time when no one else wanted to or actually bothered.

Also, there was no mention of the 40 Kwh Zoe that can be ordered now blasting all three cars on range.

stesaurus

The i3 really is a different class compared to the others. The e-Golf likes to think it is also but really only in price. I'd have the Ioniq 2nd with the e-Golf 4th

The Ioniq is larger than the i3 and got a larger boot, so the Ioniq would be 2 on my list, I have to say though that now a 40 Kwh Zoe is on the way it would be very, very hard for me to get the ioniq, even though the Ioniq is new. So I think if I were considering buying now I would definitely hold off another year or buy the 40 Kwh Zoe. But that's me.

There is also the 40 Kwh AC charger in the Zoe which can use the full 22 Kw from the standard street charge points, a major advantage with a 40 Kwh battery and you can also charge at most triple headed fast chargers at the same time another EV is using the DC side.

So my preference right now would be 1. 40 Kwh Zoe, 2. Ioniq, 3. Leaf and 4. I3 and 5. E-Golf.

The I3 has great quality and no doubt a lot more fun to drive but it is lacking space making it far less practical for me and the doors are a pain in the ass.

The E-Golf, is ...... ? don't know what it's trying to achieve.

BoatMad

s.welstead wrote: »

The i3 really is a different class compared to the others. The e-Golf likes to think it is also but really only in price. I'd have the Ioniq 2nd with the e-Golf 4th

the price comparison seemed to suggest the Leaf SVE was comparable with the I3, isn't the i3 much more expensive in ireland ?

Last time I checked the basic I3 was about 7 K more expensive than the top spec Leaf 24 Kwh.

I'd have to check the price list again if I can find it.

stesaurus

BoatMad wrote: »

the price comparison seemed to suggest the Leaf SVE was comparable with the I3, isn't the i3 much more expensive in ireland ?

UK prices which I'm not familiar with so could very well be misleading. Over here there's a bit of a pricing gap but I remember when I was buying that the PCP interest rates and p/x were much better for the i3 for me. That meant the gap wasn't huge so it made so much more sense for the better car.

stesaurus

Deleted User wrote: »

The Ioniq is larger than the i3 and got a larger boot, so the Ioniq would be 2 on my list, I have to say though that now a 40 Kwh Zoe is on the way it would be very, very hard for me to get the ioniq, even though the Ioniq is new. So I think if I were considering buying now I would definitely hold off another year or buy the 40 Kwh Zoe. But that's me.

There is also the 40 Kwh AC charger in the Zoe which can use the full 22 Kw from the standard street charge points, a major advantage with a 40 Kwh battery and you can also charge at most triple headed fast chargers at the same time another EV is using the DC side.

So my preference right now would be 1. 40 Kwh Zoe, 2. Ioniq, 3. Leaf and 4. I3 and 5. E-Golf.

The I3 has great quality and no doubt a lot more fun to drive but it is lacking space making it far less practical for me and the doors are a pain in the ass.

The E-Golf, is ...... ? don't know what it's trying to achieve.

It really doesn't lack space, we've told you this before and you keep spouting this. Plenty of room and if needs be I can drop either/both of the back seats and put in whatever.

I don't need a massive boot, if I did I'd have an Octavia! There's more room inside for passengers especially in front than the Leaf. Maybe it is let down with only 2 seats in the back but I don't have a family to cart around so don't really care

So in other words it's good enough for you and that's all that matters !

stesaurus

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So in other words it's good enough for you and that's all that matters !

Nope that's your shtick!

BoatMad

s.welstead wrote: »

UK prices which I'm not familiar with so could very well be misleading. Over here there's a bit of a pricing gap but I remember when I was buying that the PCP interest rates and p/x were much better for the i3 for me. That meant the gap wasn't huge so it made so much more sense for the better car.

I originally drove both and my memory serves me there was considerable difference in price between my Choosen model leaf ( SV + cold pack ) and the equivalent i3 . equally I felt the Leaf was less outrageous in design and slightly bigger inside and the boot.

Thats been justified, few people not in know , regard the Leaf as anything other then a ICE jap box, yet I know the I3 draws attention ( which isnt my cup of tea )

horses for courses

unkel

And the i3 no doubt will depreciate a lot less than a Leaf. With the UK EV prices so close together, it really is a no brainer over there, provided you don't need 5 seats

Over here it's a different story. You can drive a Leaf home for €20k and I very much doubt you could get an i3 for €30k. That's over 50% more. For a smaller car.

