Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

The amount of usage of weed among the 30-50s age groups is being completely ignored. It's deemed by many to be the affordable alternative to booze.

Really? I haven't had a drink in a good while but was drinking 24 cans most nights for 18 quid and would still be feeling it. 20 quid of weed (plus ****in tobacco) would do it for a night or two but tolerance increases way too quickly.

The odd time if I didn't have to worry about a hangover then 3 bottles of wine from Aldi for 12 quid was my shout, can't beat that value. 12 quid of weed ain't doing much.

Geuze

Zebra3 wrote: »

Oh yeah, that'll be the hypocrisy. Did they do away with taxpayer funded discounted alcohol in their workplace bar?

People keep saying the Oireachtas bar is subsidised.

Is it?

I doubt it.

The prices being lower than Dublin pubs may be because of having lower overheads, and not making 30% net profits.

L1011

No profits, no rent, no insurance, tiny licence cost (members club) - likely dearer staff though. Would make the prices seem subsidised.

The food in the visitors restaurant is unsubsidised, cheap and good (particularly the breakfast). Never got in to the bar!

Suckit

They also put it on their 'expenses' and leave it unpaid for months at a time.
It's also open for them to go in and have a drink at pretty much any time - even when the Dáil is in session, which is f**king ridiculous. Staff I am betting are already on higher wages thanks to their brother/mother/father/sister/uncle/aunt/cousin/neighbour etc.. getting them the job in there to begin with, and that pushed aside, it should be closed during sitting times anyway.

As of 2019, the Dáil sits on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays when the Oireachtas is sitting. On Tuesdays the Dáil normally sits from 2.00pm until 11.00pm, on Wednesdays from 10.30am until around 11.30pm and on Thursdays from 10.30am until around 8.00pm.

Why is it open before 8PM on any of those days? And that is being generous.
What incentive have they got to do any work if they are getting cheap pints on tick during work hours? Other than to throw their face in every now and then.
If we can't be trusted buying expensive alcohol at a cheaper price every now and then with random 'special offers', then how the f*ck can they be trusted to not sit in the bar until they are 4 or 5 pints deep of cheap pints before walking next door tp decide how best to look after our Country?

Zebra3

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Suckit wrote: »

They also put it on their 'expenses' and leave it unpaid for months at a time.

And there's the occasions when our politicians basically steal from the taxpayer.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/unpaid-d%C3%A1il-bar-bills-written-off-over-failure-to-settle-tabs-1.3171521

bellylint

Just gonna push me towards increasing my drug use

Effects

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I haven't had a drink in a good while but was drinking 24 cans most nights for 18 quid and would still be feeling it.

The odd time if I didn't have to worry about a hangover then 3 bottles of wine from Aldi for 12 quid was my shout.

Not sure if you’re serious, but 24 cans or three bottles of wine a night is certainly a drinking problem.

Thelonious Monk

Geuze wrote: »

People keep saying the Oireachtas bar is subsidised.

Is it?

I doubt it.

The prices being lower than Dublin pubs may be because of having lower overheads, and not making 30% net profits.

No it isn't, I've been in it loads of times. It was about 5.80 for a pint of Carlsberg last time I was there some time in 2018.
Cheaper than nearby Dawson St but no cheaper than a typical suburban Dublin pub.

Mr. teddywinkles

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

The number of young people drinking in this country is declining despite the alleged dangerously cheap prices. So why the need for this intervention?

That's a rhetorical question. The need for this intervention is to do the vintners a favour under the guise of public health.

Because drugs is rampant here. But alcohol is the problem. Pack of dumbasses that are so outa touch.

Dickie10

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Can someone explain to me what exactly happens on a night out in continental europe? sounds a mythical place where there is no trouble relating to alchol, i havent been much, i was in santa ponsa, lanzarote, tenerife but there not prob good examples.

Like do people 18-35 not go on the beer at the weekends or what do they be at? i know theres a huge nightclub culture over there in belgium, germany , holland so is it drugs there all at ot what?
I like the british cities and towns and the nightlife in them, always feel very at home there. if irish government mess around on opening up hospitality i will do a few trips to liverpool, cardiff, edinburugh, london, belfast in summer

Dickie10

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Suckit wrote: »

They also put it on their 'expenses' and leave it unpaid for months at a time.
It's also open for them to go in and have a drink at pretty much any time - even when the Dáil is in session, which is f**king ridiculous. Staff I am betting are already on higher wages thanks to their brother/mother/father/sister/uncle/aunt/cousin/neighbour etc.. getting them the job in there to begin with, and that pushed aside, it should be closed during sitting times anyway.

Why is it open before 8PM on any of those days? And that is being generous.
What incentive have they got to do any work if they are getting cheap pints on tick during work hours? Other than to throw their face in every now and then.
If we can't be trusted buying expensive alcohol at a cheaper price every now and then with random 'special offers', then how the f*ck can they be trusted to not sit in the bar until they are 4 or 5 pints deep of cheap pints before walking next door tp decide how best to look after our Country?

its supposed to be a fantastic evening of fun if you ever get the chance to visit the dail bar, a friend of mine is a senator and he said he would organise a good pisss up some night, theres apartments that TDs can use near kildare st if there staying in dublin overnight on business, mostly used by politicans who go the lash when likes of cheltenham and stuff is on, they all head to Doheny and Nesbitt go the lash for the afternoon some country TDs stay up for night, fo Flannerys, Coppers all that. sounds some craic!

ohnonotgmail

Dickie10 wrote: »

Can someone explain to me what exactly happens on a night out in continental europe? sounds a mythical place where there is no trouble relating to alchol, i havent been much, i was in santa ponsa, lanzarote, tenerife but there not prob good examples.

Like do people 18-35 not go on the beer at the weekends or what do they be at? i know theres a huge nightclub culture over there in belgium, germany , holland so is it drugs there all at ot what?
I like the british cities and towns and the nightlife in them, always feel very at home there. if irish government mess around on opening up hospitality i will do a few trips to liverpool, cardiff, edinburugh, london, belfast in summer

My own experiences are with belgium, holland and germany and it has always been very civilised. People do get drunk but that is not the aim of the exercise like it seems to be here. There is little or no aggravation involved. I had similar experiences in Spain but it was nowhere like santa ponsa, lanzarote or tenerife. The couple of people I was with were the only non-spanish in the place.

Thelonious Monk

Yes it's only really the UK and Ireland were drunk yobo culture exists. I'm sure Dublin used to be far worse years ago like in the 90s early 2000s, more fights and yobbery etc in town, it seemed more civilised in the years leading up to lockdown.

Thelonious Monk

Dickie10 wrote: »

its supposed to be a fantastic evening of fun if you ever get the chance to visit the dail bar, a friend of mine is a senator and he said he would organise a good pisss up some night, theres apartments that TDs can use near kildare st if there staying in dublin overnight on business, mostly used by politicans who go the lash when likes of cheltenham and stuff is on, they all head to Doheny and Nesbitt go the lash for the afternoon some country TDs stay up for night, fo Flannerys, Coppers all that. sounds some craic!

It's usually totally dead, very rarely is it busy. The members bar and visitors bar are mostly used for tea/coffee/sandwiches. It's a red herring now that some people seem to focus on too much, although I believe it was a bit more raucous in the heady days of Celtic Tiger and FF.

elperello

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It's usually totally dead, very rarely is it busy. The members bar and visitors bar are mostly used for tea/coffee/sandwiches. It's a red herring now that some people seem to focus on too much, although I believe it was a bit more raucous in the heady days of Celtic Tiger and FF.

I was there a few times and it is as you say workaday most of the time.

Just once I got involved in a bit of a session.

A guy who was on his first day as a Senator arrived with his supporters and one of the people in my company happened to know him so it was drinks all round.

Thelonious Monk

Yeah it's mostly used for TDs to bring in groups of aul ones from their constituency who've been on a tour of the Oireachtas, for tea and stuff.

Suckit

Dickie10 wrote: »

Can someone explain to me what exactly happens on a night out in continental europe? sounds a mythical place where there is no trouble relating to alchol, i havent been much, i was in santa ponsa, lanzarote, tenerife but there not prob good examples.

Like do people 18-35 not go on the beer at the weekends or what do they be at? i know theres a huge nightclub culture over there in belgium, germany , holland so is it drugs there all at ot what?
I like the british cities and towns and the nightlife in them, always feel very at home there. if irish government mess around on opening up hospitality i will do a few trips to liverpool, cardiff, edinburugh, london, belfast in summer

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

My own experiences are with belgium, holland and germany and it has always been very civilised. People do get drunk but that is not the aim of the exercise like it seems to be here. There is little or no aggravation involved. I had similar experiences in Spain but it was nowhere like santa ponsa, lanzarote or tenerife. The couple of people I was with were the only non-spanish in the place.

It's almost as though having less restrictive laws, people behave more responsibly and don't try and cram a load of alcohol into their systems in the shortest time.. :rolleyes:
It has been argued numerous times (and successfully) that reducing the age and abolishing the 11:30 - 12:30 archaic closing times, that there would be less problems.
Not relating to alcoholism, but I doubt very, very much that putting a 'floor price' in will do that either. It just means that many will be drinking paint stripper or whatever crap they can afford or buy on a corner.

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Yes it's only really the UK and Ireland were drunk yobo culture exists. I'm sure Dublin used to be far worse years ago like in the 90s early 2000s, more fights and yobbery etc in town, it seemed more civilised in the years leading up to lockdown.

Where I lived there was literally a fight every single Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday night. When we were younger we used to go up to the chipper before closing and get a bag of chips and sit on the wall waiting for them to come out of the pubs.
One of the pubs got blamed for attracting a 'bad crowd' and was given strikes. After a few more mass brawls and one final one that went right out into the street with tables and chairs being smashed over each other, it was turned into a restaurant for a while before slowly transforming bit by bit back into a pub over the following 10 years, and believe it or not, that was a nice area .
Definitely related to everyone having to drink in x amount of time and all being kicked out into the street at the same time. It stopped happening as often when more late bars and nightclubs started to open in the surrounding areas.

Effects

Effects wrote: »

Not sure if you’re serious, but 24 cans or three bottles of wine a night is certainly a drinking problem.

Hence why I stopped.
However the post I was addressing was the cost compared to weed. If I was to start smoking seriously it would cost a ****load more than drinking.

newmember2

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Commotion Ocean wrote: »

...I believe in capitalism. ...

WTF

Dickie10

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

yeah the late 90s and early 00s seemed very heady days for drinking and generally going out, local rural nightclub here open thursday, friday, saturday and sunday and age groups 17-35. I remember the club M or club annabel row where the chap was killed that was 2000. but i do predict we will see late 90s drinking and partying among all age groups for a good 2 years when this is over , like another roraring 20s

Snickers Man

murpho999 wrote: »

There's been lots of studies and reports of comparing harmful physical effects of alcohol and drugs and alcohol has more impact..

Oooh!!!! Studies AND reports!!! Well that proves it then. Anyone who does a study and/or a report can only ever find a universal truth applicable to any situation regardless of circumstances.

Teleology rules!!!

SuperRabbit

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

when you are making decisions to try to protect an entire population you have to go with evidence and not listen to people insisting that they are exceptions to the rule


And we aren't talking about prohibition we are effectively talking about only raising the price drinks which taste like pish and have no purpose other than to get someone fall-down drunk

Lidl vodka and 2 litre plastic bottles of cider.

If they do minimum price per unit the price of your Stella or what have you won't be effected at all

Mimon

Snickers Man wrote: »

Oooh!!!! Studies AND reports!!! Well that proves it then. Anyone who does a study and/or a report can only ever find a universal truth applicable to any situation regardless of circumstances.

Teleology rules!!!

This one is interesting in terms of where various substances lie between harmfulness and dependence.

Mimon

Dickie10 wrote: »

Can someone explain to me what exactly happens on a night out in continental europe? sounds a mythical place where there is no trouble relating to alchol, i havent been much, i was in santa ponsa, lanzarote, tenerife but there not prob good examples.

Like do people 18-35 not go on the beer at the weekends or what do they be at? i know theres a huge nightclub culture over there in belgium, germany , holland so is it drugs there all at ot what?
I like the british cities and towns and the nightlife in them, always feel very at home there. if irish government mess around on opening up hospitality i will do a few trips to liverpool, cardiff, edinburugh, london, belfast in summer

When I lived in the Netherlands we knew the late bars and nightclubs would be open until 6am so when out for a night would pace ourselves more. Public transport started running at 6am so fitted perfectly. Could even go to another city for a night and hop on the train home. Pick up a joint in a shop near your house to put you to sleep. Very civilised.

ShamNNspace

SuperRabbit wrote: »

when you are making decisions to try to protect an entire population you have to go with evidence and not listen to people insisting that they are exceptions to the rule


And we aren't talking about prohibition we are effectively talking about only raising the price drinks which taste like pish and have no purpose other than to get someone fall-down drunk

Lidl vodka and 2 litre plastic bottles of cider.

If they do minimum price per unit the price of your Stella or what have you won't be effected at all

I'd say dream on if you think your stellas and the like wont rise in price accordingly

SuperRabbit

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

ShamNNspace wrote: »

I'd say dream on if you think your stellas and the like wont rise in price accordingly

If they are actually introducing an evidence based per unit minimum, they won't. If they are tweaking it for fun, then yes they will


I feel like some people are arguing
"it's not dangerous because there are functioning alcoholics, so it's a matter of personal choice" ... am I right?

You guys know there are functioning heroin addicts, right?

odyssey06

SuperRabbit wrote: »

when you are making decisions to try to protect an entire population you have to go with evidence and not listen to people insisting that they are exceptions to the rule


And we aren't talking about prohibition we are effectively talking about only raising the price drinks which taste like pish and have no purpose other than to get someone fall-down drunk

Lidl vodka and 2 litre plastic bottles of cider.

If they do minimum price per unit the price of your Stella or what have you won't be effected at all

Your post just drips with snobbery and ignorance.
You've idea what LIDL vodka tastes like in a cocktail, with LIDL vermouth say...
I have thoroughly enjoyed many discounted LIDL wines of the week.
And LIDL perlenbacher XXL.
All of which would be affected by MUP.

Some of the people pushing it are doing it for 'genuine' reasons, i.e. they think it will help the health situation. I disagree with them both on practical grounds and on grounds of freedom.

But many if not most of those pushing it are doing it purely for selfish reasons which are deserving only of contempt - the snobs, the vintners, the off licences and their stooges in the Dail and media.

SuperRabbit

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

odyssey06 wrote: »

Your post just drips with snobbery and ignorance.
You've idea what LIDL vodka tastes like in a cocktail, with LIDL vermouth say...
I have thoroughly enjoyed many discounted LIDL wines of the week.
And LIDL perlenbacher XXL.
All of which would be affected by MUP.

Some of the people pushing it are doing it for 'genuine' reasons, i.e. they think it will help the health situation. I disagree with them both on practical grounds and on grounds of freedom.

But many if not most of those pushing it are doing it purely for selfish reasons which are deserving only of contempt - the snobs, the vintners, the off licences and their stooges in the Dail and media.

Projection, much? With your "cocktails" pffft! what are you talking about snob? Do you have any idea how much lidl vodka I've bought!?



I am literally describing how this pricing works, I studied it when I did a free course on alcohol addiction and what has worked abroad. Stella is 1.6 units, so the minimum price per unit is not going to change the price.

It won't be expensive to keep drinking it will just be expensive to buy enough alcohol to kill yourself in a single night


oh one more thing, my uncle killed himself with those cider bottles I'm talking about that you are defending. So **** you. **** you a lot.

odyssey06

SuperRabbit wrote: »

Projection, much? With your "cocktails" pffft! what are you talking about snob? Do you have any idea how much lidl vodka I've bought!?
I am literally describing how this pricing works, I studied it when I did a free course on alcohol addiction and what has worked abroad. Stella is 1.6 units, so the minimum price per unit is not going to change the price.
It won't be expensive to keep drinking it will just be expensive to buy enough alcohol to kill yourself in a single night

Your posts are all over the shop and contradict each other first you are slagging off LIDL vodka then claiming to have have bought loads.
I talked about Perlenbacher and discounted wines in LIDL and you randomly talk about Stella? Like WTF.
Nothing wrong with LIDL vodka, vermouth, beers or wine.
Your posts are not credible. They drip with ignorance and snobbery.

ohnonotgmail

SuperRabbit wrote: »

when you are making decisions to try to protect an entire population you have to go with evidence and not listen to people insisting that they are exceptions to the rule


And we aren't talking about prohibition we are effectively talking about only raising the price drinks which taste like pish and have no purpose other than to get someone fall-down drunk

Lidl vodka and 2 litre plastic bottles of cider.

If they do minimum price per unit the price of your Stella or what have you won't be effected at all

this has already been addressed multiple times.