Soarer

Only £500 difference between the Leaf and the i3 over there?

Are BMW Ireland taking us for a ride or what?

n97 mini

Am I alone in thinking the i3 is hideous looking, especially in two tone? Looks like a duplo toy. Even in the profile picture at the end of that article it looks like a swollen Opel Agila. I'm wondering if it had a different badge, especially from a Far Eastern manufacturer, what would the reaction to it have been.

Idbatterim

Only £500 difference between the Leaf and the i3 over there?

Are BMW Ireland taking us for a ride or what?

oh yeah, that fact has been well established...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057551941&page=42

Soarer

n97 mini wrote: »

Am I alone in thinking the i3 is hideous looking, especially in two tone? Looks like a duplo toy. Even in the profile picture at the end of that article it looks like a swollen Opel Agila. I'm wondering if it had a different badge, especially from a Far Eastern manufacturer, what would the reaction to it have been.

I wouldn't say hideous. Different definitely.

Took one for a test drive and loved it. Hated having to open the front doors to open the back ones. Obviously not designed living in a place with horizontal rain!
There was also too much going on with the entertainment system, which the salesman was only too eager to point out. I don't mind satnav, bluetooth and the like. But ringing an assistant, reading the online paper? Not for me.

That said, if it were available for handy money, I'd probably choose one over the Leaf as I actually really like the look of it!

stesaurus

n97 mini wrote: »

Am I alone in thinking the i3 is hideous looking, especially in two tone? Looks like a duplo toy. Even in the profile picture at the end of that article it looks like a swollen Opel Agila. I'm wondering if it had a different badge, especially from a Far Eastern manufacturer, what would the reaction to it have been.

Hated it when I first saw it but now love it. Looks are important to a degree but really I shouldn't give a toss, looks great inside so why do I need to worry about what others are seeing?
I love the fact it's unashamedly an EV and proud of it. It's completely different to a normal ice, very futuristic, hence you see it being driven in any near future tv shows.
Things like no gear stick, so take the middle section out and give me that space back, ahem Leaf take note.

BoatMad

s.welstead wrote: »

Hated it when I first saw it but now love it. Looks are important to a degree but really I shouldn't give a toss, looks great inside so why do I need to worry about what others are seeing?
I love the fact it's unashamedly an EV and proud of it. It's completely different to a normal ice, very futuristic, hence you see it being driven in any near future tv shows.
Things like no gear stick, so take the middle section out and give me that space back, ahem Leaf take note.

I like tall centre dividers , provide a rest for the knees , and is at a convienent height for cups , keys, phone etc. I remember when it used to be bare space , yuck

NIMAN

s.welstead wrote: »

Hated it when I first saw it but now love it. Looks are important to a degree but really I shouldn't give a toss, looks great inside so why do I need to worry about what others are seeing?
I love the fact it's unashamedly an EV and proud of it. It's completely different to a normal ice, very futuristic, hence you see it being driven in any near future tv shows.
Things like no gear stick, so take the middle section out and give me that space back, ahem Leaf take note.

I think looks are very important to prospective buyers.

I have never bought a car I didn't like the look of, no matter how good it was meant to be.

When I first saw the Leaf and the i3, I thought both were ugly. Both have grown on me over time, and I accepted that the Leaf had to have that rare shape for aerodynamic reasons. Or did it? Since the i3 basically looks like a square brick.

The Ioniq I think is the way most EVs will go, more traditional looking as people are easily put of wacky designs.

BoatMad

The Ioniq I think is the way most EVs will go, more traditional looking as people are easily put of wacky designs.

yes its funny, how new design follows historical trends , modern tractors essentially modelled on steam traction engines, whose form was completely defined by function. Only a few class leading companies, bright out tractors that defied that form, ( JCB for one )

I think as EV designs grow and the engineers are freed from conventional placement of engines etc, I hope we will see more creative looking e-cars

jerryg

n97 mini wrote: »

Am I alone in thinking the i3 is hideous looking, especially in two tone? Looks like a duplo toy. Even in the profile picture at the end of that article it looks like a swollen Opel Agila. I'm wondering if it had a different badge, especially from a Far Eastern manufacturer, what would the reaction to it have been.

When I originally saw the i3 in the flesh in 2014 I too thought it was unusual but it grew on me and I drove it and I also drove the leaf and there is no comparison.The i3 is a well researched car with a lot of money spent to develop it.Next time you see a leaf and an i3 look at the shut lines the ones on the leaf can be all over the place the finish on the i3 is excellent.There is a big difference in the price but the old adage that you get what you pay for applies in this case.
Happy motoring whatever EV you choose.

unkel

NIMAN wrote: »

I accepted that the Leaf had to have that rare shape for aerodynamic reasons. Or did it?

No it didn't.

Coefficient of drag (Cd) for Leaf is 0.29, i3 is 0.29, Ioniq is 0.24

(as a comparison the now 35 year old Audi 100 had 0.30 and in the 1930s (!!!) Tatras had about 0.25, so none of the above figures are particularly impressive)

BoatMad

unkel wrote: »

No it didn't.

Coefficient of drag (Cd) for Leaf is 0.29, i3 is 0.29, Ioniq is 0.24

(as a comparison the now 35 year old Audi 100 had 0.30 and in the 1930s (!!!) Tatras had about 0.25, so none of the above figures are particularly impressive)

drag coefficients are not really capable of being improved more, unless you are prepared to accept extreme styling

Panrich

BoatMad wrote: »

drag coefficients are not really capable of being improved more, unless you are prepared to accept extreme styling

So there's no particular reason why they have to be ugly then. I understand that the market for ev seem to be the young urban and climate aware but that's no reason to inflict these abominations on them just for making socially conscious decisions for their motoring needs. And don't get me started on the hybrids.

Tesla have shown that ev can be sexy as well. The traditional car companies need to up their game to tempt the less committed to move over.

isnottheword

Panrich wrote: »

So there's no particular reason why they have to be ugly then. I understand that the market for ev seem to be the young urban and climate aware but that's no reason to inflict these abominations on them just for making socially conscious decisions for their motoring needs. And don't get me started on the hybrids.

Tesla have shown that ev can be sexy as well. The traditional car companies need to up their game to tempt the less committed to move over.

Of course I'll be savaged for this statement but who gives a fiddlers what way the exterior sheets of steel are pressed out. Give me value and give me technological improvement and that's it as far as I'm concerned. Ye can't ride a Tesla! (at least, not that way - if you want something shapely, log on to plentyoffish).

unkel

Or in other words, you're not gonna pay thousands more for the exact same basic A to B appliance (EV), just because it looks good. I'd be the same.

Panrich's point still stands though. There is no need for any car to be ugly if for zero extra costs it can be made to look nice. I guess the designers at Nissan are not very talented and the higher management has no flair.

isnottheword

unkel wrote: »

Panrich's point still stands though. There is no need for any car to be ugly if for zero extra costs it can be made to look nice. I guess the designers at Nissan are not very talented and the higher management has no flair.

I can't pretend for a second to understand the car industry but there must be reasons for them ending up with the car in the shape that it did? If not, is it more a case that we are all conditioned into believing what looks 'slick' - and what looks slick this year will look shíté next year simply because we are being exposed to so much marketing hype about what the latest and greatest is (and the shape it comes in)?

I'm all for tech innovation - but pressing out the metal in different shapes from year to year doesn't mean a whole lot to me. There hasn't been any seismic shift in ICE build for a good many years so the only way they can 'mix it up' is in very superficial ways.

unkel

isnottheword wrote: »

is it more a case that we are all conditioned into believing what looks 'slick' - and what looks slick this year will look shíté next year simply because we are being exposed to so much marketing hype about what the latest and greatest is (and the shape it comes in)?

Nah, I don't believe that for a second. I'd say at least 80-90% of the people would have called the Leaf ugly when it came out 5 years ago. Similar percentage now.

I'd say the very similarly priced Ioniq will be called at least ok looking by 80% of the people and I'm sure that will still be a majority in 5 years time

People's perception of how ugly / good looking a car is has very little to do with marketing, I would have thought.

isnottheword

unkel wrote: »

People's perception of how ugly / good looking a car is has very little to do with marketing, I would have thought.

I keep an open mind - perhaps you're right - but I wouldn't underestimate the power of marketing either. Were they not able to pump out slick curved lines years ago? Like I said (and I'll get savaged for it probably), it's a utility - you drive it - ye can't climb on top of it and give it one.

unkel

Who, Nissan? Nah I don't think they were ever good looking. In their heyday (80s and 90s) their looks were bland at best

And why would you get savaged for telling the truth? :cool: